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So while I'm still working on my Marines, Orks will always be my primary 40k army. As such I'm thinking about how I want to run and transition my 3rd Ed army into a 5th Ed army (I never actually built my Ork stuff in v4, only proxies).

I've got three army ideas, and some general ideas.

1.) Green Tide - Good bit of shooty but still a decent emphasis in melee:
120 Boyz - 50/50 mix between Sluggas & Shootas
KFF Mek
2x units of Lootas - Anti-Mech Transport Poppers
<something else> - Thinking Storm Boyz + Biker Boss

This is basically my 4th Ed foot list, which I have most of the models for (albeit a lot of them are unbuilt/painted). I still think it can do well in 5th, but hey I've played so few games my opinion doesn't count for much right now, which is why I ask ye wise denizens of Dakka!

2.) Nob Bikers + Da' Tide - I've been intrigued by Nobz units since apparantly while they sucked in 4th Ed they can be ridiculously awesome in 5th. While I don't want to run 2x units of them, I was thinking that a unit of em plus 120 Boyz (another 50/50 mix) would do a bit to help out to cover some of their weaknesses.

3.) Kult of Speed w/ Wagonz - Eventually I'll probably break down and buy myself 3 Battlewagons and then load them up with Lotz-o-Boyz and support it with some Trukks or Nob Bikers.

The biggest thing I'm thinking with the Orks in 5th is that it seems to me that shooting may be important, but CC is really where you're going to want to be in order to win. Also I'm thinking that unlike in 4th where if you were on foot all Shootas were the way to go, I'm thinking a mix would be good since running can put the front line Sluggas decently far up the field on Turn 1, possibly being up for a Turn 2 Waagh if necessary. I'm thinking that I can use them to put a good amount of pressure on my opponent and with a combo'd KFF Mek I can ensure a 4+ cover for my back mobs and a 5+ for the Boyz up front.

Now the problem is that I can be relatively slow with the list, at least against the armies that have the hardest matchups for me (I'm thinking IG); so I'm thinking of mixing either Nob Bikers or some other fast assault element in there to get me down field ASAP. A unit of Storm Boyz isn't ideal, but it's a guilty pleasure of a cool unit, and a Warboss delivery system - plus with a 4+ Cover save from hiding just behind a front unit of Sluggas, they should make it in for a turn 2 charge every game.

I'd appreciate any thoughts on the first two lists, and some input on the last list since I've fleshed out the ideas for that the least. Do I really want a unit of Nobz in my army all the time? Even on foot they're near 500 points, but they can really put the hurt on most stuff. Again any input would be appreciated!

I think with the increase in BS of kans they're pretty useful for shooting high STR weapons into vehicles. And don't underestimate 5 deffcoptas with twin linked rokkits and one or two with the powerfist attack upgrade. The deffcoptas are also pretty good in assaults and 2 wounds 4+ save.
From what I've read shootas in units on foot are the best way to go so they can (try to ) shoot stuff up as they slog it across the board with sluggas being for mobs in transports.

No other input guys? :(

A bunch of battlewagons+Bikers can be a best of both worlds kind of build, you've got a hard hitting combat unit as well as lots of survivable vehicles. Thing is you need lots of points to accommodate it.

Also, I'm starting to think Dreads might be able to 'keep up' with a KOS type list now that they can run, a dread with 4 CC arms, running every turn, until the turn it got up to the enemy, and then just charged them. I could be wrong though.

Though if you get battlewagons, go for the kannon on as many of them as you can, 5points that gets you what amounts to a rokkit at a longer range!

Edit: another plus about Nobz is they can take a battlewagon that dosn't use up a Force Org slot, which is probably the best transport to put them in unless your going to give them all bikes, a trukk can be good for them if you can reliably hide it behind things, but the wagon is great!

Boys...lots and lots of boys, and some bikers

I like battlewagon spam, if I played orks, I'd have 4 wagons and 2 trukks at 1750.

I have found that for a Kult of Speed list, Trukks are more valuable then Battlewagons, though they transport less troops, they are faster and you can have more of them. Personally I would go with 4 Trukks, and perhaps 2 Battlewagons. Mek with a KFF is a must, as it will help absorb shots against your Trukks and wagons. Help out the army with a few Deftkoptas for Rokkits and tying up any squad carrying heavy weapons. Naturally throwing in a few bikers points permitting is also fun, bonus points if they are nobz, and if they are Nobz can provide a decent hard hitting unit to assist the boys who get stuck in.

On a personal note, I have had great success with the eggs in one basket tactic. AKA my Nob unit being worth 565 points or so with all the essential upgrades, plus a nasty Warboss to help them out (though typically I prefer he goes and helps the boyz in a Battlewagon filled to the brim). This has spelt the death of many a squad, and the ability to take a good amount of firepower and come out busting heads is essential to me. Nobz are solid and ded-killy so there is always room in all of my lists for them. They are expensive, but there is a sense of joy after ripping someone's unit apart. Against IG, I'd take away most of the Power Klaws in the unit, maybe keep 2 or 3 (For some up and personal Tank-Busting), the rest just using sluggas and choppas. I'd still keep their protection, as IG small-arms fire can really stack up, and its best to have all the protection you can.

Fore serious competition, I have had success with these three army archetypes, in order from most success to least.

1. KFF meks/lootas/shootas/kans

This ork list type has been quite dominant for me. It was absolute murder for just about everyone I faced at the vegas GT. Its lost its cutting edge a bit, but my most recent iteration has dropped big shoota for rokkits, especially on the kans. It takes discipline to play this list right. Contrary to what it looks like, you don't want to charge in to a mech army before you've sufficiently removed their transport capabilities. The kans do very little running, same with the boys.

2. Warbosses on bikes/nobs on bikes/grots

Much 'swingier'. I've stunningly embarrassed good players with nob biker lists, and have been tabled more with this army than any other army I've ever run (no surprise considering the model count)

3. KFF mek/lootas/shootas/battle wagons (4 rokkit 1 kannon)

Similar to the kan wall, this list had to be modified to combat mech vet IG. The wagons roll out 13" on turn one then park. You don't start moving again until you've popped the magic number of enemy transports/gunships. You will be educated very quickly on what happens to this army if you advance into melta weapons without doing any softening up. Your are just driving your models into a woodchipper if you can't kill off melta carrying transports and the easier to kill light gunships.




There is less to talk about when you are entering into a more RTT/casual realm. In that case, having a focus on the "good units" (warboss/KFF mek/lootas/nobs/boys/grots/deff koptas/battlewagons) while using the other units VERY sparingly will lead to success.

warboss on bike/nob bikes/lotsa boys/grots and kommandos

warboss and nobs move around slapping things upside the face
the big mob of boys tie up annoying nob biker killing things like assault termies (and probably win with 30 boys)
grots sit on objectives
kommandos sneak in behind anything sitting annoyingly far away and shooting the loverly pretty bikes.

also deffkotas with a buzz saw to take the heat off the nob bikers

Go all shoota boys. They are so much more effective than slugga boys i cant even explain it. so many tac squads gunned down by friggin orks...
That, and take kommando's whatever the list. They're gold.

I regularly fight an ork commander as IG at 1500 pts, and 30 man squads of boyz are hard to destroy even in the open. He runs 2 big squads of sluggas across the table at me, supported by tankbustas and lootas. Always full fast attack (big squads of bikes, buggies and koptas) flanking and screening, or turboboosting from the table edge in DoW to catch up. 2 warbosses, with 5 nobs and a trukk race up behind it all. Currently his only heavy support is a battery of lobbas, which are nasty in themselves, and that grot crew is backing up around 85 orks plus fast attack. My 80 guards bring 19 heavy weapons and 5 vehicles including 3 pieplates - plus the master of ordinance. Our battles are exceedingly bloody, both of us gleefully taking casualties off with hands full.

If I shoot the boyz, the bikes and buggies put out quite a bit of dakka on my poor meatsack guardsmen and the koptas and tankbustas shoot my vehicles. If I shoot the bikes and buggies, the big mobz of boyz will make it across the table. If it was just this conundrum it wouldn't be so bad, I have alot of guardsmen and tough vehicles. But dude, those 2 warbosses with nobs almost always make it to my lines unscathed, and that is just bad news every time. No one told them that they can't consolidate into combat anymore and that they had better watch out for gunlines, and they don't seem to mind anyways. Besides, if you told them, they would rip you limb from limb and then consolidate into your mother. I long ago dispensed with reservations about open firing with my tanks when they were so close to my own units. You should see what inept gunners on Demolishers with plasma sponsons can do for the orks...


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@ Fuzzum: what make Kommandos gold?

Kommandos are gold because they let you take Snikrot. With Snikrot in your list, your opponent either must deploy centralized enough to escape his wrath (and thus closer to the rest of your army), or ignore him and take it in the rear. Now, I'm not one to tell people where they should take it, but from the reactions I've seen on the table, it hurts in the rear. No matter what the opponent decides, its a win for the Orks.

For the OP --

I usually dig into various Ork army lists and write for hours vainly trying to get would-be Ork Warbosses to see the light of simplicity through the crafting of their lists. I've included a couple of those threads here, and think you should go read them and the comments posted (especially mine) so that I don't have to repeat myself infinitely across the forums to answer the same questions asked by different people who didn't read each others' threads.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/264154.page

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/264209.page

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/263869.page

I dont care what anyone say Having to face 45 Tankbustas in battlewagons is the most annoying thing in the world.

the trick I saw for when playing against my ork opponent was that he would usually move the battlewagons when he did not want the tankbustas to fire or move them so they were closer to a specific vehicle.

Other than landraiders most things in the game have 13 or less.


Also i had a landraider destroyed by glancing shots. Who knew the vehicle is considered destroyed when it has no weapons and is immobilized.

Facing 90 ST8 shots a turn is disgusting. Add in on the charge they have a STR of 10 yes thank you.


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edit:

WTF seriously Ive been cheated and robbed someone ent me a pm saying rokets are assault 1 not 2.

General Fuzzum wrote:Go all shoota boys. They are so much more effective than slugga boys

I disagree, 4 attacks on the charge with sluggas is far better than 3 attacks with shootas. While i agree that shootas are effective when used properly, i do believe it is important to have the right balance of (in ork terms) shooty and choppy.