Professor gets fired for grading too harshly

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**Frazzled**

(For those not from the South LSU is a good college but not Ivy League)

I like the part about 10 responses to a multiple chance question. Thats just epic fail. I would have walked out the door and dropped the class as well.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/education/2010-04-15-IHE-tough-prof-removed-LSU-15_ST_N.htm
(my bold)

LSU removes tough professor, raises students' grades
Posted 23h 10m ago | Comment | Recommend E-mail | Save | Print |

By Scott Jaschik, Inside Higher Ed
Dominique G. Homberger won't apologize for setting high expectations for her students. The biology professor at Louisiana State University at Baton Rouge gives brief quizzes at the beginning of every class, to assure attendance and to make sure students are doing the reading. On her tests, she doesn't use a curve, as she believes that students must achieve mastery of the subject matter, not just achieve more mastery than the worst students in the course. For multiple choice questions, she gives 10 possible answers, not the expected 4, as she doesn't want students to get very far with guessing.
Students in introductory biology don't need to worry about meeting her standards anymore. LSU removed her from teaching, mid-semester, and raised the grades of students in the class. In so doing, the university's administration has set off a debate about grade inflation, due process and a professor's right to set standards in her own course.

To Homberger and her supporters, the university's action has violated principles of academic freedom and weakened the faculty.

"This is terrible. It undercuts all of what we do," said Brooks Ellwood, president of the LSU Chapter of the American Association of University Professors, and the Robey H. Clark Distinguished Professor of Geology. "If you are a non-tenured professor at this university, you have to think very seriously about whether you are going to fail too many students for the administration to tolerate."

Even for those who, like Homberger, are tenured, there is a risk of losing the ability to stick to your standards, he said, Teaching geology, he said, there are students who get upset when he talks about the actual age of the earth and about evolution. "Now students can complain to a dean" and have him removed, Elwood said. "I worry that my ability to teach in the classroom has been diminished."

Kevin Carman, dean of the College of Basic Sciences, did not respond to requests for a phone interview Wednesday. But he issued a statement through the university's public relations office that said: "LSU takes academic freedom very seriously, but it takes the needs of its students seriously as well. There was an issue with this particular class that we felt needed to be addressed.

i"The class n question is an entry-level biology class for non-science majors, and, at mid-term, more than 90% of the students in Dr. Homberger's class were failing or had dropped the class. The extreme nature of the grading raised a concern, and we felt it was important to take some action to ensure that our students receive a rigorous, but fair, education. Professor Homberger is not being penalized in any way; her salary has not been decreased nor has any aspect of her appointment been changed."

In an interview, Homberger said that there were numerous flaws with Carman's statement. She said that it was true that most students failed the first of four exams in the course. But she also said that she told the students that — despite her tough grading policies — she believes in giving credit to those who improve over the course of the semester.

At the point that she was removed, she said, some students in the course might not have been able to do much better than a D, but every student could have earned a passing grade. Further, she said that her tough policy was already having an impact, and that the grades on her second test were much higher (she was removed from teaching right after she gave that exam), and that quiz scores were up sharply. Students got the message from her first test, and were working harder, she said.

"I believe in these students. They are capable," she said. And given that LSU boasts of being the state flagship, she said, she should hold students to high standards. Many of these students are in their first year, and are taking their first college-level science course, so there is an adjustment for them to make, Homberger said. But that doesn't mean professors should lower standards.

Homberger said she was told that some students had complained about her grades on the first test. "We are listening to the students who make excuses, and this is unfair to the other students," she said. "I think it's unfair to the students" to send a message that the way to deal with a difficult learning situation is "to complain" rather than to study harder.

Further, she said that she was never informed that administrators had any concerns about her course until she received a notification that she was no longer teaching it. (She noted that the university's learning management system allowed superiors to review the grades on her first test in the course.)

And while her dean authorized her removal from teaching the course, she said, he never once sat in on her course. Further, she said that in more than 30 years of teaching at LSU, no dean had ever done so, although they would have been welcome.

"Why didn't they talk to me?" she asked.

Homberger said that she has not had any serious grading disputes before, although it's been about 15 years since she taught an introductory course. She has been teaching senior-level and graduate courses, and this year, she asked her department's leaders where they could use help, and accepted their suggestion that she take on the intro course.

In discussions with colleagues after she was removed from the course, Homberger said that no one has ever questioned whether any of the test questions were unfair or unfairly graded, but that she was told that she may include "too many facts" on her tests.

Ellwood, the campus AAUP chapter president, said that his group had verified that no one informed Homberger of concerns before removing her from the course, and that no one had questioned the integrity of her tests. He also said that the scores on the second test were notably better than the first one, suggesting that students were responding to the need to do more work. "She's very rigorous. There's no doubt about that," he said.

Based on its investigation, the AAUP chapter has sent a letter to administrators, arguing that they violated Homberger's academic freedom and due process rights and demanding an apology. (No apology has been forthcoming.)

Cary Nelson, national president of the AAUP, said that the organization has always believed that "an instructor has the responsibility for assigning grades," and that the LSU case was "disturbing in several respects." He noted that "the practice of assigning tough grades in an early assignment as a wake-up call to students is quite common" and that "the instructor made it clear that she had no intention of failing that many students when it came time for final grades."

If administrators were concerned, he said, they had a responsibility to "discuss the matter fully with the instructor" before taking any action. And he said that "removal from the classroom mid-semester is a serious sanction that requires all the protections of due process." Nelson said that the incident "raises serious questions about violations of pedagogical freedoms."

Stuart Rojstaczer, a former Duke University professor who is the founder of GradeInflation.com, a website that publishes research on grading, questioned whether LSU was really trying to help students. "How many times has Dean Carman removed a professor from a class who was giving more than 90% As?" he asked.

LSU's public affairs office did not respond to follow-up questions about the statement it issued, and to the criticisms made by various faculty members.

Homberger declined to give out the names of students who have expressed support, saying that to do so would violate her confidentiality obligations. But she released (without student names) answers to a bonus question on the course's second test. The question asked students to describe "the biggest 'AHA' reaction" they had had during the course.

Many of the reactions were about various issues in biology — with evolution as a major topic. But a number dealt with grades and work habits. One was critical: "When I found out my test grade, I almost had a heart attack."

But many other comments about the course standards were positive, with several students specifically praising Homberger's advice that they form study groups. One student wrote: "My biggest 'AHA' reaction in this course is that I need to study for this course every night to make a good grade. I must also attend class, take good notes, and have study sessions with others. Usually a little studying can get me by but not with this class which is why it is my 'AHA' reaction."

**Fateweaver**

Hmm. I don't see anything wrong with her teaching method.

Obviously to get such lousy grades on a multiple choice test, even with 10 answers per question, shows more about lack of student learning than her teaching methods.

**Frazzled**

90% failing? That sounds like psycho teacher.

**generalgrog**

Prolly want to change your title from hired to fired?

GG

**Frazzled**

thanks

**dogma**

I don't know, I'd have to see some sample test question before I leveled judgment. The fact that the course was supposed to be biology for students not majoring in a hard science raises some red flags for me in terms of student behavior. That's the sort of class people take in order to focus on other courses. I know, I've taken those classes, and they often end up being more difficult than anticipated. If she's telling the truth, and there was a significant improvement in later scores, then I could see this being little more than a mass error of expectations on the part of students.

**gorgon**

On one hand, it's biology for non-science majors. And there are some real nutjobs in academia with all kinds of weird quirks, beliefs and hangups.

On the other hand, what the heck is biology for non-science majors? At my university (not LSU size but still probably 30K total student body), bio was bio. Is it intended to be a joke version of the real class? And if so, why is LSU scheduling joke classes?

During my freshman year, the class mean for my bio lab was something like 60%. Now, they did use a curve, although that generally just creates a lot of "C" grades and doesn't exactly help anyone's GPA. Anyway, we just chalked it up to bio lab being a really tough class. Which it was, and it was intended to be that. They wanted to see what you were made of.

I tend to think this was probably the case of an overzealous professor who was also well within her right to put demands upon her students. I think 10 multiple choice answers would actually be a very good way of determining mastery of the material.

A very important question here is whether athletes were in that class. It could be a class that the athletic advisors steered athletes to, only to see them risk their athletic eligibility because of the class's difficulty. If so, that would have put more internal pressure on the dean to do something, compared to some random complaining students.

Probably just Northern bias talking, but you kinda hear things about some of those Southern schools, and stories like this kinda get you wondering.

**halonachos**

And while her dean authorized her removal from teaching the course, she said, he never once sat in on her course. Further, she said that in more than 30 years of teaching at LSU, no dean had ever done so, although they would have been welcome.

"Why didn't they talk to me?" she asked.

Most likely because you would've asked them a question and offer 10+ answers.

Her teaching is absolutely absurd, she doesn't realize that non-science majors won't use biology and i she was teaching for biology major students then maybe I could accept that, but no, her teaching method is absolute garbage.

**Redbeard**

Grades can be more than just numbers.

When I was in college, I had several classes in the physics department where the highest grade in the class was below 60% (the traditional cut-off point for passing).

But, at the end of the class, the 'A' grade range was from 50-60%. The professor knew he gave sickeningly difficult tests (often due more to time constraints than actual question difficulty), and the final grades earned in the class didn't differ horribly from any other class.

I had another class, a political science class, where the teacher would always include 10 True/False questions on the exams. Inevitably, nine of them would be false, because, in his words, "he'd try to get a 50% true/false balance, but when he read the questions closer, he'd realize there was one aspect of it that made the statements false." As you can imagine, this meant that most people lost a ton of points on those questions.

Again, the final class grades reflected this though. It was accounted for at the end of the class.

My dad is a college professor, so I'm very familiar with how it should be done. I've also taught college courses as an instructor (non tenure-track teaching post). The very idea that a professor would be removed from a class in the middle of a semester for her grading policy is ridiculous. Nothing prevents the department head from making adjustments later, if the final grades really are that far off base. But she should have been given the opportunity to normalize the results herself first.

Finally, while I realize that the article above says she was teaching bio for non-science majors, there are some classes (like, say, structural engineering, or brain surgery) where I'd be uncomfortable with a professor having a 'must-pass' rate. Sometimes, if students don't get it, they need to be failed to keep the public safe. Again - I realize that this isn't the fact in this case, but it's something to consider.

**Frazzled**

Lets revisit. At mid term 90% had dropped or were failing. 90%.

**dogma**

gorgon wrote:
On the other hand, what the heck is biology for non-science majors? At my university (not LSU size but still probably 30K total student body), bio was bio. Is it intended to be a joke version of the real class? And if so, why is LSU scheduling joke classes?

I never took bio for non-science majors, but I did take a physics course for non-science majors. Basically, it was like a serious version of The Universe; theoretical physics without the mathematical component. At my school, about 2k students, the class existed in order to:
1. Provide a means by which non-science majors could fulfill their science requirement. Other examples included "Nuclear Physics", and "Nuclear Engineering" (the two largest departments at my school were International Affairs and Political Science).
2. Attract undecided students to the Physics program. Most science departments had a similar course.

**Redbeard**

Frazzled wrote:Lets revisit. At mid term 90% had dropped or were failing. 90%.

So? My wife (currently in college) has a class where the professor has weekly quizzes to assure attendance (it's an 8AM class too, which means she has to leave the house before 6am to get there). People dropped her class because they didn't want to have to attend every 8am class.

College students are getting whinier and whinier every year. It's an entry-level biology class. They're probably treating it like a blow-off class. I'd be willing to take any of her quizzes, without having taken a bio class since 1986, and I bet I could pass it. If they're not doing the work, they deserve to fail. And it is the professor's right to set the standard in her class.

They're not "failing" the class until it is over. Until then, they simply have a number. Meaning to that number can be changed at any point until final grades are turned in.

**dogma**

Exactly. We don't even know what percentage of the grade is determined prior to the mid-term.

**Frazzled**

(I should preface I took biology and received a high A-thought the class was very interesting)

In the article the professor stated that "some students in the course might not have been able to do much better than a D, but every student could have earned a passing grade. "

She wasn't grading on a curve doing accounting for her horrible tests. I too have had classes whwere the tests were horrible but the grade reflected that curve.

For every ten students that started only one was passing or still there. I've never seen a class like that where the professor was back the next semester (have seen that once and the professor was indeed gone).

**gorgon**

I'm pretty much with Redbeard here.

Like I said, there are some strange ducks in academia, and maybe she's some psycho going out of her way to make the class harder than it had to be. Maybe there are some things we don't know that change this story dramatically.

But when I read things like this:

One student wrote: "My biggest 'AHA' reaction in this course is that I need to study for this course every night to make a good grade. I must also attend class, take good notes, and have study sessions with others. Usually a little studying can get me by but not with this class which is why it is my 'AHA' reaction."

Like, oh my god, I like, have to prepare for class and study and stuff. *facepalm*

I don't think this professor is going to have a hard time getting hired elsewhere, if this is really all there is to the story.

**Fateweaver**

As I said, 90% failing a multiple choice test sounds to me more of student fail than professor fail.

Like yeah, study for class and attend class. Who'da thunk it?

**Frazzled**

Take a ten question multiple choice. Thats designed to screw you up, not test your knowledge.

**gorgon**

Fraz, you either know it or you don't. If they can't identify the right answer, then that means they'd fail a short answer test too, and that says to me they should simply be studying harder.

**Redbeard**

Frazzled wrote:
In the article the professor stated that "some students in the course might not have been able to do much better than a D, but every student could have earned a passing grade. "

She wasn't grading on a curve doing accounting for her horrible tests. I too have had classes whwere the tests were horrible but the grade reflected that curve.

For every ten students that started only one was passing or still there. I've never seen a class like that where the professor was back the next semester (have seen that once and the professor was indeed gone).

She wasn't - at that time. Like I said, I've been around academia all my life, and I've been part of the system (both as student and as teacher). One of two things is going on - either, students taking "bio for non-science" are not trying at all and deserve to fail, or she would have curved at the end, regardless of what she's saying now.

Either way, if the department head didn't like the outcome, at the end of the class, they could amend the grades then. That they're replacing her as a teacher in the middle of the semester is extremely unprofessional.

Also, I'd be interested to know how many were actually failing, and how many dropped. If I was looking for an easy science credit, and picked this bio-for-non-scientists, and realized, before the drop date, that it wasn't the blow-off class I was hoping for, I might drop it too. What if this is her first semester teaching the class, and the teacher the semester before really was a blow-off? All those kids tell their friends 'take this, it's super-easy', and they take it, and find themselves neck deep. That's not what they signed on for, so they drop. That wouldn't surprise me at all.

I have seen classes where more than half the class is expected to fail too. They're generally called weeder classes, and they're usually offered early in a program, basically acting as an alert to the students that if they want to be in this program, they better get with it and spend more time studying and less time going to topless beaches (really Frazzled, the advice you give to the kids headed to college for the first time, and then wonder why 90% might fail...

). They're also prerequisites for much of the rest of the program, so until you pass that class, you're not getting any further. I doubt bio for non-scientists is anything like that, but the practice of having classes with high fail-out rates isn't unheard of.

**Frazzled**

gorgon wrote:Fraz, you either know it or you don't. If they can't identify the right answer, then that means they'd fail a short answer test too, and that says to me they should simply be studying harder.

I thought that to until I started taking law school multiple choice tests.
Thats not correct. You can word a question or answers such that it is difficult to get the correct answer. If you're going to be a dillweed and do that you really should be doing essay tests. You're just trying to trip people up.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Redbeard wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
In the article the professor stated that "some students in the course might not have been able to do much better than a D, but every student could have earned a passing grade. "

She wasn't grading on a curve doing accounting for her horrible tests. I too have had classes whwere the tests were horrible but the grade reflected that curve.

For every ten students that started only one was passing or still there. I've never seen a class like that where the professor was back the next semester (have seen that once and the professor was indeed gone).

She wasn't - at that time. Like I said, I've been around academia all my life, and I've been part of the system (both as student and as teacher). One of two things is going on - either, students taking "bio for non-science" are not trying at all and deserve to fail, or she would have curved at the end, regardless of what she's saying now.

Either way, if the department head didn't like the outcome, at the end of the class, they could amend the grades then. That they're replacing her as a teacher in the middle of the semester is extremely unprofessional.

Also, I'd be interested to know how many were actually failing, and how many dropped. If I was looking for an easy science credit, and picked this bio-for-non-scientists, and realized, before the drop date, that it wasn't the blow-off class I was hoping for, I might drop it too. What if this is her first semester teaching the class, and the teacher the semester before really was a blow-off? All those kids tell their friends 'take this, it's super-easy', and they take it, and find themselves neck deep. That's not what they signed on for, so they drop. That wouldn't surprise me at all.

I have seen classes where more than half the class is expected to fail too. They're generally called weeder classes, and they're usually offered early in a program, basically acting as an alert to the students that if they want to be in this program, they better get with it and spend more time studying and less time going to topless beaches (really Frazzled, the advice you give to the kids headed to college for the first time, and then wonder why 90% might fail... ). They're also prerequisites for much of the rest of the program, so until you pass that class, you're not getting any further. I doubt bio for non-scientists is anything like that, but the practice of having classes with high fail-out rates isn't unheard of.

Yea intro bio LITE is not a weeder course.

**Redbeard**

Frazzled wrote:Take a ten question multiple choice. Thats designed to screw you up, not test your knowledge.

As opposed to a fill-in-the-blank, which is essentially an infinite-question multiple choice question, right?

What's easier:

In 1902, the British Empire won _____.

or

In 1902, the British Empire won ______.
a) World War I
b) The Napoleonic Wars
c) The American Revolution
d) The Second Boer War
e) World War II
f) The Vietnam War
g) The Battle of Hastings
h) all of the above
i) none of the above

**Frazzled**

Redbeard wrote:
Frazzled wrote:Take a ten question multiple choice. Thats designed to screw you up, not test your knowledge.

As opposed to a fill-in-the-blank, which is essentially an infinite-question multiple choice question, right?

What's easier:

In 1902, the British Empire won _____.

or

In 1902, the British Empire won ______.
a) World War I
b) The Napoleonic Wars
c) The American Revolution
d) The Second Boer War
e) World War II
f) The Vietnam War
g) The Battle of Hastings
h) all of the above
i) none of the above

Then why do you need ten resopnses other than to be a dick?

**dogma**

To make the question harder?

Frazzled wrote:
Thats not correct. You can word a question or answers such that it is difficult to get the correct answer. If you're going to be a dillweed and do that you really should be doing essay tests. You're just trying to trip people up.

Try taking a 50 question T/F logic test in 70 minutes.

**olympia**

Frazzled wrote:90% failing? That sounds like psycho teacher.

Agreed. She's at a public university with students of widely disparate abilities. In a non-major class for first-year students at such a university a major concern for the professor and the institution is retention. They should not be hazed by the faculty.

**Redbeard**

Frazzled wrote:Then why do you need ten resopnses other than to be a dick?

Why shouldn't you have ten responses. It has always been a teacher's right to set the questions on their own tests. If she wants to do a ten-question multiple choice, rather than a fill-in-the-blank, so what? It doesn't make it any harder - if you know the answer, in either case, you will get it right. If you don't, you get it wrong. More answers doesn't make it any easier or harder to get the answer right if you know it. All it does is make it harder to get it right by blind guessing. And why not?

**Wrexasaur**

I am not sure how I feel about this situation, I understand that professors need to keep their class learning, but I feel that there are simply limits to such a basic course.

On face value I agree with Frazz, and if I was at this college, I would probably avoid this overzealous professor like the plague. If I have 16 waking hours in the day, minus 4 hours for transportation/cooking/cleaning, etc... that leaves me approximately 12 hours, 6 days a week to work on school (study 7 days a week, every available hour? No... no thank you), and around 4-6 hours of that per day will be spent in class.

I am all for providing varied modes of education, to make more well rounded students, but that needs to balance out with the reality of why many students are there in the first place. Professors that don't give two gaks about your stress levels, and push you to 'master' some obscure field, of which you will have literally no use for in the future, are usually grade 'A' douche-bags. I don't want to master geology, or biology, or physics, and forcing me to fail because I don't have the time to study that intensely on one class, completely unrelated to my field, is douche-baggery.

All of that said, again, I am not sure how I feel about this, but I would hazard a guess that the Prof needs to take a chill pill. It does seem odd that they would cut the class off mid-semester, but the administration, very well may have had good reasons to do so.

Redbeard wrote:Why shouldn't you have ten responses. It has always been a teacher's right to set the questions on their own tests. If she wants to do a ten-question multiple choice, rather than a fill-in-the-blank, so what? It doesn't make it any harder - if you know the answer, in either case, you will get it right. If you don't, you get it wrong. More answers doesn't make it any easier or harder to get the answer right if you know it. All it does is make it harder to get it right by blind guessing. And why not?

Why shouldn't you have 100 choices? What specific purpose does it serve but to place even more doubt in the students themselves? It can be very easy to mix up facts when you have 2-3 midterms to take in one day, and having one teacher provide a completely random and opinion based alternative mode of testing, makes very little sense to me. I understand that teachers need flexibility, and 10 choices really doesn't sound that bad, but you fail testing on a 1:4 ratio when guessing anyway. It seems like a way to make people feel terrible, really.

"I knew that answer, but I had so many options that I doubted myself"

Common underhanded psych trick, not a fancy way of being a good teacher, more of a way to simply make your students annoyed. 6 more answers to check, is 12 more seconds of reading, give or take. If students are indeed being tested on their knowledge, and not their psychological fortitude, fill in the blank is the best option, and multiple choice is simply a waste of paper space.

**Fateweaver**

On the other hand Wrex you have single moms/dads going to school full time who are able to pass their classes and find time to study on top of raising kids and being a parent.

Sure the kids might be in daycare or with a sitter part or most of a day but most college students don't spend 12 hours a day studying/doing homework. I'd guess about 8 hours a day drinking, 2 hours getting laid and or puking and then 2 hours doing homework and studying and then wondering why they can't pass a certain class (or don't graduate at all).

I know nurses who were single moms, went to college full time and still found time to pass their classes AND raise a family.

As Redbeard said, if you know the answer to a question it won't matter if there are 50 answers or 3 answers. The difference being it will take longer to narrow down your choices but if you know the answer you won't even have to read the rest of the choices, you just will immediately see the right one jump off the page at you (at least that's how my brain works).

If they were worded in such a way as for there to be more than one possible answer I could see it being douchey but until a copy of the test goes up for the world to see so we can see for ourselves what kind of test it was we only have her word and the students, and as quoted earlier by one student of hers I'm more inclined to think these kids expected an easy A and now need to whine because they can't be bothered to actually study or attend class.

Whiny, lazy students = fail students, not fail teacher.

**Shaman**

In my experience at uni the work load is usually to much to learn the way she is trying to teach.. To know something inside out especially a science which has soo much info to begin with is a really tall order.

I must say though I thought the standards are pretty low when I first got to uni, IRL if your right only 50% of the time you get fired.

**Platuan4th**

Redbeard wrote:It has always been a teacher's right to set the questions on their own tests.

Actually, that's not exactly true. Having GONE to LSU, I know for a fact that certain departments have mandatory department tests/exams that teachers HAVE to administer and don't have the right to alter in any way.

Frazzled wrote:(For those not from the South LSU is a good college but not Ivy League)

They also have a live tiger for a mascot.

**dogma**

I think its also important to note that we don't have enough information to come to a definitive conclusion either way. Without access to the tests in question, there really is no way to determine whether this was a matter of an overzealous professor, a failure of student expectations, or some combination of the two.