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At my Club 1/4 of the people do space marines, 1/4 do Guard 1/4 to Tyranids and the 1/4 are all other armies (Not including Deldar, No one has them) I can kill Marines and Guard But With the Nids, I can only get about 3 Killpoints,

My chaos army 1500 pont list is


Hq

-Huron Blackheart-170
-Slannesh Sorcorer + (Gift of Chaos)-135

Troops

-8 man Bezerker Squad + Plasma pistol + (Skull Champion Powerfist)-223
-10 man chaos Space Marine Sq + Flamer + (Champion Powerfist)-180
-8 Thousand Son and Aspiring Sorcorer + (Bolt Of change)-279

Transport:
-RHINO 1 (Bezerker sq, Huron)-35
-RHINO 2 + Havoc Launcher-50 (Thousand Son Sq, Slaanesh Sorcorer)-50

Heavy Support:

-Defiler + Havoc Launcher-155
-Chaos Predator + All lascannons-165
- Chaos Predator + All Heavy Bolters/Assult Cannon-105
Total: 1497




My Blood angels Army Isn't Done with the New Units yet, So I'm Using what I got from my First marine army But... Heres My blood angels List (Not the One I'm making do with at the Moment, I'f theres a £ Before the Unit I havent Bought/Completed it yet-Only on Extreme Occasions do I field Things that I havent painted My armies Colors yet)

Hq

Reclusiarch + hand flamer+ Jump Pack-155 (i got a chaplan with a jump pack enstead and made a few upgrades to make him more blood angel"y")

Librerian Epistolary + Terminator Amour-180


Troop:


£ 10X Assualt Marine-245
2X meltagun
Sgt: powerfist
Sgt: Hand Flamer

10X Tactical Squad-200 (Squad in the drop pod)
Flamer
Multi Melta
Sgt: Powerfist
Sgt: Melta bombs

10X Tactical Squad-190 (Squad in the Rhino)
Flamer
Rocket
Sgt: Plasma Pistol (Always the most uselful wepon in the game somehow)
sgt: melta bombs

Elites:


Furiso, Librerian Dreadnought-175
(Phsykik Powers are Usualy Wings of Sanguinous, Will Of Hero's/Blood lance)

Terminator Assult Squad-210
2X thunder Hammer

£ Sanguinary Priest-75
Jump Pack

DedIcated Transport:

£ Rhino-35

Drop Pod-45
Locator Beacon


Total: 1500


Also Feel Free to Sugest a Name for my Furiso Librerian, as long as it isn't fred, I already Have a fred the Librerian in my Army

Any Idea's on Stratigies I can use For My armies,

With My Chaos I just Shoot Shoot Shoot then, Just because I know when the Nids Reach me And get to charge I'm dead, I move forward and charge them (I usually Win the first Charge) But then I just get swarmed when I take too many losses by the Second charge)


My BA Army I's Practicly The same Apart From I usually Hit the Nids from the Sides of the Board Taking out as man Synapsy Creatures as Possible Before they Get through whatever Cover Im Using to Slow them Down, And then I run away While the Nids Try to Catch me, Rapid Firing them Each turn (Until of course, As always, a trygon appears In front of my aaaaa-ing troops) they Give in to Blood Rage, Charge It and thats as far as I get haha

Well your taking Huron black heart instead of Daemon princes for one..

Thousand sons arn't that great, personally I'd swap them to plague marines they live longer and so on. And on the drop pod I'm a big fan of everything or nothing. One squad thrown in front isn't going to do much except maybe shoot once then get singled out cause its alone.

Usually I borrow a Rhino from GW (Since I havent Got my own yet, and deep strike most of my army at the sides aswell, Not just one squad,

So what kind of bugs do your nid opponents run that might help us help you

I agree with tha above poster about thousand sons. They are just too expensive for a unit that is often neutralized to being no better than regular CSMs.

I have some limited experience with the bugs. I play a rhino rush chaos list(lash prince and nurgle warptime prince, 3 rhinos w/8 csm, pf, mg, iocg, + oblits or a cult squad, usually NM or zerkers). I havn't faced the super cheese like the doom, but the basics are pretty much the same.

In general:
use high strength and low AP shooting on the big bugs. Their Hq's can be nasty in combat so shoot them down when possible.

multi assault the gaunts and other lesser bugs when possible. you can wipe out both units with combat res, or if you are really lucky one of them will survive to keep you tied up during their turn and unshootable.

Ware of genestealers. Shoot them when possible. They will win most assults or lose but take most of your unit along with them.

Beware the 24" zone of psychic denial they usually bring with them. If you are relying on psychic powers you are going to be taking wounds if you get too close and you won't be getting your powers off.

Lash hurts nids. Nids try to synergize and pulling thing closer to get assaulted, or pushing things away to break up their plans really hurts them. Dual lash is even worse for them, in fact, downright not fun for either side.

units of Obliterators in cover can be a problem for nids. They can dish out plasma cannons and las cannons at long range, and switch to twin linked plasma guns and twin linked flamers at close range. Not fun for the bugs. Their 2+/4++ can be a problem for the nids shooting as well.

In general it is ofen a good idea to sit back and shoot as you will probalby out gun them, and much of their force will be CC oriented. Then you can choose the assaults you want when they get closer.

k thanks, For My chaos army I'll Get a 10man squad and Go mad with green stuff for plage marines (the one thing I can make with green stuff lol) and yea, Oblitirators a good Idea, I just hate Metal Models, Such a pain to put together and I havent mastered the art of the Superglue yet lol,

Usually There's a trygon Prime, couple of carnifexes mabie a hive tyrant or swarm lord depending on the player and waves and waves of Termagaunts/Homogaunts usually, 1 full Squad of genestealers and a brude lord (That usually don't survive long...)

Don't worry so much, Tyranid units are fragile. Poor armor saves all around. Only few models have invul saves. The models in this army is meant to die easily.

Once you play a couple more games against this army and understand the army, it's cake for lunch.

Also Shadow in the Warp is 12", not 24".

It would be way over powered if its 24"

You can cover the whole board with shadows of the warp

It used to be...

Yeah, it used to cover the board, but it wasn't as strong as in this version where psykers can still get perils.

One word: boltguns. Hi strength, decent ap and lots of shots. Get as many as possible and shoot up the hordes and nid warriors. AC (assault and auto) are great against all those MC too.

Dont thousand sons have AP3 bolters? (seen it posted a few times now)
If thats the case, then they are worth taking for that alone.
The ability to remove saves from 99% of the nid list is something worth using.

Sure enough it wont be wounding a T6 trygon very quickly, but a unit using rapid fire (20 shots) will do damage.

I think heav support like vindi's would be a nice thing though.
Large armour ignoring pie plates allways work well against horde, and theres a nice chance you can drop it onto multiple units and drop wounds onto bigger bugs at the same time.



Other than unit choice, hang back.
Deploy as far back as possible and hug the edge, trying to keep units a few inches away from each other.
May sound dumb to group up units, but it prevents DS'ing units and MC's popping up between your units.

However, dont do this if they have a mawloc, since it will more than likely get more kills from it.



Last bit of advice: Take power weps.
Anything that can remove a save from a TMC is worth its weight in gold.
Fists are nice, but need to survive the nid attack before they can use them.

Problem #1: You have a slaneeshi sorcerer with gift of chaos.

If you want to gift of chaos give it to someone with mark of tzeentch because they can use it twice in a row. Gift of chaos without mark of tzeentch is paying full price for half the bang. Go ahead and keep gift of chaos, but give it to your aspiring sorcerer leading the thousand sons instead of your slaneshi HQ.

Give your slaneshi HQ lash of submission. Lash is really powerful against nids as it's easy to avoid the 12" bubble of shadow of the warp.

thanks, I gave my sorcorer slannesh so it could really hero-hunt, with a higher initative than most hero's (with a force wepon) and a phykik power that can turn a hero's unit he's in (or the hero himself) against the unit usually in a unit of bezerkers its quite fun, anyway...

thanks for the advice, I like that nid players never get saves against boltguns anyway, the thousand sons (in rapid fire range are really good against trygons, and carnifexes, stuff that although is hard to wound, doesn't get a save from the wounds that do get though

They could get FNP.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:Dont thousand sons have AP3 bolters? (seen it posted a few times now)
If thats the case, then they are worth taking for that alone.
The ability to remove saves from 99% of the nid list is something worth using.

One word: Cover.
Cover Saves make the AP 3 useless most of the time. It's a fun tool, but TS are too expensive for what they bring.

Kill the Big Bugs. Focus on things such as Tervigons or Hive tyrants and you can effectively kill synapse making the smaller units like termaguands easier to kill.

I play an assault oriented BA list, and charging into a unit of 30 guants with Feel No Pain and Counter assault backed up by a tervigon... not very pleasant, but once you kill the synapse creatures, T3 bugs with a 6+ save are pretty easy to kill.

Watch out for Zoanthropes if you have armour because once the get into 18" range tanks will be taken out real easy... and with that 3+ save its really hard to take them out in shooting, my opinion, assault them so they cant use their very powerful range weapons. Librarians for your BA also do work because they can nulify most of the tyranid's powers.

Since you also play CSM, i suggest obliterators to kill things at range... but I got no more adivce on CSM since I dont play them..

thanks, oblits are a must then and it all goes back down to the ol' shoot da big ones, I figured I'd get some sternguard for my ba, hellfire rounds 20shots hit-3 wound-2 on any kind of nid monster usually does the trick, and also I figured a whirlwind would also actually be quite good, as a str5 ap5 ignores cover "pie plate" (can't actually renember str and ap, I know it's something like that though) usually takes out clumps of nids at once.

The main problem I still seem to be having is hive tyrants.. No matter how many times I smack them with wepons like meltaguns, blood lance, rockets, lascannons and powerfists they still have a couple of wounds left by the time they chomped up a few killpoints, which can definately be quite anoying!

Take lash on the sorc if ur gunna mark it with slaanesh. Drop one of the Preds for another defiler or a vindicator.
Give your berzerker champ a power weapon. Your waisting his furious charge by using a power fist. That +1 I with a power wep is awsome at s5.
I would remove Huron and take another small troop choice or a DP just cuz DP are alot of fun and they look beautifal on the board.

I may be getting a dp soon (the new plastic kit) and lash on the sorcorer I will do against nids ay ay ay I picked a bad tim to spend quite a bit of money on my ba army ah ha ha, guess Im getting a summer job

one more problem about me getting a dp: I have no retinue for him


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I don't know what I can get for a retinue for him mabie termies or raptors if he has wings

DP are MC's and as such can't join units.

schadenfreude wrote:Problem #1: You have a slaneeshi sorcerer with gift of chaos.

If you want to gift of chaos give it to someone with mark of tzeentch because they can use it twice in a row.

Sorry to backtrack, but I thought you couldn't use the same power twice (P50ish). - Edit: I've just done some research and I'm probably wrong here. Sorry Schadenfreude!

In other news:

I play nids and am quite happy to see thousand sons. They are silly expensive, kill my swarms of gaunts just as easily as all the other bolters and die just as easily when I swarm them. As a rule, plague marines are a better unit. Not to say that TSs are useless. PMs just seem to be better in a lot of situations.

I'd recommend sticking with the powerfists over power weapons. Sure I5 PWs are great, but you'll really miss the fist the first time you get counter charged by a hive tyrant.

Vindicators are good for the little bigs and can hurt the big ones just as easily.

Krak missiles ID Warriors.


Most Nids aren't immune to ID.


if you go shooty bring Dual Lash. once he gets close lash him away. Lash out of cover.

Drop all Assault Units except for one heavy unit, particularly Terminators. The 2+ Sv and Power Fist+Storm Bolter does good for killing gaunts. I play BA and SW and for me the best plan is to just sit back and shoot. The AP5 on the boltguns is enough to kill a Nid outright. Bulk out on Tactical Squads and Devastator Units with Missile Launchers. The frag missile is AP6 and 5 hits to a Gaunt squad will do damage. Take a hero with a plasma pistol and power fist. If they have Tyrgon they can spawn anywhere on the field and assualt. All bad for you unless youre prepared.

HoverBoy wrote:DP are MC's and as such can't join units.

While the answer arrived at is correct, being a MC has nothing to do with why the DP can not be in a unit. Just saying.

SanguinaryGuard wrote: If they have Tyrgon they can spawn anywhere on the field and assualt.

They cannot assault after appearing, however. So shoot them if/when they do so.

Ohh so d. Can't gave a retinue anyway,

The best thing about Tsons is their 4+ invun but yeh your right their silly expensive

Does anyone know how much the dp plastic kit will cost and when it comes out?

I figured an extra unit of norm CSM with flamer (or) meltagun and heavy bolter, just to add as much firepower as possible (mabie plagemarines not csm)

the one bug that always screws me is the hive tyrant, ant idea on how to kill that, I have dreads in both army's and would it be a good idea to smack a hiveT with a dredpf. Also most hiveT's at my club have boneswords.

Slow down there champ tyrants are very high I and tend to have lash whips most walkers can't match up to getting 4 monstrous attacks to the face before getting to hit themselfs. what i've lost my tyrants to most when playing against CSM is melta havocs – the thing has 4 wounds you have 4 meltas a perfect match

good idea thanks, with my chaos army what about the defiler, battle cannon, autocannon and 5 dreadcc attacks will that work or will it end up just being torn to pieces

I'm surprised that no one has suggested noise marines.

Sure they are kind of expensive (money-wise) but a unit of 8 of them with sonic blasters and a rhino is cheaper then your TS squad and should kill about 8 genestealers per turn or a little more then 10 gaunts a turn assuming they just park it in a building.

And this has already been said, but IMO is still highly important.

Krak missiles inflict ID on warriors.

Although off the top of my head only one CSM unit can take ML, you have lascannons and a defiler right?

EDIT: I forgot one other useful tactic, take combi-plas for your termies. A unit of 5 with those will really ruin a Hive Tyrant's day.

Sure they can get hot but, assuming rapid fire range, you'll get about 6-7 hits and should come out with 4 wounds. A tyrant only has 4 wounds.

Probably better ways to kill a Tyrant, but termicide is always fun.