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It is supposed to be a new list.
Having had my old BA Codex pull a vanishing act, I emailed the guys at GWCanada and asked if I should track down a BA Codex, or if I would have to haul around a couple of WD's.
The response told me to hold off buying the dex, and that yes- I would have to carry around the WD's for a while.
(I had kinda ranted about having to carry around numerous issues during 3rd edition)

No idea what changes may have been made, but (afaic) it's confirmed that aren't a reprint of the older dex.

Posted By Hexx on 03/08/2007 4:56 PM

The response told me to hold off buying the dex, and that yes- I would have to carry around the WD's for a while.
(I had kinda ranted about having to carry around numerous issues during 3rd edition)

No idea what changes may have been made, but (afaic) it's confirmed that aren't a reprint of the older dex.

Well, if it's split fluff and rules cleanly between the two issues you'd only have to carry around the issue with the army list/rules.

 

 

 

Which is why I'm expecting it'll be something like an armoury and rules in one issue, and the army list itself in another.
Sperating the fluff and rules just sounds to easy..

Posted By 5thelement on 03/08/2007 3:05 PM
Its genius to take the number one selling army in the game and break it up that way....Look at it from a money standpoint, GW sure does.
I really like the fact that SOOOO many people that play marines now have a very wide selection to choose from. And not one of them plays the same. Its almost like haveing differant races there so differant now.

Dont take the fluff and fun out of someone elses pot of gold man.

Yeah, because there is such a huge difference between one marine chapter and another, right?

Dont get me wrong, good for GW to ride the money mule until it dies a horrible death, but it inst neccessary to have umpteen marine dex's.

I am sure they can fit all the fluff for various chapters within 80+ pages of dex. The armies arent that complicated.

Toughness 4? Check
 WS 4? Check
BS 4? Check
Armor save 3+? Check
etc

Judging by looking at my DA codex, they could have easily compressed the rules and fluff into less than 10 pages. You dont need two seperate entries detailing what a certain unit is, sorry. Its a waste of space and wood pulp, frankly.

Says you. Every time a book is released with just rules; the masses cry foul about fluff.

Every time a book is released light on rules, the gamers cry foul about uniqueness and playabiilty and competitive edge.

Cut them some slack. They release stuff that tries to appeal to everyone, but of course will always hack off someone.

Despite popular opinion, the 1ntern37 is not the majority. But man are they vocal.

Wow you BA guys are sensitive fragile flowers aren't you...

Next up: Codex Emo Marines.

Posted By Hexx on 03/08/2007 4:56 PM
It is supposed to be a new list.
Having had my old BA Codex pull a vanishing act, I emailed the guys at GWCanada and asked if I should track down a BA Codex, or if I would have to haul around a couple of WD's.
The response told me to hold off buying the dex, and that yes- I would have to carry around the WD's for a while.
(I had kinda ranted about having to carry around numerous issues during 3rd edition)

No idea what changes may have been made, but (afaic) it's confirmed that aren't a reprint of the older dex.

Just make a photocopy or scan for personal use only. Problem solved.

 

Posted By jfrazell on 03/09/2007 6:15 AM

Wow you BA guys are sensitive fragile flowers aren't you...

Nah, just not cynical gamers who read evil intent into everything....

Posted By Achilles on 03/09/2007 6:27 AM

 

Posted By jfrazell on 03/09/2007 6:15 AM

Wow you BA guys are sensitive fragile flowers aren't you...

Nah, just not cynical gamers who read evil intent into everything....

I can respect that.

Then sadly you and I seem to be in the Minority....

Posted By Hellfury on 03/07/2007 4:14 PM
since they dont print rules in WD anymore, totally removing any semblance of usefulness from the mag,

And there's no coincidence that my WD collection runs from 211 until recently, completely uninterrupted.  I just had to stop buying it when I realised I was paying $10 for a monthly catalogue 

Hi, I'm Big O and I played BA's at one time. *clap, clap*

I can admit, they are overpowered.




First step is admitting you have a problem.

oh yes BA are so damn overpowering. The UKGT thread clearly shows that BA angels and Assault cannon weild Marines are winning everything. Oh wait, they are not. hmmm that's strange. I guess some people just won't be happy until every red marine is dead and unplayable.

Personally I hope GW really screw orks over, make them the even crappier than they are now. See it's not so nice when someone wishes ill on your army.

Get back to me with the whining when BA are as powerful as Godzilla Nids.

Well I play chaos, and have played IW in the past, so I'm used to people wishing ill on my army...

No need to take it personally.

Blood Angels have been GT winners in the US in 4th edition, and are certainly a strong army. I wouldn?t call them OMFG broken, but the Chaplain w/DC is underpriced, and subject to serious abuses with a list maximized to beef up that DC (lots of tacs and scouts with naked vet sgts).

Other BA players have little bit more perspective.

Wishing ill on Orks? For shame.

The worst part is when they see your army and say well yours looks fine. But they still continue to whine and recount every crime committed against them by a Blood Angels player. Real and imagined.

In 3rd edition I never had a problem with them. Raging out of their transports was a nice balance to their extra-speedy Rhino rush. When GW eventually FAQed that so that troops in Rhinos didn?t jump out, was when they first seemed a little over the top to me. I did meet a number of BA players before that who misplayed the rule, and they certainly made a bad impression for everyone else.

I hate godzilla Nids, I cant beet them ever. when It comes to BA I can beet them quite esily, (that from playing against my brothers BA all the way from 2nd to 4th edition)

See we keep the same armies from when we started 14 years ago up unitill now, NOT cos they are Pwoerfull but we like the colour red and grey (for SW~) an we like the fluff.

Posted By jfrazell on 03/09/2007 6:15 AM

Wow you BA guys are sensitive fragile flowers aren't you...

More like an old war wound that flares up and is annoying.

I like BA, in fact it would be the one chapter I would play by the book. (i.e paint like GW paints them, the whole nine yards)

The sad thing is, the only things that keep me from starting one, is:

1. My own conscience. I know in my heart that the chappy /DC combo is underpriced. hats of to BA players who use termies, because I have never once, not one single time, have I ever seen BA termies fielded.

2. what others would say when I bring them to the table. There is a stigma that is there (rightfully so in some cases) for BA.

No thanks. I dropped an army in third ed because of that crap. BT were just as abusable as BA if not more so. I had to drop them like a bad heroin habit because everyone simply refused to play me when I fielded that army.

Of course, they whined like little girls when I put the whoop down on them using Chapter approved Sisters lists and DE, but thats another story....

What just exactly is overpowered about BA now that Rhino Rush is dead?

- Greenie

Lets see, I dont think the BA are overpowered as a whole, but the death company needs to be seriously neutered. Though I do have to say that getting furious charge for free is a bit overpowered for the army as a whole, but not a subject for me to call the army cheesy by any means.

Death Company get the following for free:

• Furious charge
• Jumpacks or rhino (jumpacks being the obvious choice)
  
• Fearless
• ignore normal wounds on a 4+

Now I realize that chaplains do cost more than a normal chaplain, but they also get 4 to 6 DC included in that cost. That price increase would be overcosted by 20 points if those DC were normal marines, but they are not.

I suppose people could argue that the freebies that DC get are included in the increased price of the chaplain, but seriously, do you really think that 20-50 points for that units abilities are comensurate with balance?

While DC do not have access to heavy weapons, I would hardly call that a drawback. They get 5 initiative and 5 strength on the charge, able to reroll to hit rolls, ignore normal wounds on a 4+, moving 12" a turn, ignore morale checks all for the price of a normal marine.

If those marines that were removed from the squads made them non scoring (assuming a lucky roll of a few 6's in a squad) then it might not be so bad. But trying to get VP from a very tough unit to take out being only 15 points per DC marine is a kick in the nuts when tallying victory point totals.

The DC is abused by people taking units expecting it to be fodder for the rage. I think if people were to take BA termies (so rare I have never seen such) or other units making the loss of a model to the DC a hard option, then it would be more balanced as there is some negative to the glaring bonuses.

I dont think it would be very hard to make BA a more balanced army while still making them very flavorful. I just hope they dont get nerfed as much as the DA did. If that were to happen, taking a very nearly balanced list and making it crippled (in the DA's case), I could expect BA to be nearly umnplayable if DA are to be used as any example.

Here is my most typical list when I field BA (abbreviated):

Chaplain w. jump pack + DC

Sanguinary High Priest w. jump pack + HG (terminator honors & squad characters)

7 tactical Marines w. meltagun + veteran sergeant w. powerfist in drop pod

7 tactical Marines w. plasma gun + veteran sergeant w. powerfist in drop pod

5 scouts w. 4x bolters + HB + veteran sergeant w. teleport homer & sniper rifle

Furiso in drop pod

Venerable in drop pod

6x terminators w. assault cannon

The thing that people always fail to mention when complaining about DC is that their size is randomly determined. I have had far more games with 4 - 6 DC Marines in comparsion to the 11+ DC Marines I always hear people crying about. In fact I was in a tournament where twice three of my terminators went to the DC. my list is based on the restrictions that were presented for Flesh Tearers and for the most part I have stuck with it. Sure you can field lots of min las/plas squads with naked veteran sergeants but not everyone that plays BA does so.

Are DC underpriced for what you get?

jump pack (no one uses the free Rhino amymore)
terminator honors
Feel No Pain
Furious Charge

I reckon they are and this will be addressed in the new 4th edition codex. Until then I will enjoy playing my BA and hopefully so afterwards. Anyone that played an army like Rhino Rushing Templars and says this army is broken is not telling the whole story in my opinion.

- Greenie

Posted By 5thelement on 03/08/2007 2:51 PM

Death company is paid for in points and in MANY other ways..

No, it isnt. Its a free unit with jumppacks. 3 plus a d3 before rolling, You either have to hit with krak missles or lascannons to make them stay down, or powerweapons in combat.

Sorry, but their not. Not even close.

Posted By Green Bloater on 03/18/2007 1:23 PM
Anyone that played an army like Rhino Rushing Templars and says this army is broken is not telling the whole story in my opinion.

- Greenie

I fail to see how that remark has anything to do with the price of beans in peru, but likewise, I feel the same way about BA players who defend BA as an unbroken army is not telling the whole story either.

*shrug*

But I guess its just the majority of BA players who feel the army itself is perfectly fine and doesnt need any changes.

Posted By beef on 03/09/2007 3:01 PM
I hate godzilla Nids, I cant beet them ever. when It comes to BA I can beet them quite esily, (that from playing against my brothers BA all the way from 2nd to 4th edition)

Stop throwing vegtables at them and you stand a chance.....

Broken armies list:

Godzilla Nidz
Rhino Rush SW, BA, BT, Khorne Berzerkers
Deamon bomb Undivided
Feral Orks
Mech Tau/Eldar
Armored Company
min/max SAFH IW
min/max SM

Every major army out there is overpowered according to someone or aonther, Hell Orks and DE are overpowered in my opinion.

40k is overpowered, Lets not play anymore.

Cmon guys grow up, Every army at one stage or another has been overpowered and usually when it gets redone they iron out some of the problems, when was BA released? way back in 3rd so compared to the newer stuff its overpowered. But put it back in its original setting when SW and templars and Khorne could all rhino rush Ba's were not that overpowered.

Posted By Green Bloater on 03/18/2007 2:20 PM
Broken armies list:

Godzilla Nidz
Rhino Rush SW, BA, BT, Khorne Berzerkers
Deamon bomb Undivided
Feral Orks
Mech Tau/Eldar
Armored Company
min/max SAFH IW
min/max SM

...I wouldn't even consider half of those lists broken

Care to explain how Mechanized Marines is overpowered? (lol?)

Or mech Tau, or Armored Company, or Feral Orks (Actually I think thats the first time I have EVER seen someone say any ork list is overpowered) Are they solid lists?  Yes.  Overpowered?  Hardly.

Most of the rest of those only have one or two items/units/equipment that even make it argueable that they are overpowered.  (Holofields spring readily to mind)

In fact, the only 2 lists on there that I would put down as overpowered is Godzilla Nids and IW.  (And I think the IW one is questionable)