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gdurant wrote:The crazy thing is,

it would in no way what so ever hurt GW to keep the LatD rules legal[u]

wether or not they realized a profit it keep the fans happy. They don'r have to produce anything they aren't already making.
They could take five minute to update the list or they could just say that it is only usable with the 3rd edition list.

I can see why they wouldn't want to do that though. You don't
want too many current versions of rules running around.

I second the idea of sending some sprue with your letter.

Perhaps we should start a LaTD thread for people to post pictures of their armies and what they bought for them with a price total. We could start putting some sales figures on the LaTD. Once we can show there is more to the loss of LaTD then just internet moaning, we can start moving forward with GW.

thats not a bad idea, all we need is for someone to make the thread.......

Like Jfrazell said earliar use counts as or failing that trash the army. If you love it so much I am sure you will still play it but just not with the out of date rules.

Also in regards to keeping the old rules as a pdf or download or whatever how many lists are they supposed to keep running?? eventually somebody will complain that they dont make models for this list they printed and so the complaint will continue. Its easier to be done with that army.

Besides it was crap anyway.

@Eazy E, as for petitioning etc. People on the internet tend to be lazy, hence we are indoors on a computer rather than outside in the world. dont get your hopes up. People find it easiar to complain and jump on the band wagon even if they dont have any interest in the issue. They just see which way the tide is flowing and go with it. Unfortunatly thats the reality of the internet. Free thinkers NOT welcome.

Give me a day to get a picture or two to start the LaTD thread army thread.

Don't worry Beef my hopes aren't up at all.

*** Warning mini-rant ahead***
It's just that in so many aspects of my life I see people, governments and companies saying and doing things that I don't like. They are essentially holding a big sign in front of me that says..."Boo hoo you don't like it. What are YOU going to do about it? You have no power." Well, you know what; "F" that. I'm going to do something about it. Do I expect results? Not really. Do I think I can "win"? Not really. However, how will I ever know if I let them just roll over me all the time. I'm mad as hell... AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE IT ANYMORE! Please note, this isn't just directed at GW either.
****End Rant***

give me a minute and I'll take some picutres form the 70 or so IG Zombies I have still unpainted lying around somewhere.

you know what? screw this. I still wanna build this army. hey H..... you've got revisited LatD Projekt lying around somewhere, don't you? mind if we take a look?

VIVE LA LATD!!!!!!!! i'll start takeing photos of my army too

and so it begins the day that the latd players march on GW watch out here comes old models and a sac full of dice

Kid_Kyoto wrote:How about this for a GRAND SUPER ULTIMATE L&D SUBING PLAN

Codex Daemon Hunters
Fallen IG = IG
CSM = Grey Knights (assume they're possesed)
Cultists = Witch Hunter Loonies (from WD)
Mutants = Kroot (who can ally with DH)
Demons = ??? Archeoflagellents? Kroot?

'snot great but it's tempting. And with screening back in 5th edition (according to rumors) mixed IG/SM armies will be a lot more viable.

Argh! I can see at least 3 things wrong with this advice.

1) Cultists = Witch Hunter Loonies (from WD)
How long do you think these guys are going to be legal? There are no official models and their rules can only be found in a Chapter Approved article in an old WD. Sound familiar?

2) Mutants = Kroot (who can ally with DH)
Again, the problem here is that allied Kroot are on the same Jervis dog house as the LatD - he just hasn't gotten around to invalidating them yet. Don't expect to be able to take Kroot allies after the Tau codex gets redone.

3) mixed IG/SM
If/when the Inquisition codex gets (re)done it may be radically different than the DH/WH ones we have now. In particular, there's no guarantee that it will still allow the use of mixed IG/SM. That may end up going to Apocalypseland.

If you've just had your army's rules invalidated, what's the point of rejiggering them to work with a "counts as" ruleset if those rules are just going to get invalidated in a year or two? How many times do you have to get burned to learn your lesson? Do you like the prospect of having to find a new "counts as" ruleset every couple of years? If not then I've got some advice for you. Just use Codex: Space Marines. It's really the safest bet.

Codex Space Marines
Fallen IG = Space Marines
CSM = Space Marines
Cultists = Space Marines
Mutants = Space Marines
Demons = Space Marines

This approach will work with any army. Alpha Legion? Space Marines. Genestealer Cult? Space Marines. Squats? Space Marines. Pan Fo? Space Marines.

Space Marines - it's the only way to be sure.

Why don't you just use it for friendly games? Most opponents won't care if you just update the list yourself to reflect the new CSM Codex and play with it. I still play with my old Genestealer cult from the Citadel Journal. It works exactly the same with 4th edition and no one complains. In fact, they're happy to see it.

Tourneys schmourneys.

You expected an army of the damned to be embraced and supported ?

/devilsadvocate

Not to ask a really stupid question, but has anybody had any success in lobbying their gaming group/FLGS/RTT to simply allowing LATD, using the old codex?

AFter all, the list survived the transition in IG codices, why not simply allow it as an artifact?

Obviously "official" GW stuff won't allow it, but anything local could.

gdurant wrote:The crazy thing is,

it would in no way what so ever hurt GW to keep the LatD rules legal[u]

wether or not they realized a profit it keep the fans happy. They don'r have to produce anything they aren't already making.
They could take five minute to update the list or they could just say that it is only usable with the 3rd edition list.

Jervis told me a WD list is out. It's either a full codex or nothing at all.

I think the issue is more with marketing than with sales. GW wants everything neatly packaged, with no "figuring out" or searching for the army list, miniatures, etc. In GW's ideal future, little Billy picks up the codex from the shelf, gives it a quick read and picks out some units, walks over to the next shelf and picks up the accompanying plastic boxed sets, each clearly marked as belonging to that codex. Inside, each set has all the options from the codex already existing on the sprue.

A WD LatDlist just doesn't fit that game plan. It makes sense that GW wants to make things as packaged and idiot-proof as possible, since they need to expand beyond their little niche market in order to grow. Whether that's even possible is of course a whole 'nuther debate.

I told Jervis that the GW of 10 or even 5 years ago would have updated the list, and I miss the days when they were more about good ideas and cool stuff than manufacturing and packaging efficiencies. *shrug*

I suppose that most players I usually hang out with would be happy to see it. a fiend of mines working on a rouge trade regiment, which I'm also very much looking forward to see the final product

beef wrote:Besides it was crap anyway.

Christ I hate comments like this. You might as well finish the line with '... and all LatD players are poo-heads and have girl cooties!'.

Your opinion, Beef, was that you didn't like the list. As you can see from this thread and the many threads before it, there were a lot of people who liked (if not loved), the LatD list. It wasn't 'crap anyway', and if you truly consider that to be some sort of argument, then you need to find a way to move your IQ into the double-digits.

My foundation can help you. PM Torador and he'll set you up with a room.

BYE

I got cooties in Tijuana once.

True story.

no beed, it was not, just crap. it happens to be one of the most interesting armies GW ever published. EVER.

screw this, were are my zombies!

Play the army you want to, and if they think they can take it away, send it back to GW, crushed in a box with a get well soon card in it.

They will find out within the next quarter or so how well that Jervis and Gav the noob have started down the slippery slope of failure. I say play the army until the wheels fall off, and then play it some more.

I started the Army photo thread here:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/207246.page

Sadly, with little Billy being a Walmart shopper, that's where the pre-painted minis will be and the hobby will be a bleak place to be.

Billy does not drive sales. This is not tobacco. You can't hook them now, get them for life. Most kids outgrow this stuff. We didn't.

/sigh

That's it! Sell them with cigarettes!

I'm a genius. Bask.

They should just make them out of cigarettes so that we have to keep buying more.

@malfred & @Platuan4th - Truly you guys are genius, but why not take it a step further and make them out of alcohol filled cigarettes? That way when they say your army is illegal you just consume it and run around the game store naked asking the owner why he closes his eyes when you make love... err...

gdurant wrote:it would in no way what so ever hurt GW to keep the LatD rules legal

wether or not they realized a profit it keep the fans happy. They don'r have to produce anything they aren't already making.
They could take five minute to update the list or they could just say that it is only usable with the 3rd edition list.

There is two problems with that:

1) The 3rd ed. Daemon Prince is 100 times better than the current one.

2) Apparently the "new" DP that is going to be in the new Daemon Codex will be much stronger than the one in the CSM.

So, I can see GeeW saying that there are to many DP to choose from so no to the "just use the army list as is." But, don't get me wrong, I would love nothing more than being able to use my LatD. And not it being a Datafax.

I will add to the post on the modeling page. It will just be on Mon or Tues. Busy weekend. Oh! I do like the idea of sending a letter with some spur pieces to GeeW. If it gets organized, I'll be getting a stamp or two ready.

Stormtrooper X wrote:@malfred & @Platuan4th - Truly you guys are genius, but why not take it a step further and make them out of alcohol filled cigarettes? That way when they say your army is illegal you just consume it and run around the game store naked asking the owner why he closes his eyes when you make love... err...

Lighting that up would be dangerous indeed.