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But Necros, this is yet another catch 22 for GW.

Some players feel it's a bit off that if they want a particularl upgrade, they have to buy the additional sprue, which is understandable.


BUT, had they included it, some players would feel it's a bit off that the price is higher for particular upgrades they just aren't going to use.

I think this is an interesting experiment. Perhaps we will see various race-specific vehicle upgrade sprues in time? I know Forgeworld offer some upgrades, so this might have proven profitable enough now to make them a 'mainstream' release.

Who knows? Not me I'm afraid. The above, as ever, is 100% speculation and is not, repeat not to be taken as a rumour.

Perhaps we will see various race-specific vehicle upgrade sprues in time?

I hope so, I love accessories/bitz sprues. I'd love one for Tau.

thinking about it, maybe the new sprue will come as a 'free bonus' in one of the new ork boxed sets, at least for the large army box that I presume will be updated for all the new models

Personally I think its a great option and certainly beats paying Forge world upgrade prices. Not only that they'll be no warping and the pieces are sure to fit.

As a footnote it has always baffled me why people winge about prices and GW policy. The new plastics are cheap in terms of the quantity and quality, provide endless variations/poses and above all are fun to build. No other game system does this, GW fill the niche in terms of war gaming and so why winge and yet still support them!!

rhuilic merc wrote:As a footnote it has always baffled me why people winge about ... GW

Well how else would I fill my day?

BYE

H.B.M.C. wrote:

rhuilic merc wrote:As a footnote it has always baffled me why people winge about ... GW

Well how else would I fill my day?

BYE

By spending many painful hours building resin superheavies?

GW : hay everyone BUY OUR NEW KIT.... we know it dosent come with everything you need... so, BUY THE NEW FRAME as well

rhuilic merc wrote:As a footnote it has always baffled me why people winge about ... GW

It's always baffled me why people spell whine winge.

Real orks make dethrollas out of toilet paper tubes and spiky bits.

Mehh...Unless one is planing on making more then one battle wagon with a Deff Rolla its a one time buy,I'll get it,use the Deff Rolla and various other bits and I'm sure any remaining bits will eventuly find themselves affixed to something .
I like the idea of upgrade sprues,just a shame this will be direct order only.

Platuan4th wrote:

rhuilic merc wrote:As a footnote it has always baffled me why people winge about ... GW

It's always baffled me why people spell whine winge.

He was probably going for:

whinge
   /ʰwɪndʒ, wɪndʒ/ [hwinj, winj]
–verb (used without object), whinged, whing⋅ing. British and Australian Informal.
to complain; whine.

Origin:
bef. 1150; dial. (Scots, N England), earlier Scots quhynge, OE hwinsian (not recorded in ME); c. OHG winsōn (G winseln); deriv. of Gmc base of whine

Alpharius wrote:

Platuan4th wrote:

rhuilic merc wrote:As a footnote it has always baffled me why people winge about ... GW

It's always baffled me why people spell whine winge.

He was probably going for:

whinge
   /ʰwɪndʒ, wɪndʒ/ [hwinj, winj]
–verb (used without object), whinged, whing⋅ing. British and Australian Informal.
to complain; whine.

Origin:
bef. 1150; dial. (Scots, N England), earlier Scots quhynge, OE hwinsian (not recorded in ME); c. OHG winsōn (G winseln); deriv. of Gmc base of whine

Ah, good to know, thanks.

ShumaGorath wrote:Real orks make dethrollas out of toilet paper tubes and spiky bits.

a real ork gathers bitz and gubbins from wherever and isn't afraid to bust someone else's teef in order to steal the new contraptions from another ork.. let's cut the puritanical bull about real orks only convert, otherwise, we'd all have crappy looking papertowel armies.. as elitist as that comes off, it's nothing more than cheap drivel .... why not use a sprue with things to make it look cool?

two_heads_talking wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Real orks make dethrollas out of toilet paper tubes and spiky bits.

a real ork gathers bitz and gubbins from wherever and isn't afraid to bust someone else's teef in order to steal the new contraptions from another ork.. let's cut the puritanical bull about real orks only convert, otherwise, we'd all have crappy looking papertowel armies.. as elitist as that comes off, it's nothing more than cheap drivel .... why not use a sprue with things to make it look cool?

And let's cut the crap about using paper towel stuff. It's bad material, and won't hold up to any use or abuse. REAL orks use PVC, since it's cheap and durable....

When this Deff Rolla kit is launched GW should also issue an FAQ that says Deff Rolla's affect vehicles. They'll sell loads.

I haven't seen the frames in the Battlewagon box, so everything I'm saying is pure speculation (keep that in mind please).


But, unless there is some big gaping hole on the Battlewagon frames that isn't filled with some other gubbin', the fact is that a Deffrolla couldn't have just been added to the existing frames without some other option being removed. And Deffrollas tend to be pretty big compared to other vehicle upgrades so they likely would have had to exclude several other upgrades to fit the rolla onto the frame.

And while hardcore players might certainly think that including a deffrolla in the kit at the expense of any of the other upgrades the truth is that there are a whole lot of players out there who do like to build their Battlewagons with a wide variety of different upgrades. So for the mass market it definitely does make more sense to include as many options as possible even if that means leaving out one of the potentially most popular.

Of course, you could say that GW should have simply included the extra frame with the deffrolla in the box. They could have done that, but then the price of the kit would have had to be increased and, who knows, maybe even the overall size of the box may have had to be enlarged (I don't know how packed the actual box is currently). No matter how you look at it, adding a frame generally means the cost of the kit has to be increased and that never makes people happy, especially those players who are building a battlewagon without a deffrolla.

Now, in the past GW simpy would have not included the option period. That's how they used to do it (Eldar kits tend to come with none of their vehicle upgrades). The fact that they've been making more of an effort in the last few years to include most (if not all) of the unit's upgrades is a great thing and I believe that offering upgrades they aren't able to fit onto the basic kit's frames as an additional purchase is a really positive sign.

Vehicle upgrades are options that not every player uses, and in many cases are relatively easy for players to create on their own if they don't feel the upgrade kit's purchase price is fair. Forgeworld has been offering vehicle upgrades kits for some time now (Tau and Eldar) and it would be great if GW started to offer the same kind of thing but with cheaper and easier to model plastic.


I guess I'm just seeing the glass half full here.

Envy89 wrote:GW : hay everyone BUY OUR NEW KIT.... we know it dosent come with everything you need... so, BUY THE NEW FRAME as well

Optional Upgrades which are relatively easy to convert? Hardly something you need. Might be something you want!

Besides, if they had included the Deffrolla in the box the kit would cost more than a Land Raider. Which is a little more than you want to pay really.

BigToof wrote:

two_heads_talking wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:Real orks make dethrollas out of toilet paper tubes and spiky bits.

a real ork gathers bitz and gubbins from wherever and isn't afraid to bust someone else's teef in order to steal the new contraptions from another ork.. let's cut the puritanical bull about real orks only convert, otherwise, we'd all have crappy looking papertowel armies.. as elitist as that comes off, it's nothing more than cheap drivel .... why not use a sprue with things to make it look cool?

And let's cut the crap about using paper towel stuff. It's bad material, and won't hold up to any use or abuse. REAL orks use PVC, since it's cheap and durable....

Exactly.. PVC all the way.. or plastic gubbinz on sprues..

Sorry if this has been coverd elsewere but, are rokkits included either with the battle wagon kit or on the direct order sprue?
I plan to get the sprue anyway,but it would be nice to have a better idea whats on it.

pleas pics, pleas, pretty pleas

IRC rokkit launchers are not included with the kit, though these can easily be converted from your big shootas.

No rokkits on the kit sadly. The breakdown of parts is in the january white dwarf.

I quite like this idea and think it should be extended to all the armies. GW are now making an effort to allow players to have all the options available in the Codexes...after all, how many years is it now since the original Battlewagon went out of production? 15 or more I think.

GW mail order have told me that they intend to produce models of 'everything' in each Codex, which is something to look forward to; whether they do it as upgrade sprues or full boxed releases is anybody's guess (however, they have no intention of putting out a dedicated Dreadnought Drop Pod as they reckon it wouldn't sell enough models...poo!!).

I have also heard they are supposed to be producing Gretchin mob box sets along with the new Stormboyz due out in the first quarter of 2009.

The Grot boxed set is old new. The box will contain ten plastic grots, ten to twelve grot heads, one runtherder and all his upgrades as found in the codex.

GREAT FIND THERE!

TheSecretSquig wrote:GW do this for one specific reason. If I want a battlewagon, I'll buy it from Ebay with a 20% discount on GW store price. But if I want the Battlewagon with a Death Roller (which every Ork player will want) you have to order your Battlewagon from GW, and thus pay full price for it.

It's simpler than that.

The new battlewagon costs £35, same as a Land Raider. But they want to charge more, so charge £5-£10 for the upgrade.

Would you complain at a £40 Battlewagon pricetag, I would. So split it over installments.

Note that the gun on the battlewagon big turret is now therefore confirmed as the kannon (it did look a little small). The upgrades people would most want are those seperate, the deffrolla and killkannon, thus most buyers will want something from the 'add on sprue'. The battlewagon box, the new standard box size is not brim full, and plastic costs ext to nothing, there would be no 'loss' in providing the full kit in the one box at one price; just no extra gain.

Finally its a plastic sprue, not metal add on parts or forgeworld resin. Therefore it cannot remotely be considered a real add on, it would have been designed alongside the orginal kit at more or less the same time, the presale engineering timelag for plastic being substantially longer than for other mediums.

This is purely a way to split the cost and raise the defacto full price of the battlewagon. Though the direct order limitation will come into it, I think that is a 'beneficial' side effect. Besides if you want only part of the upgrade sprue you can still get it third party via bits sites and save some money, just not the regular 20%-25% off we now come to use.

Also, the parts on the upgrade sprue are largely convertable if you don't want to spend any more than you already have.

Meh, Horses for Courses really.

Orlanth wrote:
Note that the gun on the battlewagon big turret is now therefore confirmed as the kannon (it did look a little small). The upgrades people would most want are those seperate, the deffrolla and killkannon, thus most buyers will want something from the 'add on sprue'. The battlewagon box, the new standard box size is not brim full, and plastic costs ext to nothing, there would be no 'loss' in providing the full kit in the one box at one price; just no extra gain.

I'd like to argue that point, mainly because that's what i always thought... apparently to get the quality GW actually pay a hell of a lot for plastic.

Was told to me by a guy who used to work at GW. I'm not a fanboi by any means.

Indeed. The setup costs of a sprue are very high. Some plastic kits never pay back the cost it made to make them, though with the greater push toward plastic, it certainly appears GW has a way round it.