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May i remind people that you can no longer refer to someone as black the PC term is coloured.
Suffused with the dying memories of Sanguinus, the warriors of the Death Company seek only one thing: death in battle fighting against the enemies of the Emperor.
Going off topic slightly here, but i just wanted to ask something thats allways wound me up
Now, im by no means a racist person (i would lose my job if i was)
but now we find all these rappers refering to each other by the N word (much like i call someone a mate or a bud) yet thats fine.
Someone of another colour says it and its instant racism.
Ive just wondered that if it was so offensive, why do they use it as a friendly name to eachother?
Suffused with the dying memories of Sanguinus, the warriors of the Death Company seek only one thing: death in battle fighting against the enemies of the Emperor.
JD21290 wrote:May i remind people that you can no longer refer to someone as black the PC term is coloured.
Funny actually, some people say You should call them Coloured, not Black.
Others say Coloured is patronising and therefore Racist. So you should call them Black.
Words are both powerful and powerless, the fact I couldn't write the N word even though I used it in an example of how it's used badly proves Context doesnt matter anymore, its the word itself (which I believe is wrong).
Back on topic though, I'm defo converting my orks to Nazis with Hearts and Rainbows everywhere, and I'm gonna make a Hitler ork and I'll think of something to make him reeeeeaallly camp
Any ideas?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
JD21290 wrote:Going off topic slightly here, but i just wanted to ask something thats allways wound me up
Now, im by no means a racist person (i would lose my job if i was)
but now we find all these rappers refering to each other by the N word (much like i call someone a mate or a bud) yet thats fine.
Someone of another colour says it and its instant racism.
Ive just wondered that if it was so offensive, why do they use it as a friendly name to eachother?
It's supposed to be the same as if I say, Hey JD21290, your Mum/Sister's a slut when im angry at you, and you'll be really offended. But when I'm angry at my Mother I could call her a whore but thats fine to me, 'cause its my mum, not yours.
Or atleast thats what you're led to believe.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/09/12 00:45:20
Back on topic though, I'm defo converting my orks to Nazis with Hearts and Rainbows everywhere, and I'm gonna make a Hitler ork and I'll think of something to make him reeeeeaallly camp
Any ideas?
Make him this camp and no-one will have a problem..
Except the romper stoma fans... If they see what you've done you'll have to run.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/09/12 00:47:29
Tarondor: While i refer to it as the N word and still dont really understand the way its fully used, i do not use it for obvious reasons.
i wish people make thier mind up, as constant change will result in a once bread PC community will become non PC due to word changes.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
It's supposed to be the same as if I say, Hey JD21290, your Mum/Sister's a slut when im angry at you, and you'll be really offended. But when I'm angry at my Mother I could call her a whore but thats fine to me, 'cause its my mum, not yours.
thats highly amusing, since for 1: i dont have a sister, and for 2: my mother died when i was 8, so maybe a new example?
also, what morals you must have to be calling your own mother a whore.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/09/12 00:49:10
Suffused with the dying memories of Sanguinus, the warriors of the Death Company seek only one thing: death in battle fighting against the enemies of the Emperor.
Just do the Nazi-Orks. I want to see a looted Panzer.
If you really want to feel "safer" about it, put some comedic pieces in it, especially with Grots and such saluting incorrectly, or mooning the Fuhrer-Boss.
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Platuan4th wrote:Huh? Rico you're American according to your flag, so you should know this is a bunch of BS. Or did all that anti-communism stuff in the 50's to late 80's NOT happen? Y'know, like McCarthy and his Lists while the American Nazi Party and Neo-Nazism flourished under protection from the VERY SAME CONGRESS McCarthy served on.
Hell, there are still people that feel that Communists(Frazzled and my Father -In-Law) are the greatest evil ever because that's how they were raised(Frazzled apparently refuses to buy anything made in Communist countries).
Actually, I agree with what Rico said. At most, my High School History classes covered what happened in the Soviet Union once for every ten times Nazi Germany was was covered. We had days in which the Holocaust was discussed, down to the specific details of the execution, and in which we watched exerts from Schindler's List. We never even came close to that kind of coverage regarding Stalin's purges, and there was no mention whatsoever of the engineered famines.
Talking about Communism, in my experiences at least, conjures up images of poverty, while Nazism conjures up images of wholesale slaughter. My guess would be that since Communists in America were frequently opposed to Stalin's authoritarianism, more emphasis was placed on its failings an economic system by those opposed to it.
There's also a huge difference in the visibility. The Nazis recorded the Holocaust, and with Germany falling under allied control, there was very little that could be hidden should the motivation have been there. In contrast, the Cold War was filled with secrecy. Stalin wanted people dead for his maintenance of power, not for ideological reasons.
Anuvver fing - when they do sumfing, they try to make it look like somfink else to confuse everybody. When one of them wants to lord it over the uvvers, 'e says "I'm very speshul so'z you gotta worship me", or "I know summink wot you lot don't know, so yer better lissen good". Da funny fing is, arf of 'em believe it and da over arf don't, so 'e 'as to hit 'em all anyway or run fer it.
Flagg07 wrote:If you've got to ask, you probably already know the answer...
Herein lies the heart of the discussion. You know exactly how this will be received, or you wouldn't ask for validation. It's ridiculous and has no place other than to garner you a little bit of attention. I am neither PC, nor am I Jewish. Make all the comparisons you want with how terrible Stalin was compared to Hitler, but making Hitler minis and an army of red armband-wearing figs in a Fantasy/Sci-Fi setting is inappropriate and speaks a bit of your maturity. Leave politics and ideologies off the gaming table.
If you or anyone else truly believes that it isn't offensive, put it to a very simple test: take your minis to temple on Friday and see how people react. Let us all know how that goes.
I think that you stand a great chance of pissin people off. I wouldn't mind so much, but I think a lot of people would. As to the right, wrong, indifferent of it all; I don't really know nor do I care a lot. But that's my opinion.
It's not to garner me attention, I've only ever posted like 15 messages or something and my other 2 threads are my army list.
People could easily say Nazi and Hitler imagery has no place in Comedy as a whole. Which misses the point. Comedy helps relieve a society and everyone likes taking the piss out of Hitler, thats why there's no problem.
Infact I think I show more maturity being able to look at Nazis and not just be automatically 100% offended and be able to take the piss out of them. It's immature just crying every time the Nazis are brought into anything other than Historical or Moral discussions, thats just ignorant.
If I was Jewish I'd love people taking the piss out of Hitler, Why wouldn't I? Sure it's a sensitive issue but you're being comedic [bold]against[/bold] him.
Also, I've had several close friends die of Cancer, and if someone makes a cancer joke I can still see the humour in it. I think this is much more mature than just simply being offended all the time.
Taking miniature figures into a temple would probably get a bad reaction regardless. And I'd like to think the more progressive Jewish people would not be going to temple but thats another issue altogether!
If you made the Warboss like Colonel Klink from Hogan's Heroes, I would find that endlessly entertaining. The more bumbling you make them, the less likely people will find them offensive.
Well the Orks were originally a cross between English Soccer Hooligans and WWII-era German troops. Some of the models had the helmets German soldiers wore at the time (and in some ways still do).
I don't mind a WWII themed Ork army, but it is quite possible to do a WWII German-themed Ork army with out resorting to Nazi or even Axis symbols. I plan to do a heavily Blood Axe-based Ork army, using all the Great Coat Ork bodies that one of these alternate resin bit-making sites makes (Maximini? It's one of them anyway). They will have grey uniforms and those style helmets, but they won't be 'Nazi-Orks' or anything like that. No crosses or otherwise obviously overt Axis symbols.
LeeHarvey (a poster, not the real man) has an army of Nazi themed Space Marines, including a Chapter Master with the "Aryan Axe". IIRC the chapter is named "the Master Race". I know he got thrown out of stores for it. Course, he didn't do a parody, he just painted them like the SS and emblazoned everything with big ol' swastikas.
In fairness, he says he was trying to show the similarities between the Imperium and the Nazis, but I find it hard to believe that he didn't realize their would be problems with public display.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2009/09/12 02:30:07
Well I would have thrown him out of my (hypothetical imaginary) store as well, but not for having an army with swastikas on it, more for being so unoriginal and unimaginative (and, I imagine, for making his army without any sense of irony).
As I said, it's quite possible to do a WWII German-themed army without resorting using Nazi symbols.
Though I wonder what would happen if someone made a Tau army based off of WWII-era Japan?
The Nazi group, or National Socialist German Organization, is a political organization, which technically had absolutely nothing to do with any racism of any kind. Even if it did, it's your free will to display your troops however you want. America was based on the freedom to express what you want, how you want it. I would just say to keep it tasteful.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Though I wonder what would happen if someone made a Tau army based off of WWII-era Japan?
Most of us americans wouldn't get it?
I posit: Ork nazis are funny. Its satire.
No one has a problem with my Afrika Korps themed IG. I'm really lazy regarding the tanks sadly. An Aguila and palm trees logo is pretty darned obvious though.
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Pho indignation *IS* the tastiest form of angry!
It's not to garner me attention, I've only ever posted like 15 messages or something and my other 2 threads are my army list.
So, you say it's not to garner attention, but 10-20% of all of your posts on Dakka are regarding making a Nazi-themed army. Your argument would make more sense if you had 1000 posts with half a dozen about Nazi figs, but I digress.
People could easily say Nazi and Hitler imagery has no place in Comedy as a whole. Which misses the point. Comedy helps relieve a society and everyone likes taking the piss out of Hitler, thats why there's no problem.
The "comedy" you speak of will be next to nil in your army and will be seen by a handful of people. Making a mockery of the Nazis or joking about their incompetency (per Hogan's Heroes) is one thing. I have a feeling your wit will be poorly executed and difficult to actually find.
Infact I think I show more maturity being able to look at Nazis and not just be automatically 100% offended and be able to take the piss out of them. It's immature just crying every time the Nazis are brought into anything other than Historical or Moral discussions, thats just ignorant.
You asked for my opinion about what I thought of your idea. I find it unimaginative and poorly concieved. Who's crying?
If I was Jewish I'd love people taking the piss out of Hitler, Why wouldn't I? Sure it's a sensitive issue but you're being comedic [bold]against[/bold] him.
Also, I've had several close friends die of Cancer, and if someone makes a cancer joke I can still see the humour in it. I think this is much more mature than just simply being offended all the time.
Everyone has had someone close to them die of cancer. Cancer doesn't care who you are. It has neither an ideology, nor an agenda. That being said, how do you feel about this army idea: 4th Edition daemonettes with bloody mastectomy scars; Imperial Guardsmen with their lower jaws surgically removed with a little oncology department display base; little, scratchbuilt, jaundiced babies with brown, cancerous lumps all over their bodies. Wouldn't that be an awesome army? That would be high-larious how I'm mocking cancer...
Taking miniature figures into a temple would probably get a bad reaction regardless. And I'd like to think the more progressive Jewish people would not be going to temple but thats another issue altogether!
Why? Jewish people (or any people of faith) can't see the skill and artistry in painted figs? My point was that they may not find YOUR version of painted figs very humorous, no matter how hard you tried to explain to them that they shouldn't be "automatically 100% offended." After all, "It's immature just crying every time the Nazis are brought into anything other than Historical or Moral discussions, thats just ignorant."
Tell that one to grandma. You know, the one with the numbers tatooed on her wrist.
jab4962 wrote:The Nazi group, or National Socialist German Organization, is a political organization, which technically had absolutely nothing to do with any racism of any kind. Even if it did, it's your free will to display your troops however you want. America was based on the freedom to express what you want, how you want it. I would just say to keep it tasteful.
Exactly how does one "tastefuly" build an army themed after Nazis?
I'm not trolling here,and belive me ,I'm a huge advocate of freedom of expresion,I'm just a bit foggy as to how a tasteful nazi army is created.
I am both selfish and chaotic. I value self-gratification and control; I want to have things my way, preferably now. At best, I'm entertaining and surprising; at worst, I'm hedonistic and violent.
jab4962 wrote:The Nazi group, or National Socialist German Organization, is a political organization, which technically had absolutely nothing to do with any racism of any kind. Even if it did, it's your free will to display your troops however you want. America was based on the freedom to express what you want, how you want it. I would just say to keep it tasteful.
Exactly how does one "tastefuly" build an army themed after Nazis?
I'm not trolling here,and belive me ,I'm a huge advocate of freedom of expresion,I'm just a bit foggy as to how a tasteful nazi army is created.
Well I would say that as long as the models are just displayed in accurate uniforms, and no forms of racism are displayed on the models, then there would be no reason for anybody to complain.
jab4962 wrote:The Nazi group, or National Socialist German Organization, is a political organization, which technically had absolutely nothing to do with any racism of any kind. Even if it did, it's your free will to display your troops however you want. America was based on the freedom to express what you want, how you want it. I would just say to keep it tasteful.
Exactly how does one "tastefuly" build an army themed after Nazis?
I'm not trolling here,and belive me ,I'm a huge advocate of freedom of expresion,I'm just a bit foggy as to how a tasteful nazi army is created.
Well I would say that as long as the models are just displayed in accurate uniforms, and no forms of racism are displayed on the models, then there would be no reason for anybody to complain.
Well.I myself would have no problem with a "German themed" army,however I would ,in all honesty, have a knee jerk dislike for any army displaying swastikas and nazi icons.
It may seem trivial,but I have been in several fights with Skinheads (my Girlfriend is Black/Purteo Rican) and those symbols (even though that's all they are) bring out the worst in me.
I am both selfish and chaotic. I value self-gratification and control; I want to have things my way, preferably now. At best, I'm entertaining and surprising; at worst, I'm hedonistic and violent.
Why don't we just skip straight to discussing whether or not painting up Deathstrike missiles as ICBM's, and Vendetta's done up like the Enola Gay and Bockscar are okay?
I´ll find kinda funny if you put orks with the tipical nazi general hat, bandages, military and maibe(just maibe) some doing the posee.
BUT don´t exagerate lad. I mean a hitler looking warboss shouting MAY be funny but if you start putting esvasticas and racism... I myself would hunt you down
Kids in my school think I have racial issues and that´s not a good place to be
WWII German themed? Fine, go ahead, the Death Korps and Steel Legion got away with it.
Nazi themed? Hell no. Believe it or not, there are coloured/homosexual/religious people in this hobby, and it's just bad taste to put swastikas and red armbands everywhere.
People are like dice, a certain Frenchman said that. You throw yourself in the direction of your own choosing. People are free because they can do that. Everyone's circumstances are different, but no matter how small the choice, at the very least, you can throw yourself. It's not chance or fate. It's the choice you made.
Suffused with the dying memories of Sanguinus, the warriors of the Death Company seek only one thing: death in battle fighting against the enemies of the Emperor. 
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