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Waaagh_Gonads wrote:I'll be buying both box set and the main rulebook.

I use the small book for tourneys and the large one for reading at home.

I hope you're not buying it from this part of the world, where it's over $50 more expensive than some other places.

Karon wrote:

Negator80 wrote:

Karon wrote:You see, with those who actually have half a brain, we can mark the pages we need to mark that we know we might forget.

Your last two posts are a great way to lock a thread.

On the same note, if GW's editors had half a brain, they wouldnt create a product that requires 3 different page references to find a single unit's rules.

And yours aren't? Your saying I'M wrong because I like the fluff in the book. Maybe you should think about what your saying before you spout nonsense such as that.

---------------------

Honestly, this is a HUGE book, and for a reason. I believe a BOLS review of it said there was around 300 PAGES of background. That's HUGE. There must be advancements in the storyline in 8th edition that nobody has had the chance to read yet.

I didn't say you were wrong but am saying you lack tact, which amounts to flaming. As far as the storyline, seems like if anything interesting was happening, somebody would be posting somewhere about how army X invaded Y's country. We'll have to wait and see

Negator80 wrote:

Karon wrote:You see, with those who actually have half a brain, we can mark the pages we need to mark that we know we might forget.

Your last two posts are a great way to lock a thread.

On the same note, if GW's editors had half a brain, they wouldnt create a product that requires 3 different page references to find a single unit's rules.

Well said regarding original poster.

But the sad thing for us gamers is GW has several halves of brains... They know marketing strategy.

And as long as kids with more money than sense are willing to buy them, we will pay through the nose.

Rather than buy something new, we have to buy the same thing over and over.

Look at White Dwarf. Ugh. Can anyone tell me the last time something new was in it? It is just an expensive advertisement for what's coming out. And can anyone tell me the last time the new army did not win the Battle Report?

Luckily, I won't have to buy the new rulebook. My friends all play at my house, so we'll pool together for a house copy, or one of them can shell out the money.

I'd buy it if it were cheaper, but that wouldn't be cost effective for GW.


This will be a small tangent, but let me explain something here.
You know why popcorn and sodas are so expensive at the theatre? Per cap.
It means the highest amount of money spent per customer. If you sold it for a lesser price you'd make about the same amount of money, but you'd have to work twice as hard and have more overhead cost, but if you drive up the cost to where an exact amount of customers make a purchase, you can maximize your profits. Its impossible to feed every single person in a theatre before the movie starts, so drive up the cost so the line gets shorter, but the income goes up. Same principle.

I understand sound business, but I don't have to like it.

Glad to see it's not only me. I'm alright now to buy it. but there's no way i was walking away thinking that it's totally worth the $75. it should have been 50. that want something that extravagant? they could have saved it for 10th ed.

Karon, you're a troll bro. bring something to the table or say nothing.

Whatever, I apologize if my blunt speaking hurt your feelings, I'm not a troll, but you have 3 options in the end.

1: Buy it, play with everyone else from the start.

2: Don't buy it, stop playing.

3: Wait till Q4 (I believe september was rumored) for the box set and buy that and the mini rulebook if you don't care about fluff.

Karon wrote:
2: Don't buy it, stop playing.

Again, as I noted above: just because you don't have the rule book doesn't mean you can't play. It'll just be annoying for your opponents.

Way to make the game friendly GW!

Platuan4th wrote:

Lexx wrote:On a similar note. Will battle for skull pass boxes in future have the new rulebook in slim format? As I'm planning to do a dwarf army anyway it would be a good way to save on cash if it is getting updated.

From the GW hype preview(that was taken down) for the new starter:

Meanwhile, if you like the Battle for Skull Pass boxed game (and who wouldn't with all those Goblins and Dwarfs) then it only seems fair to point out that once the last few remaining copies are gone they're gone, and they're never coming back! Pick one up while they last.

So no, as that would require them to reprint it(thus negating the need for a new starter in the first place).

Thanks for the insight. Ill be buying it anyway for the models. Got a friend who will buy the goblins off me likely. Plus I like the characters you get with it.

Oh and did you perchance see what 2 sides will be in the new boxed set?

nope, not hurting any feelings. Just making the observation. Anonymity does wonders for you.

like others have said. it doesn't come down to "Play or don't Play". As I've said already. I'm getting the book so that point is moot. what we're talking about is whether the book is worth the $75 buck, when previous editions have always been no more than 50 bucks.

Everyone's made really good points.

My only options were am i'm going to buy it?

Am i'm going to be that guy without the book leeching off others?

THOSE were MY only real options. I'm not "that guy" so I"m left with the one.

Unfortunately my group isn't into Fantasy. I'm the only one going to play it. So i have to dish out for it. At the end I just feel GW doesn't put out books that are worth $75 bucks, and yet here we are. And, we're all going to buy and it pretty much iis telling them "go ahead and charge what you want". I'm digressing. In the end i was just looking to see how others felt about it. a bunch are ok, another bunch will wait for the minis. for the advit player THESE are the only real options.

We all want the games we like to do well with the customers, because if they dont, they die. Criticism may not reach the developers, but any that does, and is considered, puts that much more quality into the product. That's what keeps game alive.

I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

Man. After looking at this book two days in a row, I'm pretty pleased with it. The hobby section in the back is amazing.

There's a battle report, which looked pretty cool, and a historical battle where they go into each unit. One of them is a 75 (!) strong block of Chaos Warriors. It's the sort of thing that reminds me of first getting into the game. Picking up Warhammer Siege and just daydreaming about the possibilities.

It's too early to say if the rules are tight enough (and the skirmish rules seem like they'll be difficult to put into practice), but they've certainly headed in the right direction from the rules writing perspective. Clearly it was not at the cost of the hobby side of things either, judging by the back of the book.

Bloodwin wrote:I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

No its just an update for a game you've already bought. Which is FREE in the electronic world.

CitizenPrime wrote:

Bloodwin wrote:I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

No its just an update for a game you've already bought. Which is FREE in the electronic world.

No they're not.....?

Some content is free, such as TF2 content. But the rest is either DLC: Not free, or Expansions: Not free

Don't really want to contribute to the off-topicness, but there's plenty of subscription based games too- the live content for some consoles, and MMORPGs...

Karon isn't a troll. Just an overly blunt person lacking certain tact (like me at times). I havn't looked through the new rule book but if its anything like the 40k one it will have tons of extras that you can only get if you buy every codex out there. I personally have a strange tendency to do this so I can't justify paying for the hardback rulebooks but for people who don't buy codices for armies they don't have and want all the fluff and purdy pictures the hardbacks are great. The "collectors" editions are what I can't wrap my head around.

Karon wrote:

CitizenPrime wrote:

Bloodwin wrote:I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

No its just an update for a game you've already bought. Which is FREE in the electronic world.

No they're not.....?

Some content is free, such as TF2 content. But the rest is either DLC: Not free, or Expansions: Not free

Oh good grief.

Yes they are. Its an Update. Like Internet Explorer 8.

I don't want downloadable content, expansions, extras, fluff, pictures, or a reach-a-round.
Just the rulebook, handbook, instructions....

simple.

CitizenPrime wrote:

Karon wrote:

CitizenPrime wrote:

Bloodwin wrote:I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

No its just an update for a game you've already bought. Which is FREE in the electronic world.

No they're not.....?

Some content is free, such as TF2 content. But the rest is either DLC: Not free, or Expansions: Not free

Oh good grief.

Yes they are. Its an Update. Like Internet Explorer 8.

I don't want downloadable content, expansions, extras, fluff, pictures, or a reach-a-round.
Just the rulebook, handbook, instructions....

simple.

A new edition of rules IS an expansion, as they're taking the core rules, and changing certain things about it, as well as adding new things.

Karon wrote:

CitizenPrime wrote:

Karon wrote:

CitizenPrime wrote:

Bloodwin wrote:I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

No its just an update for a game you've already bought. Which is FREE in the electronic world.

No they're not.....?

Some content is free, such as TF2 content. But the rest is either DLC: Not free, or Expansions: Not free

Oh good grief.

Yes they are. Its an Update. Like Internet Explorer 8.

I don't want downloadable content, expansions, extras, fluff, pictures, or a reach-a-round.
Just the rulebook, handbook, instructions....

simple.

A new edition of rules IS an expansion, as they're taking the core rules, and changing certain things about it, as well as adding new things.

Seriously? A new edition of rules is an expansion?




You are TFG.




I'm done here.
I apologize to the rest of dakka for this distraction. I won't be sucked in next time.

Wait, what?

I'm a TFG when in your earlier post, you said as if you were annoyed that I wasn't thinking the same as you. Are you 12 years old?

Sucked into what? Talking? Yes, it is an expansion, because its taking a core set of rules, and expanding upon them and possibly changing them.

I'm not a TFG, and to put it lightly, your not the brightest.

Karon wrote:Wait, what?

I'm a TFG when in your earlier post, you said as if you were annoyed that I wasn't thinking the same as you. Are you 12 years old?

Sucked into what? Talking? Yes, it is an expansion, because its taking a core set of rules, and expanding upon them and possibly changing them.

I'm not a TFG, and to put it lightly, your not the brightest.

And if anything I would call it a sequel. Similar principles just updated content/features. But to be honest that comes down to semantics more than anything. Im guessing citizen you just want to have the same rulebook with free updates to it constantly. With the history of games workshop ( constantly getting more expensive over years ) hobbies thats very unlikely to ever happen.

Karon wrote:

CitizenPrime wrote:

Karon wrote:

CitizenPrime wrote:

Bloodwin wrote:I know the price is steep but I think there's two points people are missing:

1) they don't bring out a new edition every year so while it stings now you'll be using it for a long time.

2) compared to computer games the cost per hour of hobby is way cheaper.

My only grip about the price is that with the current state of the economy its hard to justify. Having said that trying to sneak home the big box and justify that would be much harder and it's not like it's a $600 iPhone 4 is it?

No its just an update for a game you've already bought. Which is FREE in the electronic world.

No they're not.....?

Some content is free, such as TF2 content. But the rest is either DLC: Not free, or Expansions: Not free

Oh good grief.

Yes they are. Its an Update. Like Internet Explorer 8.

I don't want downloadable content, expansions, extras, fluff, pictures, or a reach-a-round.
Just the rulebook, handbook, instructions....

simple.

A new edition of rules IS an expansion, as they're taking the core rules, and changing certain things about it, as well as adding new things.

But, why? The game needed tweaks, not what their selling. It's like their saying: "hey, we know 80% of this game worked, but instead of fixing the other 20%, we are going to ignore it, and alter the first not broken 80% enough so that you people will feel you are getting a new product (and therefore drop loads of money into it). That's part of what seems to put some people off. Or, you can be put off by how little content you are getting and feel your'e paying for something that shouldve been in a downloadable PDF.

On a side note, of the 6 or so games i play, none are subscription and i get free patches for them all.

That's cool, Negator, but not all games are like that...

And that's GW for you, they are only really in it for the money, guy. They'll try to get every last penny out of you. Learn that early on and it'll save you a lot of headache.

Well guy, I learned it and it's saving me money rather then headache.

I don't think anybody's intentionally being TFG it's just a difference in how you are perceiving definitions of words.

Generally speaking, expansion is the noun form of the verb expand which means to make something bigger. In the context of a game (whether computer or tabletop), an expansion adds something that did not exist before.

For RPGs, Expansions are "the world of greyhawk"
or "dragonlance"..etc.

For computer games, it's downloadable content.

For GW it's things like spearhead.

What we're talking about here is actually a revision from the verb revise which means to make a new, improved, or up-to-date version. You might even be able to argue that it's a different version; however, it is clearly not an expansion.

Sure, they added a few new things but by and large it's the same game with the same concepts..

My 2 cents. As for me, I'll wait til the box set comes out and buy the mini-rulebook off of e-bay; I don't need the fluff because it doesn't include my army anyway (Chaos Dwarfs).

Modquisition on.
This thread is entirely too flamy. Lets turn it down a notch...NOW.

Dude, get a new picture of your old dog.

agnosto wrote:Dude, get a new picture of your old dog.

hey I have a bunch but photobucket was knocked off at work so I'm really on old links. I can't even see most of them-I just have faith that The Great Weinie will come through with an actual pic for everyone else.

I wont be be buying it as it is 100 pages of rules, and 400 pages of stuff I will not even look at. You do not need the big glossy rule book, just wait for the pocket edition.

I just wish they would sell the pocket edition starter rule book separably. Otherwise I am left with the option of buying the book on ebay, or selling the Skaven on ebay...

Lyracian wrote:I wont be be buying it as it is 100 pages of rules, and 400 pages of stuff I will not even look at. You do not need the big glossy rule book, just wait for the pocket edition.

Hidden in those "400 pages of stuff I will not even look at" is even more rules, actually(including several more scenarios and the rules for Legendary Battles).

Agnosto. By any chance would you have pics of your chaos dwarfs? Always liked their models and have rare chances to see a painted army of them.