Assassin's CHEESE?

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**Grey Templar**

they actually nerfed the Callidus and Vindicare slightly.

the Phase blade doesn't ignore Invulns anymore and the Vindicare can't shoot into CC anymore either.

that said, they got better overall, but being able to shoot into CC was pretty cool.

**reds8n**

Can we ask users not to quote almost every post in a thread just to add an emoticon or similar at the bottom of it. Much obliged.

**GamzaTheChaos**

Hido wrote:They are 130-145 points, unique, can get instant killed by str 8, and take up an elite slot on their own, and have a +4 save. If I was fighting them they would be a very high priority target considering the damage they can do.

what do you mean unique? can't you play 3 of them? i only went over the codex once but i never seen anything making them unique.
or did i miss something @_@

**AlmightyWalrus**

GamzaTheChaos wrote:
Hido wrote:They are 130-145 points, unique, can get instant killed by str 8, and take up an elite slot on their own, and have a +4 save. If I was fighting them they would be a very high priority target considering the damage they can do.

what do you mean unique? can't you play 3 of them? i only went over the codex once but i never seen anything making them unique.
or did i miss something @_@

They're unique in the sense that you're only allowed one of each assassin.

**GeckoOBac**

They are marked as unique in the army list... You can take 3 different assasins but not 3 copies of one assassin

**Melissia**

Basically each kind of assassin is 0-1.

**Lycaeus Wrex**

Urien_Rakarth wrote:On the GW website, I checked the 'what's new today', and found a large artical on the new imperial assasins. After reading abit, only one thought could fill my head:

WS 8! thats better than a DE Archon who would have been practicing for hundreds of years! and almost on par to Lelith Hesperax, best Wych ever to live!
S 4? why on Earth are they as strong as Super-Human Space Marines? they train to be fast right? not beefy and brawny!
Neural Shredder? for taking out MEN! then it should AP3/_ everyone will just use this on the biggest tanks on the board!
Eversor with a AP 2 Poisoned 2+ pistol? thats better than the DE's, who dedicated their WHOLE LONG lives to find better poisons!

This is all I tell you! !
The one known as Ward must be behind this...

I'd offer you some cheese with your whine but judging by your OP it seems you've got/had enough already.

L. Wrex

**Redbeard**

Kilkrazy wrote:
That's one point of view. Another one is; Archons as supreme masters of hand to hand combat. Better throw an electric heater into their bath, then.

I want to play that game. You spend 200 points on an Archon. I spend 100 on an assassin for my force. On a 2+, my assassin kills your archon in the bathtub before the game begins and neither are deployed. That's what wargames should be like.

...

They nerfed the Eversor too, he used to get a 12" charge.

**Fafnir**

Redbeard wrote:
They nerfed the Eversor too, he used to get a 12" charge.

And infiltrate.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Grey Templar wrote:
MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
Guitardian wrote:Imperial Assassins have been the shizzit ever since I started playing when dinosaurs ruled the earth. The eversor, when first released, slaughtered a banshee squad, seriously chopped up an Avatar and exploded gloriously half way into the game in the first WD batrep he showed up in.

Vindicares didn't get nearly so much love back in those days because targetting rules and ICs were not as crucial, it picked off 1 heavy weapon guy a turn, and yeah that was about it. The Calidus was the assassin of choice for most because it was the easiest way of killing off one devastator by appearing, then munching the rest of the squad in subsequent melee. Eversor was choice for people who wanted a giant tyranid monster in human form.

They are meant to be awesomely good. They have always been also meant to be easy enough to kill with massed small arms shots or sustained combats against hordes of grunts. Everybody rolls 1s.

Vindicares also lacked unlimited ammunition. If you missed with your shot (unlikely, but possible) or if it failed to cause any noticable damage, you're not gonna get a second shot. The new unlimited ammunition really help make him a force to be reckoned with. However the bump to 4D6 made him just devastating (on average it will glance a Land Raider).

Pen a Landraider you mean.

it's still a sniper rifle and so is Str3 vs vehicles.

Ok now that is cheese.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
From what I can see the Eversor suffered the worst of the nerfing, having it's points increased by 40 while loosing some special abilities (bio meltdown and the 12 inch charge). On the other hand I think the Vindicare actually got much better. Loosing the ability to shoot into combat kinda sucks, but it got unlimited ammunition, better BS (for that all important reroll) and better Turbo Penetrator. The Callidus also got a bit better in that she can just appear and cause damage, before neuro-flaming the hell out of the enemy models.

**AlmightyWalrus**

MechaEmperor7000 wrote:The Callidus also got a bit better in that she can just appear and cause damage, before neuro-flaming the hell out of the enemy models.

Except she could already appear out of nowhere, but with a C'tan power sword that ignored every kind of save. Now it's just an ID PW...

**Amaya**

Couldn't she charge in the turn she came in on also?

**Fafnir**

Yep. And she had "A Word in your Ear," which was just freaking awesome.

Really, Vindicare is the only assassin REALLY worth taking now. The Eversor lost its great charge range and infiltrate, making it much harder to actually get into combat, the Callidus lost almost everything that made her unique, and the Culexus always sucked anyway.

**Ascalam**

Culexus served me well vs my wife's dual seer councils

I don't play WH/DH any more, but i used to really enjoy the Assasins.

**Kilkrazy**

Pen≥Sword wrote:
Exopheric wrote:Assassins were originally WS 8. That was back in the days when they had their own codex...

Huh? Where'd you read this? They were pretty much the same as to how they were in the Deamonhunter release. Assassins never really had their own "Codex" it was just a small supplement to imperial armies as far as I'm aware.

Yknow the one with the Eversor on the front right?

I've got the Codex Assassins sitting around somewhere. I remember it being very thin.

**DarknessEternal**

Fafnir wrote:
Redbeard wrote:
They nerfed the Eversor too, he used to get a 12" charge.

And infiltrate.

And Sustained Assault. Of course, that predates a rule even called Infiltrate, but man did it kill armies.

For all you young'uns, when an Eversor charged into a model (not a unit, things didn't work that way), and killed that model, he immediately charged again. If he made contact, he fought again. This repeated until he ran out of models to charge.

That's a far cry better than +d6 attacks.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Bromsy wrote:but in game the only single being I know of who's defeated a C'tan one on one is the ol' Emprar.

Ferrus Manus and Khaine also.

**Pen≥Sword**

nosferatu1001 wrote:Pen - they had their own codex, called codex: assassins.

The one with the Eversor on the front right? Because that wasn't really a stand alone codex. It gave you the rules for the four assassins and how to use them with your army and a few special scenarios. None of which were WS 8.

**A-P**

What basically happened was that there was a change of guard among the Assassins in regards
to playability. Whereas previously the Callidus was choice number one and all the others distant second,
now the Vindicare reigns as top dog.

The Callidus lost two unique abilities ( "A Word in Your Ear" and C`tan Phase Sword omnipenetration ) that made her a good choice and in return became a Marbo clone.

The Eversor became a poor joke. An Assassin without Infiltrate? Really

?

And the Culexus? Was already a marginal choice during the old Codex.

**Noir**

Grey Templar wrote:
Pen a Landraider you mean.

it's still a sniper rifle and so is Str3 vs vehicles.

No, it's only 4D6.

"A turbo-penetrator shot has a Armor Pnentration of 4D6." Not +4D6.

**Jackal**

but in game the only single being I know of who's defeated a C'tan one on one is the ol' Emprar.

Dont forget Ferrus Manus.
He killed one with his hands

But OT, they are fine.
Vindi finally got the boost he deserves after so many years of nerf.
Rest seem pretty basic, if not poor.

**Ascalam**

'
Dont forget Ferrus Manus.
He killed one with his hands '

Are we talking permanantly destroyed (as all 4 remaining ones from the codex are currently accounted for) or 'temporarily inconvenienced'

It's pretty easy to temporarily inconvenience a Ctan, very very hard to actually kill one..

**timetowaste85**

Fafnir wrote: and the Culexus always sucked anyway.

This hurt to read. The Culexus is still awesome, as a large number of non-SM armies will have trouble shooting at him, and he can clear entire units by himself when playing a full GK army. Stick him in a rhino too, turn one, and drive him forward and let him unleash hell. He will take some work to get going properly, but your opponent will have a hard time ignoring him. It just adds to the punishment when his own vehicle is a psyker

(and yes, I realize a rhino is a DT, hence first turn needing to hop in)

**MechaEmperor7000**

Culexus got a tad bit better by virtue of everything else in the army counting as psykers now. However he lost his Souless rule, which is a shame because it was perfectly fluffy and competitive.

**timetowaste85**

Can you fill me in on the soulless rule? I forgot it and never got a chance to use him with old rules

**MechaEmperor7000**

It reduces everyone's LD with 12" down to 7, unless it would be lower than this. And it's everyone but the Culexus, so even your own troops. It's fluffy because it represents how even with his powers suppressed, the Culexus Assassin just unnerves everyone around him.

**timetowaste85**

Very cool. And of course, that would make it near-impossible for anyone nearby to shoot him, huh? Position him correctly and he'll almost never die. Wish that was still in effect with the new rules

**Noir**

timetowaste85 wrote: It just adds to the punishment when his own vehicle is a psyker (and yes, I realize a rhino is a DT, hence first turn needing to hop in)

No there are not. No "Psyker" rule = not a Psyker. So Culexus dose not get the bonus from GK vehicle.

**Punisher Gatling Cannon**

Noir wrote:
timetowaste85 wrote: It just adds to the punishment when his own vehicle is a psyker (and yes, I realize a rhino is a DT, hence first turn needing to hop in)

No there are not. No "Psyker" rule = not a Psyker. So Culexus dose not get the bonus from GK vehicle.

he will get the bonus from the vehicle because of the psychic pilot special rule. Page 21 if you want to look it up.

**Noir**

Punisher Gatling Cannon wrote:
Noir wrote:
timetowaste85 wrote: It just adds to the punishment when his own vehicle is a psyker (and yes, I realize a rhino is a DT, hence first turn needing to hop in)

No there are not. No "Psyker" rule = not a Psyker. So Culexus dose not get the bonus from GK vehicle.

he will get the bonus from the vehicle because of the psychic pilot special rule. Page 21 if you want to look it up.

No he dose not. Psychic pilot let you take a psychic test for the use of one power and vs psychic hood. It dose not make it a Psyker. Page 21 if you want.

**DarknessEternal**

Noir wrote:

No he dose not. Psychic pilot let you take a psychic test for the use of one power and vs psychic hood. It dose not make it a Psyker. Page 21 if you want.

pg 21 where it says "A vehicle with this special rule is treated as being a pskyer"?

Seems pretty cut and dry.