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I try to remind my opponent of rules that they forgot. Makes me feel better about the game. Now, tactical blunders, that's something else entirely.

It seems to me that when someone you just met says "lets play a friendly game" it means "lets play but let me win".

I personally make the effort, win or loose, to compliment the other player after the game by saying "well played!" (if it was) or "My compliments to a worthy opponent" and at least offering to shake hands after the match. Having gamed for a long time you often see how people put their all to fragile egos on the table. So treating others well goes along way to preserving the gamers pool and eventually getting better games out of them.

Using solid tactics such as minimizing your opponents number of targets is by no means WAAC. Last night I played I played one with our veteran GK general (he used to actually use the Daemonhunters codex), who placed himself in such a way that I had nothing to really shoot at but his land raider for at least 2 turns. Which is near exactly what the OP did, and I by no means find it cheesey or WAAC even when competing with it, or in this case, eventually losing to it.

I say don't let the whiners get to you OP.

If the roll is mandatory, I might roll for my opponent, telling them what I'm doing. I might apply the result as I know it, which might be wrong.
Is it my place to know my opponent's rules for them?
Maybe not, but it means I attempted to play the game by the rules.

lol, tell them to harden up, and if these guys are your friends, whats happening is that there getting annoyed cause they can never beat you, and next time they say your "Powergaming", tell them "Ok, why aren't you getting close to my guys then, then you wont be having these problems SEE!?!?!?"

"Friendly Game" to me means playing a game with friends, reminding them of units they forgot to shoot/move, telling them their lascannons are twin linked, not taking shots at toes maybe sticking out behind a tree and leaving away any borderline RaWs. If the friend is a fluff player I might even go for stupid things like "Waaagh! 'ard boy duell!!!"(I lost ).
A friendly game does not mean I am not allowed to bubble wrap, block vehicles, tarpit big guys, multi-charge badly placed units or even a bring a certain units/wargear.

Melissia wrote:Then there are people who are both one AND two!

Playing to win doesn't mean playing an unfluffy game.

I think winning with xenos while playing against SM should be considered unfluffy

Calling Iyanden wraithguard army WAAC is just a kick in a balls. You could give your army for a game or two and let them see how Eldar can fall apart within seconds. They will shut up for some time.

WAAAAAH! You're winning! You powergamer!

Macok wrote:You could give your army for a game or two and let them see how Eldar can fall apart within seconds. They will shut up for some time.

No, they wouldn't. That type doesn't see things that way. Doing that would open the OP up to even MORE whining, as obviously if the army loses in the hands of other players against the OP, then the OP is doing something(ie., cheating) that allows him to win with the "sucky army".

liam0404 wrote:This reminds me of another game I played a while back. I was using my Templars against BA. I announced at the start of the game that I was reserving everything - and the profanities were off the scale. "Why are you doing that? Thats so gay. I can't believe youre doing that!"

It's like people expect you to switch off your brain during a friendly game.

The guys I play with (me included) are not the most experienced 40k players. I pulled that same one (all in reserves) a few times during our first campaign. I just wanted to mix it up. The first time, my buddies did not know what to do. "Uh. You can do that? Dang. Right then..."

Of course, I didn't know what to do either when the tables were turned. But it was all in good fun.

If your friends are cursing and what-not from your using an accepted and established tactic, but one they're not used to or have a counter to, then they have a real problem. I don't know what else to say. I haven't seen anything you've said so far that would make me not want to play you.

Don't forget that it's always in good etiquette to laugh hysterically when you kill something in hand to hand when they well should have been smashed apart. Nothing shows good sport like basking in a moment of superb and stupid glory.

Two kroot warriors killing my Emperor's Champion when I charged them.... His shouts of "Krout win! Krout win!" as he ran about the room is still the stuff of legends.

personally if people dont like how i play my army thats their problem. learn to use your army in a counter, or make an army that makes me counter you. that simple. now, in a friendly game amongst friends im more likley to listen to suggestions that a particular army is over the top, or hard to play against, and im willing to try out other options or builds in my army. simply because if the games not fun for both players why play, save for a tourney? but people complaining that your army is cheese or using beardy tactics, well too bad. eldar are meant to hide, DE are supposed to use speed, tau jump around, etc. if you were supposed to just rush everything forward into a meat grinder, then why not just dice off at the start. high dice wins. no need to deploy units or objectives or terrain or anything. just a dice roll to see who wins, and narrate it how you want.

I have a friend who keeps telling me that marines are unfair (and still keeps playing against my army). He keeps saying that because he loses all the time. He is playing IG and the core of his army is 2 Veteran Squads with carapace armor, 3 Stormtrooper squads (10 man squads each) and some vehicles. No transports. I tend to blast them apart rather fast...

what a silly man!

he could deepstrike those storm trooper squads with a free re-roll due to their inbuilt special order ability and mash up marines easily with ap 3 weapons/specials!

redeyed wrote:what a silly man!

he could deepstrike those storm trooper squads with a free re-roll due to their inbuilt special order ability and mash up marines easily with ap 3 weapons/specials!

He could. He also hates 2+ saves and stormshields. The combination being the worst. And I happen to like my assault terminators.

I don't understand what these people expect you to do. When I think of WAAC players, it usually has to do with a shiney new codex and easy win army builds, plus arguing every possible rules ambiguity even if it doesn't make any realistic sense, and exploiting the loopholes instead of playing within the spirit of the rules (like wrap-around cover units, abundance of wound allocation, "creative" conversions to beat TLOS, overdone SPAM, spam, spam spam. Just ask them why it is we put terrain on the table at all if we aren't expected to use it, and if they would prefer to play yahtzee where they can just roll dice back and forth until someone wins. Ask if you sould be assaulting with sniper rifles to make it more fair too in the next game. If there is terrain, it is available for both players. If they don't use it to their advantage and you do, then maybe you are being unsporting by not have been dropped on your head as a child too.

Zakiriel wrote:It seems to me that when someone you just met says "lets play a friendly game" it means "lets play but let me win".

I personally make the effort, win or loose, to compliment the other player after the game by saying "well played!" (if it was) or "My compliments to a worthy opponent" and at least offering to shake hands after the match. Having gamed for a long time you often see how people put their all to fragile egos on the table. So treating others well goes along way to preserving the gamers pool and eventually getting better games out of them.

I always make an effort to shake hands with an opponent, even after unpleasant experiences at events where an opponent I don't know has been poorly behaved or ill mannered. Just think it's the right thing to do

To the OP, like everyone else said, playing to win is not powergaming. I like winning. I really do. However, I try to make sure it's a fair win. I don't try to play games with TLOS (If I can't see their body, I can't shoot at it), and I tend to let rules disputes goe up to a dice roll. (4+ we play it my way, 1, 2, 3 we go your way).

However, using good tactics is not powergaming. Hiding your tanks behind infantry bubble wrap is using your brain, not being a power gamer. I find the friendly games that just boil down to 'charge and roll the dice' are boring and un fun. The games that turn into 'manuver and clash over who will have a better position for battle' are much more fun, simply cause I'm using my brain more and more.

If I know the enemy has a certain rule, I'll tell them. For example, if I know that their weapons are twin linked, I'll remind them. However, if thy make a tactical mistake, I'll just smile and nod. As Napoleon said, 'Never interrupt your enemy while he's making a mistake.'

I try to be humble, respectful and in good faith. This does not mean I will not try to win also...

This should be valid for all types of games, actually.

I don't think much of anything in our codex is cheesy. It all has a lot of weaknesses in addition to being overcosted.

To really drive my point, the OP is playing a Very Fluffy list. And there isn't anything unfair about super slow units footslogging with very short range guns. The story about Tau being called cheesy was pretty funny too.

About the council...if you're not going to remind me to cast fortune I'm not going to remind you to block it. Maybe in friendly games, but in a tournament? Yeah not likely.

ArmyC wrote:I was in a trny yesterday against an average player. He had 2 Librarians on the table. I play Eldar.

1st turn I fortune my seer council, and I measure to see if I am 24" away so I can't be hooded. I am away and I do my psychic stuff.

I even mention this to him.

I realize now that it is not my option to make that measurement, but it was more a courtesy than anything else, because I expected to get hooded all game.

2nd turn, I am definantly inside 24", but he doesn't roll for the hood. I don't say anything, and feel like I got away with one.

3rd turn, he doesn't roll.

4th turn, same thing, and at this time I start to feel guilty because my fortuned counsel is tearing him up. So now I think I ought to say something, but he seems like the type of guy that would really beat himself up for not remembering his hood rolls. So I never said anything.

Both of us had lost badly in the 1st round of the trny, so there really wasn't anything to play for prizewise.

What would you have done?

In a tournament match? I don't remind my opponent of his own rules....

Now, sometimes if for example they've forgotten to tell me to take a morale check after shooting and I also forgot... then in the next phase, I will point it out if they needed to take a morale and say I let it slide.

Helping them play? NEVER.

Well, played against a really bad teenager in a tournie the other week and tried to warn him bringing in his reserves that close to all my meltas would be a dumb move. He still did.

In a friendly game with no stakes? Yeah, I'll remind people.