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 MrMoustaffa wrote:
If their goal is to sow panic and terror (because they're terrorists) a move like that makes a lot of sense, even if the target is something "unimportant".

I have never understood why we haven't seen a terror attack that is just 6 dudes with lawful, off the shelf rifles and some chain and locks doing a coordinated attack on a crowded mall food court in like.. Boise, or Peoria, or Scranton, or some other unlikely place. 5 dudes each with a $600 AK, a pair of $80 80 round drum mags and $30 of cheap russian ammo, and you've got a terror attack for less than 5 grand that will cause another decade of the US losing it's gak.

 Ouze wrote:

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
If their goal is to sow panic and terror (because they're terrorists) a move like that makes a lot of sense, even if the target is something "unimportant".

I have never understood why we haven't seen a terror attack that is just 6 dudes with lawful, off the shelf rifles and some chain and locks doing a coordinated attack on a crowded mall food court in like.. Boise, or Peoria, or Scranton, or some other unlikely place. 5 dudes each with a $600 AK, a pair of $80 80 round drum mags and $30 of cheap russian ammo, and you've got a terror attack for less than 5 grand that will cause another decade of the US losing it's gak.

Probably because you have to go big, or not go to paradise. Besides which a guy shooting up a public place is (sadly) just another weekly news item in the USA...

 SilverMK2 wrote:

 Ouze wrote:

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
If their goal is to sow panic and terror (because they're terrorists) a move like that makes a lot of sense, even if the target is something "unimportant".

I have never understood why we haven't seen a terror attack that is just 6 dudes with lawful, off the shelf rifles and some chain and locks doing a coordinated attack on a crowded mall food court in like.. Boise, or Peoria, or Scranton, or some other unlikely place. 5 dudes each with a $600 AK, a pair of $80 80 round drum mags and $30 of cheap russian ammo, and you've got a terror attack for less than 5 grand that will cause another decade of the US losing it's gak.

Probably because you have to go big, or not go to paradise. Besides which a guy shooting up a public place is (sadly) just another weekly news item in the USA...

5 dudes shooting up a shopping center, or Disney World, is a big fething deal.

 kronk wrote:
5 dudes shooting up a shopping center, or Disney World, is a big fething deal.

It was a mildly facetious comment.

Sorry, I have a cold.

 Ouze wrote:

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
If their goal is to sow panic and terror (because they're terrorists) a move like that makes a lot of sense, even if the target is something "unimportant".

I have never understood why we haven't seen a terror attack that is just 6 dudes with lawful, off the shelf rifles and some chain and locks doing a coordinated attack on a crowded mall food court in like.. Boise, or Peoria, or Scranton, or some other unlikely place. 5 dudes each with a $600 AK, a pair of $80 80 round drum mags and $30 of cheap russian ammo, and you've got a terror attack for less than 5 grand that will cause another decade of the US losing it's gak.

They just call that Chicago.

Its the same reason they don't attack a refinery in Houston. No one would notice. Meh, another plant fire...

 Easy E wrote:
They hate Norway for their Freedom? Or is it their Socialism?

Could be that they are an oil rich country, but who knows.

 Frazzled wrote:

 Ouze wrote:

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
If their goal is to sow panic and terror (because they're terrorists) a move like that makes a lot of sense, even if the target is something "unimportant".

I have never understood why we haven't seen a terror attack that is just 6 dudes with lawful, off the shelf rifles and some chain and locks doing a coordinated attack on a crowded mall food court in like.. Boise, or Peoria, or Scranton, or some other unlikely place. 5 dudes each with a $600 AK, a pair of $80 80 round drum mags and $30 of cheap russian ammo, and you've got a terror attack for less than 5 grand that will cause another decade of the US losing it's gak.

They just call that Chicago.

Its the same reason they don't attack a refinery in Houston. No one would notice. Meh, another plant fire...

Ouze... that's "the sticks" in the states. They shoot back.

Not to mention that five gentlemen of Arab descent toting rifles aren't going to make it inside Boise's mall.

People forget, this has already occurred:

Fort Hood...

The idea of Norway being somehow unimportant is a little bit...uncomfortable.

Hopefully the publicity puts off the terrorist group from trying anything. Norway has a significant muslim minority and has a very Islamophobic right wing. That could be a source of tension. Brevik was at least partially motivated by Islamophobia.

Indeed. Norway has suffered more from fostering a hatred for Islam than Islam has actually caused. Well it certainly appears that way.

I'm not keen on any new religious influence creeping into the West, but as long as it's kept to itself then that's fine. Sadly we keep seeing that religion can't keep to itself and feels the need to force itself upon society.

 Da Boss wrote:
The idea of Norway being somehow unimportant is a little bit...uncomfortable.

I certainly didn't mean that...

Kronk mentioned the draw mohammed day fracas prevously.

Hopefully the publicity puts off the terrorist group from trying anything. Norway has a significant muslim minority and has a very Islamophobic right wing. That could be a source of tension. Brevik was at least partially motivated by Islamophobia.

Good point.

 Medium of Death wrote:
Indeed. Norway has suffered more from fostering a hatred for Islam than Islam has actually caused. Well it certainly appears that way.

I'm not keen on any new religious influence creeping into the West, but as long as it's kept to itself then that's fine. Sadly we keep seeing that religion can't keep to itself and feels the need to force itself upon society.

Honestly, from past events, I think that Norway holds more of an "Anti-religion" feeling... I mean, if you remember back in the 90s all those churches that were torched by "Black Metal fans"

I can't really comment beyond that, as I'm unfamiliar with how specifically anti-islamic they are. But I do agree that more religions should take the live and let live approach to things.

 Seaward wrote:
Not to mention that five gentlemen of Arab descent toting rifles aren't going to make it inside Boise's mall.

Meh, if they roll up fast in a van and blitz an entrance, the rent-a-cops aren't going to do anything meaningful. The Kenya mall attack wasn't exactly peanuts in the news.

Let's just hope it doesn't happen, and if it does, that some armed citizen gets the drop on them.

 whembly wrote:
I'm not being snarky... but, why Norway?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to vacation there and all over Europe.

Easy target, and Norwegians are still infidel western dogs.
Apparently the collective western we are all guilty of the same crime, not being Moslems.

This type of Islam hasn't come to Europe to share, it has come to take. It's about time people realised this, it's not like they hide it.

Orlanth grow up FFS.(i'm hoping your last post was a joke)
In all my life I have never met a Muslim who even remotely subscribes to extremist views. Muslims are the same as you and me ...they come to a country to earn money.
Jihad just means struggle, generally a personal religious struggle to make yourself a better person.
There is no broad Islamic movement, in fact I'd argue there are almost as many Muslim sects as protestant movements.
The sooner people use their brains and realise that Islam is not the problem, it is people that are the problem, the sooner I can get my government to move in less fear centric circles.
Regularly I talk to Muslims from turkey, iraq, iran, jordan, sudan, as well as from europe , they are just people, people and that's it.

This whole VS Muslims thing is made by dumb people to control dumb people.

 Bullockist wrote:
Orlanth grow up FFS.(i'm hoping your last post was a joke)
In all my life I have never met a Muslim who even remotely subscribes to extremist views. Muslims are the same as you and me ...they come to a country to earn money.
Jihad just means struggle, generally a personal religious struggle to make yourself a better person.
There is no broad Islamic movement, in fact I'd argue there are almost as many Muslim sects as protestant movements.
The sooner people use their brains and realise that Islam is not the problem, it is people that are the problem, the sooner I can get my government to move in less fear centric circles.
Regularly I talk to Muslims from turkey, iraq, iran, jordan, sudan, as well as from europe , they are just people, people and that's it.

This whole VS Muslims thing is made by dumb people to control dumb people.

Then why aren't we hearing/seeing any repudiations of extremist Muslims from other "moderate" Muslims?

Can you imagine the outcry if the Inquisition was resurrected and nary a peep from the Vatican (or even leaders from Chrisitian countries)????

If you have never seen a repudiation of extremism by moderate Muslims, you must never have looked very hard. It's not like they're given much of a platform to do so by media outlets.

Also, I've only recently seen any contrition from the Vatican over some of the horrible things perpetrated by members of the Catholic church.

 Da Boss wrote:
If you have never seen a repudiation of extremism by moderate Muslims, you must never have looked very hard. It's not like they're given much of a platform to do so by media outlets.

Also, I've only recently seen any contrition from the Vatican over some of the horrible things perpetrated by members of the Catholic church.

Nah... I've looked hard.

I'm talking about Muslim officials in powerful positions.

I know a muslim family here in the states (emigrated from mid-east to Bosina, got out after that war to here in the states) who are great, great people. Love 'em to death. THEY repudiated the extremisms and literally preach that the Holy Koran does not expouses those things.

*shrug*

They're probably out there for sure.

Like someone else said ITT, it ain't the religion, it's the people who's using it as an excuse.

because Whembly Islam is a religion which is not run by power. Think of a scottish presbyterian church and your getting close.
Imams are teachers sure, but generally there is no central power controlling them, it is kind of up to the mosque they are teaching in.
Imams are actually not needed in Islam, they are optional ( although the harder core you go the less optional they are)
Imam means "teacher"
That is why you don't hear repudiations from the Muslim community, they just think "that teacher is wack"

If you want a centralist Islamic ideal then support ISIL.

 Bullockist wrote:

If you want a centralist Islamic ideal then support ISIL.

Wait... what?

AQ kicked them out for being too radical.

feth whembly, you are smart enough I shouldn't have to explain this gak.

Islam is not a monolithic movement. there are as many if not more sects than protestantism.
Islam is a church based movement. Teachers (Imams) are hired (or teach for free) by each mosque
There is no central authority.
In fact this is the cheif disagreement between sunni and shi'ite.
there is no centralism at all in Islam - religiously anyway, it is a very individualistic religion, this is coming from a guy (me ) who has read 7/8 of the koran.
Islam teaches to submit your pride before god. A good ideal.


The only people who want a centralised caliph are ISIL, I'd say 99.9% of Muslims want otherwise.( muslims in china, maylasia, indonesia, africa, the middle east, europe, burma, pakistan, afghanistan, all the stans!
Muslims are NOT the enemy.
Some muslims may be, but the whole "enemy" schtick needs to be relegated to idiots...where it belongs.

 Bullockist wrote:
feth whembly, you are smart enough I shouldn't have to explain this gak.

Islam is not a monolithic movement. there are as many if not more sects than protestantism.
Islam is a church based movement. Teachers (Imams) are hired (or teach for free) by each mosque
There is no central authority.
In fact this is the cheif disagreement between sunni and shi'ite.
there is no centralism at all in Islam - religiously anyway, it is a very individualistic religion, this is coming from a guy (me ) who has read 7/8 of the koran.
Islam teaches to submit your pride before god. A good ideal.


The only people who want a centralised caliph are ISIL, I'd say 99.9% of Muslims want otherwise.( muslims in china, maylasia, indonesia, africa, the middle east, europe, burma, pakistan, afghanistan, all the stans!
Muslims are NOT the enemy.
Some muslims may be, but the whole "enemy" schtick needs to be relegated to idiots...where it belongs.

Replace muslims with Christians and it's practically the same thing.

But we're getting off track here bull...

FWIW: I'm not trying to paint the entire muslim populate with a broad brush. Just asking, where are the critics?

WHembly , you made my point for me.
I'm sick of meeting muslims who are afraid to admit they are muslims for fear of backlash. (nice Jesus teachings we have going on here)

I thought I made the point, anyways.
Islam is an individual religion at its base , much like gnostic christianism.
From what I have read ( I actually like islam as a religion ) it is generally too personal to relate . I have a LOT of discussions with my Pakistani Boss, I've worked with Maylay muslims, Indo muslims, Palestinians, albanians, thai muslims, Iranians (weirdly the most moderate after indonesians) and many more. If you wanted to get a "profilish" opinion I'd actually say they were nicer than christians.


How many churches do you hear criticizing westborou baptist, now I dont mean when they make headlines, I mean all the time.

 Bullockist wrote:
WHembly , you made my point for me.

That was my point... we're closer than what you initially though of me.

How many churches do you hear criticizing westborou baptist, now I dont mean when they make headlines, I mean all the time.

Plenty.

It could also stem from the fact that "The Western" culture traditionally allows religious dissent... whereas its frowned upon in the East.

 whembly wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
The idea of Norway being somehow unimportant is a little bit...uncomfortable.

I certainly didn't mean that...

Kronk mentioned the draw mohammed day fracas prevously.

Wasn't the draw Mohammed day thing from Denmark because of the Cartoon? Not Norway because I can't seem to find anything on that.

bs, western church comes from the pope, where no differentiation in belief was allowed.
Islam does not have that at all. FFS there is even a sect of Islam that has had a prophet after mohammed, mohammed was supposedly the last for ever.
In fact in islamic society the women are the ones who traditionally protest.
Weird to think about from our view isn't it

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 whembly wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
The idea of Norway being somehow unimportant is a little bit...uncomfortable.

I certainly didn't mean that...

Kronk mentioned the draw mohammed day fracas prevously.

Wasn't the draw Mohammed day thing from Denmark because of the Cartoon? Not Norway because I can't seem to find anything on that.

Maybe... but Theo Van Gogh is the name that comes to me...

It was a Danish cartoonist.