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 Verviedi wrote:
Necrons- Scarabs
Guard- Hellhound
Skitarii- Ironstrider Balistarii
Space Marines- Terminators
Orks- Gorka/Morkanaut
Tyranids- Tyrant Guard
Harlequins- Voidweaver
Eldar- Storm Guardians
Chaos Space Marines- Thousand Sons
Grey Knights- Purgation Squads
Dark Angels- Dark Talon
Dark Eldar- Succubus

Hellhound vs orks, guard, Nids and even daemons are pretty good. Your saying you rate roughriders as better than them.

Also i know terminators are pricy but th ss with a good hq or two smash face vs most things. For marines I'd say numerous things are worse but to pick one I'd have to go with scout bikers

 pretre wrote:

Roknar wrote:
Surprised nobody mentioned the canoness. Especially if you restrict yourself to not using special characters or have no intention of buying fortifications. My beloved jump canoness went to...technically I can't even field her due to jump conversion and the way I play means I have no use for her...at all. Which is why I'm still waiting for a that shiny new dex.

I thought about it, but skipped her. She at least can be used if you need a super cheap HQ to get a detachment.

I suppose there is that. Then again, I can't think of a unit that puts (me) off an entire codex all on it's own ^^. The codex is still very much viable, at least in my group. Totally wrecked a friends dark angels. But to me the HQ is the leader of my army and should feel appropriately important/valuable/characterful. And since I'm not big on gearing my sisters for melee, except repentia or penitents (and we all know how well that works without allies). She's little more than glorified leadership buff to me lol.

SOB: Penitent Engine or Repentia. They're both working really hard to beat the other in crapiness.

SM: Dreadnaught. Tac termies, assault marines.

CSM: Mutilators, warp talons, dark apostles, stock land raider, Thousand Sons, Khorne 'Zerkers, Defilers.

 MWHistorian wrote:
SOB: Penitent Engine or Repentia. They're both working really hard to beat the other in crapiness.

SM: Dreadnaught. Tac termies, assault marines.

CSM: Mutilators, warp talons, dark apostles, stock land raider, Thousand Sons, Khorne 'Zerkers, Defilers.

Does access to melta really take BA ASM from one of the worst units in the SM to a "must take" that every one seems to think they are? Or are ASM not bad enough to be on this list really?

Pyrovores are the worst units in the entire game brah.

I can at least use Tyrant guards to give me 2+ saves in the living fortress formation.

SM: Almost every iconic unit: Tac marines, Dreadnoughts, ASM, Tac Termies, Devestators, pretty much all the stuff which comes to mind when one thinks "Space Marines"

Instead the army is strongest with Centurions, Assault Terminators, Sternguard, vindicators, Storm Ravens

Imperial Guard: Commissar. Don't get me wrong, Rough Riders are bad, Ogryn are basically worthless, but in a codex where so many units are bad, it helps to focus on one truly ultimate useless unit. Commissars take the cake; compared to a Priest they aren't ICs, can only be added to certain units, grant stubborn rather than fearless, kill a model which, in some cases, the enemy can choose when the squad fails a leadership test and cost the same as a Priest who grants fearless, re-roll to hit on the first round of melee, and can grant his unit re-roll failed saves.

Commissars are probably the most useless, redundant unit in a codex full of useless redundant units. At least hellhounds and Ogryns actually do something other units can't necessarily do, even if they do it poorly.

 Icculus wrote:

 Chute82 wrote:
Orks.. Deff dread, nobz unit, kans, gork naught, mega nobz, battle wagon, ect. Ect.

Mega nobz and battlewagons?!?!

Well I don't use meganobz myself, but I have seen them do some work.

But battlewagons? Battlewagons are easily one of the best units in the codex. Turn 2 charge with 40 boyz? Yes please.

Yeah, saying that Meganobz and BWs are bad units just means you either don't play orks or don't know how to use them properly. Even standard Nob units can be good at taking apart vehicles, ordinance and light infantry.

For Blood Angels..?
I feel like I should say things like Dreadnoughts, Scout Bikers, Vanguard Veterans, Baal Predator etc.
But then again, they're only considered bad when compared to similar choices in the same FOC slot.
VV's for example aren't really the worst unit that Blood Angels have, even tough no-one ever takes them.
They just happen to be in the same slot as DC, that get FnP, Fearless, Rage etc for 1 ppm more.

Ah, enough with the chit-chat, Captain Tycho, obviously!

Drager wrote:
So I was wondering what the worst unit in each codex was, what are peoples thoughts?

I'll kick us off with the Tyranid Pyrovore. Whilst the pyrovore has a reasonable model it suffers from such terrible rules that I've never seen one in action! I struggle to find anything worse in the nid dex, even with the slight buff last years book provided this little guy.

Pyrovores are awesome.. drop them in burn stuff.. and when they die they hit everything on the table (actually have a read of their rules and laugh)

GodDamUser wrote:

Drager wrote:
So I was wondering what the worst unit in each codex was, what are peoples thoughts?

I'll kick us off with the Tyranid Pyrovore. Whilst the pyrovore has a reasonable model it suffers from such terrible rules that I've never seen one in action! I struggle to find anything worse in the nid dex, even with the slight buff last years book provided this little guy.

Pyrovores are awesome.. drop them in burn stuff.. and when they die they hit everything on the table (actually have a read of their rules and laugh)

I'm pretty sure most people would throw the BRB at your face if you legitimately tried to use the pyrovore A-bomb.

And eww, elite slot wastage, use those for malanthropes or neurothropes.

Guard: Choose from the elites slot, take your pick! After that it is sentinels, the hydra, the standard leman russ battle tank, the bassilisk, and to some degree the chimera and the taurox prime.

A lot of that book is mostly crap.

Hey pyrovore a-bomb also hits your own guys so fair play =D

GodDamUser wrote:
Hey pyrovore a-bomb also hits your own guys so fair play =D

Its kinda like dropping a death strike in a GW the next town over, its just hilarious.

For Tau it's a full unit of shield drones. Try and use that squad.

Gk: Rhinos and Razorbacks, still yet to find a place for them in my list.

IG: Had problems with a lot of things being sup par, a couple of the LR variants, maybe the nova cannon one, rough riders have never done much for me either and ogryns... Whoever said Hellhounds are bad has never used them against crons!

Really the nova cannon one?

Iv been knocking out troops off objectives with that thing forever.

now RR i completely forgot about them.

It's just never done anything for me that a brace of Wyverns can't do better is all... Its one of the nicer looking LR variants though tbh!

Ill give it a try in my next game see if I change my opinion

I'm gonna have to go with rough riders. They just simply don't have a function or role. Pretty much useless, don't synergize well with anything, don't hit hard enough in melee or shooting, die like an expensive guardsmen, and take away slots from much better options.

Ratlings aren't much further behind, same goes for Ogryn.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
For Tau it's a full unit of shield drones. Try and use that squad.

Is their 4++ against shooting only? 'Cause if not, they'd make a half decent assault unit. They get a reasonable amount of attacks on the charge at Str 4, I4 and that 4++ means they can hold out for a while.

CSM: Mutilators. In addition to having one of the worst models I've seen in ages, they have less CC than terminators, since the termies can use their chainfist in consecutive turns. The Defiler certainly give the Muties a run for their money, but then it does actually provide something: a long range AP3 pie plate to force those jetbikes to jink, or at least make the Eldar player hide out of LOS and pray for a botched assault move. (Dis)honourable mention to Warp Talons, since they're in the same slot as Raptors who can take melta guns and outdamage Talons on a point for point basis against everything bar marines, though at least Talons can get a 5++ (or 4++) save. If you doo need to kill MEQ squads though, Talons can do a passable job.

SoB: Celestians. Repentia have a specialised place at taking down superheavies, Pengines are at least immune to most small arms, but Celestians are simply Battle sisters with a CC focus who cost more points and lose ObSec. No thanks. If for some reason I have already taken 6 troop choices, Celestine, Jacobus, 3x Exos, 1 Sera and a pair of Doms, then I'd rather ally stuff in than take Celestians. At least Repentia can act as counterassault by hiding behind your exos if required.

SM: Tough call, but probably tactical terminators since sternguard shoot better, can come down T1 in a pod, cost less for 5 guys with a transport and specials while competeing for the same slot. Given the amount of AP2 around these days, there's not even much difference in survivability. Stalkers give them a solid go for the title though, as the 'Talon is better AA and the heavy slot is kinda full. (Dis)Honourable mention to the Whirlwind, since the TFC does the same job much better in the same slot for a pittance more.

Daemons: Changeling. If I wanted a cheap beatstick, I'd take skulltaker for a handful more points, since the Changeling doesn't get weapon stats or armour, so he's still going to die like a punk the second he copies anything worth fighting. Not to mention that the Daemons codex is not really short on combat characters.

Tau: Vespid. Crisis suits do it better, with more armour, more shots and jsj.

Eldar: Storm guardians. Has no place in combat since he's basically a more expensive guardsman and the rest of the Eldar Dex is better in so many ways. Unless you're trying to tone down your army or play a super fluffy list, I just don't see the point. Why are these guys not a weapon swap option for normal guardians?

DE: Wyches. Duh, do I really need to expand on this?

'Nids: Pyrovore. 40 points for a heavy flamer? Nope.

Guard: The obvious one (Commisar) is ruled out for me, since going to ground behind an ADL for a 2+ cover is pretty win, especially when you can't break due to summary execution. Can't do that if you're fearless. Technically Ogryns provide CC ability, though I can't imagine ever taking them. I'll pick on Wyrdvane psychers, since the primaris psycher does everything they do for 10 points less, doesn't take a slot (though the elite slot is hardly crowded with good options) and can hide in a blob of 50 guardsmen handing out buffs like prescience, endurance, perfect timing etc. Everything else in the Guard Dex at least provides something you can't get somewhere else, even if it's not a good option, it is at least an option.

DA: Their speeder. You can already take plasma cannons by the bucketload, why stick on on such a pricy unit with only 2 HP? The fliers are bad, but at least offer something that nothing else in the codex does.

BA: Tempted to say VV here, since competing in the same slot against Sang Guard and DC means you're in for a bad time, but they can bring fast moving stormshields and power weapons, and get a formation benefit of free weapons, so Tycho gets the nod here. A melta gun and no weapon in an HQ slot where HQ slots are at a premium means you get to stay on the bus.

Orks: Flash Gits gets my vote, since they provide more unreliable anti-infantry shooting on a fragile platform that requires relatively short ranges to work, while being expensive and only haveing a 6+ save and competing for slots in what is possibly the most contested and crowded slot in all of 40k.

GK: Purgation squad. Same deal as normal PA troops, but take a heavy slot that could be better used for a dreadknight. Yes, they can take 4 heavies, but they're not relentless or S&P, so the psycannon/psilencer is pretty useless and DK's can take a torrent (heavy) incinerator in the same slot and be better at virtually everything else as well, so why bother with these guys?

Necrons: Anni barge, since it just provides more shots that glance on a 6 against AV13 at 24", which a bog standard warrior can already provide in greater quantity. Man, if you'd told me anni barges would be the worst unit in the dex last edition, I'd have had you locked up.

SW: All of them, because they're spess woofs.

From experience:

Chaos: All of chaos (sad but true)
Space Marines: Assault Marines
Necrons: Monoliths

Ugh. I play Eldar and I want to build a Raven Guard army as well. I've seen two comments that make me sigh regarding Space Marines: bolter armed marines and Assault Marines. Bolters are standard issue for their Troops and well a Raven Guard army without Assault Marines just doesn't seem interesting. Oh well, but I am glad for the forewarning.

Guardian Defenders seem to be the worst unit in my experience.

Eadartri wrote:
Ugh. I play Eldar and I want to build a Raven Guard army as well. I've seen two comments that make me sigh regarding Space Marines: bolter armed marines and Assault Marines. Bolters are standard issue for their Troops and well a Raven Guard army without Assault Marines just doesn't seem interesting. Oh well, but I am glad for the forewarning.

Use Raptors chapter tactics. They have the option to switch their bolters and bolt pistols into Heavy 1 Rending weapons for no additional cost. Non-bulky infantry get Scout and Stealth on turn one, as well.

Worst unit in the SM codex: Servitors. They have no function whatsoever.

Thanks for this idea. I'm not seeing the Raptors chapter tactics in the codex. I guess I had thought as a successor chapter they would have the same tactics as the Raven Guard. What is the page number?

Orks: Every walker in our stupid army, from 50pt Kans all the way to the Stompa itself. Also I personally think Meganobz suck. To many points for a 3 man squad that does the same task as a unit of boyz or regular nobz. 1 round of shooting at Megaobz with a Lascannon Dev squad and poof their goes your investment.

hmm......Ork Nob bikers are useless now to, WAY to many points for a biker nob and realistically the only difference between them and a regular bike is +1 wounds and +1 strength for over twice the cost.

Eadartri wrote:
Thanks for this idea. I'm not seeing the Raptors chapter tactics in the codex. I guess I had thought as a successor chapter they would have the same tactics as the Raven Guard. What is the page number?

I'm not 100% sure but I believe their rules (and their special HQ, Lias Issodon) are in Imperial Armour Volume Nine - The Badab War - Part One.

Eadartri wrote:
Thanks for this idea. I'm not seeing the Raptors chapter tactics in the codex. I guess I had thought as a successor chapter they would have the same tactics as the Raven Guard. What is the page number?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/B/FWchaptertactics-v2.pdf

It's a FW chapter tactic.

Eldar - storm guardians, shining spears, wraithlords

If you want to play eldar without being accused of cheese, take those. They're all terrible. I've lost count of the wraithlords I've killed before they inflicted a single wound. I've never faced the other 2 units because they're so awful nobody even attempts to use them around here.

Tau: Vespid or Sun Stark Bomber. Vespids are outshone by crisis suits. The Sun Shark's drones still cannot fire its weapon with both profiles due to skyfire an lack of FAQ.

Necrons: Lychguard with warscythes or Annihilation barges. Both are just too expensive for being slow. Lychguard be taken with shield and sword which makes them super durable, Annihilation barges got hit reaaly hard by the hefty point increase combined with the Tesla nerf. It has too short range for not jinking/moving 12 which deprives it of its firepower. (Us poor Necrons, right? Just take Night scythes instead.

Space Marines: There is a lot of awful models there. I would likely go with Assault centurions for being slow, expensive and lack a decent delivery option.

As much as people say Eldar is OP, Howling Banshees are just there to die

Oh yes, the Sun Shark. Can generate bombs after dropping one on a 2+, but since it doesn't start with any, can't drop one to generate more. One of the more lulzy bits of rules writing they've managed. I'd still rate Vespid as worse than the bomber with no bombs.