My take on the primarch. - rowboat gullyman

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**Captain Solon**

Hi. this is my idea for a primarch. I'm going with rowboat since he seems easy enough.

Rouboute Guilliam
300 points

Composition:
1 unique

SL
WS7 BS6 S/T4 W4 I5 A4 Ld10 Sv 2+ 4+

I felt his skill wouldn't necesarily lie in being able to smite his foe in combat, but more in tactically controling the situation. So, his stats aren't god-like.

Wargear:
Armour of maccrage
The emperors hand
The iron halo
the pistol of absolution

Armour of maccrage:
Is artificer armour, it gives the Feel no pain Special rule.

The Emperors hand is a master crafted relic blade. it grants a single parry save, in close combat per turn. this means if he is hit, roll a D6 and ignore this attack. cannot be taken against units with a higher I then him, and is granted against the most powerful attack damage he takes.

The pistol of absolution is a mastercrafted pistol made specxially for Rouboute guilliam.

This is effectively a plasma pistol, but without gets hot!
12" S7 AP2, Pistol

Special rules
All normal for a captain.

Up to three unmounted infantry squads may have one of the following rules:
infiltrate
Tank hunters
Furious charge

thoughts?

**Orkeosaurus**

Here are my stats for him:

Rowboat Girlyman, Primarch of the Ultramarines and All Around Failure

Points: 11

Composition: Unique

WS2 BS2 S4 T4 W3 I2 A2 Ld7 Sv2+/4+

Wargear:
Artificer Armor
Master-Crafted Relic Blade
Bolt Pistol
Iron Halo

Special Rules:
Idiot
Arrogant
Inferior Tactician

Idiot: Rowboat Girlyman is an idiot, who can't even show up to Terra on time, despite claiming to be logistical genius. An army that contains Girlyman cannot seize the initiative. Further, any player going against an army that contains him will seize the initiative on a 5+.

Arrogant: Girlyman thinks he's some sort of brilliant leader, even when he's getting his own men killed. All models in Girlyman's army lose the Combat Tactics special rule. Furthermore, Girlyman and whatever squad he's attached to have the Rage USR.

Inferior Tactician: Girlyman could never compare to Alpharius in terms of leadership ability, tactical awareness, or even sense of style. The Ultramarines look like a bunch of scared, confused children whenever they go up against the Alpha Legion's strategic mastery. Any Space Marine army with Girlyman in it loses And They Shall Know No Fear, and has every model's Leadership reduced by 1 whenever they go up against the Alpha Legion. Also, every model in the Alpha Legion has rending.

Hope it doesn't seem to biased.

**Iur_tae_mont**

Orkeosaurus wrote:Here are my stats for him:

Rowboat Girlyman, Primarch of the Ultramarines and All Around Failure

Points: 11

Composition: Unique

WS2 BS2 S4 T4 W3 I2 A2 Ld7 Sv2+/4+

Wargear:
Artificer Armor
Master-Crafted Relic Blade
Bolt Pistol
Iron Halo

Special Rules:
Idiot
Arrogant
Inferior Tactician

Idiot: Rowboat Girlyman is an idiot, who can't even show up to Terra on time, despite claiming to be logistical genius. An army that contains Girlyman cannot seize the initiative. Further, any player going against an army that contains him will seize the initiative on a 5+.

Arrogant: Girlyman thinks he's some sort of brilliant leader, even when he's getting his own men killed. All models in Girlyman's army lose the Combat Tactics special rule. Furthermore, Girlyman and whatever squad he's attached to have the Rage USR.

Inferior Tactician: Girlyman could never compare to Alpharius in terms of leadership ability, tactical awareness, or even sense of style. The Ultramarines look like a bunch of scared, confused children whenever they go up against the Alpha Legion's strategic mastery. Any Space Marine army with Girlyman in it loses And They Shall Know No Fear, and has every model's Leadership reduced by 1 whenever they go up against the Alpha Legion. Also, every model in the Alpha Legion has rending.

Hope it doesn't seem to biased.

FINALLY! A Space Marine my Drones can beat in CC.

**Captain Solon**

orkeo, I don't like guillaume. I'm trying to show makers how a primarch should be.

I hate seeing a primarch with statline 10.

**COMMANDER SUNTZU**

To be honest a primarch would be more powerful than even that of abaddon so they would end up costing a godly amount such as 800 to 1000 points. Remember some primarchs were nearly as powerful as the emperor himself .

**Captain Solon**

no, sun.

A primarch, as much as we'd like him to be, is still a space marine, not a god.
Same is the emperor.

Their stats, as such should never really exceed 7 in my opinion, and 6 is that of an unearthly hero or master.

Leave it to the other races to have values of 8,9,10. we'll enjoy our weaponspam, and our kewl powers that make our enemies say WTF?

**Storm Lord**

Captain Solon wrote:
The Emperors hand is a master crafted relic blade. it grants a single parry save, in close combat per turn. this means if he is hit, roll a D6 and ignore this attack. cannot be taken against units with a higher I then him, and is granted against the most powerful attack damage he takes.

Wait... roll a D6 and ignore this attack? Am I missing something or are you telling us we roll a dice and whatever the result is the attack is ignored? Why not just not bother rolling the dice and ignore the attack?
Also define most powerful attack. Does that mean the highest strength one, the one that ignores saves, one that inflicts ID due to a special rule...etc

Or did you mean roll a D6 and on a result of 4+ (or similar) the highest strength attack is ignored.

Sorry if it sounds like I'm nitpicking

**Corennus**

Roboute Guilliman:

300 points

Unit Composition: 1 (Unique)

Unit Type : Infantry

WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv

7 6 6 5 5 6 5 10 2+

Wargear:
Gauntlets of Ultramar
Gold Halo (3++ Inv Save)
Artificer Armour
Sword of Macragge

Special Rules:
And They Shall Know No Fear
Combat Tactics
Independant Character
Tactical Genius *
Father of the Codex*
Orbital Bombardment
Eternal Warrior

*Tactical Genius:
Guilliman's knowledge of tactics and strategies means he can re-roll all shooting and close combat attacks, as well as automatically passing all Leadership and Morale tests UNLESS he chooses to fail these.

* Father of the Codex:
Going to war with the mighty Primarch at their head all battle brothers within 24" automatically pass morale/leadership tests and are fearless and stubborn.

The Sword of Macragge: This is a master crafted relic blade that uses an unstable plasma blade. As such any wounds caused by this weapon gain 2D6 for armour penetration and always wound on a 2+.

**Captain Solon**

sorry, doesn't fearless kinda make stubborn redundant?
and again with the overdone stats! they don't need S/T5.

**Corennus**

They need to be comparable to a Daemon Prince Solon.

And Fearless doesn't mean stubborn and vice versa.

fearless you AUTO pass leadership and morale tests, but with fearless you lose combat you take wounds thanks to no retreat rule

Stubborn means you can't retreat out of combat.

**Valkyrie**

Corennus wrote:Roboute Guilliman:

300 points

Unit Composition: 1 (Unique)

Unit Type : Infantry

WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv

7 6 6 5 5 6 5 10 2+

Wargear:
Gauntlets of Ultramar
Gold Halo (3++ Inv Save)
Artificer Armour
Sword of Macragge

Special Rules:
And They Shall Know No Fear
Combat Tactics
Independant Character
Tactical Genius *
Father of the Codex*
Orbital Bombardment
Eternal Warrior

*Tactical Genius:
Guilliman's knowledge of tactics and strategies means he can re-roll all shooting and close combat attacks, as well as automatically passing all Leadership and Morale tests UNLESS he chooses to fail these.

* Father of the Codex:
Going to war with the mighty Primarch at their head all battle brothers within 24" automatically pass morale/leadership tests and are fearless and stubborn.

The Sword of Macragge: This is a master crafted relic blade that uses an unstable plasma blade. As such any wounds caused by this weapon gain 2D6 for armour penetration and always wound on a 2+.

Girlyman did not have the Gauntlets of Ultramar.

Sword of Macragge is a tad overpowered I think.

**Jackal**

So why must they be similar stat wise to a daemon prince?
Just makes it stupid IMO.

Angron was promoted into daemonhood for his work, so why would he be promoted to the same stats?

TBH, the strength of a primarch should rely on his ability to alter and work with the army around him, not to be a 1 man army on his own.
S and T do not need to be 6, or even 5 for that matter.
I also dont see why a primarch that was considered a tactition would somehow become a combat monster and sharpshooter for no reason.

Now, angron pre-heresy would be more inclined combat wise, as would russ.
rouboute on the other hand would be the same as a chapter master really, but should have a few rules that would help army-wide, rather than turning him into a marine on 'roids.

**Corennus**

The Gauntlets of Ultramar were fashioned by Guilliman himself I thought...

**Storm Lord**

Corennus wrote:The Gauntlets of Ultramar were fashioned by Guilliman himself I thought...

Actually I do beleive they were taken from a champion of the Ruinous powers. It said in white dwarf a couple of years back, and possibly in the old Space Marine codex. I'll cite precidence when I find it

Daemon Weapon ultramarines anyone?

**Gwar!**

Corennus wrote:Special Rules:
And They Shall Know No Fear
Combat Tactics
Independant Character
Tactical Genius *
Father of the Codex*
Orbital Bombardment
Eternal Warrior

*Tactical Genius:
Guilliman's knowledge of tactics and strategies means he can re-roll all shooting and close combat attacks, as well as automatically passing all Leadership and Morale tests UNLESS he chooses to fail these.

* Father of the Codex:
Going to war with the mighty Primarch at their head all battle brothers within 24" automatically pass morale/leadership tests and are fearless and stubborn.

The Sword of Macragge: This is a master crafted relic blade that uses an unstable plasma blade. As such any wounds caused by this weapon gain 2D6 for armour penetration and always wound on a 2+.

*Tactical Genius:
Guilliman's knowledge of tactics and strategies means he can re-roll all shooting and close combat attacks, as well as automatically passing all Leadership and Morale tests UNLESS he chooses to fail these.

Tactical Genius

All in all, I think Orkeosaurus's version is more fitting to the fluff. Perhaps he could do with a "Whiny B***h" rule, to represent his pouting over not being made Warmaster?

**Lokirfellheart**

Orkeosaurus wrote:Here are my stats for him:

Rowboat Girlyman, Primarch of the Ultramarines and All Around Failure

Points: 11

Composition: Unique

WS2 BS2 S4 T4 W3 I2 A2 Ld7 Sv2+/4+

Wargear:
Artificer Armor
Master-Crafted Relic Blade
Bolt Pistol
Iron Halo

Special Rules:
Idiot
Arrogant
Inferior Tactician

Idiot: Rowboat Girlyman is an idiot, who can't even show up to Terra on time, despite claiming to be logistical genius. An army that contains Girlyman cannot seize the initiative. Further, any player going against an army that contains him will seize the initiative on a 5+.

Arrogant: Girlyman thinks he's some sort of brilliant leader, even when he's getting his own men killed. All models in Girlyman's army lose the Combat Tactics special rule. Furthermore, Girlyman and whatever squad he's attached to have the Rage USR.

Inferior Tactician: Girlyman could never compare to Alpharius in terms of leadership ability, tactical awareness, or even sense of style. The Ultramarines look like a bunch of scared, confused children whenever they go up against the Alpha Legion's strategic mastery. Any Space Marine army with Girlyman in it loses And They Shall Know No Fear, and has every model's Leadership reduced by 1 whenever they go up against the Alpha Legion. Also, every model in the Alpha Legion has rending.

Hope it doesn't seem to biased.

Nice rules. Accurate too.

**Suicidal Cheez**

4 wounds on a Primach? So you say Marneus Calgar is of the same importance as Rob?

**Gwar!**

Suicidal Cheez wrote:4 wounds on a Primach? So you say Marneus Calgar is of the same importance as Rob?

No. If anything Calgar should have 0.5 wounds.

**Iur_tae_mont**

Wait, what?

So how would .5 wounds work? If he has to take an armor save, he wets himself in fear and curls up into a ball?

**Che-Vito**

Iur_tae_mont wrote:Wait, what?

So how would .5 wounds work? If he has to take an armor save, he wets himself in fear and curls up into a ball?

Roll a d100. On a 2+, he loses the entire 1st Company to Tyranids...nom nom nom

**Iur_tae_mont**

Don't forget: you enemy can pay 1 point to make the roll 1+.

**del'Vhar**

Don't forget that on a roll of 3+ the Ultramarines are on the other side of the galaxy and don't take part in the game!

**Iur_tae_mont**

That's only if you are fighting Chaos.

**kaidsin**

I think your primach needs some abilities to help his crew more. Maybe some really sweet chapter tactics, inspiring presence, iron will, master tactician or such? I mean he is a great super powered god human creation, but he doesnt win the war by running in the front and taking down the whole enemy force, he should help improve his force.

**WarWizard91**

Ah shucks another thread turned into Ultramarines hate, thank goodness to, 'cause for a second there I almost thought that making fun of them wasn't the cool thing to do anymore.

**Orkeosaurus**

The Alpha Legion wins again!

**reds8n**

Whilst the occasional "amusing" post is quite fine and perhaps even desirable there is a time and place for them, and most pertinently in this case, knowing when enough is enough. ta.

**AvatarForm**

Captain Solon wrote:no, sun.

A primarch, as much as we'd like him to be, is still a space marine, not a god.
Same is the emperor.

Their stats, as such should never really exceed 7 in my opinion, and 6 is that of an unearthly hero or master.

Leave it to the other races to have values of 8,9,10. we'll enjoy our weaponspam, and our kewl powers that make our enemies say WTF?

LOL... ur so off target.

Primarchs are to Space Marines as SPace Marines are to Imperial Guardsmen... your primarch wouldnt stand up to a stiff wind.

**Captain Solon**

please... never use ur again. thats what you do on facebook [if then]

Primarchs aren't necesarily any stronger then marines, and even in the case of the emperor, I'd really never go above S/T6, and there we're effectively talking about the marine of marines.

The fact is, by giving him S/T5, he's effectively capable of shurging off things that would kill the average marine chapter master in one hit. - why should a primarch be able to shrug off a blast from a lascannon?

Seriously, I don't understand why a man, duely a well armoured, super-cyborginated/implanted man could ever truely be any stronger then his co-counterparts.

Think about it:
You've a 4+ invulnerable save. that represents a half chance of either being wiped out, or being alive, and charging into an opponent.

**Corennus**

Um. Primarchs ARE stronger and tougher than marines Solon.......

They're bigger, stronger, more intelligent, faster than a normal space marine.