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JohnHwangDD wrote:GKTs as Elites (and Troops via Stern) are practically a given after Deathwing showed again that Termie Troops simply can't be broken.

I can't see GKTs as Fast, but a GKT Dev squad? Sure!

Do it!!!

@ your comment about the CMLs. Rumour has a wrist mounted CML for GKs might be available. It was mentioned in the warseer thread.

wolfshadow wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:GKTs as Elites (and Troops via Stern) are practically a given after Deathwing showed again that Termie Troops simply can't be broken.

I can't see GKTs as Fast, but a GKT Dev squad? Sure!

Do it!!!

@ your comment about the CMLs. Rumour has a wrist mounted CML for GKs might be available. It was mentioned in the warseer thread.

What moron is writing the Codex? They're completely ruining the opportunity to create a distinctive SM alternative. It's like they listened to every suggestion and said: "what is the blandest thing we could do to the most non-standard SM army we currently have?"

"No generic Rhinos & Razorbacks? Add them"

"No Termie CMLs?" Add them"

At this rate, we'll get GK Bikers and GK Vindicators.

Might as well flush the whole damn thing down the toilet.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

wolfshadow wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:GKTs as Elites (and Troops via Stern) are practically a given after Deathwing showed again that Termie Troops simply can't be broken.

I can't see GKTs as Fast, but a GKT Dev squad? Sure!

Do it!!!

@ your comment about the CMLs. Rumour has a wrist mounted CML for GKs might be available. It was mentioned in the warseer thread.

What moron is writing the Codex? They're completely ruining the opportunity to create a distinctive SM alternative. It's like they listened to every suggestion and said: "what is the blandest thing we could do to the most non-standard SM army we currently have?"

"No generic Rhinos & Razorbacks? Add them"

"No Termie CMLs?" Add them"

At this rate, we'll get GK Bikers and GK Vindicators.

Might as well flush the whole damn thing down the toilet.

I dunno, wrist mounted CMLs are pretty distinctive....

They could attach the CML to the model's crotch, and it's still functionally exactly the same as the regular CML for all intents and purposes. No imagination, no point.

JohnHwangDD wrote:

wolfshadow wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:GKTs as Elites (and Troops via Stern) are practically a given after Deathwing showed again that Termie Troops simply can't be broken.

I can't see GKTs as Fast, but a GKT Dev squad? Sure!

Do it!!!

@ your comment about the CMLs. Rumour has a wrist mounted CML for GKs might be available. It was mentioned in the warseer thread.

What moron is writing the Codex? They're completely ruining the opportunity to create a distinctive SM alternative. It's like they listened to every suggestion and said: "what is the blandest thing we could do to the most non-standard SM army we currently have?"

"No generic Rhinos & Razorbacks? Add them"

"No Termie CMLs?" Add them"

At this rate, we'll get GK Bikers and GK Vindicators.

Might as well flush the whole damn thing down the toilet.

I doubt we'll see any kind of CML for the GKT. For one,a wrist mounted ML sounds pretty silly. For another,it simply makes GKT's too good. Think about a unit of WS5 Termies with S6 Force Weapons that goes at I4 that also gets to reroll it's 2+ armor save and 5+ Invulnerable saves,AND also has the option to throw in some TH/SS models with 2+/3+ rerollable saves,AND also has the option to take an effective long range anti tank weapon like the CML. It's a do everything unit with zero weakness at all. There's no reason NOT to take them,which is why I highly doubt they'll have a long range weapon option.

Whatever1 wrote:
I doubt we'll see any kind of CML for the GKT. For one,a wrist mounted ML sounds pretty silly. For another,it simply makes GKT's too good. Think about a unit of WS5 Termies with S6 Force Weapons that goes at I4 that also gets to reroll it's 2+ armor save and 5+ Invulnerable saves,AND also has the option to throw in some TH/SS models with 2+/3+ rerollable saves,AND also has the option to take an effective long range anti tank weapon like the CML. It's a do everything unit with zero weakness at all. There's no reason NOT to take them,which is why I highly doubt they'll have a long range weapon option.

Uh, what about points cost?
GKs weakness is the very few # of them that you will be fielding. GKs SHOULD be good at everything....You just have to pay for the ability.

These are the people the Inqusition brough in to wipe out another SM chapter.

Does anybody remember a piece of rumor about a landraider with half its body being a cannon? or the one many gk flyer? any new rumours on that?

wolfshadow wrote:
GKs weakness is the very few # of them that you will be fielding. GKs SHOULD be good at everything....You just have to pay for the ability.

Except Long Range anti tank imo. That should always be their weakness so that mech armies can run circles around them

That and they're supposed to go around bashing Daemons, not tanks.

Just Dave wrote:That and they're supposed to go around bashing Daemons, not tanks.

Chainfists that strike at initiative with any daemon or chaos vehicle?

kenshin620 wrote:

Just Dave wrote:That and they're supposed to go around bashing Daemons, not tanks.

Chainfists that strike at initiative with any daemon or chaos vehicle?

If Matt Ward writes it...

kenshin620 wrote:

wolfshadow wrote:
GKs weakness is the very few # of them that you will be fielding. GKs SHOULD be good at everything....You just have to pay for the ability.

Except Long Range anti tank imo. That should always be their weakness so that mech armies can run circles around them

Just Dave wrote:That and they're supposed to go around bashing Daemons, not tanks.

This kind of argument always struck me as ridiculously dumb, especially from a fluff standpoint.

In case you've never looked at the Chaos Marine Codex, or the Chaos Demon codex - they have these Demons....bound inside vehicles. In fact the Demon book has a Vehicle that the demon took control over during the binding process.

Somehow the Grey Knights don't go to battle with the tools to take these things out. Ever.

So when they go to fight a demon incursion, once they notice a Soul Grinder on the field, they get in their Rhinos and...wait...they teleport away.

Voodoo Boyz wrote:

kenshin620 wrote:

wolfshadow wrote:
GKs weakness is the very few # of them that you will be fielding. GKs SHOULD be good at everything....You just have to pay for the ability.

Except Long Range anti tank imo. That should always be their weakness so that mech armies can run circles around them

Just Dave wrote:That and they're supposed to go around bashing Daemons, not tanks.

This kind of argument always struck me as ridiculously dumb, especially from a fluff standpoint.

In case you've never looked at the Chaos Marine Codex, or the Chaos Demon codex - they have these Demons....bound inside vehicles. In fact the Demon book has a Vehicle that the demon took control over during the binding process.

Somehow the Grey Knights don't go to battle with the tools to take these things out. Ever.

So when they go to fight a demon incursion, once they notice a Soul Grinder on the field, they get in their Rhinos and...wait...they teleport away.

GK have ways to deal with to deal with vehicles,but they force you to take different units and/or unorthodox options to do so. GK can still do TL Lascannon Dreads with or without a ML for tank busting. If you're running LR spam,then you've 2 TL Lascannons on the standard LR and Multi-Melta's on the LRC. You can give Melta-Bombs to your Brother-Captains and Justicars. You can give the Hammerhand psychic power to GK Hero's. TH/SS Termies will also wreck vehicles,and they seem to be fairly reliably in the new codex. It's not like there's nothing you can do against vehicles. It's just that to deal with heavier vehicles,you have to adjust your list accordingly and make compromises,which is how it should be. When you have powerful units that can just do everything,then the list pretty much makes itself.

Melissia wrote:If they do this to my Sisters codex I will cry.

I hope they leave all of the Inquisition aspects in the GK codex, because Sisters make a full army by themselves without adding in half-assed Guard elements.

Just need to expand the Sisters to meet fifth edition (something is definitely doable, even if it requires the creation of some new fluff).

I hope there'll be no ISTs, or 1 squad per Inquisitor. Otherwise People would just use it as an IG army with a few GK's or SoB's. And there isn't going to be a SoB AND GK codex, it'll be one big "Inquisition" codex. But you can still take SoB armies.

apparently-
Storm raven mini coming out.
Plastic GK's coming out.
Plastic GK hero mini.
GK dread mini/upgrade kit.
NFW's will be CCW's, unless the squad passes a psychic test that turn- then they're Force weapons.
Halberds are upgrades, counting as NFW's with +2 strength.
P.S: thanks to grey templar for the info


Automatically Appended Next Post:

The Hammer wrote:Does anybody remember a piece of rumor about a landraider with half its body being a cannon? or the one many gk flyer? any new rumours on that?

Maybe storm raven for GK's.

wolfshadow wrote:

JohnHwangDD wrote:GKTs as Elites (and Troops via Stern) are practically a given after Deathwing showed again that Termie Troops simply can't be broken.

I can't see GKTs as Fast, but a GKT Dev squad? Sure!

Do it!!!

@ your comment about the CMLs. Rumour has a wrist mounted CML for GKs might be available. It was mentioned in the warseer thread.

CML on wrists? Incredibly unimaginative and borcken, but it would be cool nevertheless.
And I so dearly hope about the whole "Annointed armour" thingy- re-rolling armour saves?

shrike wrote:And there isn't going to be a SoB AND GK codex, it'll be one big "Inquisition" codex.

GW has contradicted this, publicly and openly calling it "fanwank". Which is insulting, as no real fan would want it. But I digress. This rumor has been debunked so many times it's not funny. Time and time again, it's been repeatedly stated by every reliable source and even by official GW channels that there will be two separate codices. We really don't need to get into this godforsaken topic again.

Melissia wrote: Which is insulting, as no real fan would want it.

Yet I have seen it repeated over and over again till there was conformation for C:GK

Melissia wrote:Which is insulting, as no real fan would want it.

That's your opinion; I'd personally be fine with it. That said, it's not going to happen and both armies are probably better off as a result.

bhsman wrote:

Melissia wrote:Which is insulting, as no real fan would want it.

That's your opinion; I'd personally be fine with it. That said, it's not going to happen and both armies are probably better off as a result.

I would really hate to see a combined codex as it would ultimately wind up watering down the fluff that could be provided to both armies in separate codexes.

Which is why I said they'll be better off this way.

No really, it's my opinion? Gee, I was hoping noone would figure that out.

Jokes aside, let's get back on topic!

GK should definitely have some kind of Superheavy Landraider variant with TL Psycannons and Incinerators and stuff. Despite the arguments about Teleporting, what if the Enemy denied them the ability by teleport jamming. They would definitely have that and specialist Razorbacks with extra armour and TL Psycannons. Oh and a Venerable Dreadnought or two.

I know that all GK are Psykers but what about a "Blunt" a Non Psyker GK Hero a Man whose presence would be too painful for Daemons to Stand. A true Emperors Champion specifically to seek out the foulest of the Foul Daemons and "Brass them Up!"....GK's so Hard they make Diamonds look like Play dough....

Melissia wrote:

shrike wrote:And there isn't going to be a SoB AND GK codex, it'll be one big "Inquisition" codex.

GW has contradicted this, publicly and openly calling it "fanwank". Which is insulting, as no real fan would want it. But I digress. This rumor has been debunked so many times it's not funny. Time and time again, it's been repeatedly stated by every reliable source and even by official GW channels that there will be two separate codices. We really don't need to get into this godforsaken topic again.

sorry, it's just i've heard from GW staff members that it's gonna be a joint codex.

By GW staff members do you mean low level employees that don't know jack about gak?

Voodoo Boyz wrote:

kenshin620 wrote:

wolfshadow wrote:
GKs weakness is the very few # of them that you will be fielding. GKs SHOULD be good at everything....You just have to pay for the ability.

Except Long Range anti tank imo. That should always be their weakness so that mech armies can run circles around them

Just Dave wrote:That and they're supposed to go around bashing Daemons, not tanks.

This kind of argument always struck me as ridiculously dumb, especially from a fluff standpoint.

In case you've never looked at the Chaos Marine Codex, or the Chaos Demon codex - they have these Demons....bound inside vehicles. In fact the Demon book has a Vehicle that the demon took control over during the binding process.

Somehow the Grey Knights don't go to battle with the tools to take these things out. Ever.

So when they go to fight a demon incursion, once they notice a Soul Grinder on the field, they get in their Rhinos and...wait...they teleport away.

Totally agree with you...

I mean most Chaose vehicles are supposed to have their machine spirit replaced with deamons. Heck, some of the best 40K Choas vehicle conversions I've seen represent this. And yet GKs aren't supposed to be able to take them out from long range? WTF? GKs having the ability to take out tanks is easily balanced by points cost. Think about how much a squad of GKs with CMLs would cost......

mwnciboo wrote:GK should definitely have some kind of Superheavy Landraider variant with TL Psycannons and Incinerators and stuff.

The problem is that Space Marine aerospace assets simply aren't made to deliver anything bigger than a Land Raider. The dropships/transports that move that kind of stuff around for the IG are sitting ducks compared to a Thunderhawk or a Strike Cruiser/Battlebarge. They've already got their own Land Raider Redeemer variant with Psycannons and Flamestorm Incinerators, but anything bigger isn't viable.

Melissia wrote:Yep. They want to make GKs the true Elite army. When you see a Grey Knight army put down their fifteenth model at 2000 points and then close their case, you'll ask them "going to fetch your other case?" and they'll say "no, that's it."

I'd be that guy. I'd probably get my ass kicked every time but I'd still do it just to see how big a bleeding chunk I could take out of the other guy's army before he took me down.

Jervis is the last person I would quote about what GW is/is not doing unless it appears in WD, he has straight out LIED about product releases at GDs and other personal appearances, the best example is, as always, Space Hulk. With Tempus Fugitives track record, I am willing to believe that GK's codex will be called Codex Grey Knights. I doubt they would call a combined codex by such a name but GW has done weird stuff before too.

It wasn't just JJ.

temprus wrote:Jervis is the last person I would quote about what GW is/is not doing unless it appears in WD, he has straight out LIED about product releases at GDs and other personal appearances, the best example is, as always, Space Hulk. With Tempus Fugitives track record, I am willing to believe that GK's codex will be called Codex Grey Knights. I doubt they would call a combined codex by such a name but GW has done weird stuff before too.

you should really read more.....

This thread's starting to get a bit ripe, and people are getting a bit testy...

Make every effort to stay on topic (checking the title will help here) and avoid insulting each other, regardless if said insults be of the direct or implied variety.