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2023/02/09 07:18:41
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
From the WE discord, no idea if it's the same people who gave us the WE info early. If it is then high reliability, if not then it all seems very plausible but not impossible to be a wishlist:
Spoiler:
More info on 10th Edition
>New Starter Box Contents: Leonitus Crusade
SPACE MARINES
-1 Primaris Chapter Master (Think Gravis but not haunched over, armed with Power Sword and bolt pistol)
-1 Primaris Prosecutor (armed with a two-handed axe)
-1 Primaris Noviate Master (Scout Master, armed with Sniper Rifle)
-10 Primaris Space Marine Intervectors (Jump Pack Primaris, have bolter gauntlets)
-5 Primaris Noviates (New Primaris Scouts, armed with Hellblast Shotguns)
-3 Primaris Arduanters (New Primaris Terminators, equipped with Graviton Hammers and Shields, in new type of Gravis Armor)
-3 Primaris Instigators (Pimaris with shoulder mounted Grav Cannons)
TYRANIDS
-1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to "evolve" units. Semi-feminine???)
-1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, has two Devourers, a large sword and a claw-whip, boosts)
-1 Lictor (New evloved form of Lictor)
-2 Magistraunt (Strange mix of venomthropes and Pyrovore)
-20 Genestealers (New kit, has an options for armored plates and acid-claws)
-1 Cerebrofex (Think blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, smaller Maleceptor)
-3 Genehunters (New breed of warriors, designed to be even better shock troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts, dual kit
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores, dual kit that now comes in threes
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex (Genetics based off old One Eye)
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS (They say that most Nid players like their big monsters)
-New Red Terror
New Marine Kits:
-Plethora of new Characters to represent old command structure (Think the old resin character models, each one buffs a specific)
-New flying LoW called "Overlord Dropship", think a smaller Thunderhawk
-New Demolisher Tank,
-New "Veteran" unit of Assault Intercessors
-Arduant Kits can make classic Powerfist and Bolter, but with each get a missile launcher on top)
2023/02/09 07:51:26
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Dudeface wrote: From the WE discord, no idea if it's the same people who gave us the WE info early. If it is then high reliability, if not then it all seems very plausible but not impossible to be a wishlist:
Spoiler:
More info on 10th Edition
>New Starter Box Contents: Leonitus Crusade
SPACE MARINES
-1 Primaris Chapter Master (Think Gravis but not haunched over, armed with Power Sword and bolt pistol)
-1 Primaris Prosecutor (armed with a two-handed axe)
-1 Primaris Noviate Master (Scout Master, armed with Sniper Rifle)
-10 Primaris Space Marine Intervectors (Jump Pack Primaris, have bolter gauntlets)
-5 Primaris Noviates (New Primaris Scouts, armed with Hellblast Shotguns)
-3 Primaris Arduanters (New Primaris Terminators, equipped with Graviton Hammers and Shields, in new type of Gravis Armor)
-3 Primaris Instigators (Pimaris with shoulder mounted Grav Cannons)
TYRANIDS
-1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to "evolve" units. Semi-feminine???)
-1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, has two Devourers, a large sword and a claw-whip, boosts)
-1 Lictor (New evloved form of Lictor)
-2 Magistraunt (Strange mix of venomthropes and Pyrovore)
-20 Genestealers (New kit, has an options for armored plates and acid-claws)
-1 Cerebrofex (Think blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, smaller Maleceptor)
-3 Genehunters (New breed of warriors, designed to be even better shock troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts, dual kit
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores, dual kit that now comes in threes
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex (Genetics based off old One Eye)
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS (They say that most Nid players like their big monsters)
-New Red Terror
New Marine Kits:
-Plethora of new Characters to represent old command structure (Think the old resin character models, each one buffs a specific)
-New flying LoW called "Overlord Dropship", think a smaller Thunderhawk
-New Demolisher Tank,
-New "Veteran" unit of Assault Intercessors
-Arduant Kits can make classic Powerfist and Bolter, but with each get a missile launcher on top)
There is nothing really odd here, the numbers add up for an Indomitus style box, the names fit GWs naming sense, even the Overlord isn't unexpexted as Primaris finally get a flyer even if its a LoW.
Also fits other rumors close enough to be possible (Primaris Terminators instead of normal Terminators, Norn-Maleceptrix instead of Norn-Emissary)
But that also means it could just be taking old leaks, changing them slightly and adding some wishlist items like Scouts
Also why would they name every unit and weapon but then only say three big monsters for Tyranids? That sounds like "I can't think of any more names so I'll just write big monsters"
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/02/09 07:54:34
2023/02/09 08:19:48
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
If these rumours are true, then the distinction between firstborn and Primaris is going nowhere. I hope the codexes will still allow fielding firstborn though, hell freezes over before I switch to Primaris, GW will lose me as a 40K player when that happens.
"Three big monsters for nids" might mean that they are not part of the first release wave. Generally, the further a release is, the less detailed the rumours about it are
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/09 08:22:22
2023/02/09 08:20:21
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
AoS has no toughness and you rarely measure any of your stats against an incoming stat(like Strength v. Toughness). AoS is also much less inclined to give stuff rend(ap in AoS).You can get maybe -1 rend but only the big toys and heroes can get a better rend.
So honestly the rumors kind of make me feel that 40k might go more AoS than 40k. Only time will tell though.
I really hope not. Having both fixed to hit and fixed to wound roll is pointless. In AOS you have interesting weapon choices like choosing between 3+ to hit and 4+ to wound and 4+ to hit and 3+ to wound...
Getting rid of Strength vs Toughness would massively narrow the design space that allows different weapons to be effective against different targets, which in turn would remove large chunk of tactics.
What you think about AoS “wound roll” is the same I thought when returned to 40K after 15 years but concerning to melee Hit rolls. I have never understood why an Ork boy can hit on 3+ both an imperial guard and a primarch or a great demon.
That is one of the reasons why some units have some kind of rules such transhuman for wounding/hitting, -1 to wounding/hit,…
Other thing I never understood is the removing of initiative from the datasheets. It was perfectly clear who fight first in a duel without stupid rules like “this unit fight FIRST” (even against primarch), “this unit fight LAST”, “the unit fight when all units from your army had fought”,…
Pd. Sorry for my english.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2023/02/09 08:22:42
2023/02/09 08:37:18
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Added to the OP, with source & link. Because i'm nice like that.
You're doing great with this thread! For some reason, my browser doesn't like their direct-linking or I'd have given you one rather than just the quote.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
drbored wrote: Yeah, now that Whitefang has weighed in, I'm content to let all that bunk die off.
Importantly, he only quoted the rule change stuff, but left other stuff untouched.
So Dark Mech and new xenos still on the table...
Given the generally cryptic nature of Whitefang's posts, I'm willing to think that it might be the specific contents of those changes.
It was no bother to add the link, i''m fine with looking stuff like that up for myself as long as you provide a source that is specific enough that i can search for it, which you did I understand that some people browse by phone or from some other device where they can't always provide links or pictures etc. themselves. It's all good.
Dudeface wrote:From the WE discord, no idea if it's the same people who gave us the WE info early. If it is then high reliability, if not then it all seems very plausible but not impossible to be a wishlist:
Spoiler:
More info on 10th Edition
>New Starter Box Contents: Leonitus Crusade
SPACE MARINES
-1 Primaris Chapter Master (Think Gravis but not haunched over, armed with Power Sword and bolt pistol)
-1 Primaris Prosecutor (armed with a two-handed axe)
-1 Primaris Noviate Master (Scout Master, armed with Sniper Rifle)
-10 Primaris Space Marine Intervectors (Jump Pack Primaris, have bolter gauntlets)
-5 Primaris Noviates (New Primaris Scouts, armed with Hellblast Shotguns)
-3 Primaris Arduanters (New Primaris Terminators, equipped with Graviton Hammers and Shields, in new type of Gravis Armor)
-3 Primaris Instigators (Pimaris with shoulder mounted Grav Cannons)
TYRANIDS
-1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to "evolve" units. Semi-feminine???)
-1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, has two Devourers, a large sword and a claw-whip, boosts)
-1 Lictor (New evloved form of Lictor)
-2 Magistraunt (Strange mix of venomthropes and Pyrovore)
-20 Genestealers (New kit, has an options for armored plates and acid-claws)
-1 Cerebrofex (Think blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, smaller Maleceptor)
-3 Genehunters (New breed of warriors, designed to be even better shock troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts, dual kit
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores, dual kit that now comes in threes
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex (Genetics based off old One Eye)
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS (They say that most Nid players like their big monsters)
-New Red Terror
New Marine Kits:
-Plethora of new Characters to represent old command structure (Think the old resin character models, each one buffs a specific)
-New flying LoW called "Overlord Dropship", think a smaller Thunderhawk
-New Demolisher Tank,
-New "Veteran" unit of Assault Intercessors
-Arduant Kits can make classic Powerfist and Bolter, but with each get a missile launcher on top)
And in the OP it goes.
2023/02/09 08:52:47
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
I will add this last week or two has been the most excited I've been in ages for the hobby. I'm happy to have something unknown and meaty to chew over and think about, the last time we had this sort of spillage was the year long release schedule from last year.
2023/02/09 08:53:57
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
There is nothing really odd here, the numbers add up for an Indomitus style box, the names fit GWs naming sense, even the Overlord isn't unexpexted as Primaris finally get a flyer even if its a LoW.
Also fits other rumors close enough to be possible (Primaris Terminators instead of normal Terminators, Norn-Maleceptrix instead of Norn-Emissary)
But that also means it could just be taking old leaks, changing them slightly and adding some wishlist items like Scouts
Also why would they name every unit and weapon but then only say three big monsters for Tyranids? That sounds like "I can't think of any more names so I'll just write big monsters"
Some small doubty-bits:
The Overlord Dropship has been described in one of the earliest novels that dealt with Primaris, one that gave us descriptions of some of the new Necron and Primaris units before they appeared on the Tabletop. Fall of Damnos i think it was - and the Overlord is described as larger than a thunderhawk, with about double the transport capacity, more void shields and more armaments. That being said, the book is very old and they could easily have retconned that to a more table-friendly thing.
Edit: it was 'Dark Imperium' that dealt with the Overlord, not Fall of Damnos.
Lexicanum describes it like this:
Like Blackstars, Overlords possess twin transport bays with their own assault doors, but they're considerably bigger and even more blessed with advanced technologies like energy shields.[1] The cockpit sits between the two halves of the double fuselage.[2]
Armament
An Overlord is equipped with anti-munitions cannons, wing-mounted Desolator Lascannons, nose-mounted Melta Cannons and Heavy Bolters fixed on its lower wing surfaces.[1] In addition, a variety of missiles can be mounted to the wings, and the flanks of the Overlord are studded with crewed weapons bubbles containing heavy guns. The wings may be tipped with gatling las.[2]
Transport Capacity
An Overlord can transport at least eighty Primaris Space Marines.[2] During the Battle of Ardium, an Overlord transported one early-pattern Space Marine and thirty-nine Primaris Space Marines, some of which were wearing Mk X Gravis Armour,[1] while an Overlord attached to Fleet Tertius of the Indomitus Crusade carried forty Primaris Marines (fifteen of which were Aggressors in heavy Gravis plate) in each of its twin holds during a boarding action.[2]
Other than that: that's a lot of new stuff for the 'nids, and would mean a range refresh and extension that is much larger than what the Necrons got, even if some stuff stayed exclusive to the starter box for now. Not totally unbelievable, but surely not to be taken lightly. Individually, each entry makes sense and fits with GW's modelling and naming conventiesn, except maybe the n-th rendition of not-quite biovores, but then a variety of artillery is a thing that happens in other forces too.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/09 08:59:38
2023/02/09 09:06:25
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Other than that: that's a lot of new stuff for the 'nids, and would mean a range refresh and extension that is much larger than what the Necrons got, even if some stuff stayed exclusive to the starter box for now. Not totally unbelievable, but surely not to be taken lightly. Individually, each entry makes sense and fits with GW's modelling and naming conventiesn, except maybe the n-th rendition of not-quite biovores, but then a variety of artillery is a thing that happens in other forces too.
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts - ????
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores - Ophidians
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex - doomstalker
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS - silent king, void dragon, monolith
-New Red Terror - reanimator
Obviously spitballing for kit size or whatever
2023/02/09 09:09:33
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Other than that: that's a lot of new stuff for the 'nids, and would mean a range refresh and extension that is much larger than what the Necrons got, even if some stuff stayed exclusive to the starter box for now. Not totally unbelievable, but surely not to be taken lightly. Individually, each entry makes sense and fits with GW's modelling and naming conventiesn, except maybe the n-th rendition of not-quite biovores, but then a variety of artillery is a thing that happens in other forces too.
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts - ????
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores - Ophidians
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex - doomstalker
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS - silent king, void dragon, monolith
-New Red Terror - reanimator
Obviously spitballing for kit size or whatever
Yeah, if you put it like that it sure sounds reasonable I somehow assumed that the Norn-whateveress was at least Hive-Tyrant-sized, and also zoned out the fact that the box would contain no infantry besides the Genestealers Blame it on a lack of coffee
2023/02/09 09:43:47
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
stonehorse wrote: 8th/9th isn't that different from 3rd edition. Still a lot of the old DNA in there.
thinking that way is why the game does not work well in the first place
8th is a very different game from 3rd
that with a different "to wound" table and a different AP system (not even talking about movement, weapon ranges and weapon rules for now), a T4, W1, Sv3+ model needed to become a T5, W2, Sv2+ to be similar resilient, yet it took a while that all past experience with rules, points and design are useless if rules are changed on a basic level
jut because a Bolter is still a Bolter and has a Strength and AP value does not make it "not that different"
5th was not that different from 3rd but if 8th wouldn't have been much different from 7th, it would not have convinced people from coming back
(same way you could say AoS is not that different from 4th Editon Warhammer because there is still lot if the old DNA there)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/02/09 09:55:27
Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise
2023/02/09 09:54:34
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
H.B.M.C. wrote: That sounds worse. Or the kit could be as simple as the Necron kit, with just two weapon options per model.
I just worry... do Tyranids need another 9 or 10 new units? And what do we lose because of this?
Obviously a lot of the armies are way beyond the point where they really 'need' anything new, but of course GW wants to sell stuff and new stuff usually sells better than rehashes of old units and concepts. The other option would be to introduce completely new armies, but that is risky. That being said, Tyranids of all things have baked-in justifications for always having new stuff and crazy varieties, so i don't really see a problem. I just hope they don't do a lazy not-Kerrigan for the Whateveress, which they'll totally do
There are some armies that do actually need stuff: Dark Eldar are missing half their range in the online store due to the material they're cast in, and Eldar Aspect Warriors still rely on sculpts that at this point are close to old enough to have children that could legally drive
2023/02/09 10:14:52
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Damn, I will be blown away if these rumors are true. I like the sound of the new Tyranids and the rules sound like a significant departure from the current ones. Not sure if that will be good news or bad, but I am generally on-board.
2023/02/09 10:35:23
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Other than that: that's a lot of new stuff for the 'nids, and would mean a range refresh and extension that is much larger than what the Necrons got, even if some stuff stayed exclusive to the starter box for now. Not totally unbelievable, but surely not to be taken lightly. Individually, each entry makes sense and fits with GW's modelling and naming conventiesn, except maybe the n-th rendition of not-quite biovores, but then a variety of artillery is a thing that happens in other forces too.
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts - ????
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores - Ophidians
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex - doomstalker
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS - silent king, void dragon, monolith
-New Red Terror - reanimator
Obviously spitballing for kit size or whatever
Necrons got even more:
Royal Warden, Chronomancer, Psychomancer, Flayed Ones, Lokhust Heavy Destroyer, Convergence of Dominion and I would also count Illuminor Szeras
So right now Necrons still got more with 19 units to Tyranids 16
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2023/02/09 10:52:32
2023/02/09 10:40:23
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Other than that: that's a lot of new stuff for the 'nids, and would mean a range refresh and extension that is much larger than what the Necrons got, even if some stuff stayed exclusive to the starter box for now. Not totally unbelievable, but surely not to be taken lightly. Individually, each entry makes sense and fits with GW's modelling and naming conventiesn, except maybe the n-th rendition of not-quite biovores, but then a variety of artillery is a thing that happens in other forces too.
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New models for Termagaunts and Hormagaunts - ????
-New Models for Biovores and Pyrovores - Ophidians
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex - doomstalker
-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS - silent king, void dragon, monolith
-New Red Terror - reanimator
Obviously spitballing for kit size or whatever
You got the Doomstalker twice here but doesn't matter since there are still:
Royal Warden, Chronomancer, Psychomancer, Flayed Ones, Lokhust Heavy Destroyer, Convergence of Dominion and I would also count Illuminor Szeras
So right now Necrons still got more with 19 units to Tyranids 16
I did have it twice because the unit in the launch box (brofex) is included again in a separate box later, hence the same kit.
2023/02/09 10:52:58
Subject: Re:10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Dudeface wrote: -20 Genestealers (New kit, has an options for armored plates and acid-claws)
Starter boxes tend to have simplistic minis. Would they do that with a new set of Stealers?
Assault Intercessors got easy build starter box models and a multipart kit later. The question really is if we should expect Tyranids to get so lucky, since they're not Marines. Still, the kit would be used in Genestealer Cults as well, so it has a little broader appeal than usual Xenos fare. With Genestealers occasionally featuring in board games, GW may have reason to invest in both multipart and easy build molds for use down the line.
Or GW is being cheap again and skips multipart Genestealers. Who knows?
I did have it twice because the unit in the launch box (brofex) is included again in a separate box later, hence the same kit.
You're right corrected my post
No worries, if true then brofex is going to be my favourite name for a unit.
Valrak says this may be a troll attempt, but given what some people here think of him that may add or detract validity?
It might be a troll attempt, but it's a good one if so. Me, I can't tell reality and fiction apart anymore when it comes to GW names, and nothing there looks too outlandish? Even Primaris Scouts are on the table since GW gave Black Templars Primaris Neophytes.
Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone?
2023/02/09 12:14:02
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
Genestealers are strange, they are one of those models that GW has clearly updated over the years here and there and yet they are pretty much the same poses and styles as they've been since their original release (or at least so far back that they are almost unchanged)
Overread wrote: Genestealers are strange, they are one of those models that GW has clearly updated over the years here and there and yet they are pretty much the same poses and styles as they've been since their original release (or at least so far back that they are almost unchanged)
There's only so much you can do with their general layout, and they typically don't have lot of equipment and flairy stuff that you could use to make them interesting. The Stealers from the redone Space Hulk box showed what you can do with them by posing, flair and tactical rocks etc., but that would get repetitive quite fast in larger armies and i'd not want to paint three dozen of them
2023/02/09 12:20:31
Subject: 10th edition rumours courtesy of Valrak, including starter box, new terminators and tyranids
There are loads of alternate poses you could do even without jumping off rocks. Just bringing their outer back hands in more would make a huge difference. They are still all running the same way they always have.
Plus there's no reason they couldn't have gained spikes, spines or other features over the years. Many other units have changed drastically over the generations.
Of course sometimes no change is good and sometimes change for the sake of change along isn't what's needed
I understand that some people browse by phone or from some other device where they can't always provide links or pictures etc. themselves. It's all good.
