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In my last battle report, my Chaos Daemons were able to empty a GK-held objective on the last turn and snatch an unlikely victory against my son, who was trying GK for the first time. After spending some time looking at the codex more carefully, he has demanded a rematch with a revised GK list that features more dakka. So, instead of beginning to mark that pile of term papers and final exams that is sitting on my desk, I will instead begin a new battle report. And you thought only students like to procrastinate...

I have also made some revisions to my Daemons list, just for variety's sake. Here it is:


HQ: Great Unclean One
HQ: Herald of Tzeentch with chariot, bolt, gaze, master, legion
HQ: Herald of Tzeentch with chariot, bolt, gaze, master, legion
Elite: 6 x Fiends of Slaanesh (1 with might)
Elite: 5 x Bloodcrushers of Khorne (the usual extras)
Elite: 4 x Bloodcrushers of Khorne (the usual extras)
Troops: 5 x Plaguebearers of Nurgle
Troops: 5 x Plaguebearers of Nurgle
Troops: 5 x Plaguebearers of Nurgle
Troops: 5 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch with bolt
Troops: 5 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch with bolt + changeling
Troops: 15 Bloodletters
Heavy Support: Daemon Prince of Chaos (Khorne with wings, hide, blessings)
Heavy Support: Daemon Prince of Chaos (Nurgle with hide)

Here is my son's revised GK army, again with some proxies:


HQ: Coteaz
HQ: Xenos Inquisitor with 3 skulls, conversion beamer
Elites: 10 x Purifiers with 4 psyC, 2 DH, 4 halberds (in rhino)
Elites: 1 x Ven Dread with TL autocannons
Troops: 5 x GKSS with psyC (in RB with psy ammo)
Troops: 5 x GKSS with psyC (in RB with psy ammo)
Troops: 5 x Henchman with 2 plasma (in RB with plas/las)
Troops: 5 x Henchman with 2 plasma (in RB with plas/las)
Troops: 5 Death Cult Assassins + 3 Crusaders + 2 melta acolytes + 1 acolyte (in Chimera)
Troops: 3 MM Servitors + 4 acolytes in chimera
Heavy: Dread with TL autocannons
Heavy: Dread with TL autocannons
Heavy: Dreadknight with Sword

We are playing pitched battle, with 5 objectives (three placed equidistant in each third of the board, 1 each placed where-ever we liked). We will also keep track of KP for secondary scoring.

Once again my son won the dice off and no surprise, has elected to go first once again.

I'm rather pessimistic about the daemons chances in this rematch. Without any bolt princes, I assume that I'm going to have to rely on close combat to get rid of all those vehicles. Old fatty (that's the GUO not me) will have to soak up lots of shots for me to get a victory I think.

I like how you've shown each army and labeled them. Looks like the work of a designer.

I placing my bets on daemons. Although you don't have a whole lot of mobility, you've get enough threats for your son to handle that your plaguebearers will once again steal the objectives.

Also, his army isn't really geared to handle yours. His army is more geared to handle other mech armies.

But he does have the experience of 1 game now.

GO DEMONS!!!!

I was hoping you would do another one. Your last battle rep was the best I've seen on here in a long time.

I'm thinking Daemons take this one. There's very little that's actually 'daemonhunter' in that "GK" list.

Agree with jy2, your pregame pictures are excellent, and those daemons look excellent, especially your GUO

Looking forward to this .

another battle report that comes in episodes. i dont understand why people just dont get to the point.

Looks like a nice start, but i agree with above.
By the time this has been updated to actually have a batrep in it i will have got bored and wandered else where.

People get hammered for making certain threads without pics to start them, yet a batrep thread seems to start now with no batrep.

TheVacahaha wrote:another battle report that comes in episodes. i dont understand why people just dont get to the point.

Maybe because some of us are married, have children, have a job, put in the time to paint and play, and also want to put in the time to make a nicely done battle report? Unless, of course, you are his boss and are paying him to make the report.

jy2 wrote:

TheVacahaha wrote:another battle report that comes in episodes. i dont understand why people just dont get to the point.

Maybe because some of us are married, have children, have a job, put in the time to paint and play, and also want to put in the time to make a nicely done battle report? Unless, of course, you are his boss and are paying him to make the report.

Laughs. True on all cases except for the last one ... my boss is paying me to fill undergraduates' brains full of useless knowledge during the day. But for TheVacahaha and the Jackal's edification, I will tell you that once you have kids and a busy job, you may find that a single 40K game sometimes is spread over a few evenings.

Deployment

As mentioned, my son won the roll for first turn, and this is how he deployed.


Here are the five objectives.


Turn 1 - Grey Knights

Unable to seize the objective, my son rolls his GKSS forward, disembarks (and gets a run roll of 3" for both squads. The purifers and the servitors move forward, and only Cortez disembarks. He runs forward towards the purifiers in order to create an area where deep strikers can get shot.

He (just) passes both his warp quake rolls. The end result are two huge mishaps zones on the board. As in my previous battle report, we measured it out to help visualize its size.






For those of you unfamiliar with warp quake, if you land or scatter into warp quake, boom, you mishap. My son wonders if I do mishap, and then roll a misplaced result on the deep strike mishap table, can he place the unit in a warp quake mishap area, thereby forcing me to mishap again (and thus roll again on the mishap table). His father wonders whether he would like to be grounded for a week.

At any rate, there is practically no where on the board safe to deep strike. I'd hate to think if he'd taken 3 GKSS squads, had run rolls larger than 3", or had a squad larger than five men.

For those unfamiliar, the middle zone isn't a mishap zone. It is basically Coteaz's zone of deepstriking defense. Daemons can land in there, but then Coteaz's unit gets a free shot at it (just like the older daemonhunter mystics).

Warpquake is probably worst in pitched battle deployment. That's where strike squads/interceptors can get the most coverage.





Automatically Appended Next Post:
In my opinion, your mishapped daemons won't be able to mishap again on the same turn. After the first mishap and it gets "misplaced", it is no longer deepstriking. The opponent is just putting it anywhere on the table. This will probably need a FAQ for clarification reasons.

However, Coteaz's I've Been Expecting You should still work against the misplaced unit.

jy2 wrote:

TheVacahaha wrote:another battle report that comes in episodes. i dont understand why people just dont get to the point.

Maybe because some of us are married, have children, have a job, put in the time to paint and play, and also want to put in the time to make a nicely done battle report? Unless, of course, you are his boss and are paying him to make the report.

Understood, but that's not really the point. While I do (genuinely) enjoy you and the OP's reports, doesn't it make more sense just to present the finished product? Let's look at the pros and cons:

Films don't get released during pre-production; books aren't published serially (anymore, anyway). I am married, and have a kid, and two jobs as well as starting up a side business...so I understand life problems, but when i published my travelogue, it was as a 19000 word, completed journal, because I know that if I draw it out, I'll lose potential readers and valuable feedback. Drawing it out provides the illusion of ease to the author (if you have to finish the report one way or the other, you're not saving yourself work), but is considerably harder for the reader. The reader doesn't lose anything if he doesn't know a new report is forthcoming and when it is published as a cohesive whole, he can digest the whole thing in one sitting. If he has to keep coming back to finish the report, he is inconvenienced, but if he can read it all at once, he isn't. The author gains nothing by publishing serially, while simultaneously inconveniencing the reader. There's no downside, however, to publishing a complete report.

Note this isn't an attack on you or the OP, and we're all happy to read your (completed) reports. It is, I feel, a valid criticism of the presentation method.

Fair enough and will keep that in mind for the next batrep.

Not to stretch a comparison too far, but Charles Dickens published most of his novels as WIP, a few chapters at a time to the public, which did in fact increase interest in his work.

Also, it isn't actually an "illusion of ease to the author", but real ease to break things up. In 2007 I wrote a 1000+ page textbook. I would have never have completed that monster unless I could have broken it up into chapters and delivered each chapter every few months!

The rest of turn one will be out within the hour ...

randyc9999 wrote:Fair enough and will keep that in mind for the next batrep.

Not to stretch a comparison too far, but Charles Dickens published most of his novels as WIP, a few chapters at a time to the public, which did in fact increase interest in his work.

Also, it isn't actually an "illusion of ease to the author", but real ease to break things up. In 2007 I wrote a 1000+ page textbook. I would have never have completed that monster unless I could have broken it up into chapters and delivered each chapter every few months!

The rest of turn one will be out within the hour ...

I know of Dickens and his serial novel publishing...I had him in mind as my example! And why we should note that Dickens published 150 years ago! IIRC, The Old Man and the Sea was also published serially in Life Magazine. As an amateur Hemingway scholar, I should know for sure, but I don't =(

But I bet your publisher didn't send the book to print until after your lead editor had all chapters in hand...right?

Best, and thanks for listening.

hemingway wrote:
But I bet your publisher didn't send the book to print until after your lead editor had all chapters in hand...right?

Actually for safari books online, it did go out chapter by chapter as a preview to their subscribers.

Turn 1 - Chaos Daemons

Unfortunately I did not get my primary wave, making me something like 18/80 lifetime for my primary wave roll ...

Biggest footprint unit are my 4xcrushers, so I drop them first, and roll a hit.


Horrors next, and they get a hit


Tz Herald, and they have a small scatter


Bloodletters also get a hit.


I'm beginning to feel invulnerable. However, I'm brought back to earth when the first plaguebearers scatters off the table (the subsequent deep strike mishap roll makes them delayed).


Worried, I place the next plaguebearers on the largest remaining open area, but they scatter into warp quake zone (and the subsequent deep strike mishap roll destroys them).


Didn't realize this at first, but I forgot to take a picture of the fiends scattering into warp quake. Foolishly I tried to drop them into the exact same spot, with the exact same result (except I scattered off the table). Thankfully, the deep strike mishap roll just delayed them.

So this is the state of things after the drop. Only four units to face all the firepower.


I run the BloodCrushers towards one of the GKSS squads and the Bloodletters into the ruins.



So just like last game, warp quake plays a big role. I think warp quake is actually worse for the opponent in pitched battle than in quarters.

I don't play either armies, but from what i can see, Warp Quake is broken. That is a ridicules AOE :/

Turn 2 - Grey Knights

My son only repositions his left-most GKSS squad so it is out of charge range of the Crushers, and moves their Razorback so it blocks the Horrors.

He then starts shooting and I start removing models from the table. I'll try my best to remember it all. The Conversion Beamer gets a S10 AP1 direct hit over two of the Crushers, which inflicts two wounds. Two of the S8 RifleDreads, the Lascannon RB, and the nearby GKSS squad remove all but a single wound on the Crushers. The HB Razorback and the Multilaser on the Chimera do the same to the Horrors (leave a single wound).

From previous experience, my son decides the Tz Herald can be a real nuisance and therefore must be eliminated. He elects to shoot his stationary Purifier squad at it, giving it 20 wounds, or something ridiculous like that. Needless to say, its eliminated from the game.

His remaining GKSS, the MM servitors, the other Lascannon RB, and the last S8 RifleDreads shot at the Bloodletters in cover, but only five die. This will end up being a big mistake in his target selection.

At any rate, this is how things look after the GK turn 2.



Turn 2 - Chaos Daemons

At the time, I thought I had terrible luck with my Turn 2 reserve rolls. The Crushers, the fiends, the GUO, the khorne DP, the Horrors, and one of the Plaguebearers all decide to sit this turn out and watch the few daemon forces on the table get wiped out.

So, that meant only the Tz Herald, the Nurgle DP, and a Plaguebearer squad are coming in this turn.

Unluckily for me, the icon on the Crushers was killed so it is back to the Daemon Warp Quake Roulette (tm) game.

The Tz Herald scatters 6", leaving it just outside of warp quake zone.



The Nurgle Daemon Prince lands okay. As do the Plaguebearers (in fact, a mere 3" from scattering off the board).

The one bit of really good news for me is that I roll 6 for the BloodLetters' difficult terrain roll. I just might be in range to charge his GKSS squad.

The shooting phase is nothing special. The sole Bolt Horror misses, while the Tz Herald kills another few Purifiers; it is down to 6 models (4 PsyCannons and 2 hammers).

Miracle of miracles. One of my Bloodletters is about 5.75" away from his closest Grey Knight. I've found that about every fourth game, the blood letters are actually able to get into combat and it looks like this is one of those rare games.


No surprise, the Bloodletters inflict enough wounds to kill every space marine on the table three times over. Unfortunately, there is only 5 in this combat. Still, I have eliminated warp quake on this side of the board and will now be able to deep strike safely now. In retrospect, it looks like I was lucky to have had all those units stay in reserve.

On the other side of the board, the BloodCrusher charges the only thing it can: the Razorback.

While the fury of Khorne may make the sewers run red with blood, it has no effect on this Razorback.

Almost forgot, the Plaguebearers run towards the ruins and the objective marker.


For those keeping track of kill points, it is GK: 2 CD: 1


Turn 3 - Grey Knights

My son moves only the DreadKnight. Everything else stays stationary and shoots.

On the left side of the board, he quickly drops the lone Crusher and the lone Horror (though the Horror decided to make three or four 4++ saves just to draw things out). He also puts one wound on the Nurgle Daemon Prince.


He then takes aim at the ten Bloodletters and shoots and shoots and shoots and shoots ...


Yes, somehow, a Bloodletter survived.

I am starting to get worried that I am wasting a year's worth of good dice rolling luck on a relatively meaningless friendly game in my basement. This will certainly mean that in my next tournament, every 3+ save is going to result in a 1 or a 2 and every scatter roll will be an 11 or a 12.

Turn 3 - Chaos Daemons

For my reserves, I get my other Crushers, the Khorne DP, and the Great Unclean One.

The Crushers drop into that big safe area left by the death of the GKSS.

I then deep strike really recklessly with the GUO and the Khorne Daemon Prince and land with no scatter.



I think one side effect of the Daemon Warp Quake Roulette (tm) game is that it seems to inculcate in the Daemon player a type of insouciance in regards to deep strike mishaps. Sure there is one bullet in the gun for me, but I care not ...

The Daemon Prince shuffles towards the remaining GKSS and their Razorback (and the objective of course).


The Tz Herald moves over to this part of the board, and when it eventually shoots, destroys the HB turret on the RB as well as kills two GK. I think I'm falling in love with Daemonic Gaze ...


The Bloodletter, fresh from its own survive-a-plane-crash-and-change-your-life experience, charges into the Purifiers, Cleansing Flame be damned ... and survives it unscathed. Too bad the Purifiers lost all their halberds from shooting.


The Bloodletter kills two more Purifiers before finally succumbing to Grey Knight close combat rage. He is certainly the sentimental favorite to win MOTM.

Right at the end of turn, we remember that Corteaz is hiding inside that rusty old Chimera with three MM servitors, and the GUO and Crushers dropped in within his 12" I've Been Expecting You circle, which gives his unit a free round of shooting at both of them. They wound the GUO twice but he saves both, and put one wound on the Crushers.

So, end of Turn 3, and the Kill Point score is GK: 5 CD: 1

Haha the GUO just looks so disgusting! I'm not sure I could field that unit. Can't wait to see what you have in store. Also seems like your son plays for blood, is he so serious playing other friendly games?

Turn 4 - Grey Knights

My son moves his GKSS, Purifiers, and a variety of vehicles backwards. He moves the DreadKnight forward toward my Crushers. He also moves the weapon-less Razorback in front of the GKSS in order to provide them with a cover save against my Tz Herald.

Once again, he shoots, and shoots, and shoots, ...

He kills the Nurgle Daemon Prince, and eventually the GUO. By and large almost all his shooting is AP4/5 so the GUO took a lot of shooting to kill off. In fact, that was why my son added plasma guns to two of his henchman squad. Of course, those henchman are too scared right now to leave their Razorbacks ...



Turn 4 - Chaos Daemons

While I've been smoking hot with my saves and my scatter dice, my reserve dice rolls have been pretty poor. Once again, a roll a 1 for the Fiends and a 1 for the Horrors. Once again, the Fiends have to wait until turn 5.

The Plaguebearers do come in and I drop them in the ruins by another objective.


The Khorne Daemon Prince jumps into assault range of the Purifiers.


The Tz Herald uses his 12" move and surprises the Chimera with a Bolt to the side armour and Gaze towards the remaining two GKSS.


The dice favor Tzeentch, and the Chimera is wrecked, and the two remaining members of the GKSS fail their cover save. There goes the last of the warp quake. Next turn I should be able to drop the Horrors on the objective on this left-hand side of the board.

As for the Chimera, the DCAs, Crusaders, and Acolytes just pass their pining test.


In the assault phase, the Khorne Daemon Prince handily wipes out the remaining four purifiers (three PsyC and a Hammer).

The only thing close enough for the Crushers to assault is the DreadKnight, and I do so.


Sure it has Dark Excommunication and the Sword of Rerolls, but better locked in with it and be safe from GK shooting in Turn 5.

It is at this point that I learn something important about Dark Excommunication: namely, it removes all daemonic gifts of a unit in B2B for a turn. There goes my 3+ armour save, my power weapons, my rending, and my icon. That's an awfully good psychic power against daemons!

I still manage to give him one wound, and my luck rolling 5+ inv saves still holds true and I actually manage to win the combat. He passes his test so we remain stuck in combat. Man, I do hope he fails his psychic test for Dark Excommunication next turn.

End of Turn 4, and the Kill Point score is GK: 7 CD: 3

While I'm losing in the secondary KP score, I think I'm doing better with primary objective scoring. I have plaguebearers in cover on two of the objectives, with the horrors still in reserve. His three troops are all henchman, two of them in the razorbacks. I'm feeling confident.

Turn 5 - Grey Knights

One of the wonderful things about being a parent is discovering that even after 17 years, a child can still surprise you. In this case, not a nice surprise like "Dad, I got an A in math" or even "Dad, I cleaned my room." No this surprise was more of the "Dad I scrapped the car bumper at the shopping mall" variety.

He zoomed his Razorbacks (containing troop Henchman) up onto the objectives on both sides of the board.



Ignoring the tasty Khorne DP (which ended up being eliminated in the shooting phase), he got a decent terrain roll, and moved his DCAs (also troops) towards my poor, nonthreatening Plaguebearers.


Feel no pain and T5? The DCAs didn't seem to care, as they easily dispatched the plaguebearers.

Wait a second, now he has four objectives, and I have one.

Meanwhile, in the other assault, we are uncertain as to whether the DreadKnight can cast Dark Excommunication in both his combat phase and in mine. I know the rule says in either, but does that mean: his or mine (but not both), or does it mean both his and mine assault phase?

We assumed it was the later, and so the dread cast it again. Showing us that a D&D proxy model has no place on a 40K table, it once again fails one of two 2+ saves. The DreadKnight and a Dreadnaught that has joined the battle do nothing.


Turn 5 - Chaos Daemons

Okay, things have suddenly turned ugly for the Daemons. I drop the Horrors in and hope for the best with Warp Fire against the T3 DCA Henchman. Unfortunately, with cover saves, I kill only a Henchman, a Crusader, and a DCA.



The Fiends, late for the party once again, at least don't scatter and land close to the objective.

They run towards it, thereby contesting it.


Finally, the Tz Herald wrecks the Razorback, but the troops inside of it are still close enough to the objective.


In the Crusher combat, Dark Excommunication is cast again. The DreadKnight and a Dreadnaught once again, even with rerolls, do nothing. Unbelievably, the DreadKnight once again fails one of two 2+ saves (giving it a total of three wounds).

We roll to see if the game ends, and it does.

Objectives: GK: 3 CD: 1 (and one contested)
KP: GK: 9 CD: 5

Strong victory for the Grey Knights and my son regains his family bragging rights. I think I know who I will get to wash my car tomorrow ...

for analysis, see below

Great report so far that excommunication must really hurt and grats with killing the warp quake units. Also thanks for putting up the turns fairly quickly.

knightofdread wrote:... Also thanks for putting up the turns fairly quickly.

Laughs. I detect some sarcasm ...

Analysis

Once again Warp Quake was a MVP. While my son kept the GKSS out of their vehicles in order to expand its size, he is not certain whether it might have been better to keep them hiding in their transport. We both felt that it was better for the Grey Knight units to be outside their vehicles so they could use all of their shooting, but given that all three grey knight units were killed, and that my relatively measly shooting did some real damage to those units, we are both a little undecided whether it would be best to keep them in their vehicles.

Dark Excommunication is great against daemons and is the bane of BloodCrushers everywhere, especially if it can be cast in both players' turns.

We are certainly going to make DCAs part of any of our future GK armies as they have been outstanding in both games. I think it is the perfect counter attack unit and with some mixed in 3++ saves and WS5 I6 power weapons I think most opponents will avoid assaulting it.

For Daemons, Warp Quake is a brutal constraint. If you have never played a deep strike army, you may find it hard to believe how deep strike mishaps become a certainty when playing against it. In these two games I have rolled more hits and fewer scatters than in any game I can ever remember and yet I still had something like five or six mishaps. Against non Warp Quake armies, it might take me 12-15 games to have five mishaps. Indeed, in my last four tournaments, I have had a grand total of one mishap in about 14 games.

Despite the heroics of that mighty single Bloodletter, my MVP was the Tz Herald. Being able to kill a few GK marines a turn and shoot at a vehicle was golden.

Great report so far. Love the humorous comments. and some great dice rolls too.

Those models are wonderfully painted. Great job on the army and the BR. Look forward to more from you.

Excellent report.

Guess I was wrong about daemons winning. Apparently, mech is still king...especially when combined with Warp Quake and Dark Excommunication.

BTW, you guys played Dark Excommunication correctly.

another fine batrep with a fine looking army. it's clear you take a lot of pride in the models you paint, and it shows!

While i'm always sorry to see the underdog lose, it's almost a foregone conclusion if you don't get your preferred wave or first turn against an army specifically designed to dispatch yours.

good batrep for sure here!!

Too bad the wrong side won for my liking

Excellent report! I loved the last one too.

I was hoping that in this game you would assault the DK with a second unit. I think that is really the key to bringing them down in CC as they can only cast Dark Excommunication on one unit.

Looking forward to the next batrep! No complaints here on the format, just keep em coming

Excellent report with 2 great looking armies.

Thanks everyone for all the positive feedback. It was surprisingly fun putting together these two reports. I think I'll shall try to record another series of father-son games in the future.

jy2 wrote:
Guess I was wrong about daemons winning. Apparently, mech is still king...especially when combined with Warp Quake and Dark Excommunication.

Well, if my fiends had come in on turn 3 or 4, then I think the game might have turned out differently. Also, my army really needed a Bolt Tz Prince instead of a Nurgle one. That extra bit of shooting could have helped.

On the other hand, I was pretty fortunate with my scatter rolls and my 5++ rolls. If I could make 5+ invulnerable saves as easily and consistently in tournaments as I did in that last game, heck, I could table everyone with just daemonettes and furies ...

My overall impression from the two games of Grey Knights vs Chaos Daemons? If the GK player goes all purifiers or lots of terminators, then I think the Daemons are actually likely to do well or at least be competitive. However, if the GK player has two or more Warp Quake units, then the Daemons will struggle, especially if they don't bring a lot of mobile units. My usual play style has been to drop a big crusher unit and some tough nurgle daemon princes right in front of the opponent. These units can soak up a ton of damage and are close enough to get into combat in turn two.

Warp quake really forces the Daemon play back far away from the GK units because realistically, you have to drop down about 18" away from the warp quake units (unless you routinely have the same good luck as I did with the scatter dice). The result is that slower Daemon units will usually suffer two or more rounds of shooting after the drop instead of the usual one. And since GK can have a lot of 24" shooting, and with the usual presence of three S8 Rifledreads, any bad luck with rolling saves will absolutely decimate the entire first turn drop.

If my Bloodletters had been an extra 1/4" further away from the GKSS, they wouldn't have been able to charge the GKSS, which would have meant an extra turn of shooting, which would have undoubtedly destroyed them and of course left the 24" diameter warp quake bubble intact -- which would have forced the Crushers and the GUO to land deep on my board edge (and thus would have effectively removed them as a factor in the game).

Dark Excommunication is also a real problem for Crushers. It basically turns them into two-wound Ogryns.

logg_frogg wrote:good batrep for sure here!!

Too bad the wrong side won for my liking

The blood flowed, khorne is pleased regardless of outcome.