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So there is a store in my area that used to be a Magic + variety store that has just started carrying 40k/fantasy stuff. As a result, they've attracted a lot of new players in the area. They're really accommodating as far as allocating space in the store and trying to get interest drummed up, and they sell stuff under retail. It's a dream, right?

Well, the problem is that those new players are brand new, green players. I went up for a game yesterday and was faced with a poorly assembled, "bad" list. I mean poorly assembled with regards to the actual models as well as the list itself. There were rhinos with gaping cracks in them and the treads didn't meet up where they should have.

The match itself was against SM whose anti-tank at 1750 consisted of 3 missile launchers, a vindicator, a TL lascannon razorback, and a land raider. He had 5 PF/SB terminators in the land raider with Lysander. He didn't understand wound allocation even after about a 10 minute discussion with the rulebook and one of the more veteran guys helping me out, and he thought you could always take the 24" long range shot with rapid fire weapons regardless of if you moved.

My roommate went and played 2500 points of guard against two guys running 1250 each, one running CSM and the other running Nids. He gunlined and they outflanked/deep struck nothing. I think he might have lost a hellhound. From what I could hear of the discussion, they were as green as my guy.

I love the occasional noob-pounding, but I don't think it's possible to gain as much from it as someone who's an actual challenge. My question then to Dakka is what kind of experiences have you had with similar situations? What are the most effective ways you've found to get a lot (4-5) of new guys up to speed, both on rules and painting-wise. They're definitely willing to learn the rules, and they seem like they'd be interested in the actual painting portion of it. I'm just not sure what the most effective means of delivery is.

Talk to them about effective list building. I always start by saying each unit needs a "job". Explain what effective counters are there, such as TH/SS termies as a melee powerhouse, or what specific weapons are good against tanks.

Start with smaller games, 1500 or so. Let them build a balanced list, and you do the same.

Also for the wound allocation things, use a visual description. Multicolored dice placed out on the table next to each model.

Make sure when you play the new guys, you are strict with rules, so they learn the rules properly as they get more experienced.

List building is the best if you can help them before they actually purchase an army. Ask what army they wanna play, and what style, what particular units they are interested in, then build them a competitive list. If they already have the models, try to help them as best you can making them not suck (for the Lysander guy, advise him to buy thunderhammers and stormshields on ebay or games workshop to convert his regular Terminators, and get a conversion kit to turn the Land Raider into a redeemer with a MM. Tell him get multiple vindicators or none at all).

As far as playing the new people, this is a chance for you to bring a fun, less competitive list. When I play new players I use my all-foot SM list with tactical Terminators ect. Don't make it so bad that they will pick up on bad list building techniques though.

@juraigamer:

Okay, but how best to do that? Do I compile a list of things they don't appear to understand and go over them all at the same time, lecture style? Do I cover the same topic 5 times as I just happen to play each one of them?


Do I tell them to create accounts on Dakka and spend time lurking in YMDC?

The very best thing you can do is set a good example.

By playing well and fair, in a good spirit, with a well modelled and painted army you set the benchmark against which the new guys will measure themselves.

Once you've got to a critical mass of good players the new guys will start getting up to speed really quickly.

In practical terms, I wouldn't try and set up lectures. You're probably going to keep explaining the same basic things over and over for a bit but marshal your patience and keep at it.

That's not an unreasonable amount of anti vehicle firepower.

daedalus wrote:@juraigamer:

Okay, but how best to do that? Do I compile a list of things they don't appear to understand and go over them all at the same time, lecture style? Do I cover the same topic 5 times as I just happen to play each one of them?


Do I tell them to create accounts on Dakka and spend time lurking in YMDC?

Just play very small point games, 500 to 750 and let them get a grasp on the basics. Anything larger and they will be looking at just the units, not the mechanics.

They all should have/read the rulebook, if all else fails just explain things one at a time. Start in the movement phase, cover it as you are moving your models. Then in your shooting phase do the same. Explain each and every move you do and how you are required to do so. Same with assault. Learning while playing is much better than trying to preach it.

juraigamer wrote:They all should have/read the rulebook, if all else fails just explain things one at a time. Start in the movement phase, cover it as you are moving your models. Then in your shooting phase do the same. Explain each and every move you do and how you are required to do so. Same with assault. Learning while playing is much better than trying to preach it.

I would agree with this entirely. It is really good to go over everything as you play as it lets them see, hear and understand how to play . Plus you can correct and address any problems they may have as they come up.

In my local game club we have a few vets but also quite a few younger/new players

I just try to be patient with them and teach them where they are going wrong and help them. I dont try to "noob-bash" them I try to help them become better players because then in the future they will become a challange!

To get round the annoyance factor I tend to vary who I play, so I play a vet one week, a "noob" the next etc etc

Another approach is to play doubles and team each noob with an experienced player.

that works very well to.

As it helps the less experienced players learn the ropes, but also provides a little bit of a challange for the vet.

Wish it was where i lived something like that happent. There is so few players here in Denmark and especially where i live.

Anyway. A good idea if you is having a easy time killing beginners then butt in sometimes and give them good suggestions on how to use there units to there fully potential and how to use the terrain and so forth. Don't sound like ''I know better'' kinde guy (I experienced that one of my first times playing) but just give some good ideas and maby tell them what you might do if it was you. It will maby make the game a little more challengeing and they will learn a lot more

Another approach is to play doubles and team each noob with an experienced player.

Awesome idea. Like it!

Good advice, everyone. I guess I'll stay away from the lecture style idea. I'm going to set up a time that I can go in there with another veteran player and we can play some team games.

Certainly avoid lectures about playing the game, but if you're really that concerned about them having decent looking armies, you could try talking to your FLGS about running a painting and modeling workshop. I doubt most owners would mind, especially if it involved them buying new models to practice with, even it it's just one of the boxes of 3 SM or something.

Take them through clipping the sprues, cleaning the mold lines, gluing, priming, basecoats, then maybe drybrushing and washing if you wanna get REALLY advanced For the more interested, possibly even get into stuff like pinning, basing, etc.

We're in the process of training some new players at my store.
The first thing you gotta do is make sure they read the BRB and Codex.
We've had some great success in teaching new players through team games. Usually one veteran and one new player on each side. Sit down and build lists with newbies and explain why you're picking what you're picking and then play through the game with them. This way they see how the rules work and are enforced and stand a decent chance of winning over the other side which will give them the confidence they need to keep playing.

like was said earlier,


be VERY strict with the rules. if they have a question, take the time to answer it. this is more important then finishing the game as it will prevent bad habits down the road.

also keep the games small. 1000 at the most. this will prevent overstimulatuion of the rules.


as to assembling the models correctly, help them put their vehicles together. less glue is more. Vehicles arn't very hard to put together when you read the directions carefully.

Veteran/Newb vs Veteran/Newb games work great


do even 1/2 of these things and you will quickly not need them anymore.

this little bit of effort will ensure these kids don't learn any bad habits that will stick with them down the road and will lead to you enjoying to play them.