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So, I am attempting to put something competitive together for my Daemons. Let me know what you think.

HQ
Bloodthirster, unholy might, blessing of the blood god
Bloodthirster, unholy might, blessing of the blood god

Elites
4 blood crushers, instrument, fury
4 blood crushers, instrument, fury
6 Fiends

Troops
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers

Fast Attack
5 flesh hounds
5 flesh hounds

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder, Tongue
Soul Grinder, Tongue

2000 even. What do you think?

Your plaguebearers, while good for objectives, won't contribute much to the offense. I'd recommend you swap out several units for bolt horrors. Also, I'm not sure as to the effectiveness of the flesh hounds. I'd recommend screamers instead if you have the models.

Is this for a tournament? because if so your going to score low on comp, and then if not, few people will ever want to play you again with this list.

I am really opposed to the idea of having 2 greater daemons/equivalent monstrous creatures in any list under 4000pts. I understand there are ways to beat them, but it would be no fun for the opponent to face. Even if you botch most of your rolls once in a while, it wont make up for how unfun it would be to play against this list. Honestly if I was going to play against you, not knowing you had the 2 thirsters, and then you deployed them, I'd simply refuse to play. If I knew your list ahead of time, I would just outright refuse to play. Other than that I like your list.

So now you have to ask yourself what are you going for. The list is strong, yes, but you will make no friends playing with it. Do you want to win? or have a fun game, where you dont simply deploy and win? Ball is in your court now

Bastirous666 wrote:Is this for a tournament? because if so your going to score low on comp, and then if not, few people will ever want to play you again with this list.

I am really opposed to the idea of having 2 greater daemons/equivalent monstrous creatures in any list under 4000pts. I understand there are ways to beat them, but it would be no fun for the opponent to face. Even if you botch most of your rolls once in a while, it wont make up for how unfun it would be to play against this list. Honestly if I was going to play against you, not knowing you had the 2 thirsters, and then you deployed them, I'd simply refuse to play. If I knew your list ahead of time, I would just outright refuse to play. Other than that I like your list.

So now you have to ask yourself what are you going for. The list is strong, yes, but you will make no friends playing with it. Do you want to win? or have a fun game, where you dont simply deploy and win? Ball is in your court now

I played my Daemons with Fateweaver hugging a Bloodthirster and 3x MoT Princes with bolt and wings...it was pretty mean and I have made friends playing this list. I think if you are trying to win with a dated codex how does that make the game less fun and unfriendly? I'm sure playing against any Daemon army would be more fun than playing Long Fang spam Razorwolves.

Hückleberry wrote:

Bastirous666 wrote:Is this for a tournament? because if so your going to score low on comp, and then if not, few people will ever want to play you again with this list.

I am really opposed to the idea of having 2 greater daemons/equivalent monstrous creatures in any list under 4000pts. I understand there are ways to beat them, but it would be no fun for the opponent to face. Even if you botch most of your rolls once in a while, it wont make up for how unfun it would be to play against this list. Honestly if I was going to play against you, not knowing you had the 2 thirsters, and then you deployed them, I'd simply refuse to play. If I knew your list ahead of time, I would just outright refuse to play. Other than that I like your list.

So now you have to ask yourself what are you going for. The list is strong, yes, but you will make no friends playing with it. Do you want to win? or have a fun game, where you dont simply deploy and win? Ball is in your court now

I played my Daemons with Fateweaver hugging a Bloodthirster and 3x MoT Princes with bolt and wings...it was pretty mean and I have made friends playing this list. I think if you are trying to win with a dated codex how does that make the game less fun and unfriendly? I'm sure playing against any Daemon army would be more fun than playing Long Fang spam Razorwolves.

Sure that is true, but does that mean the daemon list is fun to play? no. It simply is further along the gradient from not fun, moving towards fun.

All I was saying is that in my experience playing the game, the guys who bring lists like this regularly don't make many friends or have much play time. That's saying a lot in a biggish city (like Madison/Milwaukee) and as such I am simply laying out my criticism and explaining it to the fullest. I think he/she deserves that much from anyone giving comments and critique.

Bastirous666 wrote:Is this for a tournament? because if so your going to score low on comp, and then if not, few people will ever want to play you again with this list.

I am really opposed to the idea of having 2 greater daemons/equivalent monstrous creatures in any list under 4000pts. I understand there are ways to beat them, but it would be no fun for the opponent to face. Even if you botch most of your rolls once in a while, it wont make up for how unfun it would be to play against this list. Honestly if I was going to play against you, not knowing you had the 2 thirsters, and then you deployed them, I'd simply refuse to play. If I knew your list ahead of time, I would just outright refuse to play. Other than that I like your list.

So now you have to ask yourself what are you going for. The list is strong, yes, but you will make no friends playing with it. Do you want to win? or have a fun game, where you dont simply deploy and win? Ball is in your court now

This list is for a tournament. I am not trying to make friends with this list. I am simply trying to make a competitive daemon list.

@Jy2

I agree with you about the plague bearers. They are tough, but do not do much. I usually use bloodletters. They are fragile, but can threaten everything but Land Raiders and walkers. What would you think about something like this:

HQ
Bloodthirster, unholy might, blessing of the blood god
Bloodthirster, unholy might, blessing of the blood god

Elites
5 blood crushers, instrument, fury
4 blood crushers, instrument, fury
6 Fiends

Troops
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 horrors, bolt
5 horrors, bolt and changeling
5 bloodletters
5 bloodletters



Heavy Support
Soul Grinder, Tongue
Soul Grinder, Tongue

Bastirous666 wrote:

Hückleberry wrote:

Bastirous666 wrote:Is this for a tournament? because if so your going to score low on comp, and then if not, few people will ever want to play you again with this list.

I am really opposed to the idea of having 2 greater daemons/equivalent monstrous creatures in any list under 4000pts. I understand there are ways to beat them, but it would be no fun for the opponent to face. Even if you botch most of your rolls once in a while, it wont make up for how unfun it would be to play against this list. Honestly if I was going to play against you, not knowing you had the 2 thirsters, and then you deployed them, I'd simply refuse to play. If I knew your list ahead of time, I would just outright refuse to play. Other than that I like your list.

So now you have to ask yourself what are you going for. The list is strong, yes, but you will make no friends playing with it. Do you want to win? or have a fun game, where you dont simply deploy and win? Ball is in your court now

I played my Daemons with Fateweaver hugging a Bloodthirster and 3x MoT Princes with bolt and wings...it was pretty mean and I have made friends playing this list. I think if you are trying to win with a dated codex how does that make the game less fun and unfriendly? I'm sure playing against any Daemon army would be more fun than playing Long Fang spam Razorwolves.

Sure that is true, but does that mean the daemon list is fun to play? no. It simply is further along the gradient from not fun, moving towards fun.

All I was saying is that in my experience playing the game, the guys who bring lists like this regularly don't make many friends or have much play time. That's saying a lot in a biggish city (like Madison/Milwaukee) and as such I am simply laying out my criticism and explaining it to the fullest. I think he/she deserves that much from anyone giving comments and critique.

So do people out there never bring double land raider or double storm ravens? Do you have a cap of only 5 assault terminators per army? thunderwolves and long fangs too? Do you pack up your army when someone says they want to bring Mephiston and the Sanguinor?

In lower points games (<1500) two greater demons would be down right mean, but at 2000pts your opponents armies should be balanced enough to deal with them even in friendly games. Greater Demons are big nasty models, but there are ways of dealing with them. Its certainly not up there on the list of offensive units / armies like Vulcan Spam, Guard Parking Lots, Seer Councils, Lash Princes, Nob Bikers, Jaws of the World Wolf, Blood Angel Mech Spam, etc. Even for Demons, its not Fatecrusher or Fiend Armageddon.

It's a good list, but its certainly not a "Top Tier Prefabricated Internet List". I want to know what kind of armies you are seeing in your area, because to me bringing two bloodthirsters doesn't bother me anywhere near as badly as all the Mech Spam that is out there.

Hey Extrenm(54)

I thinks it's a cool list, I'd try to trim some fat and get a third SoulGrinder however:

255 Bloodthirster, blessing of the blood god
255 Bloodthirster, blessing of the blood god

200 4 blood crushers, instrument, fury, icon
200 4 blood crushers, instrument, fury, icon
180 6 Fiends

75 5 plague bearers
95 5 horrors, bolt
100 5 horrors, bolt and changeling
80 5 bloodletters
80 5 bloodletters

160 Soul Grinder, Tongue
160 Soul Grinder, Tongue
160 Soul Grinder, Phlegm

2000 points exactly

A list like this should prove competative in a tournament setting. Good luck with it!

Cilithan

I agree with Cillthan -
At 2k you should have your heavies maxed out, given that your rolling with soul grinders - you should have 3 or none at all. The list Cilithan posts is a vast improvement. Personally i'd use all three w phlegm, BS3 is just too meh to waste on one shot - if you need to wreck a LR or monolith - simply get into CC with it. 5 strength 10 attacks will make short work of it and also 3 pie plates a turn is just plain nasty.

I'd go for DP's over SG's - but it comes down to preference.

As for all this "make no friends" and "refuse to play" buisness - it just makes me lol.
As a previous poster has stated previously - there are alot more heinous lists out there then a Daemons list w 2 thirsters and 2-3 soul grinders. He doesnt have Fateweaver for one. Also he has troops - lots of troops secondly. I'd love to see your face against Razorback spam BA w tri vindis and multiple bael preds or parking lot guard w vendettas. Honestly, there are a few absolutely horrible lists out there in 5th ed - and THIS is not one of them.

BBJ

I would relish in the challenge of killing 2 Bloodthirsters. That would be great!

I'm more in to the Soulgrinders than DP's too. They kill more than DP's if they have Phlegm. I'd take a DP if you didn't already have 2 Bloodthirsters. To be fair, i think with Cilithan's suggestion, you're fine (though I'd put Phlegm on all 3 SG's)

Cilithan wrote:Hey Extrenm(54)

I thinks it's a cool list, I'd try to trim some fat and get a third SoulGrinder however:

255 Bloodthirster, blessing of the blood god
255 Bloodthirster, blessing of the blood god

200 4 blood crushers, instrument, fury, icon
200 4 blood crushers, instrument, fury, icon
180 6 Fiends

75 5 plague bearers
95 5 horrors, bolt
100 5 horrors, bolt and changeling
80 5 bloodletters
80 5 bloodletters

160 Soul Grinder, Tongue
160 Soul Grinder, Tongue
160 Soul Grinder, Phlegm

2000 points exactly

A list like this should prove competative in a tournament setting. Good luck with it!

Cilithan

I like the list you posted. It keep the number of units at 13, and I think it all hits pretty hard. I just need to play test it.

As for the whole bloodthirster thing, I do not think 2 bloodthirsters at 2k is overpowered. If anything, its a bad idea, since at 2k my opponent will probably have the firepower to kill them pretty easily. This is one of the reasons I keep bouncing back and forth between Thirsters or heralds, or even an unclean one. I have not had a chance to play a game with daemons in a while, so I just need to see what I think works for me. But at this moment, the Bloodthirsters are painted, and I think they are awesome, so I will try those.

Thank for all of the advice so far.

Honestly probably the best greater demon to accompany this list (excluding Fateweaver) would probably be a Keeper of Secrets with Pavene. He really helps the Bloodcrushers get stuck in and he isn't a slouch in CC either. Although he's less survivable than the other 3 its basically a wash because of the number of high strength AP 1 and 2 weapons & powerfists that get thrown at greater demons which effectively negates Iron Hide or FNP. Other ways to get Pavene into this list would be using Blue Scribes or hiding a Slaanesh Herald in with the Fiends and filling up that second slot with the Skulltaker.

I really like your list, I run something really similar to it at 2000pts. Personally I go 2x 5 Plaguebearers and 3x 5 Horrors to try and maximize holding objectives and throwing out bolt. You already have a number of CC threats through the Soul Grinders, Bloodthirsters, Bloodcrushers, and Fiends that bringing the Bloodletters doesn't really add much to your army.

So long as you are aggressive with the Soul Grinders I think this list will do really well in your tournament.

I'd run fateweaver + thirster. Rerolling the Bloodthirsters + crushers saves is money in the bank.

Cottonjaw +1

- Brutal combination.

This is the list I like to run. I only want Tzeentch and Khorne as my theme. Seems to work for me, and fun to play.

Blood Thirster - Death Strike, Blessings, Instrument. 280pts
Fate Weaver- 333

2x10 Bloodletters 320pts

12 Horrors with bolt and Changeling 236pts

6 Blood Crushers w/Instrument, mark and Icon 280pts

2x Daemon Princes w/ Flight, Mark of Tzeentch, and Bolt 400pts

Total 1849

extrenm(54) wrote:So, I am attempting to put something competitive together for my Daemons. Let me know what you think.

HQ
Bloodthirster, unholy might, blessing of the blood god
Bloodthirster, unholy might, blessing of the blood god

Elites
4 blood crushers, instrument, fury
4 blood crushers, instrument, fury
6 Fiends

Troops
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers
5 plague bearers

Fast Attack
5 flesh hounds
5 flesh hounds

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder, Tongue
Soul Grinder, Tongue

2000 even. What do you think?

Fateweaver would be awesome in this list.

Honestly, cut the hounds and some PB's to fit in 1 more grinder. Should be good then.