Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I was just looking at the forums for painting showcase and saw an Imperial guard kid showcasing his desert camo. It sparked my thoughts to Space Marines.... Why don't they use Camo... I know that I guess scout units sometimes use it. But why dont regular chapters of it. If Imperial fists used it, as with Chapters like Ultramarines then maybe they might lose less. Idk random thought at 1 a.m.

My only explanation is that space marines tend to fight along side massive guard regiments and would prefer to stick out.... so that enemy fights them instead of the guard????

I have always been under the impression it is due to intimidation, they don't wear camo to show they don't need it to kick the crap out of you, along with the general intimidation that goes with fighting space marines.

Originally, Marines used camo extensively. Chapters had multiple different armour colour patterns for use on different worlds.

2nd edition introduced the idea of the Codex Astartes, and fleshed out Marines as fearless supermen. As a part of that, the use of camoflage was deemed beneath them... Hiding was just not a Space Marine thing to do. Instead, they stood out proudly in their armour, so that their enemies could recognise them and despair...

It's started creeping back into player armies... not so much because the fluff says its ok as that it just doesn't get mentioned, so the taboo is slowly fading.

Its just that they always bitch in like every book that they are always running out of precious gene seed.... well Mutha trucka. Put sone tiger stripe face paint on and digi up. haha

In fluff, they're so hard to kill they don't need it.

So, it's a matter of being Badass.

Nothing says 'here, let me help you aim for me' like a suit of blue and silver Power Armor of Greater Smurfitude.

lol agreed.
Idk i say they should use there resouces better. I mean do we put our seals and marsoc guys in blue and gold? why should they?

If they're really just being the Deus Ex Machina that the fluff paints them to be they don't really need it, deep striking into the center of the enemy lines and killing everything in sight and whatnot.

When they're fighting protracted battles, it's more like what has been said before; they're too awesome to use camoflage.

It's a pride thing. Scouts use camo and stealth plenty in the chapters. But the majority of the Marines feel no need. In their Pride and Ego and Gistuo. After all look at their tactics (granted the games rules are set-up in this way). It's pure pre-world war 1- combat tactics.

I run Imperial Fists, you could target those guys in the dark with blind folds on in their Golden Yellow Powered Armor.

The idea of camouflage is beneath them because they figure they can trust their armor and weapons and that with their training and augmentation that they can survive anything.
Add the idea of an opponent standing in the open field daring the enemy to attack him is an intimidation factor. Think the way Goliath taunted David, (granted Goliath lost that fight) but the idea is the same, none of the Jewish soldiers wanted to go up against him out of fear.

And this tactic has seemed to work on all but the most nasty of races, or the Tau who have weapons with such extensive range they never even have to see the Marines to kill them.

If I was a living ego trip of war I wouldn't think necessary to hide either.

Also, as a general rule, camoflage does not help you a jot if your tactics involve launching into battle via drop-pod assault; no matter how much the drop-pods resemble the local foliage, they tend to be rather noticeable streaking down from the sky. Marines work on a shock-and-awe basis, striking hard at an enemy, and that generally speaking does not usually involve using stealth other than the scouts and other units specialized for it.

Why would they need camo at all? The only thing that can kill them is a LOT of firepower.
Besides, they are using their color scheme as a matter of honor, and hiding in the shadows and striking your opponent at back is so no-Space Marnini

They don't do it for the same reason medieval knights didn't do it. If you hide your insignias, your heraldry, you must be ashamed of them. Camouflage is for cowards who lack the strength for true battle. The 'out in the open' thing carries some disadvantages, but it also creates a few advantages as well.

1. Allied troops (such as Imperial Guard of Sisters of Battle) become less obvious targets, meaning the bulk of enemy attention is massed at the Space Marines, who are the most resilient to it.

2. Intimidation. Extensive work goes into making a Space Marine bigger and badder than any normal human could hope to be, and the technology they are kitted out with only enhances this further. Showing that off helps to put the fear into the enemy from the get-go.

3. A Space Marine you can't see is a threat that might not exist. The Space Marine who is striding towards your front lines, wading through razorwire and shrugging off bullets like popcorn, that's a very real threat looming ever larger on your position. This helps to break enemy lines sooner, force surrenders faster, and save both lives and resources in the long run.

4. A rallying point for besieged civilians as well as allied troops (such as Imperial Guard or Sisters of Battle). The Space Marine in his canary yellow armor tearing some ork's arms out of his sockets is a much more inspirational sight than some flapping flag. I am sure many unaugmented units have refused to break do to the presence of Space Marines. 'See? The Space Wolves are here! Everything's going to be fine!' Being more visible only helps this along.

And it isn't like Space Marines never use stealth, they just prefer to do so with their deployments. Drop pods, deep strikes, it's all about hitting your opponent fast from an unexpected quarter. Once you do arrive, you want to make as big of an impression as possible. The bright colors and garrish symbols only help to make that effect stronger. Space Marines aren't just supposed to be big soldiers in armor, they are supposed to be a symbol for the entire Imperium. Check out Angels by Robert Earl. It's a short story from Let the Galaxy Burn. Gives you a good idea of the sort of impression I mean.

Stealth and camouflage is certainly used by the Imperium, from Catachans to Vindicare Assassins, and even among the Space Marine scouts, but the full fledged Space Marines have a more specific purpose, which requires a higher degree of visibility.

This is just the impression I get from reading and playing the game. It's all my opinion, and I could of course be wrong.

"Camouflage is the colour of cowardice".

Space Marines aren't exactly sneaky kind of guys.

dalsiandon wrote:It's a pride thing. Scouts use camo and stealth plenty in the chapters. But the majority of the Marines feel no need. In their Pride and Ego and Gistuo. After all look at their tactics (granted the games rules are set-up in this way). It's pure pre-world war 1- combat tactics.

I run Imperial Fists, you could target those guys in the dark with blind folds on in their Golden Yellow Powered Armor.

The idea of camouflage is beneath them because they figure they can trust their armor and weapons and that with their training and augmentation that they can survive anything.
Add the idea of an opponent standing in the open field daring the enemy to attack him is an intimidation factor. Think the way Goliath taunted David, (granted Goliath lost that fight) but the idea is the same, none of the Jewish soldiers wanted to go up against him out of fear.

And this tactic has seemed to work on all but the most nasty of races, or the Tau who have weapons with such extensive range they never even have to see the Marines to kill them.

If I was a living ego trip of war I wouldn't think necessary to hide either.

Or eldar with weaponry that can go through armor like butter.
Or necrons who's weaponry doesn't even recognize you're wearing armor.
Or demons who's hellblades aren't hindered much by that whole reality thing.
Or tyranids who'd just assume use your eyeballs as juju beads...

Yes, there are multiple pics of RT era camo schemes for landraiders - quite cool.
Also in the badab war, chapters went to camo because they had a nasty habit of killing each other pretty easily.

Some of the less pious chapters use night world camo and have their shoulder pads in chapter colours

I have camo in my army (Mantis Warriors) and for the Badab War it's the norm rather than the exception. However, if you look at the camo patterns they aren't very camo like... so in my army it denotes veteran status... specifically sternguard, as opposed to some attempt at blending in. (let's face it, bright yellow with black yucca silhouettes isn't going to blend in very well in too many places).

I always figured their armor could change colors, and that the chapter colors are like their "Dress Uniform."

As for a practical reason why they don't use camo: because camouflage is hard to paint.

They don't really need to be camo with armor like that. Plus when they do preform stealth missions with a full fleged marine he rubs dirt on his armor to dull the color down.

themocaw wrote:I always figured their armor could change colors, and that the chapter colors are like their "Dress Uniform."

As for a practical reason why they don't use camo: because camouflage is hard to paint.

My new project doesn't use camo, just muted drab and khaki colors.

it makes the pieces easier to pick up when they lose

They look nice in bright colours.

I'd imagine the practice of not using camo probably stems back to the days of the Golden Age of Technology, when it didn't matter whether or not you were wearing camo, cause that sniper is gonna see you with his thermal scope.

Similar to how in other scifi settings camo has been dropped by certain groups because it doesn't matter when there are scanners, and thermal that will pick you up anyway.

Some of the deathwatch fluff I read said that they have to paint one arm silver to keep the armor happy. Maybe SM armor gets angry when it's painted in camo?

Their face.... I mean faith is their shield.

On a serious note they don't do it because marines fluffwise don't go into many drawn out battles that's where guard excel. They drop in the center of an army scream for the Emperor and everyone their pants. I mean what would you do if you saw a bright yellow marine coming at you. They know that fear is one of the most effective weapons. In the game they are their own army, but on almost all occasions fluffwise they are backed by millions of guardsman and used as shock troops

The Astartes arrive in building-sized mammoth personnel carriers, armed with lascannons and racks of bolters, that disgorge walking tanks bearing assault cannons and thunder hammers, huge orbital dropships with a lorry-sized orbital laser on the back and in supersonic drop pods which burst open and ancient, furious mecha the size of houses and superhuman warriors emerge to deal death to the enemies of the Emperor.

Frankly, a bit of digital camo or razzle-dazzle paint wouldn't do much to disguise them...

Frazzled wrote:

dalsiandon wrote:

The idea of camouflage is beneath them because they figure they can trust their armor and weapons and that with their training and augmentation that they can survive anything.
Add the idea of an opponent standing in the open field daring the enemy to attack him is an intimidation factor.....

And this tactic has seemed to work on all but the most nasty of races,...

If I was a living ego trip of war I wouldn't think necessary to hide either.

Or eldar with weaponry that can go through armor like butter.
Or necrons who's weaponry doesn't even recognize you're wearing armor.
Or demons who's hellblades aren't hindered much by that whole reality thing.
Or tyranids who'd just assume use your eyeballs as juju beads...
....

I kind of addressed this in my sentence about nasty races, I don't quote consider the Tau to be as nasty as say Dark Elder or 'Nids. I don't recall seeing any 'Nids on Pandora where the animals will assume use eyeballs as juju beads but hey, that movies long I might have missed the one that was there.

Long ago, the fluff was that all chapters used camouflage, with the exception of the Red Scorpions, who thought that camouflage was cowardly and beneath them, and went into battle in their chapter colors.

GW wanted to enhance the feel of SM being KNIGHTS IN SPACE!!! so all chapters suddenly adopted a Red Scorpion mentality and started wearing their chapter colors into battle. If Marines (Scouts not included) need to perform a stealth mission, it seems that they have other ways of going about it rather than camo patterns. In Legion for example, the Alpha Legion blends itself in by adopting local garb, etc. How exactly an unarmored marine can blend into a local populace/go unnoticed while wearing local clothing, I do not know.

Miraclefish wrote:The Astartes arrive in building-sized mammoth personnel carriers, armed with lascannons and racks of bolters, that disgorge walking tanks bearing assault cannons and thunder hammers, huge orbital dropships with a lorry-sized orbital laser on the back and in supersonic drop pods which burst open and ancient, furious mecha the size of houses and superhuman warriors emerge to deal death to the enemies of the Emperor.

Frankly, a bit of digital camo or razzle-dazzle paint wouldn't do much to disguise them...

I think this is the most sufficiently simple way of making the point yet had

Some actually do such as the Raptors (not sure on this one but I know it's a branch off of Raven Guard that does).

well, some chapter colors arn't exactly flashy neon shades which say "Shoot Me"



the Ravenguard's black armor is condusive to fighting in the shadows and at night.



My chapter's armor is a simple Codex Grey. it blends in well with just about everything as grey is a very natural color in just about every enviroment(Rocks in the country are normally grey, and rockrete is grey)





Only chapters which favor stealthier approaches will have any kind of camo.

Most space marines favor a fast shock and awe approach to combat which doesn't require camo. a giant 8ft dude charging at you is going to be just as visable if he is wearing the color of the local terrain as if he is wearing neon orange and green pokadots.