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Yeah I have to agree. They just look shinier. But work exactly the same.

Asherian Command wrote:Yeah I have to agree. They just look shinier. But work exactly the same.

Shinier and not really useful...so the SW going forward argument doesnt hold any ground...

The only redeeming point is a sith could take on this many soldiers and heavy machinery at one time...proof http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJvQ_CQr77s

Asherian Command wrote:Yeah I have to agree. They just look shinier. But work exactly the same.

Actually, in many ways the new stuff is worse, because the design methodology under the Empire shifts from "super advanced badass stuff" to "easily mass produced and replaceable". I.e. WWII German vs. USSR.

But then so could an alpha level psyker with proper Primaris warding.

Alpha plus psykers are on a completely different level than Jedi, even ones like Skywalker. Jedi can briefly mind-trick a handful of people. From Eisenhorn, we know psykers can mind-control entire city blocks of people into a murdering mob. A Sith can throw some lightning around, a psyker can open rifts in reality.

I'm a fan of the Jedi, but they are a precision smart-bomb to the alpha psyker's hydrogen bomb. I would say only Palpatine and Starkiller approach that level of sheer power (one with his force storm, the other with his force gripping a star destroyer into the ground), but that's about it.

Mn, I wasn't thinking of an alpha plus psyker. Most of those are nutjobs who cannot control their power. Alpha level, however, is still plenty powerful. Think about the Ork special character Weirdboy, who once turned an entire army into squigs. He's probably alpha level-- what's special about him is mostly that his head doesn't bang in a large enough waaagh!, but any weirdboy with that kind of durability would also be just as powerful.

Imagine, then, an army of stormtrooper-armored squigs, looking around confused at the squig in jedi robes.

So this means the Empire loses?

Melissia wrote:Mn, I wasn't thinking of an alpha plus psyker. Most of those are nutjobs who cannot control their power. Alpha level, however, is still plenty powerful. Think about the Ork special character Weirdboy, who once turned an entire army into squigs. He's probably alpha level-- what's special about him is mostly that his head doesn't bang in a large enough waaagh!, but any weirdboy with that kind of durability would also be just as powerful.

Imagine, then, an army of stormtrooper-armored squigs, looking around confused at the squig in jedi robes.

Haha, whoops, I didn't mean to insert the plus.

An Alpha Plus, however, is a being of grotesque power. They are described in the 4th edition Rulebook as being able to "turn a man inside-out with a glance", "snap a Battle Titan in half with a flick of the wrist", and "a muttered syllable can turn an army upon itself in a frenzy of bloodlust". They are capable of destroying entire worlds - sometimes unintentionally.[.quote]

Oh yeah I remember that quote XD.

Melissia wrote:Mn, I wasn't thinking of an alpha plus psyker. Most of those are nutjobs who cannot control their power. Alpha level, however, is still plenty powerful. Think about the Ork special character Weirdboy, who once turned an entire army into squigs. He's probably alpha level-- what's special about him is mostly that his head doesn't bang in a large enough waaagh!, but any weirdboy with that kind of durability would also be just as powerful.

Imagine, then, an army of stormtrooper-armored squigs, looking around confused at the squig in jedi robes.

That would be pretty funny to see...the jedi will be like " Didn't see that coming "...can provide the source for the weirdboy turning an army into squigs, first time hearing this...

Fourth edition codex: Orks. One of the special characters has that power.


edit: Old Zogwort, with "Zogwort's Curse".

Well starkiller in the vid is shown to be a clone and clones can be made for mass production...now lets see starkiller strength is his almost perfect light saber mastery, agile movement combine with the force, his control of the force e.g repulse, lightning...now imagine that Darth Vader unleashed thousands of starkillers clones unto an imperial world...that would be a sight to behold...no need for mass invasion of clones and ships just this few thousand as one of them is an army in their own right, being able to bring down ships, destroy factories single handed, take on armies many times more and still look cool...

I know the IoM will win in the end with countless pyskers to counter...but imagine the carnage of the fighting that would occur...even space marines will know fear...and im just stating this for the cool factor of imagination...

You assume that Darth Vsder could CONTROL that many.

Melissia wrote:You assume that Darth Vader could CONTROL that many.

Probably wouldn't need too...just "Unleash" them...

The Hammer wrote:Well starkiller in the vid is shown to be a clone and clones can be made for mass production...now lets see starkiller strength is his almost perfect light saber mastery, agile movement combine with the force, his control of the force e.g repulse, lightning...now imagine that Darth Vader unleashed thousands of starkillers clones unto an imperial world...that would be a sight to behold...no need for mass invasion of clones and ships just this few thousand as one of them is an army in their own right, being able to bring down ships, destroy factories single handed, take on armies many times more and still look cool...

I know the IoM will win in the end with countless pyskers to counter...but imagine the carnage of the fighting that would occur...even space marines will know fear...and im just stating this for the cool factor of imagination...

Eh, I'm not buying this quite yet until the game is out and I've played through it. You can't clone a skill-set (just the level of force sensitivity), which is why all the clone troopers go through very rigorous training once they finish incubating.

Terminus wrote:

The Hammer wrote:Well starkiller in the vid is shown to be a clone and clones can be made for mass production...now lets see starkiller strength is his almost perfect light saber mastery, agile movement combine with the force, his control of the force e.g repulse, lightning...now imagine that Darth Vader unleashed thousands of starkillers clones unto an imperial world...that would be a sight to behold...no need for mass invasion of clones and ships just this few thousand as one of them is an army in their own right, being able to bring down ships, destroy factories single handed, take on armies many times more and still look cool...

I know the IoM will win in the end with countless pyskers to counter...but imagine the carnage of the fighting that would occur...even space marines will know fear...and im just stating this for the cool factor of imagination...

Eh, I'm not buying this quite yet until the game is out and I've played through it. You can't clone a skill-set (just the level of force sensitivity), which is why all the clone troopers go through very rigorous training once they finish incubating.

You can also force that skill-set into someone brain. Force them to learn it. The Space Marines do it to their initiates to teach them history and tactics, etc.

The only step after that is actually training your muscle memory into implementing the things you learned.

You can't really force someone to learn something that way . Sure, it might make teaching EASIER somehow, but you can't really replicate personal experience.

True enough. So, basically what terminus said X.D! Silly Crown Royal, making me look like a smacktard.

Maybe I shouldn't be giving list building and strategy tips on the 40k army lists board atm X.D!

Hey, don't diss the Crown, tis delicious!

Terminus wrote:

The Hammer wrote:Well starkiller in the vid is shown to be a clone and clones can be made for mass production...now lets see starkiller strength is his almost perfect light saber mastery, agile movement combine with the force, his control of the force e.g repulse, lightning...now imagine that Darth Vader unleashed thousands of starkillers clones unto an imperial world...that would be a sight to behold...no need for mass invasion of clones and ships just this few thousand as one of them is an army in their own right, being able to bring down ships, destroy factories single handed, take on armies many times more and still look cool...

I know the IoM will win in the end with countless pyskers to counter...but imagine the carnage of the fighting that would occur...even space marines will know fear...and im just stating this for the cool factor of imagination...

Eh, I'm not buying this quite yet until the game is out and I've played through it. You can't clone a skill-set (just the level of force sensitivity), which is why all the clone troopers go through very rigorous training once they finish incubating.

Incorrect, flash learning without the training was prevalent only the Kamino clones had the rigorous training.

It seems a major problem is erupting here. You all seem to think that force powers=warp powers. They do not.

Psykers rely on the ever shifting waves of the immaterial realm also known as the Great Ocean to unleash enormously powerful "spells" (like lightning, and fire, and boiling blood and disassembling peoples molecules, or exploding things,among others). These powers are seemingly easy to counter, as the sisters of silence's presence can easily disable them. The Ordo ereticus in general has several ways to counter psykers.

The Force is a much more potent weapon. Users rely on their own personal will-power to unleash spectacular shows of arial movement,blah-blah-blah. You all know what the force does. The force cannot be countered(to my knowledge).

I don't think that either side would anticipate the other's "psychic powers", and they would both suffer lots of casualties. However, due to the warp's chaotic nature, a psyker could easily fail to "make his psykic test" and several daemons would spew forth from the warp,whih would be awesome!

That's why they have warding. Primaris Psykers are powerful, skilled in controlling their powers, AND protected from the perils of the warp. Indeed, the process of becoming a Primaris Psyker involves surgery where they open the psyker's head up and inscribe protective wards on the inside of his skull, and then he (or she really) wears protective robes and garments as well.

Well that's a good idea. Sounds painful as shell though.

I'm fairly certain they're heavily drugged during the operation.

Melissia wrote:That's why they have warding. Primaris Psykers are powerful, skilled in controlling their powers, AND protected from the perils of the warp. Indeed, the process of becoming a Primaris Psyker involves surgery where they open the psyker's head up and inscribe protective wards on the inside of his skull, and then he (or she really) wears protective robes and garments as well.

Proof?

Havoc13 wrote:

Melissia wrote:That's why they have warding. Primaris Psykers are powerful, skilled in controlling their powers, AND protected from the perils of the warp. Indeed, the process of becoming a Primaris Psyker involves surgery where they open the psyker's head up and inscribe protective wards on the inside of his skull, and then he (or she really) wears protective robes and garments as well.

Proof?

5th edition C:IG, and Dark Heresy: Ascension.

Win. Counter measure one shot. Also Psykers would be more powerful. They can destroy anything. Read all the books about the space marines. We forgot them. They have psykers and they are incredibly strong.

If GE had even one starkiller, they could win any war he enters. Just make the transport ships crash into eachother then fire force repulse into a block of a million guardsmen. Alternatively, run around zip-zipping everyone with a lightsaber.
Without enough powerful force users, it would be a close call.

Melissia wrote:I'm fairly certain they're heavily drugged during the operation.

Bonus!

/signs application

LOLOLOLOL.

Yeah, psyker powers aren' as limited as what's in the codexes. They can really do anything their imaginations can fathom.
"hey, that's an ugly picture of me in the yearbook, lemme just burn that out...*burns*. Awesome."

Probably the limits of space marine imagination.