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New Ork player here(but gamer for a long time). After having played 20 -30 games now (1000 points or less) and reading these forums, talking
to other ork players etc. I will take a stab at this proposed rule lists thingy just for the glory of Waaaaagh.

Ok here are the main issues I see revolving around the orks and some of my proposed ideas to fix them.

1. HQ selection is terrible in orks. You have Ghaz and big mek, everything else is just foo foo fun or unviable. I see this as the biggest overall problem with Orks that reall limits
every aspect of their army. You basically go greentide or you have to have a Big Mek, those are your choices as far as I can tell.
2. Sort of a sub point of number 1, but if Zogwort and Grotsnik had a tune up they could be great HQ's.
3. Ork vehicles are broken period. BM+vehicles is effective but is also a limit on the ork army since you basically have to
have a BM to field a single vehicle(See points 1 and 2 above lol)
4. Gitz are worthless.
5. tank bustas are near worthless.
6. Its ridiculous that Meganobs don't have cybork.
7. Looted wagons serve no purpose.

Proposed fixes.

1. Give Dok Grotsnik 3+invul save and he becomes a real option, and it fixes meganobs. He is the "Mad Dokk", his cybork should be
that much better than all the others. He then can survice comabt, bring fearless to the meganobs, and you can now buy cybork bodies for them.

2. Some type of Smokescreen upgrade option on all vehicles-maybe more like smoke grenades.
This fixes the pigeonhole Big Mek HQ if you want to run vehicles.

3.Make Gitz Assault 3. 25 base and offer shootie and blasta upgrades for total cost of 35 per model, add a BP option on badrukk?

4. Wagons, not sure,maybe different variants, definitely they serve next to no purpose right now as a transport(too slow) or a gunwagon(sitting duck w no mek).
Maybe they could be dedicated transports for burnas/bustas?

5. tank bustas, cap squad size at 10, offer BP/Nob option and then make them 10 points each instead of 15.
Give them trukk transport or looted wagon.

6. Tank Bustas, keep Glory Hogs and give them Tankhunter seems a decent proposal I read elsewhere.

7. Zogwort needs a BP option and should be LD 9(he friggin got bitten by snakes as a baby-what could he possibly be afraid of now?)
then he could potentially be put into tank busta,burna groups. Maybe also give him a 2+ invul save until 1 wound is taken like that DE HQ guy.


8. Weird boy, same thing as Zogwort.

OK that's my 5 cents.

Return Burnas to 2d6 in CC against vehicles.

Weird boyz should be 1-3 IC per a single Elites FOC. Grants Fleet to any unit they are with. (Zealous Charge maybe?)

Tankbusta need Tankhunters, crime for them not to have it. Just a cruel hoax that they don't. Total middle finger to Ork players.

All mobs should have the ability to get Krak stikkbombs! Str 4?!?!? Is our only option?

Meks could also be a 1-5 upgrade honor squad that doesnt take up an FOC HQ slot. Super Stikk bombs ala Demo Charges?

Dedicated transports (including non-boom gun looted wagons) for all mobs including Flash Gitz, TB's, Burnas etc.

Squigoths, everyone except Orks get Monsterous Creatures? Total WTF????

A special Grot Leader.

Already been said but 5+ inv for Meganobz.

Eternal Warrior and/or Toughness upgrade for HQ choices.

Bikes need to be fearless again!!!!! And Stickbombs would be nice. Also some dang heavy weapons options so they can actually use their relentless rule.

Deff Dread Drop Pods!

Allowing a Big Mek to take any Heavy Support vehicle as a troop choice. 15 Kan Lists would be great!

I really feel most of these should be mandatory in the next codex while keeping the same points cost. I left out a lot of "wishes" apologies to the OP. Ok Deff Dread Drop Pods are actually just a wish

PipeAlley's comments ring very true to most of my own wishlist.

I'll add a few more...

Weirdboy powers need to be completely overhauled, and the randomness of the power needs removed. If you want the powers to be weird, make them weird, but at least let the Ork player decide what power he wants to use in a given turn. The fact that Weirdboys already have low leadership and need to be in a large mob of Boyz to be viable is enough of a handicap already. I'd love to see Pipe's idea which has been floated a lot of other places of making them Elites (or even HQs) but being able to buy 1-3 of them and distribute them to your squads.

The same FOC should be done with Painboyz. You should be able to buy a unit of 1-3 as an HQ or Elite choice and distribute to your forces.

I'm not sure Deff Dread drop pods are very "Orky" but I do think Orks need SOME kind of better Deep Strike option than we have now, which is to say ABSOLUTELY NONE. We've got Kommandos and Snikrot, and Stormboyz and Zagstrukk... that's it. While it's not Orky to have Drop Pods, having Roks drop from orbit, or FightaBombas dropping off troops or Kans certainly might be.

Also, the Orks need a Melta weapon (I'd nominate the currently useless and never-used Kustom Mega Blasta).

The Zzap gun also needs fixed. It's a downgrade from the basic Ork Kannon, but 15 points more expensive. It's so broken it's practically errata.

Yeah, the Zzap gun's previous feather was auto-hit. Bring that back and we'd use it a lot more. I don't mind Painboyz being only for Nobz. 1-3 in any unit might be too powerful but then again I'm a very conservative wisher.

I like Flash Gitz, I just wish they didn't cost so many damn points...

That's all the need to be useful, don't make them so expensive.

if they were useful, id use them as dedicated shooters over Lootas if they weren't.

Squiggoths would be great too. Orks need a useful Vindicator.

Flash Gits would be awesome and WORTH the points if the Snazzgun was AP D3 instead of D6.

The problem with Flash Gitz is that they're priced AS IF the AP was actually D3. The other problem is that you can't make them much cheaper before people would just take them instead of Nobz, because they'd be TOO cheap compared to Nobz.

There are a lot of problems with Flash Gitz lol

Let grots take big gunz as squad upgrades instead of being a heavy support choice. Looted wagons should be more customisable. Let ork units take rokks for deepstrike, which carries 15 models/one deffdread/up to three kans. It's armour 12/12/12 and scatters 3d6, but if it lands on a vehicle (friend or foe!), treat it as initiating a ram attack after moving, say, 18"? If it lands on non-tank models, (again, friend or foe) then treat it as making a tank shock and give it a nerfed deffrolla attack, say, d6 str6 hits? or large blast str6 hits? If it lands on difficult or dangerous or impasseble terrain, it's stunned, and models can't disembark. Impassible terrain is turned into difficult, and difficult is squashed flat into regular. Dangerous remains dangerous.

personally, I love flash gitz, and they've never failed to wreak havoc on the battlefield when I've used them. but I think they be better as an upgrade option for a nobz mob rather than taking up a heavy support slot. Or, failing that, let them at least take a battlewagon dedicated transport.

Other wishlist items include: Let burna and loota meks take bosspoles. Make the kustom mega-blasta a blast weapon again (as in the previous codex) or make it melta, and giving the Looted wagons some options to purchase better AV as upgrades plus more weapon choices

A grot IC.........

Murrdox wrote:Flash Gits would be awesome and WORTH the points if the Snazzgun was AP D3 instead of D6.

The problem with Flash Gitz is that they're priced AS IF the AP was actually D3. The other problem is that you can't make them much cheaper before people would just take them instead of Nobz, because they'd be TOO cheap compared to Nobz.

There are a lot of problems with Flash Gitz lol

I have tried so many times to justify the gitz because I absolutely love the fluff and their concept. There are many many many things wrong with them lol. They basically shoot as well against Meq as shooters, they are less effective at Teq than a mob of 20 boyz, they cost nearly twice as much as either, they are best in an open top BW, yet they chew up a heavy slot and have no transport so the only way you could take them in a scenario where they are optimized would limit you to 2 battlewagons-which sucks, plus they have no bosspole. WTF!

It's almost like EVERYTHING is frigging wrong with flash gitz lol.

The other guy I really really want to take is Zogwort, honestly the psychic power thing doesnt bother me. His nest of Vipers is an inredible ability, but anyone that knows anything is going to isolate him in CC and kill him before he ever even swings. Nest of vipers is honestly very similar to that DE guy that gets pain tokens(don't know his name). The way that guy works is that he has a +2 invul UNTIL he fails a save, then he is wide open. He gets like 5 poison attacks and is very tough until he takes the first wound then his invul is removed and you basically kill him next round. That is how Zogwort should work.

@ the guy who suggest Roks.

Roks are big ass massive space fortresses. They are not Drop Pods. They are asteroid sized drop pods.

Looted Wagons are very useful actually. Str 8 AP 3 pie plates, whats wrong with that! I mean sure they have a chance of "Dont press that" but if you have 2 or 3 of these things your hardly going to roll 2 or 3 ones.

I think the OP made his wishlist out of things that dont work for him, and did not take a general grasp on how certain things work for certain people

Deadshot wrote:@ the guy who suggest Roks.

Roks are big ass massive space fortresses. They are not Drop Pods. They are asteroid sized drop pods.

Ok, then call 'um stonns.

Deadshot wrote:@ the guy who suggest Roks.

Roks are big ass massive space fortresses. They are not Drop Pods. They are asteroid sized drop pods.

Roks can be MANY different sizes, it is entirely conceivable to have a drop pod sized Rok.

Have a Weirdboy as an upgrade for a boys squad - ie. They can be led by a Nob or Weirdboy. Cap it at 1 per army.

Give Warbosses and Big Meks an option to have a Rokkit pack.

Swap the Flash Gitz' Gitfinda bonus (You can pre-measure range before declaring your shot) to +1 BS.

Up the point cost of a RPJ, but having one makes the vehicle fast.

Up the point cost for a Deff rolla, and make it ignore armour (Cover saves can still be taken as the target tries to get out of it's way)

Give Mekboys access to Power Klaws.

Burnas get 2d6 armour penetration (It fits with their fluff)

Basically, make the rules fit the fluff. There's really nothing in the Ork fluff that is OP. They're big Schtick is overwhelming numbers and above-average combat ability in their basic troop- and they already have that!

Shiny things for Ork Players

A lot of the Ork player's problems stem from the simple fact that playing Orks is about having as much fun as possible, in as much of a ridiculous way as possible. They literally run on the rule of cool, and this should be represented in game.

To start with, their special rules - namely, mob rules. Crank them to 11. At 15 models in a unit, they're no longer required to make any test on their leadership. At 20 models, models within 3" of a unit in base contact with an enemy during assault may attack. At 25 models, they no longer need to make difficult terrain tests. At 30 models, they gain +2 attacks on the charge.

Secondly, many units may now be composed of up to 30 models; that is, 15 boys may be added to any unit currently limited to 15.

You may purchase a clan for your horde, changing which units become troops types and granting bonuses to statlines. Some will grant 'ard boys to all your boys, others will give you additional strength or special weapon availability. Most of the cults should be easy to figure out from a glance.

Transports; Trukks need to up to 20, and wagons to 30 - no boy left behind! Wagons need to be dedicated to more units, as well; Imperial Apocalypse Second Edition brings the Orks some Fast Attack and Heavy grot love.

GROTS! BRING THEM BACK TO USEFUL, TINY, AMAZING LITTLE BUGGERS!

As was mentioned, Flash gitz and Tankbustas need a scrutinizing; lootas could do with being assault d3 as well, or +1bs on turns they don't move.

Also, Burnas. Burnas need their own vehicle, which you can drive into the enemy, and have explode, and have the surviving burnas be in assault. I just can't see why this isn't a thing already.

Anvildude wrote:Basically, make the rules fit the fluff. There's really nothing in the Ork fluff that is OP. They're big Schtick is overwhelming numbers and above-average combat ability in their basic troop- and they already have that!

This!

Also, they need more things like the SaG...

I like playing as orks and having a random outcome of how my gun is going to shoot

How about snotling swarms?

In the fluff, it states that some orks become so huge from fighting so often, that they can be a dozen feet tall or more. We could add in the addition of 'uge boyz, which could be either like low-class monsterous creatures that come in bunches of three, or like some sort of super ogryn-like nob but with less gear options. And they could eat nearby grots for boosts in cc.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again.

Allow tankbustas to run.

Remove flashgitz as an entry, let the nob unit buy snazzguns that are assault 2 basic. Move lootas to heavy.

Remove all meks from units, and let them buy nobs that can get the standard nob upgrades. Heck, let the meks stay, but atleast toss in a nob to lead those units.

Return the mob up rule.

Return auto hitting Zzap guns.

Return the affitional d6 in cc with burnas on armour cracking.

Return the tankhunter USR to the tankbustas.

Return stikkbomma boys (with frag and krak).

Return the options to give kommandos shootas.

Etc. Etc.

I miss alot of stuff from the old dex. Heck, just lower the basic boy cost in the old dex, add koptas, and assault 2 18" on the shootas and I'd be a happy camper with the old dex...

Nah. Ghazkhul should just have a rule that gives him all the benefits of being a Monstrous Creature, without the penalties.

'e'z da biggest wun, after all.

Unless you count that Ork Planet.

Anvildude wrote:Nah. Ghazkhul should just have a rule that gives him all the benefits of being a Monstrous Creature, without the penalties.

'e'z da biggest wun, after all.

Unless you count that Ork Planet.

Ghazkhul wouldn't benefit from being a MC. He's already s10 and ignores armor, mega armor means cover doesn't bug him anyway, and he only has one gun to fire. Unless you just want the 2d6 against vehicles, then making him a MC is pointless

Basically, yes. Didn't know any of the other MC benefits. Orks, you know. Squiggoths apparently don't exist.

Top 2 on my wishlist.

Give Flash Gitz and meganobz all wargear options available to regular nobs.

Make Shokk attack gun big meks a HS option

One wish: drop boyz by 1-2 points.

Bring on the tide...

My wishes are...

1. Ork Boy squads can choose to have a PK per 10 orks, including the Nob PK.

2. Ork Boy squads can choose to have a Burna per 10 orks.

3. Ork Boys squads can have up to 50 orks per squad.

4. "Don't Press That!" removed from Looted Wagons.

I like most of your proposals, Simon, but I'd say no to one PK per 10 boys. That's a little much; it gives a max-size boyz squad no fewer than 3 power fists, or 5 if you kick the max size up to 50. Granted, they're only strength 7, but that's still pretty damn dangerous.

What about one Big Choppa per 10 boyz? That seems more reasonable to me; doesn't ignore armor, but still increases strength enough that your BC boyz will almost always be wounding on a 2+ against anything except MCs.

EDIT: Also, fluff-wise, I think any boy who managed to hang on to a power klaw for any length of time would end up a Nob in his own right pretty soon; whereas a Big Choppa is just, well, a choppa. Only bigger.

It'd also give Boyz mobs a way to be more frightening to Walkers- as of now, it's only the Nob that can do anything at all. Even Tac marines can get Krak grenades.

Grot swarms - I like gretchin as objective holders but i want them to tar-pit better and IMO since they have the worst statline of the game why not just make them swarms so they can take advantage of cover better? I dunno just doesn't make sense that gretchin are so unloved in the codex.

Behemoth Ork- I want something like a troll/ogre for our army; I imagine the easiest way is to say "Big'uns" but i am thinking of an ork that is 30-40 feet talk roughly the size of a dreadnought, if this isn't allowed then a squiggoth for sure... you have no idea how mad i was they released them for wild orks back in the older codex and then didn't add them to the updated dex. Honestly you could make it almost identical to a battlewagon. Instead of deff rolla you have something like "Voracious appetite" first round of assualt at init 10 d6 strength 10 hits + leadership or be reduced to WS 1. "battle barge" have the squiggoth take 20 orks or 12 orks plus a boomgun or the like. It would allow the orks to embark and disembark exactly like a vehicle and if the creature dies make something like a ramshackle table only a little worse for the orks as the wounds do give us an advantage as oppose to armor *shrug*

I'd like to see "Mega nobz, Nobs and Flash gitz receive a Wolf guard slot" this would allow you to buy a squad of nobs and equip them however you want and distrubute them to your army and make squads. maybe make them something like 5- 15 models."

Stormboyz points drop; I will not use them unless fighting poor players

Better HQ choices

Better Wargear choices (meaning warbosses with burnas for example)

TANKING HUNTING TOOLS like meltas or MC

Roks; i want to have this! honestly i would pay to have roks be something like a random gamble per game. round 2 you roll for your rok squad your results could be "Collateral damage: The rok explodes on contact killing all the orks inside but making sure to take plenty with them your location scatter 2d6 inches in any direction any modles from that orginal point to your ending point are hit by a strength 5 hit. "WAAAAAAGH" The boyz crash safe and sound "follow drop pod rules" unit of 3d6 orks erupt out of the rock (your choice between choppa or slugga upon arrival), "OH NO!" the rok is badly off on caluclations and the orky computers traced to the nearest ork signal "resolve collateral damage" on the nearst ork unit to your drop point. I would make them tiny squads to represent the chaotic nature of the orks or a single roll per rock *shrug*

others come to mind but I am too tired to think of more.