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H.B.M.C. wrote:Actually what saddens me the most right now is that there are people here (and elsewhere) who will both defend and celebrate this action of GW's; people who will attempt to rationalise, explain a way and - dare I say it - apologise for GW.

Happened to me on BOLS
Some idiot actually tried to say that this is an entirely reasonable move for them to do and thats its all part of the free markets

In fact it also happened on Warsser, someone said its the premium we pay for the Hobby
You can't win H.B.M.C, you cant win
Not even when the company craps on their face

While I don't post here very often , this decision has really enraged me . I'll certainly be giving alot more time to the other game systems I play and seriously have to consider my purchases if any , from now on .

Not sure if anyone had actually posted this already but:

Hi there,

It's a sad day for us here at Maelstrom Games (www.maelstromgames.co.uk) for we have the unpleasant task of informing all of our Rest of the World customers that Games Workshop will no longer allow us to sell their products to you - but here's an 18% off UK RRP voucher to soften the blow!


GW NO LONGER ALLOWING US TO SELL TO ROW CUSTOMERS
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Games Workshop's new Terms and Conditions, which come into force on the 31st of May 2011 restrict the sale - among other things - of all of their products to the European Union, although there are a couple of countries (such as Norway and Switzerland) that are geographically within Europe but not in the EU that we can still sell to.

The full list of countries that we can sell GW products to is as follows:

Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, Finland, Estonia, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, United Kingdom

Obviously this means that all of our faithful Games Workshop customers from the Anglosphere - Australia, Canada, New Zealand and the United States - as well as those from Brazil, Chile, Peru, Russia, Japan and South Korea (apologies for those countries I have missed out) will now miss out on our superb service and cheap prices, but I'm afraid the terms and conditions of our contract with Games Workshop mean that we have to say goodbye.

But it's a cracking goodbye! From today until midnight (GMT) on Monday the 30th of May all of our customers will be able to use a 18% off UK RRP discount voucher code on Games Workshop products only, so you stock up on all of those items you'll need for your Warhammer, Warhammer 40,000 or Lord of the Rings armies - and of course all your paints and brushes!


YOUR GW-GOODBYE VOUCHER
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please note that this voucher will work on all the items within our webstore, but:

- not on any Games Workshop Direct items
- and additionally, not on anything within our eBay store.

Apart from the above, the voucher will work on pre-orders and, crucially, you'll still earn Moneyback - although tiered discounts are disabled when using a voucher of course.

Your voucher code is: GW-ROW

To use this voucher simply register on the webstore, www.maelstromgames.co.uk (if you haven't already), copy and paste the code into the appropriate field in your basket when you have selected the items you want, press 'REDEEM', and the webstore will do the rest. You are not limited to one purchase and, indeed, we would ask you to recommend us to your friends with this voucher!

Remember though that this voucher will only work on Games Workshop products - specifically, Warhammer Fantasy Battle, Warhammer 40,000, Lord of the Rings, Citadel Hobby and Black Library products.

Phew! That should, at least, soften the blow for you all - and, of course, no other company restricts sales geographically, so you can always grab your Hordes and Warmachine and, of course, BaneLegions products from us!

Happy Ordering!


UNSUBSCRIBE
----------------------------------------------------------
If you feel you have received this e-mail in error or do not wish to be a part of our mailing list, simply visit the Mailing List page at http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/index.php?act=mai and unsubscribe from there by entering your e-mail address. You will not be mailed again and we would like to apologise for any annoyance we have caused to you by sending this e-mail.


MAELSTROM GAMES
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are many benefits to ordering with us, including:

- A very competitive 10-15% discount from RRP on most items
- The Moneyback loyalty scheme to reward return customers
- Our promise to match any other UK webstore prices
- FREE postage, unless you choose recorded or insured delivery
- Complete online order history
- Up to the minute news on wargaming products
- The ability to pre-order items


MAELSTROM GAMES LTD
contact@maelstromgames.co.uk
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matlock Mill, Hamilton Way, Mansfield, Nottinghamshire. NG18 5BU. United Kingdom
For online customer service, telephone: (+44) 01623 238 919
For the physical store, telephone: (+44) 01623 629 425
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Registered in England and Wales as a Company
Company No.: 4724863
VAT Reg No.: 804 3874 30
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Registered Office: 106 Carter Lane, Mansfield, Nottinghamshire. NG18 3DH

Found that in my Inbox this morning, so we can rule out the rumour bit as far as I can tell.

It's been posted at least 3-4 other times.

Including by Maelstrom themselves.

Kanluwen wrote:It's been posted at least 3-4 other times.

Including by Maelstrom themselves.

Some people are probably still in shock Kan, so are posting it again not so much to tell other people, but just to convince themselves that it isn't some sort of elaborate hoax.

That and I just rolled out of bed and am about to head for work, figured id drop in what little info I had as opposed to try and read 15 pages worth of posts.

But yes, this royally sucks.

I know that I am in a rather confortable position to propose this, since there is no GW store anywhere near me (I live in the Argentinian interior, actually closer to Chile), but seeing that our Aussie coleages are much more directly affected than most of us, are a relatively large market for GW, and also have the dubious honor of being one of the only countries affected by this embargo that actually HAVE a native GW, how about a good, old-fashioned protest?

You dont need a lot... 3 or 4 guys, some lawn chairs and a few posters, with stuff like "Buying here you are paying 2X more for the same products" and "Why GW discriminate against Australia?", and sit out in front of your local GW...

Send a letter or email to your local newspaper and/or TV station... My wife was a TV producer and they are HUNGRY for stuff like that. If this generated some visibility, or, craziest thing ever, a lot of these started happening, generating more buzz, that MIGHT actually do some good. Hell, maybe even GW would notice.

Surely some dads would at least prevent their 12 and 13-year-olds from entering that weird looking store with the fat, unshaven guys sitting outside, and that would also cost GW new customers! (Sorry, I couldnt resist that last one... If it helps, I am also somewhat overweight and unshaven )

Inquisitor Earl wrote:I'll repeat it as people are too busy repeating the same thing for it to get noticed.

Does anyone know what happens to pre-orders placed with either Wayland or Maelstrom for items such as the new Dark Eldar stuff?

If we have paid, does that mean we still get sent the product even though it's after the cutoff date?

Maelstrom says you can still pre-order stuff with their 'Bye GW discount', for delivery after the cut off date, so you're probably ok.

Still, check their site: http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk/index.php?act=new&ref=212

Guys, it's not his fault he hits us. We just make him so mad!

Here is the new US/Canadian pricing.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?pli=1&key=tIytonRUpm6fRkxpIjqcDzQ#gid=0

Wow. Resin versions of metal miniatures (which should be cheaper) are more expensive. And so is plastic. And so are codex's/army books.

So for the trifecta, we have GW stopping countries which pay 40-50% more on their product from obtaining it from a much more cost effective source, have removed metal miniatures completely and switched to plastic/resin whilst simultaneously increasing the price on them, and also now plastic and paper products also get a price hike.

It's like they don't want anyone to buy their stuff at all.

Also, epic combo-punch to the nuts on the Necron Battleforce set. $18 increase ($25 in Canada)! Woot!

Is there any one on this thread who lives in Adelaide, Australia and plays a non-gw "war game"?

If so could you introduce me to said game, maby some time this weekend or next week?

Gutted does not even begin to describe my feelings this morning (and I'm not affected by this ridiculous embargo - I only live in Barnsley, 45 mins away from GW HQ in Nottingham).

The level of arrogance and contempt for their customers adopted by GW has reached epic proportions and the short-sightedness of their business model is impossible to fathom.

Do they actively want their company to fail? Is it policy to ensure that they alienate as many existing customers as possible whilst simultaneously making it harder each year to attract new ones? Do they really think that its good economic sense to be putting up prices and restricting trade for non-essential goods at a time when people's disposable income is shrinking due to the global downturn?

I will be writing a letter of complaint and strongly encourage all those in the hobby to do the same, whether this affects you directly or not. GW needs to realise that they are nothing without their customers and that sooner or later (and I find myself increasingly hoping that its sooner) the company will inevitably crash and burn unless they overhaul the way they do business.

Gamers all over the world are becoming increasingly aware of the non-GW options and those who are not being driven out of the hobby altogether by the simple need to pay for rent/food/bills are leaving in droves for GW's competitors - long may this trend continue.

It has been said many times that nothing will change with GW until their bottom line is affected. Given this decision on independant retailers and the planned price rises with the metal-to-resin switch (despite resin being a cheaper raw material) I wonder if this has not started to happen - GW hardly has the healthiest set of company accounts. What they need to be made to understand is why this is happening and that it will only get worse for them if they keep moving down this road.

My sympathies to all those who will lose out as a result of this assinine decision, and as for my money, its time to evaluate the gaming alternatives....

There's a general price hiike AS WELL?!?!

Can anyone confirm that this embargo affects US indies too?

Guys, don't write letters, don't organize boycotts, and don't send angry emails. Vote with your dollars, and stop buying their stuff. That's all that will work, period.


As for me, when Necrons are released, I'll pick and choose the models I like, assuming they don't get Ward'd in the Codex. This won't make me quit, but I certainly won't be picking out the impulse purchases I used to, and am much less inclined to get anything that doesn't fit a significant void in an army; essentially, not "collecting" anymore.

I'm right there with you Ouze...I've committed to a Necron Army come the next update, already bought a battleforce and a generous friend gave me some destroyers and a monolith...but I will definitely not be buying willy nilly just to try stuff out like I did with my Marines, it'll pretty much be 'what can't I live without/proxy for the moment'. They're gonna see a pretty steep dropoff in sales to me, assuming I buy anything at all. I might just try and make do with a destroyer wing for the time being.

I think my next purchase (and sadly final) purchase from Maelstrom may well be my last GW related purchase for a very long time. Of course, adding to the pile will just make me less inclined to build all of it.

So beyond being insane and trying to alienate their customers even more, has GW given any reason behind this sudden embargo?

Only GW would celebrate a medium change with a price hike and to celebrate the price hike instigate a trade restriction and to celebrate the trade restriction throw another price hike party.

Nephilem wrote:I think my next purchase (and sadly final) purchase from Maelstrom may well be my last GW related purchase for a very long time. Of course, adding to the pile will just make me less inclined to build all of it.

So beyond being insane and trying to alienate their customers even more, has GW given any reason behind this sudden embargo?

they are all employed in secret by PP with the aim that once GW is destroyed PP will take over the gaming world










Well it makes as much sense as proactive stupidity GW management seem to be pursuing.

Glad I'm switching to buying bitz off of Ebay for what I need, these days. Yikes.

Nephilem wrote:So beyond being insane and trying to alienate their customers even more, has GW given any reason behind this sudden embargo?

Well, best guess would be the delusion that, once they have no access to the regular priced stuff from europe or the US, the people in the southern hemisphere (like our dear Australian and New Sealandian friends) will have no other choice but to pay the insane prizes they ask for over there.

And in all seriousness, I managed to defend quite some decisions by GW, but this?

I guess my times of collecting GW armies are done. Collecting as in "starting new armies or needlessly expanding existing armies".
I won´t stop buying GW models, or playing the game, but new models? Not as long as I have unpainted stuff. And certainly not from GW directly, or at full prize.

Considering I have a tremendous backlog of unpainted minis, and two Privateer Press armies in the works as well, it´ll be quite some time before I´m going to buy something but paints from GW again. Any instore "loyality" purchases in a GW store not to mention.

I'm not giving up on 40k as I just love the game too much but I am looking around for alternatives.

Hi all,

I think I posted somewhere earlier in this thread or another relating to it stating how mad I am but having slept on it...I am just sad BUT this has happened before in other industries.

I am a semi-pro musician and have spent thousands of £ on gear as you can imagine. Now...I LOVE music shops and can't abide buying from the net even if it is cheaper and even music companies have stopped selling to online retailers UNLESS they have a shop front. Basically the online boom sent many shops out of business because they couldn't cope with the massive discounts online guys were doing. At one point an online music shop was making around £5 on a Shure SM58 mic whilst before physical shops were making a good healthy £30/40 on them. Shops simply couldn't compete and then the local music scene struggled. Things are turning around now though and it seems a lot of physical shops have eventually caught up with the internet and offering good deals themselves on their own websites.

I can see why GW have done it but I don't think they've thought it through. It seems a knee jerk reaction to bad sales.

gr1m_dan wrote:I am a semi-pro musician and have spent thousands of £ on gear as you can imagine. Now...I LOVE music shops and can't abide buying from the net even if it is cheaper and even music companies have stopped selling to online retailers UNLESS they have a shop front.

The thing is: GW is allready doing this afaik. And has been doing it for quite some time now. And this not even close to the problem at hand.

The problem now is simple:
GW charges totally inappropiate prizes in countries like Australia and New Zealand, completely out of touch of any conversions rate. This results in the guys down under paying twice or so the price we pay.

This results in many people ordering from europe or the US. This leads to less sales down under. This leads to GW thinking "How can we stop this". THIS leads to this decision, which will most likely NOT be followed by adapting the prizes to the northern hemisphere.

gr1m_dan wrote:Hi all,

I think I posted somewhere earlier in this thread or another relating to it stating how mad I am but having slept on it...I am just sad BUT this has happened before in other industries.

I am a semi-pro musician and have spent thousands of £ on gear as you can imagine. Now...I LOVE music shops and can't abide buying from the net even if it is cheaper and even music companies have stopped selling to online retailers UNLESS they have a shop front. Basically the online boom sent many shops out of business because they couldn't cope with the massive discounts online guys were doing. At one point an online music shop was making around £5 on a Shure SM58 mic whilst before physical shops were making a good healthy £30/40 on them. Shops simply couldn't compete and then the local music scene struggled. Things are turning around now though and it seems a lot of physical shops have eventually caught up with the internet and offering good deals themselves on their own websites.

I can see why GW have done it but I don't think they've thought it through. It seems a knee jerk reaction to bad sales.

You hit the nail on the head. The reason behind this will be that FLGS's are complaining to GW reps that they put the time and effot in to grow the hobby, advertise for free and run events and people go online to stores that undercut them because they don't put the money in to the support. From my experience working in another industry online stores probably don't even hold much in the way of stock, mostly they will use EDI to run so that when you place an order they will place an order with GW. This will then be shipped to them next day, and then on to you.

This is not GW being evil and nasty, they are trying to balance the demands of the industry and the players. Both us and the shops are there customers, and we both have diffrent demands. They may have got the balance right, they may not, only time will tell.

In reply to the questions about the law, no its not illigal. Free trade only applies to the EU for GW, but in that case companys get forced to sell on a level footing, but also governments are forced to do the same with tax. If they wanted they could have given in totaly and stopped selling to anyone who sells exclusivly online.

Ouze wrote:Guys, don't write letters, don't organize boycotts, and don't send angry emails. Vote with your dollars, and stop buying their stuff. That's all that will work, period.


As for me, when Necrons are released, I'll pick and choose the models I like, assuming they don't get Ward'd in the Codex. This won't make me quit, but I certainly won't be picking out the impulse purchases I used to, and am much less inclined to get anything that doesn't fit a significant void in an army; essentially, not "collecting" anymore.

Hit the nail on the head, these are my feelings exactly re the price hike. My local Battle Bunker sits across the suburb from me, so it's not that much of a problem with regards to suppliers, but if it means less people playing the hobby, especially us middle-classes without an excruciating amount of disposable income, it's a problem.

I just don't understand who makes these kinds of management decisions....

In the meantime, my army remains small... and unpainted... and in a general state of "I want to do more with this!"

I think this just all comes back to GW not really caring about retaining customers. All they want is timmy to buy his 2000pts worth of models, then lock them in a cupboard forever when he gets bored of them. Anyone who notices any of the 3 announced changes today is NOT part of GW's target audience.
They already have their pound of flesh from you and couldn't care less if you keep offering them more. Their target audience, little timmy, doesn't know that the box of shiny models he is holding was 20% cheaper 2 days ago, nor does he know that people in another country pay 50% less than him.

Trasvi wrote:I think this just all comes back to GW not really caring about retaining customers. All they want is timmy to buy his 2000pts worth of models, then lock them in a cupboard forever when he gets bored of them. Anyone who notices any of the 3 announced changes today is NOT part of GW's target audience.
They already have their pound of flesh from you and couldn't care less if you keep offering them more. Their target audience, little timmy, doesn't know that the box of shiny models he is holding was 20% cheaper 2 days ago, nor does he know that people in another country pay 50% less than him.

That's very true but it assumes that Timmy and his parents buy blind with no heed to equivalent products or services. GW does not exist in a vacuum; it has to compete with video games and stuff like that. GW prices do not have infinite elasticity - there will come a point, sooner rather than later, where Timmy's mother looks at GW stuff as opposed to other forms of entertainment or hobbies and simply says 'no'. And some would contend that it is already happening; without quoting verbatim, the last few profit reports from GW have shown a trend of falling sales - the only reason GW has managed to keep profits steady is by slashing costs and hiking prices. There is only so much of this you can do and doing it as a way to 'fudge' growth and profit statistics is not a viable long term business strategy.

Paul wrote:

gr1m_dan wrote:Hi all,

I think I posted somewhere earlier in this thread or another relating to it stating how mad I am but having slept on it...I am just sad BUT this has happened before in other industries.

I am a semi-pro musician and have spent thousands of £ on gear as you can imagine. Now...I LOVE music shops and can't abide buying from the net even if it is cheaper and even music companies have stopped selling to online retailers UNLESS they have a shop front. Basically the online boom sent many shops out of business because they couldn't cope with the massive discounts online guys were doing. At one point an online music shop was making around £5 on a Shure SM58 mic whilst before physical shops were making a good healthy £30/40 on them. Shops simply couldn't compete and then the local music scene struggled. Things are turning around now though and it seems a lot of physical shops have eventually caught up with the internet and offering good deals themselves on their own websites.

I can see why GW have done it but I don't think they've thought it through. It seems a knee jerk reaction to bad sales.

You hit the nail on the head. The reason behind this will be that FLGS's are complaining to GW reps that they put the time and effot in to grow the hobby, advertise for free and run events and people go online to stores that undercut them because they don't put the money in to the support. From my experience working in another industry online stores probably don't even hold much in the way of stock, mostly they will use EDI to run so that when you place an order they will place an order with GW. This will then be shipped to them next day, and then on to you.

This is not GW being evil and nasty, they are trying to balance the demands of the industry and the players. Both us and the shops are there customers, and we both have diffrent demands. They may have got the balance right, they may not, only time will tell.

In reply to the questions about the law, no its not illigal. Free trade only applies to the EU for GW, but in that case companys get forced to sell on a level footing, but also governments are forced to do the same with tax. If they wanted they could have given in totaly and stopped selling to anyone who sells exclusivly online.

Doesn't fly as a concept. Its the same line that BF tried to use on Maesltrom "Your cheap cheap prices undermine the hobby because you don't have a real shop." comes in the email from the man who has BEEN to the site, and the Maelstrom chaps sit in their real shop with adjoined gaming area, look around and wonder if its all a dream, given how much they do to support the hobby. Not to mention that the ability to purchase hobby materials at a reasonable price IS supporting the hobby much more effectively than pricing half the planet out of the market.

The way to deal with the disparity between online retailers (which many of these shops exclusively AREN'T) is obvious. Internationally, more attention needs to be paid towards exchange rates and price setting, especially within this particular hobby. Within the system as a whole it would be sensible if the relevant economic bodies (governments, trade unions, whoever) address the reasons why online retail puts "real" shops out of business, and create POSITIVE parity that benefits the consumer. So that would be tax-breaks or reduced rental arrangements and so forth that make it easier for "shops" to compete..not arbitrary rubbish like this that makes it more expensive for online retailers and more importantly consumers...because at the end of the day its the consumers that are getting it in the neck.

I think this just all comes back to GW not really caring about retaining customers. All they want is timmy to buy his 2000pts worth of models, then lock them in a cupboard forever when he gets bored of them. Anyone who notices any of the 3 announced changes today is NOT part of GW's target audience.
They already have their pound of flesh from you and couldn't care less if you keep offering them more. Their target audience, little timmy, doesn't know that the box of shiny models he is holding was 20% cheaper 2 days ago, nor does he know that people in another country pay 50% less than him.

That's true. Get in and get out... i wonder if they realise it's easier to sell to current loyal customers (well were loyal) instead of getting new ones?

Having said that, why not start focusing on how we can work around it?

For anyone interested, thought it may be worthwhile working on a solution. Let's see what we can come up with?

Check it here http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/369395.page

why would they do this?