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What will 6th do to Space Wolves? Which units are going to become better, which worst?

I am not sure at the moment, after I get my Copy of 6th I will start my Space Wolf Synergy: Redux Thread.
I do know that Canis and the "Look out Sir" and some TWC will make a Diferance.

So out of this list:
6 thunder wolves
25 wolf fairs terminators
20 grey hunters
15 blood claws
Bjorn
njal
wolf lord
canis wolfborn
vindicator
land raider redeemer
4 rhinos
2 drop pods

Which would be good and which bad? (im just starting wolves btw)

He's saying he doesn't know yet, because he doesn't have the 6th Edition book yet. Keep an eye out for his thread in the near future.

JohnnoM wrote:So out of this list:
6 thunder wolves
25 wolf fairs terminators
20 grey hunters
15 blood claws
Bjorn
njal
wolf lord
canis wolfborn
vindicator
land raider redeemer
4 rhinos
2 drop pods

Which would be good and which bad? (im just starting wolves btw)

You are a Space Marine. You will be fine.

-Thunder Wolves: I don’t know at the moment, though they will become very good Tank Hunters.
-Wolf Guard Terminators: Depends on the Weapons Load Out.
-Grey Hunters: Plasma Weapons will Rock
-Blood Claws: Put them with a Wolf Pries and with the change to “Favored Enemy” Plasma Guns become Viable
-Björn: More Fragile, but he should become a force to recon with. The Plasma Cannon Version will make him a good Light Armor Hunter and the Las-Cannon [Shudder]
-Njal: Is still going to be the God of Storms, beyond that I am not sure.
-Wolf Lord: See Wolf Guard
-Canis Wolfborn: I think will he will become more viable.
-Vindicator: Fragile, but it will cause carnage before it is glanced to death
-Land Raider Redeemer: Same as the Vindicator
-4 rhinos: Exploding Battle-Taxies, but they should do their Job.
-2 drop pods: Have the Potential to inflict some glances on some transports.

Thanks for the help!

From the 6th ed rumours I've read, Space Wolves should be fine still, a high contender for sure. We're not getting nerfed too badly from what I can see.

JohnnoM wrote:So out of this list:
6 thunder wolves
25 wolf fairs terminators
20 grey hunters
15 blood claws
Bjorn
njal
wolf lord
canis wolfborn
vindicator
land raider redeemer
4 rhinos
2 drop pods

Which would be good and which bad? (im just starting wolves btw)

TWC - They won't be able to rely on wound allocation shenanigans like they used to, but they're still a tough unit to crack.
Wolf Guard Terminators - Just got much better, although they're still expensive compared to other armies.
Grey Hunters - Still good.
Blood Claws - Not as good as Grey Hunters still.
Bjorn - More fragile than before due to Hull Points (you might want to run an Iron Priest if you take Bjorn).
Njal - About the same as ever it sounds like. You can give him the new psychic powers, but it's probably best for him just to keep what he already has.
Wolf Lord - Depends on what you give him, I guess, although with the new challenges and Warlord rules, a tooled-up Wolf Lord could be an absolute monster... I know what I'm gonna be doing
Canis Wolfborn - Not sure, might be a bit weaker since his claws will likely be only AP3 now. He's still reasonably priced though.
Vindicator - Fragile, but since blast markers always hit with full strength now, they could potentially cause some serious damage. Plus they can't be Shaken/Stunned by a glance anymore.
Land Raider Redeemer - I imagine these will be handy, although we will see just how fragile hull points make them in the coming months.
Rhinos - They're gonna be fragile, but whatever. If you can hide them on Turn 1 and then blast towards your enemy lines on Turn 2, then who cares if they survive any longer?
Drop Pods - About the same as ever it sounds like. I don't really like Podding though, personally.

The Four units that will benefit the most are:

Wolf Priest: With there ability to hand out Favored Enemy to any unit they are attached to.

-Lone Wolves: They will be Murderous vs. ICs in close combat.

-Blood Claws/Sky Claws/Swift Claws: With Favored Enemy being both Close Combat and Ranged, when you mix them with a Wolf Priest.

-Long Fangs: Scoot and Shoot. [You are going to hear lots of screams with them. Think of them with a Wolf Priest.

Have not seen anything that really strikes out as OMG this is going to be so different.

Skyclaws once again become interesting with impact hits.
The ability to mix and match weapons on our termis make them suited to take on anything 2+ save or not.
Grey hunters are still just as good.
TWC seem to be just as good. New would allocation doesn't kill them too much, its just not as gravy as it used to be. It also might make people stop spending so many "extra" points on them. Thus giving more room for other stuff.

Not to mention Swift Claw. Don’t forget the Wolf Priest.

I just thought about Canis and his Wrath of the Savage, if it goes of well he could clear every model in contact, leaving no one to Assault him.

À realy space wolf player always place whit troops i got list whit non tanks.
Only 3 drop pods for my units :p

Space Wolves seem to be gaining a lot from 6th Edition (which wasn't really needed, let's be fair), including the following:
- The general trend to 6th seems to be damaging assault armies and boosting shooty armies. As Space Wolves are characteristically a COUNTER-assault, or flat-out shooty, army this can help Wolves a lot. An example of this is that defensive fire can combine with counter-assault.
With vehicles being more fragile now and their use with defensive fire, meltas on Grey Hunter squads may be getting swapped out for flamers.
- Rapid Fire may be improved.
- Allies: Necrons can grant (improved) Night Fight; helping Wolves reach that all important 24" zone. Grey Knights have a similar fighting style to Wolves and shooty Dark Eldar also operate at similar ranges (see Venoms and Blasters). It's quite possible that Sanguinary Priests can boost allied units.
- Rune Priests are set to be even more important, particularly at anti-psyker.
- Skyclaws may now be a good unit, although still have Headstrong, whilst the negative affects of rage have been removed.
- Long Fangs may be even better for anti-tank and more important for anti-monstrous creature, but are more likely to occupy worse cover.
- Space Wolves main vehicles were already fragile (Rhinos and Razorbacks), so don't suffer like the battle tanks or walkers of other armies.
- Power Fists in squads may be even better, particularly at killing Termies.
- Wolf Priests help shooting and close combat, benefitting the flexibility of squads such as Grey Hunters.


The two main setbacks for Wolves appear to be:
- Thunderwolves are worse.
- A lack if fliers and possible lack of anti-fliers.

Anpu42 wrote:-Long Fangs: Scoot and Shoot. [You are going to hear lots of screams with them. Think of them with a Wolf Priest.

At 2000pts I can see lots of cheese lists with 6x Long Fangs and 6x Wolf Priests...

With the new Wound Allocation I also see a lot of Storm Shields for Wolf Guard. I also see some very interesting “Wound Shenanigans”. Take some would scouts and arrange your front line like this.

Wolf Scouts without Special Stuff
WGBL or Wolf Priest: Runic Armor and two Wolves [On Point]
Wolf Guard with Storm Shield
Rest of the Wolf Scouts

New wound allocation rules suggest squads led by a Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour could be much tougher, as if you place the Wolf Guard at the front, then they supposedly have to kill the Wolf Guard before other squad members can be harmed.
Limited transport options however...

Andilus Greatsword wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:-Long Fangs: Scoot and Shoot. [You are going to hear lots of screams with them. Think of them with a Wolf Priest.

At 2000pts I can see lots of cheese lists with 6x Long Fangs and 6x Wolf Priests...

I disagree. With very little close combat ability and relatively few ranged weapons, paying 100pts to re-roll to-hit rolls of 1 just doesn't seem worth it IMHO.

Just Dave wrote:New wound allocation rules suggest squads led by a Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour could be much tougher, as if you place the Wolf Guard at the front, then they supposedly have to kill the Wolf Guard before other squad members can be harmed.
Limited transport options however...

Andilus Greatsword wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:-Long Fangs: Scoot and Shoot. [You are going to hear lots of screams with them. Think of them with a Wolf Priest.

At 2000pts I can see lots of cheese lists with 6x Long Fangs and 6x Wolf Priests...

I disagree. With very little close combat ability and relatively few ranged weapons, paying 100pts to re-roll to-hit rolls of 1 just doesn't seem worth it IMHO.

Good point, we'll have to see when the Rulebook drops so I can get all the rule changes straight haha.

Just Dave wrote:New wound allocation rules suggest squads led by a Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour could be much tougher, as if you place the Wolf Guard at the front, then they supposedly have to kill the Wolf Guard before other squad members can be harmed.
Limited transport options however...

Andilus Greatsword wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:-Long Fangs: Scoot and Shoot. [You are going to hear lots of screams with them. Think of them with a Wolf Priest.

At 2000pts I can see lots of cheese lists with 6x Long Fangs and 6x Wolf Priests...

I disagree. With very little close combat ability and relatively few ranged weapons, paying 100pts to re-roll to-hit rolls of 1 just doesn't seem worth it IMHO.

I agree that we will see a lot of the 6xLF + 6xWP, not that its smart, I think we will see it.

Though I think I will be adding one to my “Njal Death Blossom”
-Njal, in Runic Terminator Armor
-Wolf Pries [Runic Armor or Terminator Armor, Combi-Plasma
-Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor, Storm Bolter, Power Sword and Cyclone Launcher
-Long Fang Sergeant with Plasma Gun and Power Axe
-5x Long Fangs with Missile Launchers.

Anpu42 wrote:
-Lone Wolves: They will be Murderous vs. ICs in close combat.

But still probably not worth the points.

-Blood Claws/Sky Claws/Swift Claws: With Favored Enemy being both Close Combat and Ranged, when you mix them with a Wolf Priest.

And their "free" initiative 10 impact attack on the charge.

-Long Fangs: Scoot and Shoot. [You are going to hear lots of screams with them. Think of them with a Wolf Priest.

Oh...That's just evil. I hadn't thought of this. I predict lots of Dakka whining. In fact, I think I'm not going to use this combo just because I am SO sick of everyone complaining about long fang missile spam.

Also, be aware that
1) You won't be able to "snap fire" with blast weapons. So if you shoot and scoot with long fangs, it's Krak missiles only. No frag. =(
2) There are two levels of "preferred enemy". There is "preferred enemy" which is for shooting only, and there is "hatred" which is for close combat only. I suppose there will be an FAQ which clarifies this for our codex.



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I predict that at a 2000 pt game, you will see SW players taking 3 units of LF's and for 50 points for an Ageius Defense line to guarantee that they'll get cover.


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Anpu42 wrote:With the new Wound Allocation I also see a lot of Storm Shields for Wolf Guard. I also see some very interesting “Wound Shenanigans”. Take some would scouts and arrange your front line like this.

Wolf Scouts without Special Stuff
WGBL or Wolf Priest: Runic Armor and two Wolves [On Point]
Wolf Guard with Storm Shield
Rest of the Wolf Scouts

I don't think this is going to work all that well. I shoot your squad and get 10 wounds. That could mean 10 models get wounded starting with the one in front and counting back. Then that 25 point Storm Shield doesn't help the squad. It only helps the WG who's holding it.

Or it could mean, you make 10 armor saves with the predominant armor type (4+ since you have so many scouts). Say you fail 5 saves. Now remove 5 models starting with the closest one and working back. In this case, the storm sheild does nothing for you.

Remember: lowest ap hit is taken first. Meaning thatg WG in termi armor is going to take those meltas and things first.

Actually you can make Lone Wolves Cheep, Resilient and Very Deadly.

I run 2, Blitz and Muzzle: Just Power Armor, CCW, Storm Shield and MotW, sometimes if I have the points each gets 2 Wolves. For 65 Pints Each 85 with the Wolves
The Immunity to ID, FNP and a 3+/3++ Save makes them hard to kill.
The MotW give them 1d6+1 Rending Attacks [1d6+2 on the Assault]. With there WS of 5 they usually hit on a 3+. I have killed many a Squad because of Sweeping Advance [This is why no Terminator Armor].
Also remember you WANT them to Die at some point.
Now they have a chance of Killing Dreads with Rending Attack, this makes them even more dangerious.

Some of my Quotes about them from my Space Wolf Synergy Thread:
-What you get with the Lone Wolf:
1 Space Wolf with a Death Wish
0-2 Wolves

-MotW: Always an option just be prepared with quotes like: “I did not know that is was possible to stick an arm in the human ear up to its elbow”, “Grots do make great clubs” and “A Pulse Rifle should not go there!”. Guardsman Marbo will think “Now that was overkill.

How do you use him?
-Like the crazed psycho he is. You point him at something big and give the command “Kill” and then cover the eyes of the Blood Claws so they won’t get traumatized. This is especially true with the MotW Lone Wolves.”
-The funny part is that in the first few turn of the game you pray for good saves and then as the game move on you should start to get really aggressive and trying to get him killed with thing like. “I Charge the Hive Tyrant and his full Guard!” 3 turns later you may be looking for something else like a Fex and just stop 1 inch away and to quote Joe Swanson and shout “BRING IT ON!”
-Remember one thing: It is impossible for you to loose in Close Combat. If you can inflict 1 wound most of the time you have won, then if he fails his moral you have a chance of catching him in a Sweeping Advance. If you take the one would you get one save and if you save nothing happens. If you loose your last wound you just stole a VP from your opponent.

It' s just me, but for 85 points, I'd rather have an up-gunned razorback and 10 points to spare. For 65 points I'd take a Land speeder with mm. Or you could shave some points from something else and make this dude a WGBL instead. Sure, the lone wolf is killy, but only if he gets to CC in the first place. He's too easy to ignore.

But that was 5th edition. In 6th Edition, I might take an Aegis defense line with a lascannon for 70 points.

We'll see.


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Grugknuckle wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:
-Lone Wolves: They will be Murderous vs. ICs in close combat.

But still probably not worth the points.

It's questionable whether lone wolves will be able to "challenge" an IC since a lone wolf is NOT a character.

Grugknuckle wrote:It' s just me, but for 85 points, I'd rather have an up-gunned razorback and 10 points to spare. For 65 points I'd take a Land speeder with mm. Or you could shave some points from something else and make this dude a WGBL instead. Sure, the lone wolf is killy, but only if he gets to CC in the first place. He's too easy to ignore.

But that was 5th edition. In 6th Edition, I might take an Aegis defense line with a lascannon for 70 points.

We'll see.

True, but can a 65 point Razorback take out a 50+ man Guard Mob in One Turn?
Point for Point I find them Very Effective.
In one game my 130 [65x2] points took out well over 300 points a piece.

I say, give one a try:
-Modeling them is a Blast
-You will have more fun watching them tie up the 30 Model Ork Mob for 5 turns while the rest of your army can ignore them.

Seems like this would be the best place to ask.

1) Allies, do folks who have the book think Wolf allies will be able to field 2 HQ for the one they have access to, as it is in their own list?

2) As I don't have the book yet, (but I am planning on getting some Wolf allies for my Guard) Would Space wolf players recommend a Wolf lord on Thunderwolf, or Arjac Rockfist as a better HQ option?

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Seems like this would be the best place to ask.

1) Allies, do folks who have the book think Wolf allies will be able to field 2 HQ for the one they have access to, as it is in their own list?

2) As I don't have the book yet, (but I am planning on getting some Wolf allies for my Guard) Would Space wolf players recommend a Wolf lord on Thunderwolf, or Arjac Rockfist as a better HQ option?

1) The rule stats "In a Space Wolves army, each HQ 'slot' allows you to take up to two Space Wolf choices" - so, I would say yes. Ultimately, I'd wait for a FAQ (probably upon release of the rulebook) however, as technically it's a detachment, not an army.

2) Arjac isn't a HQ, he's an upgrade for Wolf Guard; so that's that question solved! Although Wolf Lords on Thunderwolves are VERY powerful and probably the better choice of the two.
Rune Priests are the best, competitively, choices however and may give Guard some psychic defence they're otherwise lacking.
FWIW, Logan can grant +1 attacks to all friendly units in 18" (once per game) and can grant Tank Hunters, Relentless, Preferred Enemy and Fearless to a unit he leads. Rules as written, this would apply to allies too...
Wolf Priests (grant preferred enemy and fearless to unit) may also be good for leading Grey Hunter Squads or Guard Blobs.

Hope that helped man!


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Holy crap. Ragnar, RAW, could grant +D3 attacks to a Guard Blob on the charge and Furious Charge (the latter once-per-game).

Bjorn would also be a very strong ally for Guard; potentially counting as an objective, being a tough-arse vehicle and most importantly, helping get the 1st turn.

Yeah thats great, thanks.

It means I'll probably get both, and then if they rule the Space Wolf allies can have two HQ, I'll add a runepriest.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Seems like this would be the best place to ask.

1) Allies, do folks who have the book think Wolf allies will be able to field 2 HQ for the one they have access to, as it is in their own list?

2) As I don't have the book yet, (but I am planning on getting some Wolf allies for my Guard) Would Space wolf players recommend a Wolf lord on Thunderwolf, or Arjac Rockfist as a better HQ option?

1] I don’t Know Yet
2] Thor, sorry Arjac is a Character Upgrade for Wolf Guard.
-A Thunder Lord would only be good if you are planning on taking Thunder Wolves.

Better HQ Choices:
-Logan: What he can do for any Army is Unbelievable, and he will make you Wolf Guard with Thor your Troop Choice.
-Njal: God of Storms
-Ragnar: As a leader of a Blob you plan on getting into Close Combat
-Björn: Once more he makes a Great Leader and Anti-Vehicle Unit.
-Wolf Lord: Keep him on Foot and load him up, Terminator Armor and Saga of the Bear in you CCS and he give you one more hard to kill Body Guard.
Wolf Pries: I would put one with your CCS or a Heavy Weapons Squad to take advantage of Favored Enemy.
Rune Priest: Just a good Choice overall.
Wolf Guard Battle Leader: Relatively Cheep.

Anpu42 wrote:
In one game my 130 [65x2] points took out well over 300 points a piece.

I say, give one a try:

Nope.

The Meta at my FLGS does not include any IG. But if it did, I would be afraid to hear all of the cheese-whining if my one lone wolf killed 50 guardsmen in one turn. That's just not right.

The Meta at my FLGS DOES include a bunch of Necron players though. And to be honest, I try to avoid CC with them because once you get into CC with them, it's really hard to get out of CC.

Grugknuckle wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:
In one game my 130 [65x2] points took out well over 300 points a piece.

I say, give one a try:

Nope.

The Meta at my FLGS does not include any IG. But if it did, I would be afraid to hear all of the cheese-whining if my one lone wolf killed 50 guardsmen in one turn. That's just not right.

The Meta at my FLGS DOES include a bunch of Necron players though. And to be honest, I try to avoid CC with them because once you get into CC with them, it's really hard to get out of CC.

That’s a perfect Job for Blitz and Muzzle, you can tie them up for a turn or two, that what they do best, Tar-Pit



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The Sick thing I cam up with them was for an APOC Game:
-Karamazov
-Muzzle and Blitz
-By Any Means Necessary

You Tar-Pit get surrounded and then start dropping Pie on them with no scatter. Odds are they will both live the first strike or two.

Thanks for the further info Anpu.

As to my list, yeah probably one of the key factors would be taking Thunderwolves, as I love the look of the models.

My allies list options going on what we have seen in the thread in N&R would be something like.

HQ - Lord on Thunderwolf
Elite - 5x Wolfguard in Terminator armour + Arjac Rockfist
Trps - 10 Grey Hunters
Fast - 3 Thunderwolf Cav
Hvy - 5 Longfangs

How I field that would vary on what I was after that battle. Although my regular opponents have Dark Eldar, Orks, Tyranids and Necrons, and apart from the Ork player, its mostly, fun based have a laugh and game kind of situation.

Me and Ork player are a bit more serious, but still not WAAC level.