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It boggles me, I don't get it and I can't understand why others fall for it. It's like a weekly passtime here in the US.

1. Celebrity is found guilty of something.

2. Scandal erupts, people are outraged and angered.

3. Celebrity pays nominal fee/reduced sentence/community service compared to any non-celebrity.

4. Celebrity appears on national tv shows, newspapers etc and makes a disgustingly gushing apology.

5. General Public suddenly saint the same criminal, holding them up as a pillar of virtue and defending them vigorously.


So, celebrities, go do evil things, fall on your sword publicly and with plenty of tears then become loved by all.




Case in Point.

Michael fething Vick.

Michael was exposed as being deeply involved in dog fighting. He abused animals in his 'care', he killed them in horrific ways.

Today, I was treated to an advert for a Michael Vick item of clothing.


And there you have it, redemption y'all. He's dun bad, but he's cried about it and now we all think he's a fething great guy because he said he was sorry for all that gak he did to those dogs...

Oh and his sporting achievements helped to make it all better.

The same horse piss I hear from workmates who Still defend good old Joe Paterno for covering up Sandusky's horrific crimes. 'Well, there was no absolute evidence' or 'how can you deny though that he did great with the team for years, that's got to count for something, right?'

No mate, having a good football coaching career does not act as karmic balance for allowing a child sodomiser to continue raping little boys for years because you didn't want bad press.

And then the inevitable 'But JoPat said he was sorry'...

There it is, go on Oprah, sniffle a lot as you admit to your horrible crime, let them get a good close up of your tears and then tell everyone that you're better now, that you are ashamed and then drop God into it somewhere, you know, 'It was then I could hear Him telling me, you got to stop flaying nuns, because you know, you're a great nascar driver and what you do is important for 'Murica!' to much applause.

It makes me sick.


I choose not to forgive Paterno and his cronies in PennState for covering up the rape of children.

I choose not to forgive Vick for this:



We lend our forgiveness here in America all too freely and easily if the individual is a celebrity and if they use 'the right codewords'. Some people need to languish a good time longer in purgatory. Some don't deserve to ever leave it.

Grrr, Dot get me Started on Micheal Prick, He is the personification of why i hate sports.
And if i had to hazard a guess, its more infatuation with the lives of celebrities themselves, we dont want the story to end we want it to continue.
Or it could be our idea that celebrities are gods.

Double standards for this crap

I agree with you fully MGS

This seems less aimed at having a discussion on the idea of redemption then it is about Michael Vick.

The news media is vapid and worthless. Tabloids are more vapid and more worthless.

Don't think that they represent the whole of America though.

Ahtman wrote:This seems less aimed at having a discussion on the idea of redemption then it is about Michael Vick.

It was the advert for his clothing line, with 'Redemption' on that teeshirt, that started me off with this, it's very noticeable for me as an 'emotionally stifled' Brit living over here in America, the whole very uncomfortable falling on your sword as noisily, publicly and spectacularly as possible once you're caught in order to 'move' the audience into approving your elevation from pariah into reborn saint.

There are plenty of others though, Kobe Bryant and Ben Roethlisberger both leap to mind, Lohan constantly arrested with enough snow to put your average 20something black man away for several years. All of them experience the Road to Damascus only after they have been caught and their career suffered.

hotsauceman1 wrote:Grrr, Dot get me Started on Micheal Prick, He is the personification of why i hate sports.

The double standards of Sports culture and the public celebrity worship associated with it are indeed deplorible, but sports themselves I have no issue with.

Kobe Bryant was accused of rape by a gold digging moron and cheated on his wife. Yeah, adultery is messed up, but comparing him to Big Ben the rapist and Vick is a stretch.

Amaya wrote:Kobe Bryant was accused of rape by a gold digging moron and cheated on his wife. Yeah, adultery is messed up, but comparing him to Big Ben the rapist and Vick is a stretch.

They all belong to the same fraternity: membership demands you are a complete donkey-cave at all times.

Confidence/cockiness != donkey-cave

Amaya wrote:Confidence/cockiness != donkey-cave

There is a fine line between confidence and narcissism. Most of the pros/celebs that end up in trouble (Vick, Sheen, etc.) crossed that line about 100 miles back...

You're accusing Bryant of that without justification.

Amaya wrote:You're accusing Bryant of that without justification.

I also found this article about some of the out of control egos in the NBA to be spot on:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/433854-the-narcissistic-basketball-association-top-5-nba-narcissists

And my day has been ruined.

At least my rage isn't felt alone, I know several huge aminal activists/vegetarians who are going to be really, really upset about this.

He's a shooting guard. His job is to shoot.

He's been on 12 All NBA defensive teams, 9 of them first team. He has a career per game assist average of nearly 5 per game and averages 4-6 a game consistently each year, significantly higher than the beloved Kevin Durant.

I get it, you don't like him. Your allegations remain unjustified and ignorant. He is one of the best all around players to ever play the game.

Amaya wrote:I get it, you don't like him. Your allegations remain unjustified and ignorant. He is one of the best all around players to ever play the game.

I have no opinion as to Kobe Bryant, I don't pay attention to sports.

But is what you just typed a glorified "Might Equals Right"?

Slarg232 wrote:

Amaya wrote:I get it, you don't like him. Your allegations remain unjustified and ignorant. He is one of the best all around players to ever play the game.

I have no opinion as to Kobe Bryant, I don't pay attention to sports.

But is what you just typed a glorified "Might Equals Right"?

As you don't pay attention to sports I can understand you misinterpreting my post.

CTGamer accused Kobe of being a one dimensional ball hog that doesn't play defense. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Haters gonna hate though.

Amaya wrote:
He is one of the best all around players to ever play the game.

I don't dispute this.

Being the best and constantly having to tell everyone you are the best and acting like an donkey-cave because you think your skill gives you a free pass is the problem...

He doesn't do that. He plays the game with energy and passion. Nothing he does on and off the court qualifies him as an donkey-cave.

Amaya wrote:

CTGamer accused Kobe of being a one dimensional ball hog that doesn't play defense. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Haters gonna hate though.

For the record that opinion of Kobe wasn't thought up by me, it is pretty much a universal opinion of him by most fans, writers and sports figures. The flow chart was a joke (why so serious bra?) and is secondary to the real issue which is his narcisism...

You have suggested multiple times in your posts that because someone is good at something he somehowhas a right to behave in a way that is socially/moraly repugnant because he is just being "confident".

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that, because I don't care how good you are at your job you still have no right to be an donkey-cave to other human beings and expect to get a free pass for it (your fanboys aside).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Amaya wrote:He doesn't do that. He plays the game with energy and passion. Nothing he does on and off the court qualifies him as an donkey-cave.

Right.

I never said that, but I appreciate you putting words in my mouth in order to justify your unwarranted hatred of Kobe Bryant.

Amaya wrote:I never said that, but I appreciate you putting words in my mouth in order to justify your unwarranted hatred of Kobe Bryant.

I think you should reread your above posts.

As should you.

Back on topic, I don't really understand it myself. I guess we (not me, certainly) like giving the rich and powerful second chances for some reason.

I haven't really been following the Sandusky business, but anyone who molests children and covers up molestation of children is a piece of gak and will probably always be a piece of gak.

RatBot wrote:Back on topic, I don't really understand it myself. I guess we (not me, certainly) like giving the rich and powerful second chances for some reason.

I haven't really been following the Sandusky business, but anyone who molests children and covers up molestation of children is a piece of gak and will probably always be a piece of gak.

But he won alot of football games though.

Which I guess means that we arn't aloud to melt his statue down into slag and piss on the molten metal to cool it.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:It boggles me, I don't get it and I can't understand why others fall for it. It's like a weekly passtime here in the US.

1. Celebrity is found guilty of something.

2. Scandal erupts, people are outraged and angered.

3. Celebrity pays nominal fee/reduced sentence/community service compared to any non-celebrity.

4. Celebrity appears on national tv shows, newspapers etc and makes a disgustingly gushing apology.

5. General Public suddenly saint the same criminal, holding them up as a pillar of virtue and defending them vigorously.


So, celebrities, go do evil things, fall on your sword publicly and with plenty of tears then become loved by all.




Case in Point.

Michael fething Vick.

Michael was exposed as being deeply involved in dog fighting. He abused animals in his 'care', he killed them in horrific ways.

Today, I was treated to an advert for a Michael Vick item of clothing.


And there you have it, redemption y'all. He's dun bad, but he's cried about it and now we all think he's a fething great guy because he said he was sorry for all that gak he did to those dogs...

Oh and his sporting achievements helped to make it all better.

The same horse piss I hear from workmates who Still defend good old Joe Paterno for covering up Sandusky's horrific crimes. 'Well, there was no absolute evidence' or 'how can you deny though that he did great with the team for years, that's got to count for something, right?'

No mate, having a good football coaching career does not act as karmic balance for allowing a child sodomiser to continue raping little boys for years because you didn't want bad press.

And then the inevitable 'But JoPat said he was sorry'...

There it is, go on Oprah, sniffle a lot as you admit to your horrible crime, let them get a good close up of your tears and then tell everyone that you're better now, that you are ashamed and then drop God into it somewhere, you know, 'It was then I could hear Him telling me, you got to stop flaying nuns, because you know, you're a great nascar driver and what you do is important for 'Murica!' to much applause.

It makes me sick.


I choose not to forgive Paterno and his cronies in PennState for covering up the rape of children.

I choose not to forgive Vick for this:



We lend our forgiveness here in America all too freely and easily if the individual is a celebrity and if they use 'the right codewords'. Some people need to languish a good time longer in purgatory. Some don't deserve to ever leave it.

Team Wienie states their belief that atonement and redemption could only be obtained when he endures what he put those poor dogs through. If he survives, then gives all his money to doggie charity and devotes the rest of his life in a monklife existence helping animals, then he can be considered redeemed.
In the interim
http://www.greymuzzle.org/
this place can use all the help it can get. Its been TBone certified!

CT GAMER wrote:
They all belong to the same fraternity: membership demands you are a complete donkey-cave at all times.

Not really. During college I would intern at a training camp that worked with professional athletes (mostly NFL). The amount of female attention they got, even when they're not socializing, is ridiculous. Try staying faithful to your wife, who you don't see very much in-season, while having every gorgeous 20-something fawn over you.

CT GAMER wrote:...and is secondary to the real issue which is his narcisism...

Narcissism? What narcissism? He's one of best professional athletes in the world, has many fans, makes tons of money, and when he brands things people buy them. He actually is important. Understanding that isn't narcissism, its recognizing the truth.

dogma wrote:


Narcissism? What narcissism? He's one of best professional athletes in the world, has many fans, makes tons of money, and when he brands things people buy them. He actually is important. Understanding that isn't narcissism, its recognizing the truth.

There are plenty of gifted athletes, some of whom are the best in their sport or position who do not express themselves in this manner or act as if they are above those around them. Humility and being classy CAN coexist with great ability and celebrity.

Take Lebron James: he speaks of himself in the third person and has tattoos glorifying his own ability. Now compare that to Gretsky or Tom Brady who always downplay their own skills and performances and instead talk about teammates or team effort, etc.

Knowing you are great is one thing. How you choose to carry and represent yourself in spite of that fact speaks to your character...

What makes you think anyone forgives him? The news said so?