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Like in the title - how would you counter balance him and general stupidness which they done...I' mean like Mortarion round 2, give him to Magnus or Abaddon or maybe get someone like Kharn to deal with him....
(probably Draigo would win all this fights:-)....

Easy, just make a part II in the up coming Chaos Codex.

Something like Mortarion was following Tzeentch's secret plan and threw the fight as a loss on purpose etc etc.

Simultaneously "fixing" the GK fluff while making the new Chaos fluff "BAD ASS"

and the cycle continues xD

LunaHound wrote:Easy, just make a part II in the up coming Chaos Codex.

Something like Mortarion was following Tzeentch's secret plan and threw the fight as a loss on purpose etc etc.

Simultaneously "fixing" the GK fluff while making the new Chaos fluff "BAD ASS"

and the cycle continues xD

Oooo it sounds to sweet......

The easy way to fix his fluff is to simply say he's an unknowing pawn of the chaos gods.

Yes, it would involve Tzeentch, but its not like mortarion would have to throw the fight. The specifics of the Mortarion vs Draigo fight isnt know, but I could see how Tzeentch could see that Draigo would encounter Mortarion, and how he could want Mortarion defeated, to weaken one of Nurgle's champions.

So, all he would have to do is encourage a rebellion, and time it so some daemon attempts to kill him right before Draigo arrives. Obviously, the hapless daemon tool fails, and Mortarion wins, but he is weakened in the process, enough for a Grand Master of the Grey Knights to defeat him.

All his supposed "victories" in the warp... orchestrated by Tzeentch, who subtly weakens his enemies, or pacifies the warp around him to recover from fights. One day, he will see a situation he assumes he can win, because he has won so many before, and will engage in the fight.... and Tzeentch will have forseen this, and instead stacked the odds against Draigo, so he dies.

I would first make him slowly but surely being corrupted by Tzentech. And with each time he is summoned he is closer to being consumed by the chaos and turning on his brothers.
Also have Khorne come by and sit on him.

hotsauceman1 wrote:I would first make him slowly but surely being corrupted by Tzentech. And with each time he is summoned he is closer to being consumed by the chaos and turning on his brothers.
Also have Khorne come by and sit on him.

I'm still of the school of thought that grey knights are incorruptable.

The new fluff involving purifiers is stupid ><

There's nothing wrong with it.

I really like the idea of him being trapped in the Warp, every victory he earns being meaningless. How long before he simply gives up? The Warp is the Chaos Gods playground. He's only there because they want him to be. Sooner or later, after the hundred thousandth time he's defeated the same Daemon, he'll give up. He'll sit down and say "What's the point? I'm not even banishing them from the real world. They just come straight back".

And what then?

I think Draigo could become the very first Grey Knight to fall to Chaos.

Of course, it's a bit silly that he comes back into the real world on occasion, but how else do you make him a playable character?

Horst wrote:

I'm still of the school of thought that grey knights are incorruptable.

The new fluff involving purifiers is stupid ><

I don't mind it. To some Grey Knights, the temptations of the dark gods are a very real concern that occupies much of their time and willpower. Only through a continuous and concentrated effort do they resist. To others, the temptation of Chaos fall on deaf ears. These are the purifiers.

It's like anything in life. For some people, doing the "right thing" takes a lot of willpower. For others, it's just natural.

Kaldor wrote:There's nothing wrong with it.

That's fething right.

I want you to try to imagine the most badass cover to a metal album ever conceived of. That is Kaldor Draigo.

Complaining about Kaldor Draigo is like complaining about Doomrider. If you don't know who that is or don't understand what I mean then ... man, I just don't know. Maybe you're too cool to be playing with toy soldiers.

Easy fix.

There is no Draigo. He is a mythical character whose stories are told to new GKs to inspire them to achieve greatness.

DeffDred wrote:He is a mythical character whose stories are told to new GKs to inspire them to achieve greatness.

That's not going to work for people who misunderstand 40k, er, I mean, hate the Draigo fluff. You see, they think the story itself is absolutely ridiculous. So if GK actually pass that kind of story around themselves and see it as inspirational then that makes the GK ridiculous.

Wasn't that already the case with the new fluff?

And point proven.

Kaldor wrote:There's nothing wrong with it.

This. I've never understood why it's so incomprehensible that a guy who's the best of the best of the Imperium's Daemonhunters, a guy whose mere presence is painful to daemons, his very bones etched with anti-demonic wards, managed to banish a daemon Primarch who'd just gone to town beating the previous Supreme Grand Master to death. It'd stand to reason that fighting two guys (the best two) whose very reason to exist is to make you as miserable as possible would weaken you quite a bit. I don't ever see anyone complaining that Khârn's fluff is a bit OTT (Which, let's face it, it is. Love the guy though), despite him killing everything in his way and then some. Is it just some sort of irrational hatred against "good" (very arguably) heroes being as strong (or silly, you choose) as some of their evil counterparts? Is it just "it's new therefore it sucks"? Is it something I've missed completely?

I've never understood why it's so incomprehensible that a guy who can just hurrrr his way through everything Chaos throws at him is laem.

A bottle full of whiteout is the best start, and from there build up a create something new,
WE can rebuild him
Stronger, Faster, Tougher, for he shall be named EMPRAH...
But in all serious just give him a good background not over the top a he is set to go.

BlaxicanX wrote:I've never understood why it's so incomprehensible that a guy who can just hurrrr his way through everything Chaos throws at him is laem.

The same way that Khârn "hurrs" his way through everything? Or Ghazghkull? The difference being, of course, that Khârn actually kills stuff, instead of having his work undone with ease.

Why is it that everytime the Imperium has someone that's good enough to take on a major enemy one on one it's reviled like hell (Mephiston, Calgar, Draigo, Tigurius), but when some non-Imperium dude does something equally ridiculous (Ghazghkull, Swarmlord, fething Maugan Ra not to mention Eldrad) it's generally ignored?

I wish his backstory got fleshed out, and he was that kid who the Grey Knights found in the torn up commune in a short story in the back of an old WD (the daemonhunters one I think, with DH v Eldar battle report). I loved that story, and it would fit Draigo I think

motyak wrote:I wish his backstory got fleshed out, and he was that kid who the Grey Knights found in the torn up commune in a short story in the back of an old WD (the daemonhunters one I think, with DH v Eldar battle report). I loved that story, and it would fit Draigo I think

That I can agree with.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

BlaxicanX wrote:I've never understood why it's so incomprehensible that a guy who can just hurrrr his way through everything Chaos throws at him is laem.

The same way that Khârn "hurrs" his way through everything? Or Ghazghkull? The difference being, of course, that Khârn actually kills stuff, instead of having his work undone with ease.

Why is it that everytime the Imperium has someone that's good enough to take on a major enemy one on one it's reviled like hell (Mephiston, Calgar, Draigo, Tigurius), but when some non-Imperium dude does something equally ridiculous (Ghazghkull, Swarmlord, fething Maugan Ra not to mention Eldrad) it's generally ignored?

Easy

Ghazghull: universally liked (pretty much) as his fluff is both cool and fits the fluff nicely,
Swarmlord: Also fits the fluff nicely as the big daddy superbug in a race of superbugs
Maugan ra: Again fits the fluff AND cut a trygon in half with his axe.. awsome
Eldrad: once again fluff doeth fit well with the rest of 40k
Kharn: This guy rocks the casbar... nuff said

Draigo: A primarch.. really? a bloody Deamon primarch??? walks though the warp fighting unlimited deamons.. um ok, oh and he isnt a spirit going through the warp that would disipate his corporial boby into itty bitty ickle bits of .. well nothing, he is alive and walking around..in the warp.

So basically Draigos fluff breaks a bunch of the main themes of 40k, just so matt ward could have a special little snow flake.

motyak wrote:I wish his backstory got fleshed out, and he was that kid who the Grey Knights found in the torn up commune in a short story in the back of an old WD (the daemonhunters one I think, with DH v Eldar battle report). I loved that story, and it would fit Draigo I think

Agreed. He simply needs to have some characterization other than being the greatest Grey Knight that every lived. As it stands, we know of some things that he did, but not much about him personally. Maybe Black Library will give us a book that expands on him and gives him some deep, personal struggles he must face while being trapped within the Warp.

Formosa wrote:

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

BlaxicanX wrote:I've never understood why it's so incomprehensible that a guy who can just hurrrr his way through everything Chaos throws at him is laem.

The same way that Khârn "hurrs" his way through everything? Or Ghazghkull? The difference being, of course, that Khârn actually kills stuff, instead of having his work undone with ease.

Why is it that everytime the Imperium has someone that's good enough to take on a major enemy one on one it's reviled like hell (Mephiston, Calgar, Draigo, Tigurius), but when some non-Imperium dude does something equally ridiculous (Ghazghkull, Swarmlord, fething Maugan Ra not to mention Eldrad) it's generally ignored?

Easy

Ghazghull: universally liked (pretty much) as his fluff is both cool and fits the fluff nicely,
Swarmlord: Also fits the fluff nicely as the big daddy superbug in a race of superbugs
Maugan ra: Again fits the fluff AND cut a trygon in half with his axe.. awsome
Eldrad: once again fluff doeth fit well with the rest of 40k
Kharn: This guy rocks the casbar... nuff said

Draigo: A primarch.. really? a bloody Deamon primarch??? walks though the warp fighting unlimited deamons.. um ok, oh and he isnt a spirit going through the warp that would disipate his corporial boby into itty bitty ickle bits of .. well nothing, he is alive and walking around..in the warp.

So basically Draigos fluff breaks a bunch of the main themes of 40k, just so matt ward could have a special little snow flake.

The same way that Maugan Ra held back an entire Tyranid Hive Fleet from a planet BY HIMSELF? This is what I'm talking about, it's just silly that that "fits the fluff" and is "awesome", whereas the Imperial counterparts are "bad Mary Sues".

Where is that fluff about Maugan Ra? eldar codex?

BlaxicanX wrote:I've never understood why it's so incomprehensible that a guy who can just hurrrr his way through everything Chaos throws at him is laem.

It would be, but that's not what Draigo is.

After a titanic clash of forces, Draigo banished Mortarion. So what? That's pretty much exactly what happened during the first war for Armageddon and no one complains about that.

Later, Draigo was trapped in the Warp, where he is a toy for the Chaos gods. You think they couldn't just disintegrate him if they wanted? Of course they could.

But they don't want to. They have all eternity to make him repeat the same battles over and over, and see just how long it takes for his will to break.

I think a lot of the problem stems from its fanboy nature, if it had been written a little less, exuberant shall we say, with a little more thought into its execution, it would be fine.

This is the case with the codex itself in my opinion, a little more time providing a better explanation and half the hatred towards it wouldn't have happened.

It's reviled because it's relatively new. In nine years, kids will think Draigo is awesome and talk about Fifth Edition was a golden age for 40k.

Manchu wrote:It's reviled because it's relatively new. In nine years, kids will think Draigo is awesome and talk about Fifth Edition was a golden age for 40k.

Totally, new kid's will all be GK fanboys just because of him ,btw ALL the epic-great characters have other side of the coin( read :weaknesses or stupidity ) even the meatbag Emperor when he was almost snuffed by a world biggest ork and was outdrinked by Russ:-)
But Draigo would probably outdrink Russ and fart a psykic storm which would kill all of Khorne's bloodthirsters.....

DarthMarko wrote:

Manchu wrote:It's reviled because it's relatively new. In nine years, kids will think Draigo is awesome and talk about Fifth Edition was a golden age for 40k.

Totally, new kid's will all be GK fanboys just because of him ,btw ALL the epic-great characters have other side of the coin( read :weaknesses or stupidity ) even the meatbag Emperor when he was almost snuffed by a world biggest ork and was outdrinked by Russ:-)
But Draigo would probably outdrink Russ and fart a psykic storm which would kill all of Khorne's bloodthirsters.....

What's Khârn's bad side? Maugan Ra's? Ghazghkull's? The Swarmlord's? And that's not even including the fact that all Draigo ever does in the Warp is completely pointless.

MarkyMark wrote:Where is that fluff about Maugan Ra? eldar codex?

Tyranid 5th edition.

What's Khârn's bad side?

Uh..I can't think of any, I mean he dies occasionally, get's brought back, shattered two entire legions by himself in one battle..

Kharn was owned by Loken ( it was hersey I know, but still )
and how can you like a guy who has no flaws?

I think if we look at the facts of Draigo story, it's not that bad, or as over the top as any other champion.
I mean he is suppose to be the greatest master of the Grey Knights, who are like space marines on steroids with psychic powers and the best possible armament that the imperium can provide.

My problem with it is the way its written. It really feels like ward was trying really hard, to hard actualy, to make us see how good Draigo is.
If it was written in a more neutral, more unbiased style, I honestly think I would have enjoyed the read.

Well thats my 2 cents anyway. We just have to remeber Ward isn't an exelent writer. He has lots of ideas, but he has trouble putting them down on papper.
He will get better, with practise.
And in any case, you can't play 40k and enjoy the fluff, and moan about something being ott.
Thats like saying I LIKE ICECREAM, but this one is to cold.