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title says it all, I'm thinking of making some counts as cult troops to ally with my necons, but I'd like to know which one to use. I've got four ideas for specialist necrons that I could use to represent them:

the Keel Haulers: necrons with barnacles on them, used as plague marines.

Rackham's raiders: vain necron women who failed to become sirens (see my blog for that), used noise marines.

Mess #4: someone forgot to serve the oil, and they're pissed about it, used as berserkers.

the Tell No Tales Brigade: a group of necrons who've removed their voice boxes and are close with the crypteks, used as TS.

so which one should I use? anyone with more experience with chaos have any ideas?

I would imagine with the general lack of CC options berserkers would be quite useful, but I don't play necrons and this is also quite dependent on your list.

Plagues are the best cult troop imho.

Take them and 2 plasma or 2 melta and you're rocking!

Just so you know. Cult units only become troops when you take approriate HQ in a PRIMARY detachment. Otherwise they will be elites.
You could build some little robot things as cultists? I'd say bezerkers though.

 lunarman wrote:
Plagues are the best cult troop imho.

Take them and 2 plasma or 2 melta and you're rocking!

Take the plasma, Necrons have a ton of anti-tank options, but are sorely lacking in decent AP2 shooting.

Ajroo wrote:
Just so you know. Cult units only become troops when you take approriate HQ in a PRIMARY detachment. Otherwise they will be elites.
You could build some little robot things as cultists? I'd say bezerkers though.

well crap, at least the way I built the models they could also be used as warriors. I guess I'll find something else to ally with.

As said, cult marines cannot become troops when used as allies.

Also, allying something else with nercons? Have you no shame?

 yeri wrote:

Ajroo wrote:
Just so you know. Cult units only become troops when you take approriate HQ in a PRIMARY detachment. Otherwise they will be elites.
You could build some little robot things as cultists? I'd say bezerkers though.

well crap, at least the way I built the models they could also be used as warriors. I guess I'll find something else to ally with.

It is upsetting, however you can take Generic CSM with a mark.

Thats true, csm are a good choice especially slaaneshi feel no pain tying in with re-animation quite well. But they lack the fearless they would need to be the awesome countercharge unit. Stick to wraiths.

I still don't get the fixation with allying Necrons and CSMs around here; they do not gel together and play pretty much as two separate armies, in order words, a bad idea.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
I still don't get the fixation with allying Necrons and CSMs around here; they do not gel together and play pretty much as two separate armies, in order words, a bad idea.

http://www.theruleslawyers.com/2012/10/building-the-case-giantkillers-chaos-space-marines-with-necron-allies-at-1850/

this list looks rather solid though

I could see a cool conversion for the Flayed Lord as a count as Kharne or Khorne Lord with FO's as berserkers.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
I still don't get the fixation with allying Necrons and CSMs around here; they do not gel together and play pretty much as two separate armies, in order words, a bad idea.

honestly it was because when I was coming up with names and themes for my four warrior squads by chance or by the hand of a greater power they each had a theme corresponding to one of the cult troops. thus an idea was born.

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
I still don't get the fixation with allying Necrons and CSMs around here; they do not gel together and play pretty much as two separate armies, in order words, a bad idea.

http://www.theruleslawyers.com/2012/10/building-the-case-giantkillers-chaos-space-marines-with-necron-allies-at-1850/

this list looks rather solid though

It's not bad, but I'd say it's mediocre at best. There is a good bit of overlap between the two detachments, and I've seen several better lists as pure CSM (not to mention that all pure Necron are probably better).

Funnily enough though, I've seen this list before. Either here or on Warseer someone was flaunting it as their own; exact copy/paste job of the list; the explanations weren't posted with it though.

Ajroo wrote:
Just so you know. Cult units only become troops when you take approriate HQ in a PRIMARY detachment. Otherwise they will be elites.
You could build some little robot things as cultists? I'd say bezerkers though.

But that's not a big deal since the ally detachment must include an HQ. I'd go for a Sorcerer w/ MoN and Plague Marines, the toughest of the Cult troops.

 wuestenfux wrote:

Ajroo wrote:
Just so you know. Cult units only become troops when you take approriate HQ in a PRIMARY detachment. Otherwise they will be elites.
You could build some little robot things as cultists? I'd say bezerkers though.

But that's not a big deal since the ally detachment must include an HQ. I'd go for a Sorcerer w/ MoN and Plague Marines, the toughest of the Cult troops.

Sorry but it won't work as a sorceror only unlocks thousand sons, also it only work in a PRIMARY detachment. Not allied detachment.

I think that if I were going to go Necrons with CSM it would be along the lines of

Typhus

4 x 15 Cultists(or there abouts)

3 Hell Drakes with Bale Flamers

Destroyer Lord (with scythe and weave)

6 Wraiths (3 Whip Coils)

2 x 5 Warriors in Scythes

5 Deathmarks in Night Scythe

Aegis Defense line w/ Quad Gun.

I personally find hell drakes to be a horrific waste of points. The doomscythes are far more desirable, IMO.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
I personally find hell drakes to be a horrific waste of points. The doomscythes are far more desirable, IMO.

The Doom Scythe doesn't have the ability to mop up any infantry other than TEQ as quickly, nor can it swing out at another target first in the movement phase. The Heldrake is also harder to kill and cheaper.

Tesla destructors and death rays have been carving up hordes just fine for me.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
Tesla destructors and death rays have been carving up hordes just fine for me.

Hordes are easy, MEQ not so much. The Death Ray should only be getting about 4 models against an even half-decent opponent anyway.

And up to twelve models from the destructor and average about 6. That's still around 4-5 models at inv/cover saves only, and 6 str7 wounds at Armour. The death ray kills more with hordes at ap1 and on meq armies they average 10 wounds which is usually a squad. Almost always forces a morale check, or decimates the unit.

I can see great synergy with berzerkers (ok, marked csm with icon of wrath) and imotekh's night fighting to get them over safely.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
And up to twelve models from the destructor and average about 6. That's still around 4-5 models at inv/cover saves only, and 6 str7 wounds at Armour. The death ray kills more with hordes at ap1 and on meq armies they average 10 wounds which is usually a squad. Almost always forces a morale check, or decimates the unit.

Destructor hits 5.5 on average, that's 4.6 wounds, and 1.5 Marines dead. The Death Ray takes another 3.3 in the open, or 2.2 in the open, meaning 3.7 - 4.8 Marines. Even at 2" spacing the Drake gets 5 n its flame meaning 4.2 Marines dead regardless of cover. So in the open the Doom Scythe wins out, but no Marine player is going to get caught in the open when there's one of those flying around. So given the cheaper points cost and much better resilience, the Drake wins out.

As for where you got the idea that the Doom Scythe averages 10 wounds I have no idea, but it is bizarre; between both guns it averages 9 hits, so it can't possibly average 10 wounds.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 NecronLord3 wrote:
And up to twelve models from the destructor and average about 6. That's still around 4-5 models at inv/cover saves only, and 6 str7 wounds at Armour. The death ray kills more with hordes at ap1 and on meq armies they average 10 wounds which is usually a squad. Almost always forces a morale check, or decimates the unit.

Destructor hits 5.5 on average, that's 4.6 wounds, and 1.5 Marines dead. The Death Ray takes another 3.3 in the open, or 2.2 in the open, meaning 3.7 - 4.8 Marines. Even at 2" spacing the Drake gets 5 n its flame meaning 4.2 Marines dead regardless of cover. So in the open the Doom Scythe wins out, but no Marine player is going to get caught in the open when there's one of those flying around. So given the cheaper points cost and much better resilience, the Drake wins out.

As for where you got the idea that the Doom Scythe averages 10 wounds I have no idea, but it is bizarre; between both guns it averages 9 hits, so it can't possibly average 10 wounds.

It wounds most models on 2s. I round up as I play 40k not math hammer. Practical use of the doomscythe against everyone except daemons, has proven its effectiveness to me. Ther is no way for you to math hammer the Death ray as it has a variable length and squad sizes and placement vary, not to mention its ability to pivot 360 from point of origin. I generally hit and wound 3-5 models with the doom scythe against mea. Hordes upward of 7-11 and or multiple units.

NecronLord3 wrote:It wounds most models on 2s. I round up as I play 40k not math hammer.

Oh right, you are one of those people

NecronLord3 wrote:Ther is no way for you to math hammer the Death ray as it has a variable length and squad sizes and placement vary, not to mention its ability to pivot 360 from point of origin.

Yes you can mathhammer it; 3D6 has an average length, and you make the assumption of playing against a decent player, thus they space their models out as much as possible.

NecronLord3 wrote:I generally hit and wound 3-5 models with the doom scythe against mea. Hordes upward of 7-11 and or multiple units.

Even without mathhammer, it you generally hit 3-5 and sometimes hit 7-11, that doesn't make you average 10.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

NecronLord3 wrote:I generally hit and wound 3-5 models with the doom scythe against mea. Hordes upward of 7-11 and or multiple units.

Even without mathhammer, it you generally hit 3-5 and sometimes hit 7-11, that doesn't make you average 10.

I was referring to the Death Ray portion of the doomscythe. And you can insult the "decent" players at my venue. However using terrain, after effects of assaults, moving through ruins, fortifications, deep strikeing, etc. does not give players optimal placement to spread out in the ideal fashion you are suggesting. In a vaccum your theory may be sound, with practical implementation it is far more successful than you are giving it credit for and we haven't even discussed the Arc portion of the tesla destructor's rules. Hordes are very popular and effective in 6th edition, the Doom Scythe's damage potential goes up considerably against against Horde units. The Helldrake can only ever wound what it fits under the template or vector strikes regardless if MEQs or not.

That idea could work if you make your primary detachment the CSM army... and the allies are the Necrons.

I juste made a list with a CSM Lord with the MoN leading 2 Plague Marine squad in rhinos ~600 pts allied to ~1400 pts of Necron allies...

The warlord would be the Chaos Lord wich suit me fine because the chaos warlord traits are better than the BRB ones... even if my allies can't use it...

Any chance of working ?

The Heldrake is better than the Doomscythe. Use your mass gauss and other weaponry to crack vehicles. Force clumped deployment and watch the St 6, AP3 mop up.

I'm much more fearful for killing my stuff outright versus a variable length St10, AP1 line that I get cover saves.

I'd not use ANY cult troops. Spam 13pt marines for bodies. You just want the T4, 3+ armor save and some bolter action. Maybe give them a CC.

Proxy wrote:
That idea could work if you make your primary detachment the CSM army... and the allies are the Necrons.

I juste made a list with a CSM Lord with the MoN leading 2 Plague Marine squad in rhinos ~600 pts allied to ~1400 pts of Necron allies...

The warlord would be the Chaos Lord wich suit me fine because the chaos warlord traits are better than the BRB ones... even if my allies can't use it...

Any chance of working ?

hey that's not a half bad idea.