Teen kills little sister with wrestling moves

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**hotsauceman1**

And people wonder why i hate wrestling. It causes kids to imitate....
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/8815418/Teen-kills-sister-with-WWE-moves

A 13-year-old boy in the US has been charged with second-degree murder in the death of his 5-year-old half-sister after investigators said he told them he repeatedly struck her with wrestling moves imitated from TV.

"The 13-year-old reported he started to wrestle with the victim and practised WWE [World Wrestling Entertainment] style wrestling moves on the 5-year-old," Colonel John Fortunato of the Jefferson Parish Sheriff's Office in New Orleans said.

Those moves allegedly included repeatedly slamming the girl on a bed, punching her in the stomach, jumping on her and striking her with his elbow.

Devalon Armstrong inflicted several injuries upon the girl, Viloude Louis, including broken ribs, internal bleeding and a lacerated liver, Fortunato said.

In a statement WWE offered condolences to the victim's family but cautioned against attributing the death to its industry.

"Authorities have already charged the accused with second-degree murder and determined that this was not an accidental death due to a wrestling move," the organisation said.

"As in similar cases, criminal intent to harm and a lack of parental supervision have been the factors resulting in a tragic death."

The boy had been left to babysit the girl by his stepmother when the alleged beating occurred, authorities said.

After the beating, the girl later complained of a stomach ache. When she stopped breathing, the boy called 911. Emergency crews could not revive her and she was pronounced dead at a hospital.

The boy was taken to a juvenile facility and booked on a second-degree murder arrest warrant after he was interviewed by homicide Detective Matt Vasquez.

The detective said the boy told him that he knew the wrestling moves on TV were fake, but he was smiling and appeared to enjoy talking about them.

"The 13-year-old continued by saying the victim complained that she was hurting, but he continued to slam, punch and elbow her for an additional two or three minutes, stopping when his mother called him on the phone to check on he and the victim," sheriff's officials said in the news release.

....Nevermind, this kid sounds like a psychopath

**Sir Pseudonymous**

"Authorities have already charged the accused with second-degree murder and determined that this was not an accidental death due to a wrestling move," the organisation said.

I don't think they quite understand what "second-degree murder" means. Or else they're hoping their audience doesn't.

**TheCustomLime**

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
"Authorities have already charged the accused with second-degree murder and determined that this was not an accidental death due to a wrestling move," the organisation said.

I don't think they quite understand what "second-degree murder" means. Or else they're hoping their audience doesn't.

According to google, it's a murder that isn't planned basically. It can be a murder that is the result of an assault, like in this case. It's used correctly.

Awful, awful story. That boy has serious issues.

**Sir Pseudonymous**

TheCustomLime wrote:
Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
"Authorities have already charged the accused with second-degree murder and determined that this was not an accidental death due to a wrestling move," the organisation said.

I don't think they quite understand what "second-degree murder" means. Or else they're hoping their audience doesn't.

According to google, it's a murder that isn't planned basically. It can be a murder that is the result of an assault, like in this case. It's used correctly.

That was my point. "An accidental death due to a wrestling move" (which this is) is second-degree murder. The WWE is either completely clueless or explicitly lying in the hopes their audience doesn't know enough to realize it.

**Peregrine**

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
That was my point. "An accidental death due to a wrestling move" (which this is) is second-degree murder. The WWE is either completely clueless or explicitly lying in the hopes their audience doesn't know enough to realize it.

Second-degree murder can be the result of an assault. A wrestling move is not an assault. This isn't a wrestling match that ended with a horrible accident, it's a deliberate beating.

**Breotan**

Law & Order SVU had a recent episode about a sociopath child who was becoming an imminent threat to his family. In the episode, the parents were in denial about the warning signs. I wonder if that was the case here, too.

**Sigvatr**

Well, there is only ONE logical consequence:

BAN WRESTLING! IT KILLS OUR CHILDREN!

**xole**

Creeeepy. Completely unrelated but reminds of that thrill killer who killed her younger neighbor.

@Breotan we all see what we want to see. I can understand if the parents didn't see something coming. And sociopathy is sort of hard to spot in children because they tend to be a little evil in the first place.

**Sir Pseudonymous**

Peregrine wrote:

Second-degree murder can be the result of an assault. A wrestling move is not an assault.

You're right, it's battery, not assault. I never mentioned assault though?

This isn't a wrestling match that ended with a horrible accident, it's a deliberate beating.

He's charged with second-degree murder, which is accidental death caused by negligent behavior or violence which lacked intent to kill, such as inflicting injury that later proves fatal, but which the perpetrator did not intend to be fatal.

I'm not sure what exactly you're contesting here; the beating consisted of imitations of wrestling moves; according to the charges law enforcement doesn't believe there was intent to kill ; "an accidental death due to a wrestling move," to use the WWE's words, describes the situation, if in somewhat lighter terms than appropriate.

I'm not going to say the WWE is culpable, because that would be insane, but I am criticizing the specifics of how they're trying to distance themselves from it. "This is second-degree murder not *describes situation accurately and in words that aren't a contradiction of 'second-degree murder'*"

**SagesStone**

Don't they advise people not to try what they see at home anyway? That alone is usually enough to keep the blame off of them, the apology isn't really required but is obviously (as obvious as the sun rising) there for PR. I think it's more the parents than the TV. It's up to them to make sure they know it's not right to do, not some company.

**Peregrine**

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
You're right, it's battery, not assault. I never mentioned assault though?

And a wrestling match isn't battery.

He's charged with second-degree murder, which is accidental death caused by negligent behavior or violence which lacked intent to kill, such as inflicting injury that later proves fatal, but which the perpetrator did not intend to be fatal.

Exactly: the kid didn't intend to kill his sister, he just tried to beat her. That's a deliberate beating against a helpless victim. That is NOT the same thing as an accidental death due to a wrestling move, which would be something more like two kids (of comparable size/age) wrestling and one of them accidentally doing something wrong and killing the other.

I'm not sure what exactly you're contesting here; the beating consisted of imitations of wrestling moves;

Beating using wrestling moves =/= accidental death due to wrestling.

I'm not going to say the WWE is culpable, because that would be insane, but I am criticizing the specifics of how they're trying to distance themselves from it.

They're entirely correct in distancing themselves from it like that. "Accidental death due to a wrestling move" suggests a case of kids playing around and wrestling being a dangerous activity, when what really happened is a deliberate beating. It's the equivalent of a car company distancing themselves from an "accidental death due to driving" which just happened to involve the driver deliberately running over the victim.

**TheCustomLime**

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
TheCustomLime wrote:
Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
"Authorities have already charged the accused with second-degree murder and determined that this was not an accidental death due to a wrestling move," the organisation said.

I don't think they quite understand what "second-degree murder" means. Or else they're hoping their audience doesn't.

According to google, it's a murder that isn't planned basically. It can be a murder that is the result of an assault, like in this case. It's used correctly.

That was my point. "An accidental death due to a wrestling move" (which this is) is second-degree murder. The WWE is either completely clueless or explicitly lying in the hopes their audience doesn't know enough to realize it.

Oh, misread ya. It's probably the latter given how much bad press they could get from this incident.

**snurl**

Was this a Steel Cage match?

**Sir Pseudonymous**

Peregrine wrote:
snip

Just bothered to look at your username and realize who I was talking to; oh hi Peregrine, I've missed bickering about overly literal minutiae with you <3

I'm still not sure what we're arguing about though. Second-degree murder charges for an accidental death resulting from a beating consisting of imitation wrestling moves. None of that contradicts what I said.

**Peregrine**

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
I'm still not sure what we're arguing about though. Second-degree murder charges for an accidental death resulting from a beating consisting of imitation wrestling moves. None of that contradicts what I said.

What it contradicts is your claim about the WWE's response being inappropriate. It isn't, because it corrects the mistaken impression people get when they hear "accidental death involving a wrestling move". Most people who hear just that summary would imagine a case of kids playing around and one of them getting hurt in a tragic accident. And then many of them would assume that wrestling is a dangerous activity and potentially blame wrestling entertainment for giving kids bad ideas. The WWE statement justifiably points out that this was actually a deliberate beating of a helpless victim involving second-degree murder charges, a very different scenario.

**Howard A Treesong**

I think people are jumping to conclusions about the kid being a sociopath or it being a 'deliberate beating'. Well it was deliberate but not necessarily malicious. Some kids are just dumb, they don't relate cause and effect well and can't understand the consequences of their actions. The 13 year old was probably getting carried away and didn't understand the difference between his size and the 5 year old. Sounds obvious to adults but some children really aren't that smart.

**Super Ready**

n0t_u wrote:
I think it's more the parents than the TV. It's up to them to make sure they know it's not right to do, not some company.

Agreed. Blaming wrestling is the same knee-jerk reaction as trying to blame violence on video games, TV, movies, and music. It couldn't possibly be irresponsibility by human beings!

Now, I do think the over-hammed soap opera TV version of wrestling is stupid, but that's for another thread.

**Soladrin**

Pretty obvious from the interview that the kid was a grade A psychopath.

There is only one logical course of action:

Kill all the children.

Wait...

**CthuluIsSpy**

Soladrin wrote:
Pretty obvious from the interview that the kid was a grade A psychopath.

There is only one logical course of action:

Kill all the children.

Wait...

I for support the development of fast ageing technology.

I also welcome our new Observer overlords.

If you get the reference, you may have a cookie.

**Super Ready**

Hmm. Was going to say Half Life 2's Administrator Breen... but I think he himself was a reference too.
Logan's Run?

**Seaward**

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:
He's charged with second-degree murder, which is accidental death caused by negligent behavior or violence which lacked intent to kill, such as inflicting injury that later proves fatal, but which the perpetrator did not intend to be fatal.

Uh, no. That'd be manslaughter.

The difference between first and second degree murder is simply that first degree murder is planned with malice aforethought, and second degree is spur-of-the-moment.

**SlaveToDorkness**

Howard A Treesong wrote:
I think people are jumping to conclusions about the kid being a sociopath or it being a 'deliberate beating'. Well it was deliberate but not necessarily malicious. Some kids are just dumb, they don't relate cause and effect well and can't understand the consequences of their actions. The 13 year old was probably getting carried away and didn't understand the difference between his size and the 5 year old. Sounds obvious to adults but some children really aren't that smart.

So he really should spend the rest of his life in a facility designed to care for individuals too dumb to realize the consequences of their own actions.

**CthuluIsSpy**

Super Ready wrote:
Hmm. Was going to say Half Life 2's Administrator Breen... but I think he himself was a reference too.
Logan's Run?

Nope. Fringe, actually.

There's a race called the Observers who use time manipulation to quickly grow their children to adulthood in a matter of seconds.

They were the only race I could think of that does that sort of thing.

**Krellnus**

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Super Ready wrote:
Hmm. Was going to say Half Life 2's Administrator Breen... but I think he himself was a reference too.
Logan's Run?

Nope. Fringe, actually.

There's a race called the Observers who use time manipulation to quickly grow their children to adulthood in a matter of seconds.

They were the only race I could think of that does that sort of thing.

No wonder no-one got the reference, that show is more lost than, well, LOST.

OT: I have to agree that wrestling itself is not to blame, but whether it is malicious enough to warrant a 2nd degree murder charge, I cannot say.

**kronk**

SlaveToDorkness wrote:

So he really should spend the rest of his life in a facility designed to care for individuals too dumb to realize the consequences of their own actions.

I'm fine with that. If he's too dumb to keep from hurting people, then he should be put in a place where he can't hurt anyone.

**Morathi's Darkest Sin**

Aye, this kid had issues. WWE now pretty much does all it can in regard with this issue, at least one, if not two side reals per episode by the highest profile stars, faces or heels telling folks not to copy the moves at home.
At some point parents have to be responsible.

My two eldest boys watch wrestling, but they also both know if I ever see them copying the moves they'll be sent to the wall for thirty minutes and banned from watching wrestling for the rest of the year, with the warning maybe you'll be able to control yourselves better a year older. They've not broken the rule yet and the oldest lad has watched it now for two years off and on.

**SoloFalcon1138**

Psychopath is not applicable here. He wouldn't have called 911 evem out of fear of getting caught. The kid is 13 and is left unattended by his stepmother. Obviously, family ties is just an old TV show to them.

The kid surpassed his limits physically with regards to a 5 year old. The stepmom shouldn't have been parenting via phone. Second-degree murder will likely get dropped to manslaughter and he'll be in prison til he's 18. I want to see the parents get slapped with neglect charges.

**CthuluIsSpy**

Krellnus wrote:
CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Super Ready wrote:
Hmm. Was going to say Half Life 2's Administrator Breen... but I think he himself was a reference too.
Logan's Run?

Nope. Fringe, actually.

There's a race called the Observers who use time manipulation to quickly grow their children to adulthood in a matter of seconds.

They were the only race I could think of that does that sort of thing.

No wonder no-one got the reference, that show is more lost than, well, LOST.

OT: I have to agree that wrestling itself is not to blame, but whether it is malicious enough to warrant a 2nd degree murder charge, I cannot say.

Yeah, it's not that good. I couldn't think of a better one >.<

**chaos0xomega**

Howard A Treesong wrote:
I think people are jumping to conclusions about the kid being a sociopath or it being a 'deliberate beating'. Well it was deliberate but not necessarily malicious. Some kids are just dumb, they don't relate cause and effect well and can't understand the consequences of their actions. The 13 year old was probably getting carried away and didn't understand the difference between his size and the 5 year old. Sounds obvious to adults but some children really aren't that smart.

I remember what it was like to be a 13 year old boy (it was only 10 years ago). Even at that age I could understand the size difference between myself and a 5 year old (seriously when youre a 13 year old you feel like a giant compared to the younger kids). I also knew that wrestling was an act and that if you hit someone hard enough like they did that you could easily kill them. I used to play fight with my friends all the time, and I knew well enough that if someone said stop that meant stop and if someone said they were in pain to get an adult. I also had some REALLY dumb friends, who also understood all these things. The kid is a sociopath. The "just a child" bit doesnt work, if he was 10, maybe but at 13 he should know well enough otherwise that he killed his sister and ye shouldnt be smiling about it.

I'll also add that my parents left me home alone unsupervised/in charge of my younger brother all the time when I was that age, as did most of my friends parents. They even *shock* let us play out i the park unsupervised! I had no idea this constituted neglectful behavior, as opposed to giving your children some amount of trust and responsibility for themselves so they can hopefully grow up into productive citizens.

**MrDwhitey**

I am suffering a massive case of deja vu here. I'm certain I've heard of almost exactly the same thing (young teen kills pre teen sibling with "wrestling moves") before.

Seriously, it's bizarre.

Edit: It was probably this story: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lionel_Tate