Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The Metal Tide wrote:@anpu-adom
well if a scarab unit makes a tanks armour down to one because of entropic on any facing, the vehicle counts as wrecked

Wrecked means that the units inside (if any) are disembarked, and no flaming death happens in the area? Ok.

What if it gets destroyed by gauss shooting (after the armor has been taken down below 10, for example)? Then there is the possibility of explosions, right?

Sorry for being a Noob.

schadenfreude wrote:

The Metal Tide wrote:The question being, how many times will you be able to pull this off after your opponent has played one game against necrons and seen how dangerous scarabs are. If they had half a brain they would target scarabs if they are a tank heavy list or rely on the tanks that they have.

EDIT: spelling

I agree scarabs should be a high target priority, but multi wound swarms with the stealth universal special rule are difficult to kill.

Yeah. If they had the scout universal special rule it would make this unit very deadly. If they had it they could outflank and that would mean that to be safe a tank would have to be 19-24 inches away from the edge of the board or risk being assaulted with no chance of retaliation until the next turn. Does anyone know if scarabs have scout?

My question is, how is the C'tan entropic stike upgrade worded. Does it only effect their close combat attacks, as I imagine it would, or can it effect their ranged attacks as well. If that were the case it would make the high shot low strength ranged upgrade well worth it. IIRC 8 s4 shots that were entropic would knock about 3 armor off. That would make any other shooting much more effective, plus if your shooting at rhinos AV8 is relatively easy to pen even with s4 (well the same as missiles at av12 anyways).

Anpu-adom wrote:

The Metal Tide wrote:@anpu-adom
well if a scarab unit makes a tanks armour down to one because of entropic on any facing, the vehicle counts as wrecked

Wrecked means that the units inside (if any) are disembarked, and no flaming death happens in the area? Ok.

What if it gets destroyed by gauss shooting (after the armor has been taken down below 10, for example)? Then there is the possibility of explosions, right?

Sorry for being a Noob.

Oh I see what you mean. Something else destroyed the tank and the scarabs were next to it and caught in the explosion. well since the explosion is NOT from a blast template the vulnerable to blast rule does not apply.

The Metal Tide wrote:

Anpu-adom wrote:

The Metal Tide wrote:@anpu-adom
well if a scarab unit makes a tanks armour down to one because of entropic on any facing, the vehicle counts as wrecked

Wrecked means that the units inside (if any) are disembarked, and no flaming death happens in the area? Ok.

What if it gets destroyed by gauss shooting (after the armor has been taken down below 10, for example)? Then there is the possibility of explosions, right?

Sorry for being a Noob.

Oh I see what you mean. Something else destroyed the tank and the scarabs were next to it and caught in the explosion. well since the explosion is NOT from a blast template the vulnerable to blast rule does not apply.

RAW the scarabs would be safe. thing is if the scarabs ate the armor, AND you were able to shoot it, it means you opponent didn't move his tank, or destroy the scarabs in his turn.... probably not going to happen too often.

Has anyone considered making a CC-heavy C'tan? Imagine a C'tan with:

Time's Arrow (initiative check on 1 model before assault takes place, failure results in model being removed)
and
Gaze of Death (large blast over C'tan after combat, all models touched suffer str3 hit with no armor saves allowed and restores 1 wound to the C'tan if a model is killed, up to 1 wound, doesn't affect combat resolution)

Taken with the fact that it's WS5 S7 T7 W4 I4 A4 and has a 4+ invuln save, this thing could really hurt some SS/TH termies or a lot of the other elite close combat units out there. Plus it has the option to kill characters who fail initiative checks and even if it dies, explodes D6 inches out at str 4 ap1, further wrecking whatever defeated it.

This guy is 275 points and easily rivals Abaddon the Despoiler in damage output, and he's tougher.

liam0404 wrote:Just as a general wondering - does anyone know if the Tomb Stalker is in the codex or not?

They do get Triarch Stalkers though

LunaHound wrote:

liam0404 wrote:Just as a general wondering - does anyone know if the Tomb Stalker is in the codex or not?

They do get Triarch Stalkers though

And it makes a solid C'tan counts-as.

Mustakha the Undying wrote:Has anyone considered making a CC-heavy C'tan? Imagine a C'tan with:

Time's Arrow (initiative check on 1 model before assault takes place, failure results in model being removed)
and
Gaze of Death (large blast over C'tan after combat, all models touched suffer str3 hit with no armor saves allowed and restores 1 wound to the C'tan if a model is killed, up to 1 wound, doesn't affect combat resolution)

Taken with the fact that it's WS5 S7 T7 W4 I4 A4 and has a 4+ invuln save, this thing could really hurt some SS/TH termies or a lot of the other elite close combat units out there. Plus it has the option to kill characters who fail initiative checks and even if it dies, explodes D6 inches out at str 4 ap1, further wrecking whatever defeated it.

This guy is 275 points and easily rivals Abaddon the Despoiler in damage output, and he's tougher.

Old gaze was Str 4 with no armor saves. Loved that ability. Don't know if I like having to roll 5+ to wound meq's with it now.

tiekwando wrote:My question is, how is the C'tan entropic stike upgrade worded. Does it only effect their close combat attacks, as I imagine it would, or can it effect their ranged attacks as well. If that were the case it would make the high shot low strength ranged upgrade well worth it. IIRC 8 s4 shots that were entropic would knock about 3 armor off. That would make any other shooting much more effective, plus if your shooting at rhinos AV8 is relatively easy to pen even with s4 (well the same as missiles at av12 anyways).

Close combat attacks only.

The Metal Tide wrote:The question being, how many times will you be able to pull this off after your opponent has played one game against necrons and seen how dangerous scarabs are. If they had half a brain they would target scarabs if they are a tank heavy list or rely on the tanks that they have.

EDIT: spelling

Less shooting at your other good units then. Also, this is what night-fight is for, mitigate the shooting at the little guys.

Kevin949 wrote:

Mustakha the Undying wrote:Has anyone considered making a CC-heavy C'tan? Imagine a C'tan with:

Time's Arrow (initiative check on 1 model before assault takes place, failure results in model being removed)
and
Gaze of Death (large blast over C'tan after combat, all models touched suffer str3 hit with no armor saves allowed and restores 1 wound to the C'tan if a model is killed, up to 1 wound, doesn't affect combat resolution)

Taken with the fact that it's WS5 S7 T7 W4 I4 A4 and has a 4+ invuln save, this thing could really hurt some SS/TH termies or a lot of the other elite close combat units out there. Plus it has the option to kill characters who fail initiative checks and even if it dies, explodes D6 inches out at str 4 ap1, further wrecking whatever defeated it.

This guy is 275 points and easily rivals Abaddon the Despoiler in damage output, and he's tougher.

Old gaze was Str 4 with no armor saves. Loved that ability. Don't know if I like having to roll 5+ to wound meq's with it now.

Even a Str3 is pretty damn good for an auto-hit that ignores armour when it's going to restore a wound IMHO.

Kevin949 wrote:

Mustakha the Undying wrote:Has anyone considered making a CC-heavy C'tan? Imagine a C'tan with:

Time's Arrow (initiative check on 1 model before assault takes place, failure results in model being removed)
and
Gaze of Death (large blast over C'tan after combat, all models touched suffer str3 hit with no armor saves allowed and restores 1 wound to the C'tan if a model is killed, up to 1 wound, doesn't affect combat resolution)

Taken with the fact that it's WS5 S7 T7 W4 I4 A4 and has a 4+ invuln save, this thing could really hurt some SS/TH termies or a lot of the other elite close combat units out there. Plus it has the option to kill characters who fail initiative checks and even if it dies, explodes D6 inches out at str 4 ap1, further wrecking whatever defeated it.

This guy is 275 points and easily rivals Abaddon the Despoiler in damage output, and he's tougher.

Old gaze was Str 4 with no armor saves. Loved that ability. Don't know if I like having to roll 5+ to wound meq's with it now.

Old gaze also only worked on a 4+ against the models that weren't fully covered, which was basically all of them. It stated that specifically in the rules of the ability, therefore the updated blast markers rule in 5th ed didn't override it. This new form will ultimately net more hits and probably wounds, costs less to obtain (85 points less in fact) and restores a wound.

schadenfreude wrote:

The Metal Tide wrote:The question being, how many times will you be able to pull this off after your opponent has played one game against necrons and seen how dangerous scarabs are. If they had half a brain they would target scarabs if they are a tank heavy list or rely on the tanks that they have.

EDIT: spelling

I agree scarabs should be a high target priority, but multi wound swarms with the stealth universal special rule are difficult to kill.

People laughed at me for seeing the value of the Leman Russ Eradicator. But with S6 AP4 Large Blast that ignores Terrain, I think One or 3 may be added to my IG in the future

Mind the look and feel of the Crons is very temptings too.

Kevin949 wrote:

Mustakha the Undying wrote:Has anyone considered making a CC-heavy C'tan? Imagine a C'tan with:

Time's Arrow (initiative check on 1 model before assault takes place, failure results in model being removed)
and
Gaze of Death (large blast over C'tan after combat, all models touched suffer str3 hit with no armor saves allowed and restores 1 wound to the C'tan if a model is killed, up to 1 wound, doesn't affect combat resolution)

Taken with the fact that it's WS5 S7 T7 W4 I4 A4 and has a 4+ invuln save, this thing could really hurt some SS/TH termies or a lot of the other elite close combat units out there. Plus it has the option to kill characters who fail initiative checks and even if it dies, explodes D6 inches out at str 4 ap1, further wrecking whatever defeated it.

This guy is 275 points and easily rivals Abaddon the Despoiler in damage output, and he's tougher.

Old gaze was Str 4 with no armor saves. Loved that ability. Don't know if I like having to roll 5+ to wound meq's with it now.

Yes, but now you get wounds back, making the C'tan even harder to kill.

Mustakha the Undying wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

Mustakha the Undying wrote:Has anyone considered making a CC-heavy C'tan? Imagine a C'tan with:

Time's Arrow (initiative check on 1 model before assault takes place, failure results in model being removed)
and
Gaze of Death (large blast over C'tan after combat, all models touched suffer str3 hit with no armor saves allowed and restores 1 wound to the C'tan if a model is killed, up to 1 wound, doesn't affect combat resolution)

Taken with the fact that it's WS5 S7 T7 W4 I4 A4 and has a 4+ invuln save, this thing could really hurt some SS/TH termies or a lot of the other elite close combat units out there. Plus it has the option to kill characters who fail initiative checks and even if it dies, explodes D6 inches out at str 4 ap1, further wrecking whatever defeated it.

This guy is 275 points and easily rivals Abaddon the Despoiler in damage output, and he's tougher.

Old gaze was Str 4 with no armor saves. Loved that ability. Don't know if I like having to roll 5+ to wound meq's with it now.

Old gaze also only worked on a 4+ against the models that weren't fully covered, which was basically all of them. It stated that specifically in the rules of the ability, therefore the updated blast markers rule in 5th ed didn't override it. This new form will ultimately net more hits and probably wounds, costs less to obtain (85 points less in fact) and restores a wound.

What are you talking about "basically all of them"? I don't know who you fought against but if you had a squad in B2B with you you easily had 5+ guys getting autohit and typically 2+ only getting hit on the 4+ roll. It won't net more wounds because it's exactly the same ability minus the 4+ hit for partials but one less strength meaning more failures to wound.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Just Dave wrote:
Even a Str3 is pretty damn good for an auto-hit that ignores armour when it's going to restore a wound IMHO.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
Yes, but now you get wounds back, making the C'tan even harder to kill.

Oh I agree, but now that those str4 marines can wound your c'tan that's going to be 10-20 potential wounds that you would never have suffered previously.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

alphaomega wrote:

schadenfreude wrote:

The Metal Tide wrote:The question being, how many times will you be able to pull this off after your opponent has played one game against necrons and seen how dangerous scarabs are. If they had half a brain they would target scarabs if they are a tank heavy list or rely on the tanks that they have.

EDIT: spelling

I agree scarabs should be a high target priority, but multi wound swarms with the stealth universal special rule are difficult to kill.

People laughed at me for seeing the value of the Leman Russ Eradicator. But with S6 AP4 Large Blast that ignores Terrain, I think One or 3 may be added to my IG in the future

Mind the look and feel of the Crons is very temptings too.

I don't think it ignores terrain, it just means you don't benefit from intervening terrain between the firer and the target, if it doesn't scatter. But if you're in "area terrain" you still benefit from that regardless of the blast location. I thought only flamer templates straight ignored covered saves.

Hox wrote:

It would follow that the model he replaces gets to make his own RP roll at the end of phase?

Thoughts?

No. It says he takes control of the body, morphing it to his shape. The existing model is now him. there is no damaged necron body to be reanimated

Edit: He can even live hidden inside another necrons (including overlords), taking control when he needs to and pushing the consciousness of the other necron to the side.

Wow, that sounds really familASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL!!

Just so you know scarabs have the following rules

Vunerable to blast
Scouts
Stealth

thats for being a swarm.

aboytervigon wrote:Just so you know scarabs have the following rules

Vunerable to blast
Scouts
Stealth

thats for being a swarm.

swarm doesn't give scout. It gives stealth and Vuln. to blast/template.

aboytervigon wrote:Just so you know scarabs have the following rules

Vunerable to blast
Scouts
Stealth

thats for being a swarm.

Swarms don't have Scounts just by being swarms, at least not according to the 5th edition rulebook.

The scarabs also don't have the scouts rule.

EDIT: Sunoccard beat me to it.

I died a little inside when i read that monoliths have a crew

mcmuffin wrote:I died a little inside when i read that monoliths have a crew

What? In the fluff, or rules wise?

Stunned vehicles are not hit automatically in assault, so it won't be hit automatically from not moving for an entire other turn.

Mustakha the Undying wrote:

aboytervigon wrote:Just so you know scarabs have the following rules

Vunerable to blast
Scouts
Stealth

thats for being a swarm.

Swarms don't have Scounts just by being swarms, at least not according to the 5th edition rulebook.

The scarabs also don't have the scouts rule.

EDIT: Sunoccard beat me to it.

I died a little inside when i read that scarabs didn't have scout. I would love to have scarabs outflank but oh well

Do scarabs get fleet at least?

Mjoellnir wrote:The webway is getting really crowded, isn't it? Craftworld Eldar, Dark Eldar and now Necrons. Why still have classic battlefields? Just glue a bunch of shoeboxes together and spray the inside with weird, misty, psychedelic colours. Bam you have a battlefield where webway users can randomly meet.

That would actually be a neat idea, especially if you had some rules that represented the webway occasioanlly twisting and rearranging, like every turn you roll to identify two boxes which are swapped.

Balance wrote:

Mjoellnir wrote:The webway is getting really crowded, isn't it? Craftworld Eldar, Dark Eldar and now Necrons. Why still have classic battlefields? Just glue a bunch of shoeboxes together and spray the inside with weird, misty, psychedelic colours. Bam you have a battlefield where webway users can randomly meet.

That would actually be a neat idea, especially if you had some rules that represented the webway occasioanlly twisting and rearranging, like every turn you roll to identify two boxes which are swapped.

Yeah, that sounds like one hell of a scenario for a kill team game or campaign mission.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Do scarabs get fleet at least?

They are beasts, so yes.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Do scarabs get fleet at least?

Because they are now beasts they come with fleet

EDIT: wigwam got there first

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Do scarabs get fleet at least?

Doesn't being a beast grant fleet by default?

*edit*
answered above me.