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What-If situation:

The forces of High Marshall Helbrecht's Black Templars, Ghazghkull Thraka's orks, and Imotekh the Stormlord's necrons all run into each other. They all have vast armadas, resources, and armies and can be considered the most powerful of their respective races.

Helbrecht has sworn to kill Ghazghkull no matter the cost, hunting him across the galaxy. However he's also sworn to kill Imotekh, also no matter the cost, for cutting off his hand and wiping out a bunch of his men.

Imotekh hates Orks above all other races in the galaxy, and what is pretty much the most important ork around would raise his ire more than anything else. He also hates Helbrecht for blowing up his capital ship and trying to kill him at every turn.

Ghazghkull is an ork. His position on the matter is self-explanatory.

Who sides with who? What happens? Who ends up on top of the smoking heap?

In the end? The Eldar. This was all carefully arranged by Eldrad himself to take out some Necrons and divert a Waaagh that would have caught up a few Maiden worlds.

Well doesn't Ghazzy have the biggest army behind him by far of those three commanders? I mean Helbrecht only has one chapter of Space Marines if you don't count the entirety of the Imperium. I don't have the Necron book, but I doubt that Imotekh has more than a few star systems under his direct control. Also Ghazzy isn't exacly a pushover in personal combat. Helbrech is a masterfully skilled super human, but Ghazghull is a downright monster.

the necrons of course. The Sautekh dynasty is the biggest and most advanced of all the dynasty and with one of the greatest strategists in the galaxy (zahndrekh and imotekh great commad and work with the weather would destroy the templars and focus a full fire attack at the orks turn the two against eachother then just picking apart whats left

None of them win!

Trollzine of the Infinite lollage catches them all and adds them to his collection showing the final showdown He then invites Creed over for beer and pizza

As much as I like the black Templars, even if their whole chapter (roughly 5-10k men) were there all at once (unlikely) they would have to NOT charge blindly into combat, which, they would, and would die. then I have to go with orkz, cuz. well orkz can't lose

 Grey Templar wrote:
None of them win!

Trollzine of the Infinite lollage catches them all and adds them to his collection showing the final showdown He then invites Creed over for beer and pizza

This is the answer. Also, don't forget that Trazyn will likely have rowboat tied to the roof of his Wagon queen family truckster and one of the wolf guard from the 13th tied to the bumper.

One thing is for sure, that the templars would not side with any one, they would gladly charge into both forces at the same time if it meant wiping out two great threats at once.

Their chances of winning with this strategy? I cannot say.

If the Stormlord has his fleet present, he wins it in a landslide. That Necron fleet will wipe out the armadas of both the Templars and the Orks without breaking a sweat, and once space superiority is established, will be able to beam down reinforcements whenever and wherever Imotekh wants them. The BT and the Orks will both, separately, find themselves divided, surrounded, and shot to pieces in fairly quick order.

The Stormlord won't have his fleet present. Because orks. Before the three run into each other, he will have calculated every imaginable and logical situation that any smart being would have done, and arranged to have his entire fleet converse at that exact point he, Ghazzy, and Helbrecht run into each other. It will be a masterful strategy of epic proportions that he would have won hands down, eliminating both his enemies.

Except Ghazzy would do something absolutely RIDICULOUS, resulting in the Stormlord finding himself somehow stuck with only a small fraction of his fleet just as Helbrecht and Ghazzy coincidentally converge on his location in the boondocks of nowhere, the various circumstances and events leading up to it so ridiculously stupid that Imhotek's still not sure how it happened, only that it's all Ghazzy's fault. Damn orks.


(for those who don't know, Imhotek is specifically stated to have his strategies ruined by Ork stupidity and even has a tabletop initiative-seizing rule that gets nullified if he's fighting orks)

Stormlord has more infantry and star fleets under his control (Having a hundred Tomb Worlds under his command, and Tomb Worlds individually are said to house "billions" of Necrons), is by far the superior general (Considered to be one of the top candidates for the most brilliant the galaxy has ever even seen), and as Psienesis addressed Imotekh would easily control the air. Were it to become a matter of single combat, we already know that Imotekh has Helbrecht's number in single combat, he's already beaten him. I have doubts that he could defeat Ghazghkuull though.

The only X factor is Imotekh's stated weakness to Orks, but that is mitigated both by Imotekh's considerable starting advantages, and the fact that Ghaz has the BT to deal with as well.

Its a game of Rock, Paper, Scissors, fire.

Imotehk outsmarts Helbrecht and is Scissors

Helbrecht outsmarts Ghazzy. He is paper.

Ghazzy confundles Imotehk's logic engines. He is rock.

And CREEEEEEDDDD!!! is fire!

 Bonde wrote:
I don't have the Necron book, but I doubt that Imotekh has more than a few star systems under his direct control.

Imotekh controls eighty tombworlds and has four hundred other alien worlds under his thumb. His forces are probably the greatest, but I suppose it probably just depends how many Orks happen to be in the area at the time.

Ghazghkull commands a Giga-Waaagh of combined waaaghs, his chiefs are full blown warbosses in their own rights, he's got a sizeable chunk of the imperium funneled at the Armageddon system. We talking about 20 chapters of marines, 8 titan legions, more regiments of imp guard than can be counted...


If Ghazghkull isn't stopped, if he continues to grow and dominate, his army will just increase daily.

I don't think Imotekh's armies come remotely close to what Ghaz can muster.

Helbrecht and co are going to be a nasty stain on the carpet.


This belongs to the Beast of Armageddon.

As much as I like Templars (Zerg rush of angry germans?! yes please!) I would think that Ghazy would roflstomp the Necrons on land, but it all depends on the (boring) matter of space warfare. Due to the whole "Stormlord is bad at randomness" deal, I would say that the Necrons would be decimating the templars on land and void, yet when all seems lost a huge green tide of football fans stampede in.
After that, Templars would probably come out on top because, y'know. Space Marines.

I'd say Ghaz, because even Imotekh can't predict the orks, and Ghaz is a very, very smart ork. Ghaz could personally smash either of them, and quite likely at the same time. BT wont win because, believe it or not, they are the worst tactical army of the three! Yes, charge the Gargent! Krak grenades ready! *Booom, Belly Gun*. Also its quite likely that someone will use the lasy writing technique of ''Warp drive explodes, creates massive portal which sucks in all of the other fleets''. If it was Necrons VS BT then Necrons would win hands down, but orks add a random factor, necrons don't improvise well.

Going with the those big o'l Greenskins....Orky goodness

Like I said, no matter the outcome, the Eldar win.

The Eldar have their asses firmly planted on the worf train.

They've been losing for the past ten thousand years.

Well, how I imagine it going down is something along the following lines.

- if all three fleets come to a head then the battle will be fought and decided in space, this gives Necrons a starting advantage

- both Helbrecht and Imotekh know this, while Ghazzy's too busy praising Gork & Mork for such a juicy opportunity to crack so many skulls to care

- Helbrecht would normally be more than happy to butt heads with either Ghazzy or Imotekh, he's just as comfortable at the head of a fleet as planetside, but both at the same time... that's a problem

- similarly, Imotekh figures that, even with a ship-for-ship advantage, getting up close and personal with both the cc-proficient greenskins and Templars could get very, very messy and for this reason he plays a defensive early game, using his fleet advantage to do as much damage as possible at range while the other two knock chunks out of each other

- Helbrecht has to make a tough decision, he wants to kill Ghazzy, but he also wants Imotekh, either way, he wants - no, needs - to see them die. He can make sure he gets a kill if he throws everything into the attack... but only against one, not both. He chooses Ghazzy, because a) he (from what I know) hates him probably more than any other being in the Galaxy and b) figures his fleet has a better chance of pulling off the suicide run against the Ork fleet over the Necrons

- Ghazzy... well, like the OP said, he's an Ork, so his play is pretty self explanatory - full charge against both enemy fleets!

Therefore:
1) Orks charge in against the other two and start smashing stuff
2) Imotekh holds back and uses his superior fleet to keep the charging Orks at bay
3) Helbrecht charges the Templar fleet straight for the greenskin's heart - Ghazghkull's flagship
4) Helbrecht boards, duels and slays Ghazghkull once and for all, sacrificing himself and breaking the Templars to do it
5) The remaining Templars, their deed done, fight bitterly to the last marine, taking untold greenskins down with them
6) Ork numbers start to outweigh Necron ship advantage as the latter close the gap and focus fully on Imotekh's forces
7) With both Helbrecht and Ghazzy dead, and the remaining Orks rampaging insanly through his fleet, Imotekh breaks off the engagement and departs
8) The remaining Ork Bosses fight among themselves and/or scatter in the wake of Ghazzy's death

How's that?

I think it was imohtek that humiliated helbrecht the most though wasn't it?

Space Marines always win.

the Black templars charge the orks, kill ghazzy, then suicide run into the heart of the cron fleet, detonating a warp engine, creating a black hole that even the necron leaders can't get away/out from/of. thereby sacrificing almost the entire 5k man chapter. (their flagship is bigger than any other chapter/Imp navy fleet ship) and "winning" at the cost of every as Helbrecht jumps into the black hole duels Imotehk and slays him just before the black hole/warp hole consumes them all.

 raiden wrote:
I think it was imohtek that humiliated helbrecht the most though wasn't it?

Possibly, the "(from what I know)" in my first post could also read "(I don't really know anything about Imotekh and Helbrecht's beef)"

 raiden wrote:
the Black templars charge the orks, kill ghazzy, then suicide run into the heart of the cron fleet, detonating a warp engine, creating a black hole that even the necron leaders can't get away/out from/of. thereby sacrificing almost the entire 5k man chapter. (their flagship is bigger than any other chapter/Imp navy fleet ship) and "winning" at the cost of every as Helbrecht jumps into the black hole duels Imotehk and slays him just before the black hole/warp hole consumes them all.

Well... you've certainly out-epic'd my summation!

well I try lol had to make it memorable

Simple.

Creed wins.

 Void__Dragon wrote:
Were it to become a matter of single combat, we already know that Imotekh has Helbrecht's number in single combat, he's already beaten him.

Helbrecht won the rematch though.

Templars win. Fly ship into middle of battle, detonate Warp Drives. Success!

If the Necron fleet is the full strength of what Imotekh can muster, none of the other armies live to see infantry combat, going by IA12 + other Necron Fleet information we actually have.

Depends on how we define Helbrecht's fleet. He was overall void commander during Armageddon III after all.

Also how does Helbrecht beat Ghazz? Ap 3 Vs. 2+ armour save. T 4 Vs, strength 10 and a bunch of attacks. Plot armour aside, Ghaz wins full stop.