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Just in general, what do other armys fear when facing C:SM?
I´m pretty sure it´s not the armor save and people probably are not afraid to drown in bodys and massive dakka.
So what gives them a hard time?

Generally speaking, I don't think people are afraid of much when facing Space Marines.

It is an odd disconnect - Fluff-wise and Sales Numbers-wise, they should rock.

In reality, they are decidedly average and middle of the road.

Thunderfire cannons.

In my opinion they are the dumbest thing ever, and completely invalidate footslogging anything even more than Heldrakes.
However, since more than half of people play SMs, there's not nearly as much interwebz hate against them compared to other, more tame things.

Facing the boys in yellow... they just look horrible (no offence to anyone)!
The following I would rate as 'worrying' not scary like a serp spam.

Spams:
Iron hands air spam
Iron hands dread drop spam
Grav biker spam
Thunderfire cannon spam
Pod spam
Chap master spam

Tigurius/cent dev unit
Av14 wall
Podding sternies/command squad with combis.

None of these are top of the pecking order but all of the above can get a decent enough win record.

Short answer, we aren't. SM had their heyday for a long time. But that is gone now. If they should hit my lines is GG but they won't.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok av 14 wall can cause problems. It's not that SM are bad, they just aren't the easy button they were. You can't just deploy and say "here I come" any longer. They have to be tactical, which SM players aren't used to. And sternguard are boss.

Were C:SM armies ever 'easy button'?

I would guess drop pod spam is still the most viable option for a successful space marine army. An army that can literally start it's whole army in reserves is nasty.

Sternguard are also pretty mean.

The current state of the game means they aren't any harder to kill, usually, than any other troop unit and their vehicles are either too costly for what they do (land raider) or are too easy to blow up (rhino/razorback/landspeeders) to cause any real headaches.

I think it's a point that could be argued. No army is unbeatable but SM had a far and away advantage when they could reliably assault.

Lets just say they were twice what they are now back in 5th, now they are on an even keel.

The Codex is average, but the army revolves around tactics more than deathstars. Granted we have our deathstars in Honor Guard + LR or Cents + Tiggy, and spam in Bikes or Dreads (which is... meh), but I've found the greatest success in nothing BEING overly threatening, but everything being capable. You can ignore bikes or tacs running towards a tank, but they'll krak it to death given the chance. You can shoot them, but that leaves fire off of tanks or artillery. C:SM won't really do anything better than another Codex, but once its rank-and-file get inside 24'' there isn't much it can't do either.

That being said, you can plop down 4 landraiders and just give your opponent the "deal with it" look.

Oh I missed one (only ever seen it on paper but looks awsome)

Legion of the damned (If salamander primary) with melta, multi melta and combi grav. Ignores cover. Slow and purposeful. Reliable deepstrike. Rerolls melta misses if Vulkan is warlord. Anyone running tanks more pricey than a razor should be worried.

Imnewherewheresthebathroom wrote:
That being said, you can plop down 4 landraiders and just give your opponent the "deal with it" look.

Sad thing is, Codex: Inquisition does this better.

Every codex does it better

Imnewherewheresthebathroom wrote:
Every codex does it better

If every codex had land raiders... yeah, they'd probably all do it better.

Though DA have the most unkillable land raiders. Which hardly matters when C:=][= drops down five of them at 1500.

Fear the player not the army. Space marines are a good test of how competent a player is, we have drake spammers and all that at our club but the best players are our marine group as they avoid your strong areas and go for your weaknesses.

Codex inquisition is the best thing to ever happen for the imperial side. However due to servo skulls it is the worst thing to ever happen to the game since GW decided to do away with assault. Sorry - went off at a tangent there...


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Also dont forget - BA have the cheapest LRs.

Drop Pods.

I think that SM are not feared much because of people being prepared to fight them. In our local meta nearly half of armies are marines based (I'm including BA, SW, DA, SM, CSM, GK) so everyone needs to have some good anti-SM weapons

Sternguards using thier damn anti tyrannid shells to wipe out my tervigons! From a drop pod...

For my Tau force, I wouldn't call anything scary, but priority targets. Things that can get into CC quickly get my attention: jump packs, transports, drop pods, etc. Or stuff that moves fast: bikes, speeders, etc. I want to be more maneuverable and have the advantage at range.

My marine force is all choppy. I do have a lot of shooty vehicles, but the bulk of my force is chainsword and bolt pistol. In the past, it was easy to get them in CC with rhino rushing. I'm still debating on how to deliver my choppy marines into combat with the new rules. I expect casualties on my way to the fight as a purely choppy marine force, but with current rules, I haven't found the path I want to take them with yet.

Imnewherewheresthebathroom wrote:
That being said, you can plop down 4 landraiders and just give your opponent the "deal with it" look.

Theirs that! lol

Meltaguns in drop pods.

Freakin 2+ save on non-termi models, who takes in all the AP3 wounds you can dish at the freakin squad, and no ones dies...

Its not really something that i'm afraid off, just something that really annoys me to no end.

Imnewherewheresthebathroom wrote:
Short answer, we aren't. SM had their heyday for a long time. But that is gone now. If they should hit my lines is GG but they won't.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok av 14 wall can cause problems. It's not that SM are bad, they just aren't the easy button they were. You can't just deploy and say "here I come" any longer. They have to be tactical, which SM players aren't used to. And sternguard are boss.

I don't recall any vanilla marine heydays.

That's because there weren't any. 3rd; sorta.

Thunderfire Cannons and White Scars Bike Spam. So much silly.

TFCs are probably the most efficient thing in the codex, followed by grav bikers. Maybe Tiggy is better. Okay best non-special character thing.

Everything with armor values because I can't kill them.

In general I think its cause they are so middle of the road, they dont shine in any one given spot, but do them all well so that leaves few gaps to exploit when facing them

Stormravens. That and mass drop pod armies.