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Most certainly Tau, unless someone can give me a reason how they are even vaguely competitive in 5th ed.

Squats. They haven't had a codex since the Black Codex.

1. Necrons. Parts of their army just stopped working with the new edition or never worked at all, and there's plenty of room to expand the model range.
2. Dark Eldar are how old?

Troll answer:
1. Space Marines
2. Space Marines
3. Space Marines

Completely rewrite Codex: Space Marines every month. That'll shake things up.

DE codex was the 2nd codex done in 3rd edition after Space Marines.

Raxmei wrote:Completely rewrite Codex: Space Marines every month. That'll shake things up.

There's no need for a complete rewrite every month - all that's needed for each rewrite is to add some of the following (choose 3-4): new land raider variant; new land speeder variant; new dreadnought variant; new type of vet squad; new morale special rule; new special character who strikes at Initiative with power fist equivalent; something with Str 6 power weapons; increase Storm Shield inv save by 1. Hurr!

Pariah Press wrote:Squats. They haven't had a codex since the Black Codex.

Ohh... Good answer!

I don't think the necrons are in as dire straights as they are being made out to be. They are somewhat hurt by the new vehicle rules but by that same token they gained much needed mobility in everything that wasn't a jetbike and the monolith became even harder to kill. Besides anyone that wasn't running some heavy destroyers in fourth was going to get raped my MC's anyway so honestly it's not an huge stretch to think you may run a few in fifth.

The IG are fine right now, if anything fifth was a huge boost for them with their large numbers of small disposable squads making close combat armies have to pay dearly every time they kill a squad. Oh and tanks are harder to kill.

No one cares about space wolves.

With hunters and daemon hunters do need a serious overhaul, of any of the armies listed i think they are the best mix of poor rules and antiquated special abilities to warrent a new book. Preferably an inquisitor one since those armies historically just can't be alone. No one buys them when they are stand alone forces.

Dark eldar are a pretty good second as while they are still pretty viable in fifth they are ancient beyond reckoning and the models are just plain terrible. The art direction is bad, the backstory is old and bad, the force is really bi polar with only a few good units, and they really just don't fit well into the current 40k.

SDFarsight wrote:Most certainly Tau, unless someone can give me a reason how they are even vaguely competitive in 5th ed.

The hammerhead is the single best tank in the game, the new close combat rules prevent single chaplains/squads from killing your entire army, Tau are one of the few forces that really didn't care much about the new vehicle rules since rail guns are still death-megacannons, marker lights and true line of sight mean if done right you can shoot everything all the time and no one gets cover, and lastly devilfishes with fire warriors are excellent choices for capping objectives late game after you've laid waste to whatever was previously sitting on it.

I hope I have helped.

ShumaGorath wrote:
No one cares about space wolves.

You're statement is true if you add the words "given the current and most recent ruleset." Wolfs were huge in 2nd, and a big favorite in 3rd. They have some of the most compelling and interesting fluff, they're unabashed good guys without an angsty fatal flaw, and they're the most "human" of all the non-IG books. Of course, their current book is built for rhino rush and assault, and 4th edition killed both of those focuses pretty hard. A good Space Wolf book will re-ignite Wolves like Eldar and Orks did.

Agreed Polonius. Hell, I can't think of anything I like much more than 15 blood claws with 3 power fists launching themselves out of a LRC. 50 attacks? yes k please.

ShumaGorath wrote:

SDFarsight wrote:Most certainly Tau, unless someone can give me a reason how they are even vaguely competitive in 5th ed.

The hammerhead is the single best tank in the game, the new close combat rules prevent single chaplains/squads from killing your entire army, Tau are one of the few forces that really didn't care much about the new vehicle rules since rail guns are still death-megacannons, marker lights and true line of sight mean if done right you can shoot everything all the time and no one gets cover, and lastly devilfishes with fire warriors are excellent choices for capping objectives late game after you've laid waste to whatever was previously sitting on it.

I hope I have helped.

Yes. Maybe it's just paranoia from GW allegedly "hating" Tau ever since Chambers left. :S

Though our FAQ still hasn't mentioned how Shield Drones work, and the 'run' rule sounds deadly. But while the new infiltrating rules could cause havoc to Tau gunlines, it's good my making Stealth suits and Kroot much more usefull, and helping the Tau not to rely on the gunlines. Purhaps running could help prevent getting into CC, but that might just turn into a pontless chace. And I've heard that you've got to counter-charge in all CC. Why would Tau do that!?

Though I'm still not entirely sure how it effects Fish of Fury and Jump-Shoot-Jump. They're pretty much the only 'special' things about the Tau. Take them away and our only real selling point is the Railgun.

SDFarsight wrote:Though I'm still not entirely sure how it effects Fish of Fury and Jump-Shoot-Jump. They're pretty much the only 'special' things about the Tau. Take them away and our only real selling point is the Railgun.

Ultimately an army with Str5 basic weapons has plenty going for it.

S5 isn't that much of a confident trade-off for having to run away from anything that has a fist. That's why I have Orks as my 2nd army, for when I want to run at the enemy rather than away. JSJ was more dodgeing than 'running away', so it didn't feel so silly.

Though having said that, Kroot are more useful now, so maybe I'll make a change from my pure-Tau lists. And the no-consolidation rule makes gunlines more dangerious, espcialy if it can all focus on one small elite CC unit. Although the 'friendly units gives the enemy a cover save' makes an annoying nerf to ranged combat.

Cadian16th wrote:Chaos Marines

/thread

/agree

Typeline wrote:

Cadian16th wrote:Chaos Marines

/thread

/agree

It's urgent need of a new codex, not urgent want.

Typeline wrote:

Cadian16th wrote:Chaos Marines

/thread

/agree

Yeah. Take out the lash, put all the legion units into elites, make it so obliterators can only shoot flamer weapons and remove the daemons entirely from the book. My orks waited nine years for a passable codex and the dark eldar STILL haven't gotten one. There are armies in much more urgent need of a book than the iron warriors. Err, chaos. Sorry I meant to say Chaos.

ShumaGorath wrote:

Typeline wrote:

Cadian16th wrote:Chaos Marines

/thread

/agree

Yeah. Take out the lash, put all the legion units into elites, make it so obliterators can only shoot flamer weapons and remove the daemons entirely from the book. My orks waited nine years for a passable codex and the dark eldar STILL haven't gotten one. There are armies in much more urgent need of a book than the iron warriors. Err, chaos. Sorry I meant to say Chaos.

\

I'd rather the CSM codex "update" had been given to someone else, we sure didn't want it.

The Dark Eldar.

ShumaGorath wrote:I don't think the necrons are in as dire straights as they are being made out to be. They are somewhat hurt by the new vehicle rules but by that same token they gained much needed mobility in everything that wasn't a jetbike and the monolith became even harder to kill. Besides anyone that wasn't running some heavy destroyers in fourth was going to get raped my MC's anyway so honestly it's not an huge stretch to think you may run a few in fifth.

The IG are fine right now, if anything fifth was a huge boost for them with their large numbers of small disposable squads making close combat armies have to pay dearly every time they kill a squad. Oh and tanks are harder to kill.

When I read the summary of the rules changes in White Dwarf my first thought was that IG will benefit probably more than anyone else from those changes, and yet they are supposed to be getting a new codex soon.

No one cares about space wolves.

With hunters and daemon hunters do need a serious overhaul, of any of the armies listed i think they are the best mix of poor rules and antiquated special abilities to warrent a new book. Preferably an inquisitor one since those armies historically just can't be alone. No one buys them when they are stand alone forces.

Daemonhunters need a new Codex (they have seniority) and I was promised Ordo Xenos, so Ordo Xenos is what I demand!

Typeline wrote:

ShumaGorath wrote:

Typeline wrote:

Cadian16th wrote:Chaos Marines

/thread

/agree

Yeah. Take out the lash, put all the legion units into elites, make it so obliterators can only shoot flamer weapons and remove the daemons entirely from the book. My orks waited nine years for a passable codex and the dark eldar STILL haven't gotten one. There are armies in much more urgent need of a book than the iron warriors. Err, chaos. Sorry I meant to say Chaos.

\

I'd rather the CSM codex "update" had been given to someone else, we sure didn't want it.

A sentiment I've only really ever seen online. The current codex certainly has problems (the lack of daemons being about the only big one) but honestly to say that no one wanted the previous codex updated is just an outright lie. That book was badly designed, unbalanced, non sensical, and difficult to create armies with.

Of course as most competitive chaos armies were iron warriors and that's about the only force you can no longer make perhaps it makes sense that the vast majority of codex complaints from from the online space.

ShumaGorath wrote:A sentiment I've only really ever seen online. The current codex certainly has problems (the lack of daemons being about the only big one) but honestly to say that no one wanted the previous codex updated is just an outright lie. That book was badly designed, unbalanced, non sensical, and difficult to create armies with.

Of course as most competitive chaos armies were iron warriors and that's about the only force you can no longer make perhaps it makes sense that the vast majority of codex complaints from from the online space.

I heard someone complaining about the new Chaos codex about fifteen minutes ago at the friendly local gaming store. He unconfirmably had friends who also played Chaos and felt the same way. Something about lack of legion-specific rules.

Althoughth I can't substantiate the source of what I've heard (yeah I know). I've heard they are working on an Inquisitorial codex.

This will include all arms of the inquisitorial branches, according to the sources who have been playtesting the codex.

You can believe me if you like, I don't care. I'm not even sure if I belive these rumours. And I'm not playing any inquisitorial type armies - TBH - I don't care.

I heard them at a local GW where 2 or 3 of their established members were commenting and their associated staff weren't discounting it.

I'm not saying "I believe", I'm just pointing out what I've heard.

I'm taking it with a pinch of salt myself, before anyone tries to blow this out the water as my speculation.

Let's all wait and see.

Cheers

Edited for spelling

ShumaGorath wrote:Of course as most competitive chaos armies were iron warriors and that's about the only force you can no longer make perhaps it makes sense that the vast majority of codex complaints from from the online space.

Uhm, my rubric terminators and noise marine havocs would beg to differ.

Brother Bartius wrote:Althoughth I can't substantiate the source of what I've heard (yeah I know). I've heard they are working on an Inquisitorial codex.

This will include all arms of the inquisitorial branches, according to the sources who have been playtesting the codex

You take the Proposed Rules forum too seriously.

Typeline wrote: I'd rather the CSM codex "update" had been given to someone else, we sure didn't want it.

Speak for yourself. I'm very happy with it because I can finally make the army that *I* want to make. I'm no longer shoehorned into a dozen choices of named traitor Legions, Red Corsairs, or Fallen.

How can someone be shoehorned when there are dozens of choices? Does not compute.

Besides, I can't think of anything in the current Chaos Codex that you couldn't do previously with the old Chaos Codex, except for fluff-breaking combos like Khornate Leader/Slaaneshi Troops or Nurgle Leader/Tzeentchian Troops (and vice versa).

Conversley, I can think of loads of stuff you can't do with the new Codex that you could do with the old one...

BYE

LargeAngryGoff wrote:Daemonhunters need a new Codex (they have seniority) and I was promised Ordo Xenos, so Ordo Xenos is what I demand!

Yeah that is true, but that was printed in WD. Then GeeW posted the FAQ that made that statement no longer playable in tourneys.

I hate it when they do that.

Everyone needs a new Codex.

I think every edition should of had an "edition" codex to go with it and released simultaneously.

LOST AND THE DAMNED!!!!!!!

and imperial guard would be nice too, and the inqusition