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ah, I understand now.

so dow 2 says they are blood angel successors, but what about in the story line about the chapters dark secrets and stuff? it cant just be the black rage because why would they lead it on so much if its just the blood angles curse? there has to be more to it!

The games are really good.

There is precedent for chapters founded from blended geneseed, I dont remember the specifics, but I remember reading official fluff about a chapter descended from both Ultra's and DA.

This thread becomes more and more interesting.

ANy idea what chapter that is, at all?

so it seems like its rather blood angles and thousand sons, or the cleverly predicted XD blood angles and raven guard? but there is no supporting fluff for raven guard so it seems the first combo must be it

All this blood raven talk makes me want a librarian squad *sneaks off to find spare apocalypse datasheet*

I thought something similar from just playing the first DoW game. The link to the BA seems tenuous. But with the number of psykers, and forgotten progenitor, it would make sense. I don't know if an age has been given so they could be from the Dark Founding.

Although I believe there are blended gene-seeds.

The Cursed Founding featured chapters with "blended" geneseed, but I think it got retconned to them having been "improved". Having just checked Lexicanum, that seems to be a yes.

@physcosamatic: It doesn't seem likely to be Raven Guard. Their geneseed is massively flawed and I can't imagine the Inquisition being ready to start another chapter using stock that has failed in the field, so to speak.

Fifty wrote:I thought Legion was quite good.

The only terrible Horus Heresy book so far has been Mechanicum, which made me want to blind myself incase I ever read anything as bad again.

legion was great, so was mechanicumum. all of them were, except maybe battle for the abyss

Problem with dark founding idea is that Blood Ravens apparently are a VERY old chapter.

I personally think they should have left the whole prophecy out of A Thousand Sons, and not taken C S Goto's idea as canon....

Still, I'm starting to like the Thousand Sons now.

lol, the DOW books are probably some of the only SM black library books I haven't read... i think I'm gonna keep it that way too lol!

Sigh... Don't you wish they'd get off their duffs and make some heresy era models officially already?

It can be wrong, but.... they cannot be somekind of geneseed mixing??? think about it, mostly can be 1ksons with a part of...blood angels? that can explain the absence of black rage... word bearers? i always think why Eliphas treated them as somekind of "lost brother".... maybe Angron? that can explain their love for battle, that can be confused with loyalist chapters....

WGXH wrote:That item was just a complete random drop from the first campaign. Nobody would even think to check the text on it before throwing it aside.

Unless they were bored out of their minds, as I was.

I got a Bolt Pistol in a drop in DoW2 named "Wrath of Baal" or something that says it has a blood drop symbol on the handle indicating it's from the Blood Angels, but that the BA don't have any records of the exchange the Blood Ravens claim they got it from.

I check the fluff on ALL my weapon drops. I like to think I just wanna know all the fluff there is to the game, but maybe I'm just lame and bored.

The fluff on a chapter that was only made up to be in a dinky video game does not interest me.

dinky eh? then why're you on this thread?
Just politely wondering...

maybe during the events of the blood angel novels, some tzeentch followers got some BA seed...
I've never actually read those books but I do know that much, do i need a spoiler thingy for that?

I'm on this thread because I have an interest in things related to the Thousand Sons. I see now that this isn't one. Just a misinterpretation.

Your problem with the Blood Ravens is that they are from a video game?

i've heard this arguement before, I can't find where but his/her (i've met too many guys under female usernames) problem seems to be that the game doesn't do WH40k justice... or something like that... or it could be that the Blood Ravens suck.

I dunno what i'm talking about anymore.

I LOVE the Blood Ravens. I have a pretty good sized table top version of the army. Fell in love with the games (DoW, DoW2). I also think they may just be related to 1ksons. The little things they poke in there with BA fluff, throws me for a loop. Either way, to me the BR are far more than just canon fodder for 40k.

Random comment, but keep in mind that Sanguinius was the second strongest psyker amongst the primachs, from memory... certainly a skilled one regardless.

Besides, I thought librarians had to be psykers before the geneseed implantation started in the first place?

Ok about to commit Heresy.

I'm reading the Dawn of War trilogy again, and the first book is actually pretty readable.

Actually having played the game (obsessively lol).

Sanguinius is not a psyker at all Morgrim. He was gifted with wings for flight.
Magnus is the strongest psyker in the Imperium after the Emperor.

And all initiates to space marine chapters are "vetted" for psykers at the first stage. Those that show potential are trained as Lexicanums.

Although i'm very surprised that the Blood Ravens have much more of an affinity with the Alpha Legion than anything else.
They have a long hatred of the Alpha Legion, which means maybe they're not descendants of Magnus but Alpharius.....

But wasn't the black rage the result of some psychic backlash the BA received from some battle? i'm sorry i got this from lexicanum, i'm kinda too poor for official material

so you're saying that it's all Alpharius' master plan to do what exactly?

offnote here, was it not the novel that was made before the game?

after... i think

The Black Rage and Red Thirst were hidden curses unlocked by the death of Sanguinius at the hands of Horus at the end of the Horus Heresy. The death of their primarch was something every Blood Angel felt in their souls when they heard about it, and from the feelings of loss were born the Black Rage and Red Thirst.

wait a minute sangiunius wasnt a psyker?!

the only "psyker" among the Primarchs was Magnus. That's not to say the primarchs couldn't feel the currents of the Warp, or defend themselves against it, but the only primarch who actively had psyker power was Magnus the Red.

The reason the Red Thirst and Black Rage are arttributed to a "psycic" event is the fact that it is the blood of Sanguinius (caught in the Red Grail) that activates the geneseed of new Blood Angels. And the blood from Sanguinius' body carries the memories of his last desperate fight against Horus.

Corennus wrote:the only "psyker" among the Primarchs was Magnus. That's not to say the primarchs couldn't feel the currents of the Warp, or defend themselves against it, but the only primarch who actively had psyker power was Magnus the Red.

Horus the Warmaster wrote:“Sanguinius. It should have been him. He has the vision and strength to carry us to victory, and the wisdom to rule once victory is won. For all his aloof coolness, he alone has the Emperor's soul in his blood. Each of us carries part of our father within us, whether it is his hunger for battle, his psychic talent or his determination to succeed. Sanguinius holds it all. It should have been his...”

Sangiunius was a psyker too.

Nothing in any of the official canon actually says sanguinius was a psyker.
Sanguinius certainly used weapons that required a certain level of concentration to use (The Spear of Tesluo) but he didn't have any psyker ability beyond an intuition for war....

Once again, the only Primarch who inherited the Emperor's psyker ability was Magnus.

Sanguinius inherited his father's nobility along with his hidden savagery.

The reason the Red Thirst and Black Rage are arttributed to a "psycic" event is the fact that it is the blood of Sanguinius (caught in the Red Grail) that activates the geneseed of new Blood Angels. And the blood from Sanguinius' body carries the memories of his last desperate fight against Horus.

What's that red grail you talked about?

So there's no place in any of the official canon that says he was a psyker? and are you sure that no other primarchs had any psyker ability?
Would like some quotes and proofs please

Corennus wrote:Nothing in any of the official canon actually says sanguinius was a psyker.
Sanguinius certainly used weapons that required a certain level of concentration to use (The Spear of Tesluo) but he didn't have any psyker ability beyond an intuition for war....

Once again, the only Primarch who inherited the Emperor's psyker ability was Magnus.

Sanguinius inherited his father's nobility along with his hidden savagery.

Sanguinus had some (mild) psyker abbilities, most noted is his ability to see glimpses of the future, and even knowing he would die to Horus' punch he still battle him in order to buy the Emperor time and the famous crack in the armor of Horus.