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Made in us
Screeching Screamer of Tzeentch





"Beta Rules Changes" are currently on preview on the Warhammer Community Site. The rules are being tested at Adepticon and LVO. I still need to read and process them all myself.

Smite changes: "With the exception of smite, each psychic power can be attempted only once per turn, rather than once per psyker per turn. In addition, subtract 1 from the result of any psychic test taken when attempting to manifest smite for each other attempt (whether successful or not) that has been made to manifest smite during this psychic phase. For example, if a psyker attempts to manifest smite during a psychic phase in which two other psykers have already attempted to manifest smite, then you would subtract 2 from the result of the psychic test."
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





Yeah, the Aspiring Sorcerer is now a completely useless model. This is exactly what I feared would happen, GW throwing the baby out with the bathwater on the smite issue.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Hehehe, baby tson sorcerers.....

Funny thoughts aside anyone else getting the feeling tsons are going to be the weak link when the codex drops and we don't look as good as the other options?
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Boulder, Colorado

God damn it. TSons didn't need to be nerfed even harder lol

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Bay area, CA

New rule errata is coming: -1 to roll for for every smite you tries to cast.

So 1st smite normal roll 5+, next 6+, 7+ ...
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Eh it’s baby smite anyway with a risk of blowing up your squad as you auto die on perils. Good riddance to a suicide bomb.
Plus smite spam was hardly fun to play against, glad it’s gone.

I’m new to thousand sons (my usual tournament army is tyranids which I’ve been doing very well with) but am seeing value in tzaangors, the rubrics are overpriced but dangerous. Liking a couple of flamer squads sharing a rhino so far.
Scarab occult I think need some finesse, they are not a battering ram and need treating differently. Not even put my magnus on the table yet, not convinced what thousand sons need is a really expensive bullet magnet.
Got some more games coming up and a tournament I’ll be taking the thousand sons to in January so I’ll keep you posted.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Chillicothe, OH

Meh. Boxed my 1k Sons up. Got bored of playing Not-Thousand sons Thousand Sons army.

My Painting Blog, UPDATED!

Armies in 8th:
Minotaurs: 1-0-0
Thousand Sons: 15-3

 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Sneggy wrote:
Not even put my magnus on the table yet, not convinced what thousand sons need is a really expensive bullet magnet.
Got some more games coming up and a tournament I’ll be taking the thousand sons to in January so I’ll keep you posted.


Magnus is great as long as he doesn't get blown off the table turn one. Once he's got weavers of fate up there is no easy way of killing him, we will gobble up most things in assault and the super smite is just crazy good. He's also not at all expensive for what you get. Give him a go and your unlikely to be disappointed.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Steelcity

kaptin_Blacksquigg wrote:
Sneggy wrote:
Not even put my magnus on the table yet, not convinced what thousand sons need is a really expensive bullet magnet.
Got some more games coming up and a tournament I’ll be taking the thousand sons to in January so I’ll keep you posted.


Magnus is great as long as he doesn't get blown off the table turn one. Once he's got weavers of fate up there is no easy way of killing him, we will gobble up most things in assault and the super smite is just crazy good. He's also not at all expensive for what you get. Give him a go and your unlikely to be disappointed.


Pretty sure everyone is aware how insane Magnus is, considering he's in virtually every chaos army nowadays.

Keeper of the DomBox
Warhammer Armies - Click to see galleries of fully painted armies
32,000, 19,000, Renegades - 10,000 , 7,500,  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Chillicothe, OH

plus in a pure 1k sons list, he's your best anti armor.

My Painting Blog, UPDATED!

Armies in 8th:
Minotaurs: 1-0-0
Thousand Sons: 15-3

 
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





 nintura wrote:
plus in a pure 1k sons list, he's your best anti armor.

Assuming you can actually get him past the screen. A pure Thousand Sons list has no Changeling, which means he's far more vulnerable than he is in the Chaos Soup lists where he's been showing up in tournaments. He will often times die on turn one or two, before you can chew through the screens enough to get his massive base into contact with the enemy vehicles.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




obviously Magnus is good in other chaos armies. Other chaos armies have chaff, cheap and dangerous deep striking units, other big targets etc.

Thousand sons have expensive, survivable units. Which win by attrition.
Do I want to spend 1/5th of my army on a big red dude who likely takes every heavy weapon turn one and dies? Maybe not. When your army has 100 expendable brims, changeling, drop oblits and a bunch of daemon princes hes viable. I'm not convinced he isn't actually detrimental to pure thousand sons.
All theory but will do some testing.

   
Made in us
Tzeentch Veteran Marine with Psychic Potential





Tuluth wrote:
"Beta Rules Changes" are currently on preview on the Warhammer Community Site. The rules are being tested at Adepticon and LVO. I still need to read and process them all myself.

Smite changes: "With the exception of smite, each psychic power can be attempted only once per turn, rather than once per psyker per turn. In addition, subtract 1 from the result of any psychic test taken when attempting to manifest smite for each other attempt (whether successful or not) that has been made to manifest smite during this psychic phase. For example, if a psyker attempts to manifest smite during a psychic phase in which two other psykers have already attempted to manifest smite, then you would subtract 2 from the result of the psychic test."


Yeah...Go feth yourself GW

 
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





I'm just going to assume/hope they have a solution for the armies that are intended to have a lot of psykers. Obviously Craftworld Eldar don't have a problem with this already because they get 18 fething spells; we'll see when the Daemons Codex comes out if Tzeentch has a solution, and if so we can readily assume that Thousand Sons will have one as well.
   
Made in us
Screeching Screamer of Tzeentch





I’m actually thinking that these beta rules are taking the upcoming Codex: Daemons of Chaos into count. Since LVO is 26-28 January, and the new codex is supposed to be dropping in January... I am hoping for a large spell lore for booth Tzeentch Daemons and TS though, similar to what they gave Disciples of Tzeentch in AoS. Spell page for Daemons and another for mortals. I could see something similar being put into place for TS.
   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut




I wonder if our legion trait won't focus on the invuln save as it seems most of our stuff has already ie: Magnus rerolling ones, Ahriman, exalteds etc. maybe we'll get a +1 like tzeentch demons? That would be pretty solid overall. But is that asking for too much haha

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/21 13:22:27


 
   
Made in us
Screeching Screamer of Tzeentch





So, question for the forum. In a pure TS list, what do people typically use as objective campers at the 1000 and 2000 point range?

In my pickup games (around 50PL since that's what we use at my FLGS for those) I've found my Rubrics typically get stuck on objectives on the back end of the field. Seems like too expensive of a unit to have standing around not doing much.
   
Made in us
Sacrifice to the Dark God Tzeentch




Uk

Was looking at the forge world units, what do you think of the Hellforged Contemptor dread and the Decimator, was thinking of using a couple of them with Magnus maybe trying to get the opponent to divert fire from Magnus onto them, that and i like the Butcher Cannon.

The difference that i can see really between the 2 is that the Decimator works really well with the changeling and is guaranteed a wound back each turn and is about 30 points cheaper after weapons

And the Contemptor has a better profile, better at shooting and combat (at least until wounded and particularly whilst in Magnus's buff) and more weapon choice (such as the soulburner instead of hellflamer in it fist), but only has a chance to gain wounds back after it kills in combat and it cant be used with the changeling (and this seems like the best thing to use the Osiron dread as for now at least).

Do you guys think either would work well in a 1ksons list of mostly rubric, scarab occult and tzeentch deamons?
   
Made in fr
Waaagh! Warbiker





Tuluth wrote:
So, question for the forum. In a pure TS list, what do people typically use as objective campers at the 1000 and 2000 point range?

In my pickup games (around 50PL since that's what we use at my FLGS for those) I've found my Rubrics typically get stuck on objectives on the back end of the field. Seems like too expensive of a unit to have standing around not doing much.


I use 5-men Rubric Squads to camp mid-field objectives (just 5 guys with bolters and Soulreaper).

They're quite tough if you stick to cover and have OK-ish firepower. They're more resistant than cultists to Moral but less to multi-damage and high AP weapons (wish we had Ephemeral form equivalent...).

For backfield objectives I use Cultists, Tzaangors and in january, probably Brimstones.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/22 14:43:02


Deffskullz desert scavengers
Thousand Sons 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Bay area, CA

What woul you say about Chaos Predators? Are they good? I don't have them but 48'' shooting sounds good for our mid range army.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Los Angeles

I'm starting up TS, and I really want to make it a pure TS army. Here is the list I'm working on, for a 1700 tournament with no twinsies beside troops, and single mandatory battalion detachement. What do you guys think? Also, can I use CSM stratagems with this list? Thanks.

PLAYER : Haechi

PRIMARY DETACHMENT : Thousand Sons
HQ1 : Ahriman(1*131) [131]
HQ2 : Daemon Prince with wings(1*170), Hdemonic axe(10) [180]
HQ3 : Exalted Sorcerer(1*112) [121]
Troup1 : 30 Cultistss(40 + 20*4) [120]
Troup2 : 12 Rubric Marines(90 + 7*18), 10 Bolter Inferno(20), Canon Soulreaper(20), Aspirant Sorcier(0) [265]
Troup3 : 12 Rubric Marines(90 + 7*18), 10 Bolter Inferno(20), Canon Soulreaper(20), Aspirant Sorcier(0) [265]
Troup4 : 12 Rubric Marines(90 + 7*18), 10 Bolter Inferno(20), Canon Soulreaper(20), Aspirant Sorcier(0) [265]
Elite1 : Helbrute(1*72), Twin lascan(50) [162]
HS1 : Chaos Predator(1*90), Two lascan(50), Twin lascan(50) [190]
Total detachment : 1699

ARMY TOTAL [1699]
   
Made in il
Tzeentch Doomlord Pilot






Based on my experience, the prince and brute are questionable.

The brute is the simple answer, it just gets singled out if he's alone, and gets taken down before he gets anything done.

The prince, is slightly more complicated.
The issue is, we are not really an "all in your face" kind of army too much, so the prince is stuck in a limbo of wanting to charge in, but the moment he does, he is alone and isolated leading to a quick death.
His aura is not enough to justify the price, his melee is is good but not when he's out there on his own, and his speed is rather pointless when nobody else is catching up with him.


On another note, most everyone agrees that we can use the soulreaper price in the CSM codex, making each of your squads 5 points cheaper.

can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Los Angeles

You make valid points on the Prince. I do want it for his aura, and I didn't even think too much about diving in with him. I was gonna use it as counter offensive in case I'm fighting a close range army. But in that case, I don't really need the wings, and can at least save up on that if not scrap him altogether.

As for the hellbrute, it's kind of the same issue with its gauntlet I guess, but I was mostly taking it for the twin lascan.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Chillicothe, OH

Both are good if you use warptime. My Thousand Sons has been successful because I dont run pure Thousand Sons and it's melee based instead of shooting. Deep striking termies, 30 man strong Tzaangor, Melee Brute, Heldrake, Daemon Prince. Just rush the enemy and put too many things in their face they need to shoot.

My Painting Blog, UPDATED!

Armies in 8th:
Minotaurs: 1-0-0
Thousand Sons: 15-3

 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Los Angeles

Melee based lists seems interesting, especially if you want to include Magnus. Right now I'm more interesting in making work the Rubric Marines, and build a more conventional "moving forward" gunline, since it is for a tournament with a lot of restrictions.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Bay area, CA

I feel that Rubrics are really overcosted and not competitive.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Los Angeles

 ArtyomTrityak wrote:
I feel that Rubrics are really overcosted and not competitive.


I'd say it depends what you want in your army. I don't like having tax troop, but I like having battalions. Rubrics are such strong troop choices that you don't feel like being taxed using them. I like that.

I think I overlooked the Scarabs Occult, and this is my revised list :

PLAYER : Haechi

PRIMARY DETACHMENT : Thousand Sons
HQ1 : Ahriman(1*131) [131]
HQ2 : Daemon Prince(1*146), Bolter Warp(3), Demonic Axe(10) [159]
HQ3 : Exalted Sorcerer(1*112) [121]
Troup1 : 15 Cultists(40 + 5*4), Champion Cultist (0) [60]
Troup2 : 15 Cultists(40 + 5*4), Champion Cultist (0) [60]
Troup3 : 12 Rubric Marines(90 + 7*18), 10 Bolter Inferno(20), Canon Soulreaper(20), Aspirant Sorcier(0) [265]
Troup4 : 12 Rubric Marines(90 + 7*18), 10 Bolter Inferno(20), Canon Soulreaper(20), Aspirant Sorcier(0) [265]
Elite1 : 5 Scarab Occult terminator(165), 3 Combi-Bolter Inferno(9), 4 Power Swords (16), Canon Soulreaper(20), Hellfyre missile rack(22), Scarab Occult Sorcerer(17) [260]
HS1 : Chaos Predator(1*90), 2 Canon laser(50), Canon laser jumelé(50) [190]
HS2 : Forgefiend(1*119), 2 Autocanon Hades(50) [177]
Total detachment : 1688

ARMY TOTAL [1688]

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/12/25 18:07:28


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Chillicothe, OH

 Haechi wrote:
Melee based lists seems interesting, especially if you want to include Magnus. Right now I'm more interesting in making work the Rubric Marines, and build a more conventional "moving forward" gunline, since it is for a tournament with a lot of restrictions.


I agree and that's why I've shelved mine for now until we get a dex. I like the models I use, but it's not Fluffy and could easily just be a regular Chaos army.

My Painting Blog, UPDATED!

Armies in 8th:
Minotaurs: 1-0-0
Thousand Sons: 15-3

 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Bay area, CA

I'm thinking about Defilers vs Predators.
Defilers are daemons so will get -1 to hit from changeling.
They also have more shooting than Predators but more expensive and hitting on 4s instead of Predators 3s.

Predators are cheaper but have less shooting and no melee potential in case of something charging you.

Both have reroll 1's to hit from TS Daemon Prince.


I personally think that 3xDefilers with autocanons and scourges will be better than 4xPredators (same points cost).

Your thoughts?
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Los Angeles

 ArtyomTrityak wrote:
I'm thinking about Defilers vs Predators.
Defilers are daemons so will get -1 to hit from changeling.
They also have more shooting than Predators but more expensive and hitting on 4s instead of Predators 3s.

Predators are cheaper but have less shooting and no melee potential in case of something charging you.

Both have reroll 1's to hit from TS Daemon Prince.


I personally think that 3xDefilers with autocanons and scourges will be better than 4xPredators (same points cost).

Your thoughts?


I'm really not fond of the Defiler's weapon options. I like the Forgefiend a lot as an alternative to Predators.
   
 
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