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Battle Brother Ambrosius wrote:

kronk wrote:The ability to take cults as troops with a non-unique warlord makes me happy. I didn't want every Berserker list to be Kharne and friends!

Battle Brother Ambrosius wrote:
I agree. We BT players can still offer a solid fight to our opponents, with our unique drop pod rules and everything,

I'm going a little off-topic here, but what unique drop pod rules are you talking about?

Drop Pod Assault, which allows half of our Pods to arrive simultaneously.

All of the Space Marine drop pods bring in half on turn 1 now, including Black Templars.

The Black Templars Codex allowed you to put them all in reserve and then roll for them as normal reserves, preventing you from getting 1/2 on turn 1. However, the newest FAQ puts the Black Templars on the same footing as every other codex with Drop Pods: 1/2 on turn 1.

Rivet wrote:If they have not, I hope they do this time.

Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. I doubt they would release two things at the same time. GW isn't one to break their MO.

That is too bad about CSM getting pushed back.

If they really do release the starter before the codex that will be really dumb imo. I can't think of a time they released a unit that did not have rules, individual one off characters are different.

If these are the releases that we are getting without a codex I can't wait for the proper Daemons book.

From that back page I wouldn't be surprised if Dark Angels drop first. I know that isn't what is rumoured, but Daemons weren't exactly on the cards for August so...

Medium of Death wrote:If these are the releases that we are getting without a codex I can't wait for the proper Daemons book.

From that back page I wouldn't be surprised if Dark Angels drop first. I know that isn't what is rumoured, but Daemons weren't exactly on the cards for August so...

Yes and no. Chaos was on the books for August, and the rumors started coming for CSM, forgetting about the true powers of Chaos. Everyone got thrown for a loop, and I'm happier with this one honestly. Bring me new toys!!

Annoying to wait an extra 2 months, but at least we still have CSM in sight.

I'm going to cross my fingers on the possibility of a starter set and chaos codex release in the same month. They have to realize that if they have a backlog problem they're just kicking their problem down the road if they don't do something about it.

kronk wrote:All of the Space Marine drop pods bring in half on turn 1 now, including Black Templars.

The Black Templars Codex allowed you to put them all in reserve and then roll for them as normal reserves, preventing you from getting 1/2 on turn 1. However, the newest FAQ puts the Black Templars on the same footing as every other codex with Drop Pods: 1/2 on turn 1.

If I'm not mistaken DA drop pods don't arrive on turn 1.

I'm a bit disappointed actually, I was hoping for some love for Iron warriors or other non-cult chaos space marine legions...And the fact that there are no new independent characters, Abaddon still gets killed by his daemon weapon, and no one else gets eternal warrior.

What we seem to be getting is nice, but Im sure the next Ward-dex will trample over us.

walledin wrote:That is too bad about CSM getting pushed back.

If they really do release the starter before the codex that will be really dumb imo. I can't think of a time they released a unit that did not have rules, individual one off characters are different.

*sigh*
You do realise that both the 4th & 5th ed core sets included a little wee booklet with all the profiles & rules for the models in the box, don't you?!

You don't try and sell a brand new player, (espeically one who's the target age GW catters too), a core set + hobby starter set + codex/army book + carry case + additional crap all in one go... You try and sell 'em just the absolute basics which is core set + hooby starter pack + primer and then arrange times for them to come back into your store for hands-on lessons teaching them how to clean, prep & prime their models properly, the basics of painting, etc...
Once they've got their core set done, then GW tries to add to their collection at which the codex is the first "must-buy" item.

At least, that's how we ran an almost-successful GW store despite our mall's best efforts to kill us every other week! (the endless fires, spills & evactuations kinda fethed us in the end though )

Cyrax wrote:

kronk wrote:All of the Space Marine drop pods bring in half on turn 1 now, including Black Templars.

The Black Templars Codex allowed you to put them all in reserve and then roll for them as normal reserves, preventing you from getting 1/2 on turn 1. However, the newest FAQ puts the Black Templars on the same footing as every other codex with Drop Pods: 1/2 on turn 1.

If I'm not mistaken DA drop pods don't arrive on turn 1.

The "drop pod assault" rule is a general rule for Drop Pods unless the entry in the DA codex specifically said "cannot preform Drop Pod Assault"

Even if the CSM are not next month, atleast the starter set will give us new rules for the cultists and assuming the guys on the front cover of the rulebook are chosen, no doubt thats what they will probably look like in model and my eyes will melt from such glory. Either way, next month will have some good chaos love.

kronk wrote:All of the Space Marine drop pods bring in half on turn 1 now, including Black Templars.

The Black Templars Codex allowed you to put them all in reserve and then roll for them as normal reserves, preventing you from getting 1/2 on turn 1. However, the newest FAQ puts the Black Templars on the same footing as every other codex with Drop Pods: 1/2 on turn 1.

Oops, didn't know that. My bad.

Can we be done with the Drop Pod rules? I think most of us want CSM rumors/discussion in the CSM rumors thread. BT pods are now in line with all other DPs except DA who have the DPs rules affecting terminators instead (half terminator squads DS 1st turn, pods DS as normal). Great, now that's done...let's go back to chaos.

Can't wait to have cheaper NMs and I'll be happy to see changes in Lucius's rules (please??)

timetowaste85 wrote:Can't wait to have cheaper NMs and I'll be happy to see changes in Lucius's rules (please??)

I agree. I didn't feel his rules for his armor properly represented his fluff really well. What I'd like to see is something like Necron's WBB or Justicar Anval Thawn's ressurection rule, but placing Lucius where the model that slew him was and removing that model as a casualty. Of course, that's also highly imba (hay! imma challengez u, <insert big special character i.e. Abaddon, Draigo, C'tan...>. o wait, you killd me. nvm, next turn you die and I respawn lulz) Oh well.

I don't see why not-he becomes a target that has to be dealt with by shooting, you need to avoid him in CC. I mean, Necron Lords are something you don't wanna meet in CC because MSS will rip you to pieces. How about the Brotherhood Champion who just has to hit you if he dies (usually on a 3+) and he kills you outright too. Or Lukas the Trickster with his stasis bomb. It's perfectly acceptable for Lucius to join their ranks as a character-killer.

I'm just worried as an Undivided player. Cult stuff are getting cool marks etc. If they try and palm us off with bloody MORALE REROLLS again, I'm going to lose it.

Cerebrium wrote:I'm just worried as an Undivided player. Cult stuff are getting cool marks etc. If they try and palm us off with bloody MORALE REROLLS again, I'm going to lose it.

Rumor was 4 marks, 5 icons different from each other.

ZebioLizard2 wrote:

Cerebrium wrote:I'm just worried as an Undivided player. Cult stuff are getting cool marks etc. If they try and palm us off with bloody MORALE REROLLS again, I'm going to lose it.

Rumor was 4 marks, 5 icons different from each other.

And units could have both, in different combinations.

Marks and Icons are both purchasable by most units. That means you have five new Icons and the same four marks, in which units can have a combination of two. This is a list of the USRs and stat bonus possible.

Fearless
FnP
+1 T
+1 Invul Save
Rage
Soul Blaze
Furious Charge
Fear
+1 I

The only question is which of these go with which marks and which go with the different icons. It also raises the possibility that if you can mix and match the marks and icons, the icons themselves won't be god-specific. 9 options, 9 legions... anyone think that GW will simply imply that particular legion purists use only one choice? This wouldn't necessarily be in any absolute terms, just maybe recommended ones. Maybe this is GW's attempt to deemphasize legion by saying non-legion and ex-legion are more non-conformists to the cult-ritual and modus operandi of their former legion.

Plastic Plague-bearers finally sighted *swoons* now my life is complete!

Cheaper Noise Marines make me happy. Would hope they also drop the price of the Blast Master.
Regardless, I still want vehicle sonic weaponry. (I bet this is too far out of the realm of possibility though)
Looking forward to making some Slaanesh Cultists (yay conversion time!)

I see no marks giving extra CC attacks, so it could be that the Rage USR will be replacing the extra +1A from the khorne mark. Still remains to be seen, though.

By now I'm mostly curious about the design 'theme' we are going to see. If CSM is to be a high-value, low-number army like GKs, we need to see quite a boost in rules, statlines and weaponry. If they are going to be skilled generalists like vanilla marines, prices need to drop and the line needs more variety in vehicles. So far, it seems that Kelly may have tried to onclude both options, which is a gamble. More power to him if it works!

Marks and Icons are both purchasable by most units. That means you have five new Icons and the same four marks, in which units can have a combination of two. This is a list of the USRs and stat bonus possible.

Fearless
FnP
+1 T
+1 Invul Save
Rage
Soul Blaze
Furious Charge
Fear
+1 I

My thoughts:
Nurgle: FnP and +1 T
Khorne: Rage and Furious Charge
Slaanesh: Fear and +1 I
Tzeentch: Soul Blaze and +1 Invul
Undivided: Fearless

SpitfireArsonist wrote:
Undivided: Fearless

That's kinda like a morale reroll, right? Undivided should feel right at home!

Back OT, the Daemons were just a rules packet in WD. Who's to say that August doesn't still hold a Codex release for CSM? Yeah, no new models yet, but that's just because we already have most of what we'd need anyways (marines, tanks, Defilers, etc). We'll just have to salviate for a few months on the new units (or make counts-as) while they decide when to release any new models we get (like that Dragon).

SpitfireArsonist wrote:

Marks and Icons are both purchasable by most units. That means you have five new Icons and the same four marks, in which units can have a combination of two. This is a list of the USRs and stat bonus possible.

Fearless
FnP
+1 T
+1 Invul Save
Rage
Soul Blaze
Furious Charge
Fear
+1 I

My thoughts:
Nurgle: FnP and +1 T
Khorne: Rage and Furious Charge
Slaanesh: Fear and +1 I
Tzeentch: Soul Blaze and +1 Invul
Undivided: Fearless

HEEELLLLL to the naw! So not only are the cult troops moved from troops to the elite slot (which should be more powerful than troops), but they get nerfed as well? Right now all the cult troops are fearless. How could they move them off of being troops to elites, and nerf them by taking away fearless? They should keep fearless as well as getting more buffs for becoming elite. I'm not going to play with non-fearless troops, so if the new CSM codex nerfs their troops that hard I guess I'll have to start playing blood angels


But seriously I think it will be similar to how it is in this current codex. The cult troops have more benefits than the marked basic CSMs. So the basic CSM troops can take 2 of the above list, but the cults will get 3 or more. Kindof like how currently basic CSMs can take mark of nurgle for +1T, but they dont get all the benefits plague marines have.

Phragonist wrote:

SpitfireArsonist wrote:

Marks and Icons are both purchasable by most units. That means you have five new Icons and the same four marks, in which units can have a combination of two. This is a list of the USRs and stat bonus possible.

Fearless
FnP
+1 T
+1 Invul Save
Rage
Soul Blaze
Furious Charge
Fear
+1 I

My thoughts:
Nurgle: FnP and +1 T
Khorne: Rage and Furious Charge
Slaanesh: Fear and +1 I
Tzeentch: Soul Blaze and +1 Invul
Undivided: Fearless

HEEELLLLL to the naw! So not only are the cult troops moved from troops to the elite slot (which should be more powerful than troops), but they get nerfed as well? Right now all the cult troops are fearless. How could they move them off of being troops to elites, and nerf them by taking away fearless? They should keep fearless as well as getting more buffs for becoming elite. I'm not going to play with non-fearless troops, so if the new CSM codex nerfs their troops that hard I guess I'll have to start playing blood angels


But seriously I think it will be similar to how it is in this current codex. The cult troops have more benefits than the marked basic CSMs. So the basic CSM troops can take 2 of the above list, but the cults will get 3 or more. Kindof like how currently basic CSMs can take mark of nurgle for +1T, but they dont get all the benefits plague marines have.

I should have been more clear. I meant to say that I believe those stats would be base for each legion, and that fearless would be a base stat for all CSM regardless of god affiliation, or elite status.

One thing that's worrying me is that since leadership is going down we need Fearless since we don't have ATSKNF... CSM troops better be cheaper than vanilla. Fearless is better, yes, but you know it's gonna be a cost heavy icon.

unmercifulconker wrote:
Edit: It looks like a dark angel librarian? Not sure but I am certain the symbols on him are dark angels.

This picture is from Codexark Angels librarian entry, page 39.

No cult terminators would still be a dealbreaker for me. As far as I am concerned, their inclusion would be a no-brainer. Who the hell wants two kinds of obliterators?

warpcrafter wrote:No cult terminators would still be a dealbreaker for me. As far as I am concerned, their inclusion would be a no-brainer. Who the hell wants two kinds of obliterators?

I'm hoping marks/icons may get as close to giving termis the same fle and rules of cult troops as to make the difference immaterial.

But yeah, two kinds of Oblits is the answer to a question no one was asking. Was anyone ever that keen on charging them forward? As if CSM heavy support wasn't crowded enough. The skeptic in me fears a money-grubbing finecast scheme here. "Sure, zerkers got a nerf and chaos termis are meh, but you can still load your land raider with the new assault oblits and beat faces in! Only $41 for a box of two!"