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changemod wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

changemod wrote:
Anyhow the two studios only -mostly- ignore one another. It'a not actually implausible these are hets and we just need to wait for FW to do an upgrade kit for the variant spears.

For these to work as Hetaeron FW would also need to provide variant armour. Those are TERMINATOR armoured guys while Hetaeron's are on standard custodian armour. You need wee bit more than spear to change armour type.

Not the terminators dude.

The elite looking guys that you apparently missed are in the cabinet. It's four new units: Captain general, terminators, Hetareon-looking guys and jetbikes.

nothing is confirmed abou the unit that you call Haeteron looking guys. could just be the 40k version of the normal custodes we got in the BoP set. the guy in the video said more units will follow, so I am eager to get another squad which represents Haeteron i.e. veterans custodes in power armor.

changemod wrote:

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:

changemod wrote:

 AegisGrimm wrote:
I actually like the idea of Chaos Monsters, Tzaangors on foot and on Discs alongside standard Thousand Sons and their Sorcerers. The last thing Thousand Sons need are Assault and Devastator variants to make them yet another force of Spiky-flavored Space Marines.

I don't think that's a good attitude to take honestly, because they -will- be a flavour of spiky marines by definition. Locking them out of basic roles in a rush to differentiate them isn't going to do them any favours. As is, Rubrics are a durable anti-elite unit, and rubric terminators are a durable anti-elite unit.

and I thought the whole unit of rubrics could be armed with flamers

Expensive, high AP flamers? Yes. Works pretty well as an anti-everything bomb, but pays through the nose for the privilege.

Doesn't really do anything to address the near-complete role overlap of Rubricae units.

but a whole unit of flamers can be anti-horde no? The option is there, and it works against more armoured opponents as well. A versatile unit, particularly against all comers i'd imagine. The cost is a moot point, you're playing Tsons

 Fireball wrote:

changemod wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

changemod wrote:
Anyhow the two studios only -mostly- ignore one another. It'a not actually implausible these are hets and we just need to wait for FW to do an upgrade kit for the variant spears.

For these to work as Hetaeron FW would also need to provide variant armour. Those are TERMINATOR armoured guys while Hetaeron's are on standard custodian armour. You need wee bit more than spear to change armour type.

Not the terminators dude.

The elite looking guys that you apparently missed are in the cabinet. It's four new units: Captain general, terminators, Hetareon-looking guys and jetbikes.

nothing is confirmed abou the unit that you call Haeteron looking guys. could just be the 40k version of the normal custodes we got in the BoP set. the guy in the video said more units will follow, so I am eager to get another squad which represents Haeteron i.e. veterans custodes in power armor.

I'll try my level best to take what you just said seriously...

The normal Custodes -are- the 40k version of regular Custodes. We know full well that these guys are a new unit in fancier robes, and the current Custodes kit is a full kit, not a snapfit starter model set.

We can also see in this group photo that both units are present in an example army.

I think the models are really cool. The jet bikes looks amazing. If I had to guess though, this is going to be one expensive release. The 3 terminators could be a tiny bit more than the 3 Deathshroud terminator box. The jet bikes could easily be 50 pounds for 3.

changemod wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

changemod wrote:
Anyhow the two studios only -mostly- ignore one another. It'a not actually implausible these are hets and we just need to wait for FW to do an upgrade kit for the variant spears.

For these to work as Hetaeron FW would also need to provide variant armour. Those are TERMINATOR armoured guys while Hetaeron's are on standard custodian armour. You need wee bit more than spear to change armour type.

Not the terminators dude.

The elite looking guys that you apparently missed are in the cabinet. It's four new units: Captain general, terminators, Hetareon-looking guys and jetbikes.

Ah good point. Damn OP doesn't have all the pics.

Though bit...Dunno plain(?) for inner circle of Emperor's bodyguard which are all basically equilavent of space marine captain(hell stats are pretty much same). Now good they are not super-hyper-dyper blinged up but was still expecting bit more for Hetaeron...

Also seeing GW is hell bent on making sure the new plastics aren't usable in 30k would seem weird if they would suddenly get 30k unit in plastic or even easy to convert(termies and bikes sure aren't). Well here's hoping! I would like squad of those inner circle bodyguards.

tneva82 wrote:

changemod wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

changemod wrote:
Anyhow the two studios only -mostly- ignore one another. It'a not actually implausible these are hets and we just need to wait for FW to do an upgrade kit for the variant spears.

For these to work as Hetaeron FW would also need to provide variant armour. Those are TERMINATOR armoured guys while Hetaeron's are on standard custodian armour. You need wee bit more than spear to change armour type.

Not the terminators dude.

The elite looking guys that you apparently missed are in the cabinet. It's four new units: Captain general, terminators, Hetareon-looking guys and jetbikes.

Ah good point. Damn OP doesn't have all the pics.

Though bit...Dunno plain(?) for inner circle of Emperor's bodyguard which are all basically equilavent of space marine captain(hell stats are pretty much same). Now good they are not super-hyper-dyper blinged up but was still expecting bit more for Hetaeron...

Also seeing GW is hell bent on making sure the new plastics aren't usable in 30k would seem weird if they would suddenly get 30k unit in plastic or even easy to convert(termies and bikes sure aren't). Well here's hoping! I would like squad of those inner circle bodyguards.

thanks for also thinking that the new unit is cool, but not what you would expect of Haeteron ...

tneva82 wrote:
Also seeing GW is hell bent on making sure the new plastics aren't usable in 30k would seem weird if they would suddenly get 30k unit in plastic or even easy to convert(termies and bikes sure aren't). Well here's hoping! I would like squad of those inner circle bodyguards.

What gives you the idea they don't want them used in 30k? So far there is no 30k red book for Talons, just the list in Inferno. In fact the Talons seem to be the only 30k army without a red book list. So when FW do get round to updating the 30k list I would not be shocked to see the new plastics in there as well.

GoatboyBeta wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
Also seeing GW is hell bent on making sure the new plastics aren't usable in 30k would seem weird if they would suddenly get 30k unit in plastic or even easy to convert(termies and bikes sure aren't). Well here's hoping! I would like squad of those inner circle bodyguards.

What gives you the idea they don't want them used in 30k? So far there is no 30k red book for Talons, just the list in Inferno. In fact the Talons seem to be the only 30k army without a red book list. So when FW do get round to updating the 30k list I would not be shocked to see the new plastics in there as well.

Well that's guess. So far nobody has said a word about 30k rules. I'm going with what we KNOW. Not what MIGHT be. No FACTS about 30k rules incoming and neither terminators nor bikes are usable in 30k without new rules.

I hope they get 30k rules but then again I hoped for balanced and interesting rules for 8th ed. And new variable IG plastics(some which might also work for 30k) have been on my hope list for years(well 30k part only for a year). Just because one hopes for something doesn't mean it will be so.

tneva82 wrote:

Well that's guess. So far nobody has said a word about 30k rules. I'm going with what we KNOW. Not what MIGHT be. No FACTS about 30k rules incoming and neither terminators nor bikes are usable in 30k without new rules.

I hope they get 30k rules but then again I hoped for balanced and interesting rules for 8th ed. And new variable IG plastics(some which might also work for 30k) have been on my hope list for years(well 30k part only for a year). Just because one hopes for something doesn't mean it will be so.

Your right there is no info about them getting 30k rules. Just as there is also no info about them not getting 30k rules either. But if FW are going to port some of there 30k units into 8th to work with the codex, its not a massive leap to think they would add the new plastics to there 30k Talons list as well. So maybe hold off on proclaiming the sky is falling just yet?

GoatboyBeta wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Well that's guess. So far nobody has said a word about 30k rules. I'm going with what we KNOW. Not what MIGHT be. No FACTS about 30k rules incoming and neither terminators nor bikes are usable in 30k without new rules.

I hope they get 30k rules but then again I hoped for balanced and interesting rules for 8th ed. And new variable IG plastics(some which might also work for 30k) have been on my hope list for years(well 30k part only for a year). Just because one hopes for something doesn't mean it will be so.

Your right there is no info about them getting 30k rules. Just as there is also no info about them not getting 30k rules either. But if FW are going to port some of there 30k units into 8th to work with the codex, its not a massive leap to think they would add the new plastics to there 30k Talons list as well. So maybe hold off on proclaiming the sky is falling just yet?

Given that the new models I've seen thus far (Terminators and Jetbikes) could be easily implemented in 30k with a few lines adding, what, two or three weapon options to the existing Aquilon and Agamatus rules?

Even if FW doesn't go and write them 30k rules they're incredibly easy proxies/conversion bases.

 AnomanderRake wrote:

GoatboyBeta wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Well that's guess. So far nobody has said a word about 30k rules. I'm going with what we KNOW. Not what MIGHT be. No FACTS about 30k rules incoming and neither terminators nor bikes are usable in 30k without new rules.

I hope they get 30k rules but then again I hoped for balanced and interesting rules for 8th ed. And new variable IG plastics(some which might also work for 30k) have been on my hope list for years(well 30k part only for a year). Just because one hopes for something doesn't mean it will be so.

Your right there is no info about them getting 30k rules. Just as there is also no info about them not getting 30k rules either. But if FW are going to port some of there 30k units into 8th to work with the codex, its not a massive leap to think they would add the new plastics to there 30k Talons list as well. So maybe hold off on proclaiming the sky is falling just yet?

Given that the new models I've seen thus far (Terminators and Jetbikes) could be easily implemented in 30k with a few lines adding, what, two or three weapon options to the existing Aquilon and Agamatus rules?

Even if FW doesn't go and write them 30k rules they're incredibly easy proxies/conversion bases.

Also even if FW doesn't it's not unreasonable to assume that the custodes may have had time to develop over the past 10k years. Not ALL Space Marine units are avaliable in 30k eaither. And we just accpet the lack of razorbacks, land raider crusaders, etc

 Breotan wrote:
I just saw a picture from GW of a Thousand Sons' Hellbrute. Why would they have a Hellbrute? I thought the whole thing with the rubric was to eliminate mutation by giving us lobotimized ghosts in rubric armor. I'm pretty sure they don't put Tzaangors in dreadnought armor.

Either

-The pilot was in the Hellbrute back during the Rubric, and so it's essentially a giant Thousand Son marine.

-The pilot could be a Sorcerer on life support.

-Its not a Thousand Son at all. Nothing really forces a Dreadnought pilot to be a Astartes. Maybe it's either a test subject or even a prisoner from another warband or captured Loyalist Astartes, forced into a Hellbrute as a form of servitude, limbs amputated, chemically altered and lobotomized to be slaved to the leader of the Thousand Sons warband. All sorts of horrible things are possible with Chaos forces!

You just need the right sadistic imagination. Remember Chaos is the same faction that thought up the Daemonculabla (spelling?).

I'd buy Tzaangornauts

GoatboyBeta wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Well that's guess. So far nobody has said a word about 30k rules. I'm going with what we KNOW. Not what MIGHT be. No FACTS about 30k rules incoming and neither terminators nor bikes are usable in 30k without new rules.

I hope they get 30k rules but then again I hoped for balanced and interesting rules for 8th ed. And new variable IG plastics(some which might also work for 30k) have been on my hope list for years(well 30k part only for a year). Just because one hopes for something doesn't mean it will be so.

Your right there is no info about them getting 30k rules. Just as there is also no info about them not getting 30k rules either. But if FW are going to port some of there 30k units into 8th to work with the codex, its not a massive leap to think they would add the new plastics to there 30k Talons list as well. So maybe hold off on proclaiming the sky is falling just yet?

Cynical mode on - actually it's pretty massive leap, seeing 40K plastics just made most of their range obsolete by looking far better and being cheaper, so I can see the studio show the middle finger to 30K players just like they did keeping 7th ed rules and try to prop up their collapsed sales by including rules for resin only. They just deleted whole family of weapons from 30K (grav) despite multiple units having them in HH books, as well as some plastic Ad Mech guns, and are trying to pretend graviton guns and Mechanicum weapon upgrade packs are only thing that was at war with Eastasia...

If there's a chance to sell you another book tongive you different rules for your gold NotMarines in PrequelHammer you *know* they'll take it...

 Irbis wrote:

GoatboyBeta wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Well that's guess. So far nobody has said a word about 30k rules. I'm going with what we KNOW. Not what MIGHT be. No FACTS about 30k rules incoming and neither terminators nor bikes are usable in 30k without new rules.

I hope they get 30k rules but then again I hoped for balanced and interesting rules for 8th ed. And new variable IG plastics(some which might also work for 30k) have been on my hope list for years(well 30k part only for a year). Just because one hopes for something doesn't mean it will be so.

Your right there is no info about them getting 30k rules. Just as there is also no info about them not getting 30k rules either. But if FW are going to port some of there 30k units into 8th to work with the codex, its not a massive leap to think they would add the new plastics to there 30k Talons list as well. So maybe hold off on proclaiming the sky is falling just yet?

Cynical mode on - actually it's pretty massive leap, seeing 40K plastics just made most of their range obsolete by looking far better and being cheaper, so I can see the studio show the middle finger to 30K players just like they did keeping 7th ed rules and try to prop up their collapsed sales by including rules for resin only. They just deleted whole family of weapons from 30K (grav) despite multiple units having them in HH books, as well as some plastic Ad Mech guns, and are trying to pretend graviton guns and Mechanicum weapon upgrade packs are only thing that was at war with Eastasia...

...What grav weaponry did they 'delete'? The 40k grav-guns (the ones that wound based on armour save) have never been in 30k, the entire reason there are "grav-guns" and "graviton guns" is that GW and Forge World brought back the grav-guns from 2e independently without talking to each other.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
...What grav weaponry did they 'delete'? The 40k grav-guns (the ones that wound based on armour save) have never been in 30k, the entire reason there are "grav-guns" and "graviton guns" is that GW and Forge World brought back the grav-guns from 2e independently without talking to each other.

Wrong. Graviton Imploders used 40K rules for grav, and it actually had a very neat little explanation - graviton guns being precise, yet weaker 'tractor beams' type of thing, whereas later grav was brutal, club like device developed by someone who went 'mate, I don't need all these fancy modes, just make something that will hit the target real hard, thank you'. It served as a precursor of 40K stuff, both serving to show weapon development, and subtly implying how tech got worse later (due to requirements getting more pragmatic and users wanting brutal, cheap, easily produced weaponry, not an elegant weapon for a more civilized age) in much better way than grimderp 'we duh forgut bluprints mate'. And now, since people were using plastic bits instead of 50$ FW upgrade packs, the fun and subtlety is gone. And I say this as someone who hated grav weapon rules

 Irbis wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
...What grav weaponry did they 'delete'? The 40k grav-guns (the ones that wound based on armour save) have never been in 30k, the entire reason there are "grav-guns" and "graviton guns" is that GW and Forge World brought back the grav-guns from 2e independently without talking to each other.

Wrong. Graviton Imploders used 40K rules for grav, and it actually had a very neat little explanation - graviton guns being precise, yet weaker 'tractor beams' type of thing, whereas later grav was brutal, club like device developed by someone who went 'mate, I don't need all these fancy modes, just make something that will hit the target real hard, thank you'. It served as a precursor of 40K stuff, both serving to show weapon development, and subtly implying how tech got worse later (due to requirements getting more pragmatic and users wanting brutal, cheap, easily produced weaponry, not an elegant weapon for a more civilized age) in much better way than grimderp 'we duh forgut bluprints mate'. And now, since people were using plastic bits instead of 50$ FW upgrade packs, the fun and subtlety is gone. And I say this as someone who hated grav weapon rules

Remind me what's stopping you from using the plastic grav-gun bit to represent a graviton gun? Where's the grav-gun model to confuse it with?

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 Irbis wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
...What grav weaponry did they 'delete'? The 40k grav-guns (the ones that wound based on armour save) have never been in 30k, the entire reason there are "grav-guns" and "graviton guns" is that GW and Forge World brought back the grav-guns from 2e independently without talking to each other.

Wrong. Graviton Imploders used 40K rules for grav, and it actually had a very neat little explanation - graviton guns being precise, yet weaker 'tractor beams' type of thing, whereas later grav was brutal, club like device developed by someone who went 'mate, I don't need all these fancy modes, just make something that will hit the target real hard, thank you'. It served as a precursor of 40K stuff, both serving to show weapon development, and subtly implying how tech got worse later (due to requirements getting more pragmatic and users wanting brutal, cheap, easily produced weaponry, not an elegant weapon for a more civilized age) in much better way than grimderp 'we duh forgut bluprints mate'. And now, since people were using plastic bits instead of 50$ FW upgrade packs, the fun and subtlety is gone. And I say this as someone who hated grav weapon rules

Remind me what's stopping you from using the plastic grav-gun bit to represent a graviton gun? Where's the grav-gun model to confuse it with?

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Graviton-Gun-Set-2015

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
And the Ogroid Thaumaturge as a kind of 'bruiser' HQ for Tzeentch armies, like a Tzeentch Beastman Daemon Prince. That'd be awesome.

Oh yea! I almost forgot, because i've been using the Ogroid as a DP.

 Breotan wrote:
I just saw a picture from GW of a Thousand Sons' Hellbrute. Why would they have a Hellbrute? I thought the whole thing with the rubric was to eliminate mutation by giving us lobotimized ghosts in rubric armor. I'm pretty sure they don't put Tzaangors in dreadnought armor.

The helbrute is the last "non-fluffy" unit in the Thousand Sons list, it's true. It'd either have to be a normal dreadnought that got Rubric'd or there would have to be a psyker inside, and obviously neither of those things are the case with the base CSM helbrute.

 Arachnofiend wrote:

 Breotan wrote:
I just saw a picture from GW of a Thousand Sons' Hellbrute. Why would they have a Hellbrute? I thought the whole thing with the rubric was to eliminate mutation by giving us lobotimized ghosts in rubric armor. I'm pretty sure they don't put Tzaangors in dreadnought armor.

The helbrute is the last "non-fluffy" unit in the Thousand Sons list, it's true. It'd either have to be a normal dreadnought that got Rubric'd or there would have to be a psyker inside, and obviously neither of those things are the case with the base CSM helbrute.

It'd be nice if TS did get a psyker Dread, sort of how like BA get Libby Dreads. It'd fit with the army.

I have an old FW TS Chaos Dread that could use that to great effect.

Like I said above, I don't think anything about dreadnoughts, especially Chaos ones where the pilot's longevity is not a care, necessarily means the guy inside has to be an Astartes (especially when Chaos sorcery is involved to facilitate things), and even if it did, it's not like being interred has to be voluntary when you don't care if the Dread is a rage-monster on the battlefield.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Graviton-Gun-Set-2015

Okay, let me try again.

What does the plastic grav-gun model represent in 30k?

If you were to field models with plastic grav-gun models and say "these guys have graviton weapons" who would you confuse?

This isn't an army I am interested in, but those jetbikes sure are nice looking.

I've never been so hyped and let down so quickly by a GW announcement.

Well since we have another thread for custodes news, I'm going to lock up this one.