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So, i've done loads of glass cannon armies, and have pseudo-durability in the form of model recycling with my Legions of Nagash. I'm looking to try the pure durability end of the spectrum for my next build. Is any army currently both competitive, but primarily focused on defense vs. offense?

Can big blobs of Fyreslayers still reach those 2+ re-rolling saves? I'd be tempted as I love Dwarves and want an excuse to buy Gotrek. I'm guessing Nurgle or Mortal Nurgle still fits the tanky bill?

Well Slaanesh seems insane in the you kill them and they bring it all back and more.

Fyreslayers is a good candidate for traditional hardiness.

They nerfed 2++ saves, realizing that shockingly people hate playing against that kind of thing lol.

I would say that Nighthaunt is up there for durability of the army.

Un-rendable saves across the whole army, numerous ways to return slain models and high leadership.

You can also field a lot of them if you wanted due to the awesome Chainrasps.

 auticus wrote:
They nerfed 2++ saves, realizing that shockingly people hate playing against that kind of thing lol.

For what it is worth, I wouldn't have busted that out anyway at a casual game. For whatever reason (couldn't tell you why), AoS is the one system locally that has both a fun/casual playerbase and a tournament power-game one... with even a few healthy folks able to switch sensibly. I actually wish I could say this was the case for other local games which only manage to do one or the other.

I do own a lot of Nighthaunt, but would worry it would just feel like more Legions of Nagash.

So how do Slaneesh work currently? I mean... I don't traditionally associate them with durability. Likewise, what Fyreslayers builds actually work competitively?

Thanks a lot guys!

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:

 auticus wrote:
They nerfed 2++ saves, realizing that shockingly people hate playing against that kind of thing lol.

For what it is worth, I wouldn't have busted that out anyway at a casual game. For whatever reason (couldn't tell you why), AoS is the one system locally that has both a fun/casual playerbase and a tournament power-game one... with even a few healthy folks able to switch sensibly. I actually wish I could say this was the case for other local games which only manage to do one or the other.

I do own a lot of Nighthaunt, but would worry it would just feel like more Legions of Nagash.

So how do Slaneesh work currently? I mean... I don't traditionally associate them with durability. Likewise, what Fyreslayers builds actually work competitively?

Thanks a lot guys!

Slaanesh isn't realy durable, you just try to make your opponent fight last with the locus ability that all the hedonite heros have. The locus ability states:
pick a single enemy unit within 6" and on a 4+ that unit fights last, add 2 to the roll for a keeper of secrets and each unit can only be affected by the locus once. But other then that they don't have any real durability, most has a 5+ save with a few 4+ saves. The contored epitome has a 2+ save against mortal wounds, but only a 5+ against normal wounds. Slaanesh does have some healing(2 spells and an option on the keeper) and summoning which can get crazy against certain opponents

Slaanesh's main things are doing damage before you can respond, and then if you have min/max'd properly being able to generate a crazy amount of depravity to summon a ton of free points extra to replace your losses, as the army has little durability.

It's not so much that Slaanesh is durable, they just have a really solid summoning mechanic that allows them to replenish losses. It's dependent on the other army having alot of multi-wound models though so it shakes apart against hordes.

Definitely not what I am looking for, in that case. As I mentioned, I have done the mass return of models thing with Legions of Nagash, i'm just very much looking for a different experience at the table.

How about traditionally durable things like Nurgle? Are Mortal or Daemon Nurgle at all super-tanky?

Mortals are pretty trash. Daemons of nurgle are what I'd consider one of the tanky armies in the game because of their additional save against every type of wound plus the ability to summon.

Mortals are trash? As a long-time Nurgle player I completely disagree; blightkings exist. Blightkings kick ass and essentially subsidize the entire Nurgle allegiance with how good they are. A harbinger of decay can give them the same 5+ fnp daemons get, too.

I never got much use out of mine. I had a couple games where they would do well. The rest of the time they were a liability. I did pretty well otherwise with the army as a whole, I just found I did much better when I minimized the mortal part of the list.

Fyreslayers with the Hearthguard Berserker block are incredibly tanky and resilient. It requires some character support, however, and the army outside of that block isn't remarkably durable beyond normal dudes. They're just dwarves with 2 wounds.

Daughters of Khaine with the right prayers and buffs can stack a lot of durability, but again is dependent on character support. Morathi is a pretty good beatstick as well; she can only take 3 damage in any given turn, but savvy people know how to land Endless spells on her to sneak extra damage each turn.

Idoneth Deepkin with their eels are surprisingly robust, with a 4+ (I think, might be 3+) that ignores rend. The army is fast enough to pick it's fights too, which gives it surprising longevity. Pick the wrong fight(s) or get caught out and they do crumble though.

You already play Legions, so something like Legion of Grief, which combines the ethereal saves of Nighthaunt with the summoning mechanic from Legions is durable in the sense that your army can make trades, whittling opponents down without diminishing itself over the course of the game.

Nurgle daemons are surprisingly tanky, but they also do nothing in return, so you're banking on your opponent mis-playing or luck of dice (bad luck for them).

I'm not sure what else you're going to get for "durability"; stuff dies in AoS.

Honorable mention to Sacrosanct Stormcast. Sequitors with a Castellant supporting roll around with a 3+ re-rollable save (healing on natural 7s, which means 6s because the Castellant provides a +1). Add a Lord Arcanum for Cycle of the Storm to recycle a model a turn before it dies.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
So, i've done loads of glass cannon armies, and have pseudo-durability in the form of model recycling with my Legions of Nagash. I'm looking to try the pure durability end of the spectrum for my next build. Is any army currently both competitive, but primarily focused on defense vs. offense?

Can big blobs of Fyreslayers still reach those 2+ re-rolling saves? I'd be tempted as I love Dwarves and want an excuse to buy Gotrek. I'm guessing Nurgle or Mortal Nurgle still fits the tanky bill?

Fyreslayers are probably what you are looking for. They all have at least 2 wounds base, and Hearthguard bersekers can be buffed to be very durable.

Fyreslayers are also considered to be pretty competitive as well, as the entire book is pretty good. The current competitive king is Slaanesh though.

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Honorable mention to Sacrosanct Stormcast. Sequitors with a Castellant supporting roll around with a 3+ re-rollable save (healing on natural 7s, which means 6s because the Castellant provides a +1). Add a Lord Arcanum for Cycle of the Storm to recycle a model a turn before it dies.

than its not natural 7s or else it would be useless

Slaanesh will only be king until the next faq drops and ups the keeper's points. Which should be around december time.

terry wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Honorable mention to Sacrosanct Stormcast. Sequitors with a Castellant supporting roll around with a 3+ re-rollable save (healing on natural 7s, which means 6s because the Castellant provides a +1). Add a Lord Arcanum for Cycle of the Storm to recycle a model a turn before it dies.

than its not natural 7s or else it would be useless

Sorry, you're right. Just 7s.

Fyreslayers sound fun, fit the bill, and let me paint up a Gotrek just for fun. Plus I imagine they'll be a nice, quick paint, assuming I buy a half-gallon of Contrast Fyreslayer Flesh. :-p

Thanks again all. I really appreciate all of your suggestions.

 obsidiankatana wrote:

terry wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Honorable mention to Sacrosanct Stormcast. Sequitors with a Castellant supporting roll around with a 3+ re-rollable save (healing on natural 7s, which means 6s because the Castellant provides a +1). Add a Lord Arcanum for Cycle of the Storm to recycle a model a turn before it dies.

than its not natural 7s or else it would be useless

Sorry, you're right. Just 7s.

Any amount of rend eliminates the healing aspect, unfortunately.

It’s not that hard to set it up so that a 20+ block of Plaguebearers is at -4 to shoot at and -2 to hit in melee, with the opponent having to reroll 6s in melee. Coupled with their native FNP save after the save and Nurgle’s healing, it can be very hard to get rid of them. As noted though they’re purely an anvil; you’ll need something like buffed up Plague Monks or Blightkings to do the actual killing.

The Spiny Dryads brick doesn't work as well as it used to, but it doesn't need as many abilities to go off to work anymore and a block of infantry with a rerollable 3+ that return mortal wounds to their attackers on saves of 4+ in melee are certainly infuriating.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
The Spiny Dryads brick doesn't work as well as it used to, but it doesn't need as many abilities to go off to work anymore and a block of infantry with a rerollable 3+ that return mortal wounds to their attackers on saves of 4+ in melee are certainly infuriating.

I'm not familiar with the new Sylvaneth. What are Spiny Dryads?

Sisters of the Thorn have a spell that gives a unit re-roll failed saves and saves of a 6+ bounce a mortal wound to the attacker. Dryads are a natural choice as they get +1 from their own warscroll ability and are often standing in cover for another +1, meaning a 4+ will generate a mortal wound (provided the enemy doesn't have rend).

Eternal guard looking to take the place of dryads with the 3+ if the dont move that turn. Which means always a 3+ on enemies turn for a infantry unit thats not much more expensive than dryads. For added laughs sit em next to a lord with the artifact that makes them immune to morale. I forget which city has that artifact but it also gives them a 5+ to ignore enemy spells

 Mythantor wrote:
Eternal guard looking to take the place of dryads with the 3+ if the dont move that turn. Which means always a 3+ on enemies turn for a infantry unit thats not much more expensive than dryads. For added laughs sit em next to a lord with the artifact that makes them immune to morale. I forget which city has that artifact but it also gives them a 5+ to ignore enemy spells

so a 2+ save when in cover with +1 to hit and wound when not moving that turn. Hallowheart for a +5 ignore spell/endless spell effects (not just damage). General with ignore battleshock command trait. For fun have a Wizard give them all +1 ignore spell effects roll.

You are not moving that unit off that point.

BomBomHotdog wrote:

 Mythantor wrote:
Eternal guard looking to take the place of dryads with the 3+ if the dont move that turn. Which means always a 3+ on enemies turn for a infantry unit thats not much more expensive than dryads. For added laughs sit em next to a lord with the artifact that makes them immune to morale. I forget which city has that artifact but it also gives them a 5+ to ignore enemy spells

so a 2+ save when in cover with +1 to hit and wound when not moving that turn. Hallowheart for a +5 ignore spell/endless spell effects (not just damage). General with ignore battleshock command trait. For fun have a Wizard give them all +1 ignore spell effects roll.

You are not moving that unit off that point.

Oops I messed up yeh its command trait not an artifact. Also Sisters of the Thorn are a natural inclusion in the army to give them cover wherver they are and because of hallowheart they even get two spells a turn so they can give them mystic shield as well

BomBomHotdog wrote:

 Mythantor wrote:
Eternal guard looking to take the place of dryads with the 3+ if the dont move that turn. Which means always a 3+ on enemies turn for a infantry unit thats not much more expensive than dryads. For added laughs sit em next to a lord with the artifact that makes them immune to morale. I forget which city has that artifact but it also gives them a 5+ to ignore enemy spells

so a 2+ save when in cover with +1 to hit and wound when not moving that turn. Hallowheart for a +5 ignore spell/endless spell effects (not just damage). General with ignore battleshock command trait. For fun have a Wizard give them all +1 ignore spell effects roll.

You are not moving that unit off that point.

Anything that deals mortal wounds in shooting/combat will still mow through them, unfortunately. Those things are not uncommon in general, getting more frequent and more eggregious the more competitive the meta. That is the real bane of many otherwise-durable builds.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

BomBomHotdog wrote:

 Mythantor wrote:
Eternal guard looking to take the place of dryads with the 3+ if the dont move that turn. Which means always a 3+ on enemies turn for a infantry unit thats not much more expensive than dryads. For added laughs sit em next to a lord with the artifact that makes them immune to morale. I forget which city has that artifact but it also gives them a 5+ to ignore enemy spells

so a 2+ save when in cover with +1 to hit and wound when not moving that turn. Hallowheart for a +5 ignore spell/endless spell effects (not just damage). General with ignore battleshock command trait. For fun have a Wizard give them all +1 ignore spell effects roll.

You are not moving that unit off that point.

Anything that deals mortal wounds in shooting/combat will still mow through them, unfortunately. Those things are not uncommon in general, getting more frequent and more eggregious the more competitive the meta. That is the real bane of many otherwise-durable builds.

But in the end its just 330points for a 30 man unit so cant expect it to do everything

You mentioned a number of buffs coming from other units, so falling back to just it's own cost is a bit disingenuous.