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Made in us
Numberless Necron Warrior




As soon as the Imp Fists join in the meta the Doom 6 are done. After CA 2019 we will need to do something different to hang in there.
   
Made in dk
Deranged Necron Destroyer






Pyrothem wrote:
As soon as the Imp Fists join in the meta the Doom 6 are done. After CA 2019 we will need to do something different to hang in there.

We don't get any lists nearly as viable without 3+ vehicles, it might just have to be a 20% win-rate matchup, but even if you find a 60% WR list against IF you will most likely lose a major chunk of win-rate against other factions. Melee is next to hopeless when a TFC can halve the movement of two units. I can't see LG or Wraith spam working for that reason. Destroyer spam could replace vehicles, I don't think it'll be worth it.
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Perfected Haemonculi Living Sculpture






 vict0988 wrote:
Pyrothem wrote:
As soon as the Imp Fists join in the meta the Doom 6 are done. After CA 2019 we will need to do something different to hang in there.

We don't get any lists nearly as viable without 3+ vehicles, it might just have to be a 20% win-rate matchup, but even if you find a 60% WR list against IF you will most likely lose a major chunk of win-rate against other factions. Melee is next to hopeless when a TFC can halve the movement of two units. I can't see LG or Wraith spam working for that reason. Destroyer spam could replace vehicles, I don't think it'll be worth it.


Like anything, it will take a mix. One thing is for sure though, immortals have been dropping like flies in my list. I used to run at least 2x10 telsa immortals but I am finding myself more and more likely to just take min squads now.

   
Made in us
On a Canoptek Spyder's Waiting List




South Carolina

I have found success with the opposite. I run 30 to 40 immortals with imo/overlord support. If taken in small numbers, such as 20, they haven't the critical mass of fire to clear the field of any poor slob who moved infantry within '24 of that ruin.

With 40 on the field, all tesla on 5s or 4s, things die. It also makes your Imo/over combo more points efficient, as 4 squads is the most efficient use of the orders coming out of that combo.

I usually do not invest into improving res prots or giving them an invuln. A battalion of 30 to 40 MWBD immortals lives not by saves, but by being the most efficient choice for walking through a ruin wall and killing everything withing 24 on the other side.

Always Confident. Occasionally Correct. 
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





Somewhere over the rainbow, way up high

Ugh...feel like I got hit by a truck today. I didn't run my most competitive list ever, was told it was a friendly scenario game.

Squared off against my buddy's new Iron Hands.
Iron Father...Sniper Rifles everywhere, 2 invictor warsuits.

After losing the roll off to go first despite the +1 to the roll, and failing to seize, those invictor warsuits walk up an inch away from me, and I lose 20 fearless warriors, and 9 of 10 of my immortals, (All in a chronometron bubble) and a squad of tomb blades too...

I managed to drag things out into a game, which had to end on time at the bottom of turn 3. Only thing keeping me in the game was Nihilakh doomsday arks rolling 6s for their shot numbers like champs and a squad of Lychguard with sword and board body guarding my lord, overlord, and cryptek with/chrono. Soaked up a lot of damage from the sniper rifles and then speed bumped and ground their way through an ironclad character, and 10 intercessors.
Niche, but they did a good job.

Now my point

How the frak is there any counter-play to those stupid warsuits, and Iron Hands in general?
The whole army just sits in dev doctrine all game, functionally ignoring cover with the bonus AP, and rerolls everywhere.
I knew from the reviews it was rough, but SHEESH.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/10 03:14:50


Bedouin Dynasty: 9000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4k pts
The Emperor's Finest 3k pts

MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum. 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Perfected Haemonculi Living Sculpture






 DogHeadGod wrote:
I have found success with the opposite. I run 30 to 40 immortals with imo/overlord support. If taken in small numbers, such as 20, they haven't the critical mass of fire to clear the field of any poor slob who moved infantry within '24 of that ruin.

With 40 on the field, all tesla on 5s or 4s, things die. It also makes your Imo/over combo more points efficient, as 4 squads is the most efficient use of the orders coming out of that combo.

I usually do not invest into improving res prots or giving them an invuln. A battalion of 30 to 40 MWBD immortals lives not by saves, but by being the most efficient choice for walking through a ruin wall and killing everything withing 24 on the other side.


I just find tesla is irrelevant verse primaris though, especially if they are using stealth trait or sitting in actual cover. 10 tesla immortals with MWBD only kills an intercessor and wounds a second if they are in cover. I wouldn't consider that great. I still like them, don't get me wrong, but they die twice as fast in return. It gets even more silly when you factor in the additional AP they get for doctrines. I think Necrons will be in a better spot after CA19, the army won't ever function on a high level until it gets a rewrite, but at least we can squeeze a few more guns into a list with a point cut. 8th is kind of in a bad place ATM though, the game is way too lethal and the supplements opened Pandora's box, there isn't an elegant fix to those. Should be an interesting year, I am betting there is a core rule update sometime next year. But thats just speculation.

   
Made in de
Chalice-Wielding Sanguinary High Priest






Germany

 Red Corsair wrote:

I just find tesla is irrelevant verse primaris though, especially if they are using stealth trait or sitting in actual cover. 10 tesla immortals with MWBD only kills an intercessor and wounds a second if they are in cover. I wouldn't consider that great. I still like them, don't get me wrong, but they die twice as fast in return. It gets even more silly when you factor in the additional AP they get for doctrines. I think Necrons will be in a better spot after CA19, the army won't ever function on a high level until it gets a rewrite, but at least we can squeeze a few more guns into a list with a point cut. 8th is kind of in a bad place ATM though, the game is way too lethal and the supplements opened Pandora's box, there isn't an elegant fix to those. Should be an interesting year, I am betting there is a core rule update sometime next year. But thats just speculation.


You do know there is a stratagem which removes the benefit of cover ? And tomb blades can use nebuloscopes, no bonus for cover.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/11/10 07:44:45


 
   
Made in dk
Deranged Necron Destroyer






 Red Corsair wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:
Pyrothem wrote:
As soon as the Imp Fists join in the meta the Doom 6 are done. After CA 2019 we will need to do something different to hang in there.

We don't get any lists nearly as viable without 3+ vehicles, it might just have to be a 20% win-rate matchup, but even if you find a 60% WR list against IF you will most likely lose a major chunk of win-rate against other factions. Melee is next to hopeless when a TFC can halve the movement of two units. I can't see LG or Wraith spam working for that reason. Destroyer spam could replace vehicles, I don't think it'll be worth it.


Like anything, it will take a mix. One thing is for sure though, immortals have been dropping like flies in my list. I used to run at least 2x10 telsa immortals but I am finding myself more and more likely to just take min squads now.

I've run 58 Tesla Immortals twice against IH, won both times through objectives by pressuring my opponent, staying out of LOS and taking objectives. I tried running 18 Wraiths against IH and I got destroyed because trying to kill things with Wraiths requires them to get into melee.

 iGuy91 wrote:
Ugh...feel like I got hit by a truck today. I didn't run my most competitive list ever, was told it was a friendly scenario game.

Squared off against my buddy's new Iron Hands.
Iron Father...Sniper Rifles everywhere, 2 invictor warsuits.

Sounds like you need to have a talk with your opponent about what constitutes a friendly scenario.

How the frak is there any counter-play to those stupid warsuits, and Iron Hands in general?
The whole army just sits in dev doctrine all game, functionally ignoring cover with the bonus AP, and rerolls everywhere.
I knew from the reviews it was rough, but SHEESH.

Just shoot them, they don't have an invuln. If you'd gone first you would have destroyed at least one, pretty likely both of them depending on exactly how friendly your army was and deployment. A friendly army getting annihilated by a competitive army isn't anything new, the same thing would happen if you played against competitive Knights or Craftworlds most likely. I don't know what I'm hoping for with CA19, I don't want to be too optimistic, I'd prefer if SM got nerfed but TF Stratagems, Combat Doctrines, IH and successors probably won't be touched before spring FAQ 2020, pts most likely won't be changed until CA20 as they wait and see what impacts any buffs they implement in CA19 has and any nerfs they implement to rules in Spring. Combat Doctrines was implemented quite badly, how it could be anything but obvious that you'd sit in one Doctrine all game when you can build your army around one Doctrine instead of three and you get an additional bonus for doing so is pure GW. I get so mad when Podcasters say that it's fluffy, nope, I find the lack of IH Reivers/Assault Marines very unfluffy. I'm still waiting for them to show up. Any day now.
   
Made in ro
Irked Necron Immortal




Here's a question. If CA19 gives us another points drop on warriors, down to 10 pts a model (or even 9pts), would warrior spam become our best bet at dealing with the current meta?

Warriors can still batter space marine infantry around. We have no way to out kill marines and that's not going to change, but would a slight drop in pts for warriors give us a way to outlast them?

If not, what else can we try? QS spam?
   
Made in gb
Wicked Canoptek Wraith




 vict0988 wrote:


 iGuy91 wrote:
Ugh...feel like I got hit by a truck today. I didn't run my most competitive list ever, was told it was a friendly scenario game.

Squared off against my buddy's new Iron Hands.
Iron Father...Sniper Rifles everywhere, 2 invictor warsuits.

Sounds like you need to have a talk with your opponent about what constitutes a friendly scenario.


Probably his opponent was just as surprised by his army’s effectiveness. It takes a while, even for honest brokers, to be able to tell how good their own lists actually are.
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Perfected Haemonculi Living Sculpture






 p5freak wrote:
 Red Corsair wrote:

I just find tesla is irrelevant verse primaris though, especially if they are using stealth trait or sitting in actual cover. 10 tesla immortals with MWBD only kills an intercessor and wounds a second if they are in cover. I wouldn't consider that great. I still like them, don't get me wrong, but they die twice as fast in return. It gets even more silly when you factor in the additional AP they get for doctrines. I think Necrons will be in a better spot after CA19, the army won't ever function on a high level until it gets a rewrite, but at least we can squeeze a few more guns into a list with a point cut. 8th is kind of in a bad place ATM though, the game is way too lethal and the supplements opened Pandora's box, there isn't an elegant fix to those. Should be an interesting year, I am betting there is a core rule update sometime next year. But thats just speculation.


You do know there is a stratagem which removes the benefit of cover ? And tomb blades can use nebuloscopes, no bonus for cover.


Yea and I also actually play the game enough to know that doesn't fix it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 vict0988 wrote:
 Red Corsair wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:
Pyrothem wrote:
As soon as the Imp Fists join in the meta the Doom 6 are done. After CA 2019 we will need to do something different to hang in there.

We don't get any lists nearly as viable without 3+ vehicles, it might just have to be a 20% win-rate matchup, but even if you find a 60% WR list against IF you will most likely lose a major chunk of win-rate against other factions. Melee is next to hopeless when a TFC can halve the movement of two units. I can't see LG or Wraith spam working for that reason. Destroyer spam could replace vehicles, I don't think it'll be worth it.


Like anything, it will take a mix. One thing is for sure though, immortals have been dropping like flies in my list. I used to run at least 2x10 telsa immortals but I am finding myself more and more likely to just take min squads now.

I've run 58 Tesla Immortals twice against IH, won both times through objectives by pressuring my opponent, staying out of LOS and taking objectives. I tried running 18 Wraiths against IH and I got destroyed because trying to kill things with Wraiths requires them to get into melee.



Well not to be dismissive, but you simply saying you ran 60 immortals verse some dude and won, with zero context doesn't really encourage me. I would enjoy a discussion though if you feel like sharing a few more details when you have the time. My best guess is your just bridging the gap with player skill and/or the other guy was running a toned down list. There are plenty of things that scrub immortals without batting an eye. Iron hands are OK, but their are a lot of other traits and builds out there and I am not sure I can believe you can consistently hide 58 models on 32mm bases from an army with some of the best fliers in the game and thunderfire canons. Realistically you would lose all your infantry in ~2 turns verse that bullsh!t and that's not a slight at you, it's just how silly the new marine supplements are. But I would like to know more details, sounds interesting.

I never even mentioned wraiths BTW, nothing in the necron combat section is even remotely worth running unless your playing a friendly game. That we can agree on up front.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/11 00:16:28


   
Made in us
On a Canoptek Spyder's Waiting List




South Carolina

Look at 40 immortals as board control and intense threat to anything 4 tough or less. To be honest, I deal with bigger threats by linking 2 squads to fire at the same target. I do run this competitively, and it works as a solid ITC board control core battalion with strong threat upsides. Run it Imo/Over. I support ot with 3 DDAs, and am playing with concepts on the remaining points after permanently shitcanning the dscythes. Current plan is 3 gauss Tessie Arks.

Always Confident. Occasionally Correct. 
   
Made in cn
One Canoptek Scarab in a Swarm




IanVanCheese wrote:
Here's a question. If CA19 gives us another points drop on warriors, down to 10 pts a model (or even 9pts), would warrior spam become our best bet at dealing with the current meta?

Warriors can still batter space marine infantry around. We have no way to out kill marines and that's not going to change, but would a slight drop in pts for warriors give us a way to outlast them?

If not, what else can we try? QS spam?


In my opinion, not likely. Space Marines have become the killers of Horde Armies and Necron Warriors would suffer the same fate. Those Thunder Fire Cannons and Intercessors on Rapid Fire 2 at 30" means they outrange us and can destroy them quite easily. I think our best units against them would be Wraiths, Destroyers, Doomsday Arks and maybe the 3 Doom Scythes. We need to play more of the Elite variant of Necrons, hordes just get wiped off the table.
   
Made in ro
Irked Necron Immortal




We'll see what CA brings. Nothing can fix us, but maybe it'll nerf everything else into the ground, bring them down to our level.

In the meantime, I guess I have some space marines to get painted.
   
Made in us
Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker





Somewhere over the rainbow, way up high

So have you guys considered what with all the eliminators, scout snipers and the like in the meta, that lychguard may in fact have a place in a small 5 man squad to bodyguard our key characters?
Being able to transfer the wounds over on a 2+, and turning potential d3 wounds and a mortal wound into a single mortal wound could be good math in our benefit.

Without them, my characters would be cowering all game. What are your thoughts?

Bedouin Dynasty: 9000 pts
The Silver Lances: 4k pts
The Emperor's Finest 3k pts

MajorStoffer wrote:
...
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum. 
   
Made in dk
Deranged Necron Destroyer






sieGermans wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:


 iGuy91 wrote:
Ugh...feel like I got hit by a truck today. I didn't run my most competitive list ever, was told it was a friendly scenario game.

Squared off against my buddy's new Iron Hands.
Iron Father...Sniper Rifles everywhere, 2 invictor warsuits.

Sounds like you need to have a talk with your opponent about what constitutes a friendly scenario.


Probably his opponent was just as surprised by his army’s effectiveness. It takes a while, even for honest brokers, to be able to tell how good their own lists actually are.

That'd go with SoB, Necrons or GK, not Iron Hands. You should assume your list is competitive when you play a tier 0 faction, if you can't stand up to your local competitive meta you get to downgrade it to a casual list. A deliberately terrible list can be counted as casual as well. Like Necrons in 7th, compared to Decurion taking a CAD was terrible, so any CAD list was most likely okay in casual games. Maybe if the IH player ran multiple units of Sternguard in Drop Pods or at least a unit of Terminators or Assault Marines.
 Red Corsair wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:
 Red Corsair wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:
Pyrothem wrote:
As soon as the Imp Fists join in the meta the Doom 6 are done. After CA 2019 we will need to do something different to hang in there.

We don't get any lists nearly as viable without 3+ vehicles, it might just have to be a 20% win-rate matchup, but even if you find a 60% WR list against IF you will most likely lose a major chunk of win-rate against other factions. Melee is next to hopeless when a TFC can halve the movement of two units. I can't see LG or Wraith spam working for that reason. Destroyer spam could replace vehicles, I don't think it'll be worth it.


Like anything, it will take a mix. One thing is for sure though, immortals have been dropping like flies in my list. I used to run at least 2x10 telsa immortals but I am finding myself more and more likely to just take min squads now.

I've run 58 Tesla Immortals twice against IH, won both times through objectives by pressuring my opponent, staying out of LOS and taking objectives. I tried running 18 Wraiths against IH and I got destroyed because trying to kill things with Wraiths requires them to get into melee.



Well not to be dismissive, but you simply saying you ran 60 immortals verse some dude and won, with zero context doesn't really encourage me. I would enjoy a discussion though if you feel like sharing a few more details when you have the time. My best guess is your just bridging the gap with player skill and/or the other guy was running a toned down list. There are plenty of things that scrub immortals without batting an eye. Iron hands are OK, but their are a lot of other traits and builds out there and I am not sure I can believe you can consistently hide 58 models on 32mm bases from an army with some of the best fliers in the game and thunderfire canons. Realistically you would lose all your infantry in ~2 turns verse that bullsh!t and that's not a slight at you, it's just how silly the new marine supplements are. But I would like to know more details, sounds interesting.

I never even mentioned wraiths BTW, nothing in the necron combat section is even remotely worth running unless your playing a friendly game. That we can agree on up front.

I didn't mean to say that Immortals are the perfect answer, my opponent misplayed and I misplayed, this isn't tournament statistics and while we were both bringing tournament lists we didn't play at that level. I don't think Immortals should be dismissed though, I was just saying that Wraiths did not feel like a good replacement which theoretically they are. 3+ invul and T5 should be good against AP-2 S4-5, maybe Wraiths are okay but the specific list I brought didn't compare to my usual Immortal spam. Theoretically, complete vehicle spam fails because of IF and Tomb Blades are iffy against the heavy bolt rifles even if you take the invul upgrade.
IanVanCheese wrote:
Here's a question. If CA19 gives us another points drop on warriors, down to 10 pts a model (or even 9pts), would warrior spam become our best bet at dealing with the current meta?

Warriors can still batter space marine infantry around. We have no way to out kill marines and that's not going to change, but would a slight drop in pts for warriors give us a way to outlast them?

If not, what else can we try? QS spam?

Intercessors are very good against Warriors I think, two wounds and the ability to fire twice if they don't move means Warriors would have to be 9 pts to have a chance. Maybe with a Chronometron Cryptek you'd be relatively durable against the heavy bolt rifles and be able to better stand up to Combat Doctrines but Crypteks are IMO overpriced compared to most characters in the game. Warriors become pretty good if you play against lists that can't instantly pop a unit, but Repulsor Executioners and the standard bolt rifle absolutely can. Barring any change in cost for our HQs I think Warriors would need to come down to 8 pts to become popular but I think they'd see a solid amount of play at 9. 10 feels like too much, 11 pt Warriors weren't good against Intercessors before they got beta bolters and I don't think 1 pt cheaper is better than Combat Doctrines, bolter discipline, +1 attack in the first round of combat for Intercessors.

 iGuy91 wrote:
So have you guys considered what with all the eliminators, scout snipers and the like in the meta, that lychguard may in fact have a place in a small 5 man squad to bodyguard our key characters?
Being able to transfer the wounds over on a 2+, and turning potential d3 wounds and a mortal wound into a single mortal wound could be good math in our benefit.

Without them, my characters would be cowering all game. What are your thoughts?

Lychguard Guardian Protocols does not work like Tau Empire Drones Saviour Protocols, your character loses d3+1 wounds and then you get to individually transfer those wounds. That's why Lychguard are bad at being bodyguards and are not worth it in that capacity.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/11/11 14:19:06


 
   
Made in fr
Trazyn's Museum Curator





on the forum. Obviously

 vict0988 wrote:

Lychguard Guardian Protocols does not work like Tau Empire Drones Saviour Protocols, your character loses d3+1 wounds and then you get to individually transfer those wounds. That's why Lychguard are bad at being bodyguards and are not worth it in that capacity.


What? It doesn't work like that. I just checked the rule, it says that if a character takes a wound roll a D6 - on a 2+ Lychguard takes a mortal wound instead. There's nothing about D3+1.

What I have
~4100
~1660
: LM

Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!

A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble

 
   
Made in dk
Deranged Necron Destroyer






 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:

Lychguard Guardian Protocols does not work like Tau Empire Drones Saviour Protocols, your character loses d3+1 wounds and then you get to individually transfer those wounds. That's why Lychguard are bad at being bodyguards and are not worth it in that capacity.


What? It doesn't work like that. I just checked the rule, it says that if a character takes a wound roll a D6 - on a 2+ Lychguard takes a mortal wound instead. There's nothing about D3+1.

You lose a wound when damage is inflicted. So if you get hit and wounded by a weapon with D3 damage that does an additional 1 mortal wound you get your Sv and then for each damage inflicted the Lychguard can roll a D6, for each 2+ rolled the character takes one less wound and the Lychguard suffer one mortal wound. It's better in some circumstances than Shield Drones (against things with no AP), but against snipers it is worse.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/11 16:19:31


 
   
Made in us
Irked Necron Immortal





Jackson, TN

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
 vict0988 wrote:

Lychguard Guardian Protocols does not work like Tau Empire Drones Saviour Protocols, your character loses d3+1 wounds and then you get to individually transfer those wounds. That's why Lychguard are bad at being bodyguards and are not worth it in that capacity.


What? It doesn't work like that. I just checked the rule, it says that if a character takes a wound roll a D6 - on a 2+ Lychguard takes a mortal wound instead. There's nothing about D3+1.


Yeah, the wording is just different enough to be confusing. Guardian Protocols is actually closer to Disgustingly Resilient than Savior Protocols.
Guardian Protocols triggers each time the character "loses a wound", so in this case the Lychguard will be taking up to D3+1 mortal wounds, depending on how many 2+ rolls you can make.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/11/12 02:19:32


 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




trying to make a decent list, not planning for competetive, though the local meta is relatively tough, feedback?
Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Necrons) [67 PL, 8CP, 1,174pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

Dynasty Choice
. Dynasty: Mephrit

+ HQ +

Cryptek [5 PL, 80pts]: Staff of Light

Overlord [6 PL, 139pts]: Artefact: The Veil of Darkness, Resurrection Orb, Voidscythe

+ Troops +

Immortals [8 PL, 150pts]: 10x Immortal, Tesla Carbine

Immortals [4 PL, 75pts]: Gauss Blaster, 5x Immortal

Necron Warriors [6 PL, 110pts]: 10x Necron Warrior

+ Elites +

Lychguard [8 PL, 140pts]: Hyperphase Sword and Dispersion Shield, 5x Lychguard

+ Heavy Support +

Doomsday Ark [10 PL, 160pts]

Doomsday Ark [10 PL, 160pts]

Doomsday Ark [10 PL, 160pts]

++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Necrons) [49 PL, 1CP, 819pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Detachment CP [1CP]

Dynasty Choice
. Dynasty: Mephrit

+ HQ +

Catacomb Command Barge [9 PL, 153pts]: Gauss Cannon, Warlord, Warscythe

+ Fast Attack +

Canoptek Scarabs [4 PL, 78pts]: 6x Canoptek Scarab Swarm

Canoptek Wraiths [18 PL, 288pts]
. 6x Canoptek Wraith

Destroyers [9 PL, 150pts]
. 2x Destroyer: 2x Gauss Cannon
. Heavy Destroyer: Heavy Gauss Cannon

Destroyers [9 PL, 150pts]
. 2x Destroyer: 2x Gauss Cannon
. Heavy Destroyer: Heavy Gauss Cannon

++ Total: [116 PL, 9CP, 1,993pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe
   
Made in de
Chalice-Wielding Sanguinary High Priest






Germany

xenoterracide wrote:
trying to make a decent list, not planning for competetive, though the local meta is relatively tough, feedback?
Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Necrons) [67 PL, 8CP, 1,174pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

Dynasty Choice
. Dynasty: Mephrit

+ HQ +

Cryptek [5 PL, 80pts]: Staff of Light

Overlord [6 PL, 139pts]: Artefact: The Veil of Darkness, Resurrection Orb, Voidscythe

+ Troops +

Immortals [8 PL, 150pts]: 10x Immortal, Tesla Carbine

Immortals [4 PL, 75pts]: Gauss Blaster, 5x Immortal

Necron Warriors [6 PL, 110pts]: 10x Necron Warrior

+ Elites +

Lychguard [8 PL, 140pts]: Hyperphase Sword and Dispersion Shield, 5x Lychguard

+ Heavy Support +

Doomsday Ark [10 PL, 160pts]

Doomsday Ark [10 PL, 160pts]

Doomsday Ark [10 PL, 160pts]

++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Necrons) [49 PL, 1CP, 819pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

Detachment CP [1CP]

Dynasty Choice
. Dynasty: Mephrit

+ HQ +

Catacomb Command Barge [9 PL, 153pts]: Gauss Cannon, Warlord, Warscythe

+ Fast Attack +

Canoptek Scarabs [4 PL, 78pts]: 6x Canoptek Scarab Swarm

Canoptek Wraiths [18 PL, 288pts]
. 6x Canoptek Wraith

Destroyers [9 PL, 150pts]
. 2x Destroyer: 2x Gauss Cannon
. Heavy Destroyer: Heavy Gauss Cannon

Destroyers [9 PL, 150pts]
. 2x Destroyer: 2x Gauss Cannon
. Heavy Destroyer: Heavy Gauss Cannon

++ Total: [116 PL, 9CP, 1,993pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe


Tesla is the way to go for immortals. Always use a maxed unit of destroyers, no heavy destroyer. Harder to wipe out, better to reanimate. Better for EP. Res orbs arent worth the points. Mephrit is not as good as you might think. Wraith dont benefit from mephrit, and destroyers already have -3.
   
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Augusta GA

I wish Spyders were a little tougher. I’ve been running a Novokh Scarab list with cryptek and spyder support and it’s pretty nasty unless they just pop the spyders first. Giving a non character monster the same amount of wounds as a guard commander is a little insulting.

Crimson Haze scarabs are no joke though, they can tear through a lot of targets pretty well.
   
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 p5freak wrote:


Tesla is the way to go for immortals. Always use a maxed unit of destroyers, no heavy destroyer. Harder to wipe out, better to reanimate. Better for EP. Res orbs arent worth the points. Mephrit is not as good as you might think. Wraith dont benefit from mephrit, and destroyers already have -3.


wouldn't mephrit put destroyers at -4 (not looking at my codex atm)? not saying mephrit is great, but... honestly on my wishlist of things would be to increase the range of that ability to be 18 inches so you don't have to be in charge range. What dynasty would you suggest if I'm building my list around the doomsday arks?
   
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xenoterracide wrote:
 p5freak wrote:


Tesla is the way to go for immortals. Always use a maxed unit of destroyers, no heavy destroyer. Harder to wipe out, better to reanimate. Better for EP. Res orbs arent worth the points. Mephrit is not as good as you might think. Wraith dont benefit from mephrit, and destroyers already have -3.


wouldn't mephrit put destroyers at -4 (not looking at my codex atm)? not saying mephrit is great, but... honestly on my wishlist of things would be to increase the range of that ability to be 18 inches so you don't have to be in charge range. What dynasty would you suggest if I'm building my list around the doomsday arks?


Yes, mephrit would put destroyers at -4. But you need to be within 12", thats an easy charge for your opponent. DDAs like nihilakh, when they stand still, they get to re-roll 1s to hit.
   
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xenoterracide wrote:
 p5freak wrote:


Tesla is the way to go for immortals. Always use a maxed unit of destroyers, no heavy destroyer. Harder to wipe out, better to reanimate. Better for EP. Res orbs arent worth the points. Mephrit is not as good as you might think. Wraith dont benefit from mephrit, and destroyers already have -3.


wouldn't mephrit put destroyers at -4 (not looking at my codex atm)? not saying mephrit is great, but... honestly on my wishlist of things would be to increase the range of that ability to be 18 inches so you don't have to be in charge range. What dynasty would you suggest if I'm building my list around the doomsday arks?


And how often you need -4? There's not that many 2+ save WITHOUT inv save. Remember anybody with 5++ ignores -4 already even if they sport 2+ save. And plenty have 4++.

-3 is already more than enough to get you max benefit. Numerous inv saves makes sure -3 is already often enough as good as -2 as it is!

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Centurions, often down to a 1+ with no invul.

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Yeah so one unit. Good if you know you are facing them for sure. Whatabout all the power you give away when you don't face them? Not to mention you already average 7 wounds with -3. You'll be wiping most of the squad as it is...7.11 wounding hits will do wonders already. Is that 2.37 extra wounding hits REALLY worth being weaker against most other units?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/13 12:34:41


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5265 pts
5150 pts
~3200 pts Knights

 
   
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tneva82 wrote:
Yeah so one unit. Good if you know you are facing them for sure. Whatabout all the power you give away when you don't face them? Not to mention you already average 7 wounds with -3. You'll be wiping most of the squad as it is...7.11 wounding hits will do wonders already. Is that 2.37 extra wounding hits REALLY worth being weaker against most other units?


Not advocating Mephrit over Sautekh because Sautekh offers a lot of nice things, but Centurion are played a lot, and successor marines tend to play Stealthy (you only have one Solar Pulse per turn) i could understand the choice. -4 AP tend to become good right now and Primaris Marines don't have a lot invulnerable saves.
Being at 12" is probably too much of a risk for everything, especially Destroyers, though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/13 12:43:12


 
   
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Reading immortals and destroyers are good. Should I run more immortals if I have any and run heavy destroyers as destroyers? What about wraiths?
   
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Shaelinith wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Yeah so one unit. Good if you know you are facing them for sure. Whatabout all the power you give away when you don't face them? Not to mention you already average 7 wounds with -3. You'll be wiping most of the squad as it is...7.11 wounding hits will do wonders already. Is that 2.37 extra wounding hits REALLY worth being weaker against most other units?


Not advocating Mephrit over Sautekh because Sautekh offers a lot of nice things, but Centurion are played a lot, and successor marines tend to play Stealthy (you only have one Solar Pulse per turn) i could understand the choice. -4 AP tend to become good right now and Primaris Marines don't have a lot invulnerable saves.
Being at 12" is probably too much of a risk for everything, especially Destroyers, though.



Maybe. I think you're going to see an Ordo Malleus Inquisitor in most marine armies soon since he doesn't break their doctrines and they're great toolboxes. They can give infantry a 5++ with a power. I know it seems like a bit of a random thought, but they're that good. They'll be in most lists.

I still think sautekh is our best option (of Nephrek to teleport in)
   
 
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