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In Soviet Russia, there are one of you every block.

Bignutter wrote:As for the store not having space and having bad use of space- to a certain extent the move to an automated stock system has tied the hands of individual managers on what to expect stockwise- having said that the stock management has really improved because of this recently in the UK and it is very rare for a store to run out of things, unless its something they are only meant to have one of or someone goes on a wee spending spree- the "complete army collectors" being the usual culprits (I'm one of them

Yeah, that's actually what I was referring to.

A computerised stock system can track stock levels compared to the store's sales history for that time of year, and can predict how many of a given item should sell within the time period required to reorder that item.

It won't always do a perfect job, as there are too many unpredictable variables that can affect sales... but if set up right can make the whole process a lot faster (and so theoretically more cost-effectively) than a human.

But humans need money, so they don't replace everyone with computers.

If all GW employees were computers, then they lose money as the human GW employees don't have jobs and can't buy GW merchandise.

C'mon? Anyone? "Strange things are afoot at the Circle K?"

Yeah, not ringing a bell...

Bogus, Man

Theodore S. Logan, Esquire

might have got that wrong, it's been YEARS

LOL. Awesome!

halonachos wrote:But humans need money, so they don't replace everyone with computers.

I wasn't talking about replacing everyone with computers.

Stores with automated ordering systems still need staff. They just don't need to spend as much time sorting out stock orders.

I would never pay retail for gw stuff, it's just not worth it.

When i used to be an independant stockist it used to drive me nuts to go past my local gw store and see all the "beardies" doing little more than playing games all day while i was spending all my time getting orders ready etc, it's like a hippy commune in most gw stores.

chaplaingrabthar wrote:Bogus, Man

Theodore S. Logan, Esquire

might have got that wrong, it's been YEARS

malfred wrote:LOL. Awesome!

Thank you. +2 cool points.

konversionz wrote:I would never pay retail for gw stuff, it's just not worth it.

When i used to be an independant stockist it used to drive me nuts to go past my local gw store and see all the "beardies" doing little more than playing games all day while i was spending all my time getting orders ready etc, it's like a hippy commune in most gw stores.

hey I take offense to that.... only one of our staff members is called a hippy.... and thats only because of his long feminine hair

Ironhide wrote:Go ahead and kill me, but I've skimmed through the thread.

I've always wondered why there are around 9 GW stores in the Washington, DC area, yet such and such state doesn't have a single store in it at all. GW must get a lot of sales from that area.

There must be a relationship to various factors including population density, average income, average retail rent, and so on, including propensity of the local population to buy GW. For example, a university town is likely to make higher sales than a retirement community. (Maybe, I don;t know, but you get my meaning.)

insaniak wrote:

halonachos wrote:But humans need money, so they don't replace everyone with computers.

I wasn't talking about replacing everyone with computers.

Stores with automated ordering systems still need staff. They just don't need to spend as much time sorting out stock orders.

Exactly. The point of EPOS is to record sales and stock levels to allow for rapid, automatic sales data to be generated. However, human intelligence has a role to play because a good retailer will know that he gets a lot more sales of SM in January, when Little Johnny comes to spend his Christmas money. For example.

You could program this kind of knowledge in at headquarters but that's just shifting the human intelligence from one place to another, not getting rid of it.

God, I was only joking with the whole computer thing. You know "terminator, computers become competent and enslave people, and such" kind of joke.

asmith wrote:

halonachos wrote:Well, you can't exactly play a tabletop on the internet now can you.

If the only reason to go to a GW store is to play games, I would argue that this indeed makes them not viable as a store.

Quite frankly, BALLS I say. BALLS!

GW Stores are the life blood of the entire company. How so?

Because it makes them the only Hobby Wargames company with it's own High Street Presence. PP don't have their own. Rackham (are they still going btw? Can never keep up with that lot) don't, and whoever makes Flames of War don't. This is a massive advantage to GW. In British High Streets, if you see a nicely painted model in a shop window, probably 90% of the time, it's a GW Model, painted with GW paints, in a GW Window.

Unlike using FLGS, GW doesn't need to worry about the competition. You go into an FLGS, and you have the pick of numerous games, from other TTG's, to card games, to daft stuff like Munchkin, and even adult board games (no, not that sort of adult. DIRTY BOY!). And whether or not your stuff sells (or is even sold at all) will depend upon the person running said store. If they don't like your game, or don't like your company, they are unlikely to put much effort into promoting your gubbins. You could have the best rule set, the best models, and the cheapest prices, but if they don't like the setting, or just don't like it just because, you aren't going to get the sales there. A GW store ropes you into the GW Hobby (which is a seperate entity from the wider Wargaming Hobby before anyone gets shirty with terminology and I have to waste more of my time explaining the differences).

Plus, more than just somewhere for smelly Vets to have a game when they fancy one, it's somewhere you can go and learn how to play, paint, convert, greenstuff etc. To many people (mainly in the UK*) GW Stores are the centre of the Hobby. It's where you meet other players initially, and then form your own club from there (Thats the theory at least).

So to say they serve no other function than as a games host is a fallacy.

*And contrary to popular belief, GW didn't use bully boy tactics to achieve their dominance of the market. The stores were a massive risk on behalf of the company. Had they failed, the company would likely have stalled. Sure, latterly they might have moved onto someone elses 'pitch' but all the FLGS I used to see weren't especially inviting. I shy from saying they deserved to close down, but in my experience (YMMV of course) they certainly didn't try terribly hard to keep their custom. Instead the ones I am aware of (All two of them!) simply put theirs hands over their ears and screeched. No attempt at generating interest in other Games Systems, no attempt made to persuade people to buy from them (when it's the difference between losing your business and not, why wouldn't you discount??).

Sometimes I enjoy eating ice cream.

Now because I'm old (not that old!) I do remember when there were only a few GW stores open and the only place to get your GW fix was from a FLGS, albeit that my FLGS wasn't all that friendly and wasn't all that local!
However my point is that when at the age of 15 (17 years ago), and the all new GW Store opened not so far from me, a store that allowed you to meet up and see the almost entire range, new models and even play the odd game it was by far a very fresh approach and i would say created a boom for GW sales (at the same time GW were opening alot of new store's nationwide).
I have seen the stock levels dwindle locally, and i also have had the same old excuse about what sells etc etc.
Well now all i see at my local GW store is the same stuff or lack of it! yes i am one of the retail sheep that see's a shiney new thing in a box, holds it in my hands and thinks sod it i've just got to have it (impulse buy!) even though i still have countless models awaiting assembly and paint!
Unfortunatly because i am one of those retail sheep and often the store doesn't have anything to inspire me or even have the odd model i've been looking for then i just dont buy AT ALL from any outlet retail or mailorder.
I do support the local store and what they do with the new games etc, and the fact that the unmeasurable free advice on gaming, painting or even some friendly banter.
But I think that GW really should do something bold again the first being taking the plunge and opening so many stores to promote their products/hobby.
Impulse buying is very important for this hobby we all enjoy especailly for the younger generation of gamers, who have alot more things now to spend their money on xbox, playstation, nintendo as a quick comparison. Plus if you go in to said store and the shelves look empty and uninspiring apart from the 6 boxes of assault marines! then most people will lose interest in wargaming and play more xbox etc.
And as another note, I work in retail and we do hold stock of accessories that maybe sell 1 or 2 a year! and yes i still keep them in stock because like Games Workshop my store is a specialist in the field we operate! I stock them because i'm a specialist and as such people assume that i either have item or have a suitable alternative!
Please take this as it is written, my take on the original point, stock on shelves = sales in-store. Stock in a warehouse may mean, same sale but not supporting the retail model, and paying the wages of the people who work in the stores, people who do a huge part in promoting the hobby and teaching people/customer's about the rule sets, painting etc.
Remember all wargaming is a tabletop game, not a virtual world internet/computer game, if we wanted that then we'd all be playing warcraft world or whatever it is? Wargaming is a socialable game that gets people out from behind their computer screens, and above all is fun, where else can you have a chat and a laugh about a game argue about the rules, get annoyed at each other and bad dice rolls and still be friends afterwards?

Good luck to all, happy gaming!

I think GW stores are very much viable. And I know some people might disagree but I think that if FLGS works well with a local GW shop they can get a huge boost. As several shops in the local area can attest to.

GW stores are very much geared toward that beginning to middle of the road gamer. They have such a huge range that stocking the whole thing just doesn't make business sense. Not to mention the cost involved in making enough to stock them worldwide.

If it was a big event weekend and he drove down for an item and didn't call then I say he got what he deserved. If it wasn't a big event weekend and he didn't call then he got what he deserved. And as for ordering from the Warstore in GW if i'd been working I would probably would have laughed at him. He was obviously doing it for attention and as a middle finger statement but since GW makes and distributes all it's own product they could care less. He's still buying product.

I personally don't like an automated order system as a person that knows his store and area will, 99/100, order better than the computer. This is dependent on a good retailer though and is the reason most major retailers have an automated system (a lot of managers don't know a thing about business or growing it).

Just some personal opinions.

Oh, and I used to work for GW before the automated system and because I knew my area I generally sold stuff you never see outside of a bunker because I knew what people in my area liked. That being said it's harder for some stores because you get one order a week and if someone buys an entire army your inventory is shot for minimum of a week.

Hulksmash wrote:I personally don't like an automated order system as a person that knows his store and area will, 99/100, order better than the computer. This is dependent on a good retailer though and is the reason most major retailers have an automated system (a lot of managers don't know a thing about business or growing it).

I totally agree - I am not sure how it is in other regions, but in my experience, it is not uncommon to see the entire staff of a GW store change over the course of a year. It is hard to maintain a feel for the store and area if the staff keep changing.

keezus wrote:

Hulksmash wrote:I personally don't like an automated order system as a person that knows his store and area will, 99/100, order better than the computer. This is dependent on a good retailer though and is the reason most major retailers have an automated system (a lot of managers don't know a thing about business or growing it).

I totally agree - I am not sure how it is in other regions, but in my experience, it is not uncommon to see the entire staff of a GW store change over the course of a year. It is hard to maintain a feel for the store and area if the staff keep changing.

We had the same staff in our Local Gw for quite some time. I worked there for almost 7 years (in two stores) the manager was there (two stores) just a little over 5 and 2 other staff (one in both stores, one in only one) were there for about 4 years. There was another staff member that worked at both stores for (on and off) about 4 or 5 years. and another manager (who worked about 3 or 4 years at the one store.) so, turnover, happened, but we still had the same core folks. even if we worked at two different stores during that time.

You were on the east coast Two_heads. Out here 4-5 years ago the upper management had a commisar mentality and very few people made it through it. Not to mention the pay rate to live in Cali made it hard back then to work for them. I hear they've gotten much better and 3 of the managers I worked with are still with the company after 5 years. Also there have been 3 employees at the local bunker who have been there for at least the last year (just moved down near the bunker around then). But all in all they've gotten much better at retention around here and it's showing in their events, knowledge, and customer service.

Hulksmash wrote:You were on the east coast Two_heads. Out here 4-5 years ago the upper management had a commisar mentality and very few people made it through it. Not to mention the pay rate to live in Cali made it hard back then to work for them. I hear they've gotten much better and 3 of the managers I worked with are still with the company after 5 years. Also there have been 3 employees at the local bunker who have been there for at least the last year (just moved down near the bunker around then). But all in all they've gotten much better at retention around here and it's showing in their events, knowledge, and customer service.

well, it has been 2+ years since I worked, so I am a bit disconnected. Don't get me wrong, there was a pretty heavy hand/commisar mentality throughout GW and quite honestly if you couldn't hack it, you got shot/sacked. It's just that a few of us were able to handle that pressure and still deal with all the internal/external buzzbys..

I don't know what the rate of pay vs cost of living is in Cali, but is sure isn't cheap to live in the VA/DC/MD area and some of our turnover was people moving on to better paying jobs. As a father with kids, my GW experience was in a part time capacity and so it wasn't the basis of putting food on the table, but I couldn't ever figure out how the managers managed let alone the red shirts (perhaps they all lived at home with parents still). I've heard it's alot better myself too. But in my 6+ years, I saw 13 managers move through the area.. that's alot of managers.. (of course that is mainly in one store, so that's a high turnover..

The games workshop stores in my area (Seattle) always seem to be full of kids or out of work teenagers. I haven't even been playing 40k for a year but I've already grown sick of some of the stuff happening at the Battle Bunker.

When I first started playing last June there was a weekly game as part of a campaign and about once a month I could expect a 3 game tournament. I used to go there at least once or twice a week, they carried forgeworld stuff as well so I bought well over $1000 worth of forgeworld stuff from them.

However, I also had to put up with the "daycare" element. Don't get me wrong, I've had good conversations and played against some pretty cool kids but most..... Welll...... Parents would drop kids off for hours at a time. Most of these kids had never really read a full codex, had less then 500 points of an army, and always wanted to pick up my models.

THE WORST WAS THE FREAKING HYPOTHETICAL ARGUEMENTS THE KIDS WOULD HAVE! Here are some examples:

"I think Darth Vader could beat Horus in one on one combat"

"What if the Zerg from Starcraft teamed up with the Nids and attacked?"

"Necrons would lose to the real terminators because..."

"Do you think it would be cool if the Space marines could summon monsters to fight for them like in Pokemon?


As the fall approuched they started doing fewer 40k tournaments and after the campaign ended I was lucky to get a pick up game on the weekly 40k night. I rarely go in, only to pick up a schedule, but to my dissapointment there have been no 40k touranments since at least December. However, if I want to come in and paint my Stompa or baneblade...................

So now instead of buying the odd unit or book and all my painting supplies from the battle bunker or store in the mall near me I either purchase it online or at a FLGS that has a weekly 40k night and is holding its first RTT next month.

All that being said GW stores do seem to be good about bringing in new people, the staff are friendly, the hobby classes for those just starting out always seem to be full, and when they do host weekly games or tournaments they are fun. However, IMO GW stores do not cater to what I would consider the "hardcore" gamer.

Thing is, the very definition of being Veteran means that you shouldn't be dependant on your local Store (GW or FLGS) for your Hobby. Knowing at least the basics is enough for you to continue at home.

However, please see my thread about 'What Would Help'.

Just like Johnny Five, I need input.

Thats location specific MDG. In Houston there are more cattle than people near my home. 2/3s of the people I've played would not be invited to my house regardless-thats for close friends only.

Fair enough I suppose.

But still no reason not to go and give input to my thread. If i get a positive phonecall, and thus the job, I *Will* be putting my ideas into practice. I need as many perspectives and thoughts as possible to ensure I can extend my nefarious plans to rope in lots of peoples....

HI all.

I belive that GW B&M stores are a bit of a catch 22 .

To vallidate the current price point GW has to display the 'GW hobby TM.' And to sustian the current company size GW has become reliant on a high turn
over of new customers.

However , because of the focus on new players and showing the 'GW hobby TM' in the best light .The B&M stores are not optimised (or located ) to be a highly efficient retail outlet.
And the insistance of the higher managment to meet 'optimistic' sales targets ,(along with other issues) tends to facilitate a high turn over of staff.

If GW relinquished a bit of control and promoted games clubs in schools- colledges- community centres, thus relocating the hobby centres to the community in general.

The 'need for a high street presence' would diminish and efficient and MUCH cheaper online retail options could present themselves perhaps?

I do not play in, or buy from GW B&M stores. So I am indifferent to thier existance.

Happy Gaming
Lanrak.

Wow look as though my plight got some support. i apreciate it guys. Believe me i think my experience was lost in translation somewhat. Overall i think now that some people are discussing this without me means that maybe they understood what i really meant. There are so many other ways to get GW gear but ifelt almost compelled to take the kid in a candy store approach and try to enjoy the whole experience of going 70 miles to a GW store and finding the things i could not around home. Also enjoy the company of other players and talk shop with the locals.

That didnt turn out to be the case.

Thanks to all of you that have understood and offered support for the situation. Its appreciated.

Also i want to clear something up as well. The shop was 70 miles away not an hour but i drive fast sometimes. I was at the mall with my family for other shopping for the kids and wife and such... it was an added bonus that there is a GW store there. So i had something to look forward to for me to do. That turned out to be a waste of time. Thee is exactly 1 GW store within a 300 mile radius of where i ive and with such a distributed presence on the East Coast i only could assume they would stock a hell of a lot more than they did, especially for a Saturday afternoon.

H.B.M.C. wrote:I love the part where he rings Neal while in the store and makes a Warstore order. Hilarious. I would have loved to have seen that. Very cool.

BYE

Heh yeah it was liberating.. and commended by a couple people in the store... I was able to tell my wife i bought something while at the GW store LOL

Yea brilliant move Sparky. Are you still going on about how you pwoned some minimum wage red shirt? You're a real he man.