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aka_mythos wrote:You would never got to an EB, Best Buy, or Walmart buy a video game or movie and expect to be able to enjoy it on those premises. Why then a table top game store?

But I wouldn't go to an EB, Best Buy, or Walmart at all-- I'd just buy online.

Let's be frank, the only real reason to go to a tabletop game store is for the sense of community there. Online stores have better deals, are almost never out of stock, and offer items that most stores can't get. If you are just looking for the best bargain on your models, you aren't going to find it at a game store. However, people call 'em FLGSs for a reason. When I had a store in my area, I would go there to buy *everything* hobby-related, just because I liked the store. The friendly environment there was enough for me to become a devoted customer. I could have easily got a better deal online, but there was something about going down to that store that really appealed to me. If a gaming store can't offer a sense of community to me, though, I don't see any reason that I should take my business there.

Game stores really don't have much to offer in comparison to online retailers when it comes to prices, so they have to beat them on other grounds. Charging for table time, in my opinion, really goes against the atmosphere that a gaming store should be trying to cultivate, and would definitely drive my business away.

Fetterkey wrote:Game stores really don't have much to offer in comparison to online retailers when it comes to prices, so they have to beat them on other grounds. Charging for table time, in my opinion, really goes against the atmosphere that a gaming store should be trying to cultivate, and would definitely drive my business away.

Doesn't leave them with many other ways of making money now does it? Coffeshop perhaps?
Many customers aren't as decent as you and will continue to buy online AND use your facilities.

There are ways to charge for services without changing the spirit of community. Call it a donation and you're gold!

twistinthunder wrote:

wardancer wrote:my local FLGS (Wargames Heaven in Brighton) charges one pound for a game, unless yo ugot full membership, then yo udont have to pay. i didnt see that putting people off and nobody is asking you to pay, people just do it themselves. So I guess it all depends on the amount and how it is handled.

really when did that change? and whats with loads of us being in brighton for some reason?

seriously last time i was in their it was £5 a year (or the year membership) and something more than £1 a play.

Its all on their website- it was always 1 quid a game with £5 membership and nothing with £25 membership. Saying that nobody EVER asked me for money there, people just come to the till and pay so obviously its not that bad?
I dont get thr part with "loads of us being in Brighton for some reason? yo umean wargamers?

All I can say is that in the St. Louis region we pay nothing to play. But, if you are starting new armies you have to buy them from the store you play at.

See my LGS gives a 20% discount on all GWS products...so I dont HAVE to go online to buy, in fact its cheaper for me not to (no taxes)

Y'know what I just realized? There's a better way to charge for gaming space at your buddy's store without really saying it upfront. Simply create a membership which grants said member priority access to gaming space. If all the tables are filled they have the ability to kick a non member off one of the tables. They could also have the ability to reserve space ahead of time. You kind of create an illusion of scarcity by doing this.

Essentially you're saying "You can play here, but if a member comes you have to jet" up front and encourage people to buy membership. You can include more benefits later on and say that to possible members as well.

How do you handle it when members play on the table and members show up to play?

malfred wrote:How do you handle it when members play on the table and members show up to play?

Length of standing as a member, of course

Sgt.Sunshine wrote: If all the tables are filled they have the ability to kick a non member off one of the tables. They could also have the ability to reserve space ahead of time.

This is going to lead to to some pretty weird situations. First, as a paying member, I'd feel bad about kicking people off the table mid-game, and I'd also feel bad about how I'd paid to do something I'd never really feel comfortable doing. No win there, unless you're a jerk. If I were a non-member, and someone who paid to be a member kicked me off a table mid game, I wouldn't feel like "wow, I should buy a membership" - I'd feel like "well, this is their private little club, I'd better go elsewhere and never return".

Dropping a "reserved" note on a table at the time it's been reserved seems more fair, like at a restaurant.

If you had members with longer standing kicking off other paying members (who paid the same amount!) for the same tables, I'd fight for a refund, and never return again.

privateer4hire wrote:

malfred wrote:How do you handle it when members play on the table and members show up to play?

Length of standing as a member, of course

Sounds like a good way to make people bitter at your store policy and not come back.

"Hey, we're haldway through a 2000 pt game here. We'll be done in an hour."
"Sorry, I joined a week before you, so I'm kicking you off and playing my game, you have 10 minutes to pack."


A much better idea is to let people reserve the table for a certain time, for a fee. If you just show up and there's an empty table you can play, but reserved tables will have a marker on them saying "reserved from 2pm-5pm, all games must end here by 1:30".

Or something!

Okay fine you whiners, a solution would be to have the majority of tables listed as members only and a limited amount for free. Therefore members have access to more tables, the ability to reserve those tables ahead of time, and...whatever other benefit you'd like to throw in...Free members on the other hand would have a limited out of space and would be on "first come first serve" policy.

That's a solution? :B

I've played games in a few stores with gaming space that was for members only - they used to do late night (fri/sat nights) gaming sessions.

If you wanted to take part, you were charged a membership fee (one off) which also gave you an instore discount (a further 5% off their already RRP-10% prices).

Roleplaying sessions were charged at $5 per person per session (5-6 hours) which covered power usage and potential damages from accidents.

Nobody ever complained. They had access to cheap drinks and food. They had a place to store their stuff (lockers). They had a guaranteed safe place free from harassment to play their games (the store was locked up downstairs - to get in, you had to dial up or be there when they were letting people in).

If it was some kind of special club, I'd pay... especially if there was an age limit involved (say 18+).

If it was just standard gaming space... at least in the U.S., most people would balk at paying for it. I know I would. But it does sound to me like it might be different elsewhere... I'd love to hear how it goes for him after he gets more established.

chromedog wrote:I've played games in a few stores with gaming space that was for members only - they used to do late night (fri/sat nights) gaming sessions.

If you wanted to take part, you were charged a membership fee (one off) which also gave you an instore discount (a further 5% off their already RRP-10% prices).

That sounds decent to me.

Alex Kolodotschko wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:Game stores really don't have much to offer in comparison to online retailers when it comes to prices, so they have to beat them on other grounds. Charging for table time, in my opinion, really goes against the atmosphere that a gaming store should be trying to cultivate, and would definitely drive my business away.

Doesn't leave them with many other ways of making money now does it? Coffeshop perhaps?
Many customers aren't as decent as you and will continue to buy online AND use your facilities.

There are ways to charge for services without changing the spirit of community. Call it a donation and you're gold!

I actually see very little of that. If you have what a customer wants sitting in front of him, he usually buys it. This means stores need to keep things in stock, and multiples of better selling items. Out of stock means no one is buying it, and online may become an option, even if they did want to buy from their FLGS.

A good selection and lots of gamers in a store produces sales, and those sales outweigh any amount of money you might have gotten chasing after each gamer for a couple of bucks.

Nice to see that this thread is still going (I couldnt get here yesterday) and hopefully he's read the varying viewpoints by now (I've not heard from him since I sent him the link)

Once again, thanks for your contributions all.

Lomar, also have him check out this site:

http://forums.delphiforums.com/gamestore/start

This is a site to help new game store owners, and wannabe game store owners. Many older store owners answering questions and giving advice.

so a thought that may be a little off or mentioned already, instead of charging for play, why not charge to reserve the table at a certain time? or for a day? say I know a friend and I only have sunday off, and we want to get together and play that day, since you are in the uk, charge 5 pound for the table reservation at noon and it expires say at 3pm, that is unless you come and claim your reservation. I know I would use this on a favorite table, and heck you could make it a bid system, if someone else wants the table charge them 6 pound and give the first guy his money back, but the trick about that is the first guy needs to understand this little part about it.

I don't know just think into the keyboard I guess.

I just re-read the OP's original post, and something occurs. Lomar, you said that the owner is considering letting out the upstairs room of a shop out to rent. If that's the case, then there's a solution that doesn't hack off customers.

Set up two gaming table in the lower part of the storefront which are free for everyone to use. Give it some basic terrain, and make them unreservable. This gives anyone who isn't a regular, or who might just be starting out a place to play, without creating any ill-will. Not only that, since there's the option of being able to actually play without paying, most of the naysayers in this thread (myself included) would be content.

Now here's the trick. You fill out the upstairs game room with the all the best boards and nicest terrain, a painting table, lockers, etc. Make sure you have at least 5 or 6 tables up there. Now if a customer wants to use that space, they have to be a member. (£5 a month?). The tables that are up there can be reserved ahead of time, and are clearly superior to the ones downstairs. Not only that, if you do not possess a membership card, you are not allowed up into the upstairs room. Not only that, but because you have to be a member to reserve a table, that alone should help encourage customers to get a membership.

As other members have said, perhaps an in-store discount for members as well, to encourage them to spend their money there?

And voila! Now I would pay to be a member, simply because it gives me access to so much better facilities. But because I'm under absolutely no obligation to be a member to actually play a game, I don't resent having to pay. In fact, in a situation like that, where you now have a separate space and everything, I'd probably sign up immediately, just because it lets me play a game with my mates whenever I want away from the general hubbub of the store downstairs.

What do you guys think. Would that settle it for you? Or would you still resent the owner for keeping the best facilities to paying members?

Gamer walks into the store:

"I'd like your finest battle of champagne, if you take my meaning."

"Of course, sir. Right this way, sir.

Put a settee and some chairs tv etc. as a waiting area.
Some people would pay just to get away from parents. and chill out

Note is this store opening in stoke on trent ?

JohnHwangDD wrote:If I'm going to pay for my gaming space, it'll be my garage, basement, or game room - not somebody else's place.

Indeed. This is why I bought a house with a basement.

I do like the "donation" jar idea though. I would make sure it is completely secure though. There are plenty of gamers who might liberate some for a drink or a snack.

absolutely not.

Local experience: We had a game store here in Maryland a few years ago. He didn't have a huge customer base and started getting into financial trouble.

He started a "club" that you had to pay to get in to play there.

The few people that were left bailed on him immediately and he was closed in 2 weeks.

Like I said before. I have a GW Store that's 10 minutes away from my house now. They're table space is always free. Not that I play there much. I paint there. I play maybe once a week at most. (escalation league and that's the first I've bothered since Current CSM came out)

If you're going to do a store local to me, to get my business you have to be:

1) on GW level for your staff as far as Customer Service, modeling and game knowledge etc.

2) beat Warstores prices.

3) free paint and game space.

Otherwise I'm just going to the mall and GW where I can hang out, paint and hit the mexican joint next door for dinner and a beer.

Read the other threads,

Like I said before. I have a GW Store that's 10 minutes away from my house now. They're table space is always free. Not that I play there much. I paint there.

soon that may not be an option


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Games Workshops New Business Model?

I'd have no issue paying for a place to play as long as you offered something beyond some bad terrain, cheap tables, and a couple chairs. I like the locker idea for folks to store stuff there. However, how would your insurance feel about it if the place were broken into? I like the idea of drinks, and snacks to recover some costs. Stores here buy stuff from Sam's club (Wal-Mart's brother) and gain some revenue that way.

Clubs only work if there is a true incentive reason to be a member. Look at places like Sam's or BJ's in the US, people pay to be members because there is a clear benefit. A game club with club dues will only work if it is incentivised. If the only benefit is something people have grown to just expect, you're only going to lose customers.

Here's another cat skinning method (if you agree with a pay for play model). It requires a modicum of easy book-keeping that places most responsibility on the customer to track.

Instead of custoemr buys x amt of merchandise to play for free that day, there is a nominal fee. Customer gives me two bucks and I give customer a gift certificate with today's date. To play you always have to have a current date gift certificate. Gift certificates are redeemable just like cash with no refunds. After five nights of gaming, he's banked up $10 of 'free' store credit that he can use to buy stuff with.

The customer now has an investment, albeit small, in the store. He's two bucks closer to buying that blister that's $10. It may even feel like he's basically getting the blister for only $8 since he had to pay $2 to play in the first place.

This could work in the shops and a young players interest.
Young timmy gets AOBR for christmas.

Two weeks later goes to mum " mum i need (insert price here) for a trukk.
Mum says no, wait till your birthday.
Timmy says can I have 2 bucks so I can play at the store!
some weeks later he has a new trukk. lol

And his mum dosent know she paid for it

At one of our local gaming stores, they don't charge, but it's not uncommon for a employee to walk up and offer consessions (Soda, pizza, ice cream bars ect) at a price. And now after seeing the Temple of Skulls I did, they want to try to get me to paint more terrain for bonus discounts. I told them after I do my Trygon and Malwoc we'll talk.

It's like anything in life nothing is free or very seldom.

And if a small charge is asked for by your store to facilitate the space for you to use then I don't see the problem.