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rocklord2004 wrote:Let me rephrase my question since after reading it again I see how weird it is to answer that. What is it that attracts you to anime? I can't place mine personally but a large portion is the effort that goes into the story and putting the emotion into voices that you just dont find in live action. Well at least with the series that I like.
Ok. Just like this :'D looks like a happy face , then anime can be a medium used to express other things.
Anime is capable of showing us incredible things through a simpler / cheaper medium that would other wise cost millions of special effect to create.
Because of this , they are able to create full series without worried about budgets as much.
Demynin wrote:Huh? Okay, so I'm guessing you are referring to either young girls acting more sexual than you think is appropriate or older girls purposely acting younger in an attempt to be cute... This'll include more shows than my overexageration but there are still a lot that don't have ANY of this. Black Lagoon, Count of Monte Cristo, Ghost in the Shell, Hellsing, Cowboy Bebop. The only 'sex' in these kinds of shows is the straight up and forward women (not girls) acting like women with women bodies. No 'loli' getups or teen idol dress & behaviour. Heck, Black Lagoon has strip clubs as locale in it.
Ok. You convinced me. I now like Anime. Well done.
What exactly are you trying to prove? I specifically said that I would give anything a chance about a page ago. I've never tried to convince other people NOT to like anime, or that liking it makes anyone a bad person. I've just given the reason/s why I don't like it. I don't particularly like Power Metal, so why would I plow through loads of it, in an attempt to find one band that I like?
I find much of Anime too 'cutesy' for my taste (see Lunahounds avatar/s). Simple.
@LunaHound - Once again, Anime is NOT an artistic medium. Neither is 'Impressionism' - 'oil on canvas' however, is. Just an example.
I don't like the 'cutesy' anime, nor do I like Gundam and other mecha stuff. Death Note and Spice and Wolf are my top two.
People are like dice, a certain Frenchman said that. You throw yourself in the direction of your own choosing. People are free because they can do that. Everyone's circumstances are different, but no matter how small the choice, at the very least, you can throw yourself. It's not chance or fate. It's the choice you made.
Drk_Oblitr8r wrote:I can't beleive no one has brought up the reason MOST people hate animes.
Yep.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Falconlance wrote:
You need only see the way people who watch a lot of anime live to know how bad the stuff is.
Yup Narutards can be pretty stereotypical, but let's just point out the hypocrisy of this statement being made on a WARGAMING forum... that's like saying all you have to do is get a whiff of the smell at a gaming convention to understand how bad wargames are...
Some people are like that, not everyone, and I wouldn't even say the majority of people that enjoy anime. (Maybe the majority of the obsessive fans though)
Automatically Appended Next Post: @Albatross
No, I don't care at all if you like anime. I did care that there was a confusion of the 'anime style' and all the rest of anime which has different styles. I think it's a problem with the dilution of the term anime. Where 'Anime', to fans, refers to more than the shows that use the 'Anime style' while for most non-fans it means just the shows that have the anime style.
If you think that only shows with the stylistic characteristics of anime should be refered to anime, than I actually don't like anime. I like Animated Japanese shows of the style of Cowboy Bebop, Black Lagoon and such. Unfortunately, I don't know any other name for this type of show; so I call it Anime.
And Lunahound was refering to Animation in general as a cheaper medium as opposed to Live action. Animation allows action, 'special effects' and camera angles that would be prohibitively expensive if done live, without a large increase in cost. The style of Anime has little to do with the cost of a show.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Wow, I can't seem to stop talking...
IMHO Japan developed the techniques of animation much further than North America did and the end result was a lot more powerful than NA cartoons. And even now, NA is adopting Japanese techniques of computer added animation in shows like Futurama and the Simpsons. Because of that, the ability to write better shows using the medium of animation grew more in Japan. So the Japanese animation productions are at a higher level then the NA counterparts. And just like talking about North American animation includes everything from Dora the Explorer through Looney Tunes and into Family Guy, Japanese animation runs from cute talking cars kiddie shows, through tween-age cutesy stuff and into adult themes. Anime can refer to the style or can refer to the broader category of pretty much all Japanese animation.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I really need to stop as this is ending up as a wall of text.
Not the best example, but here's a quote from wiki
Grave of the Fireflies (火垂るの墓, Hotaru no Haka?) is a 1988 animated film written and directed by Isao Takahata.[1] This is the first film produced by Shinchosha, who hired Studio Ghibli to do the animation production work. It is an adaptation of the semi-autobiographical novel of the same name by Akiyuki Nosaka, intended as a personal apology to the author's own sister.
Roger Ebert considers it to be one of the most powerful anti-war movies ever made. Animation historian Ernest Rister compares the film to Steven Spielberg's Schindler's List and says, "it is the most profoundly human animated film I've ever seen."[2]
Though Studio Ghibli's style is pretty close to the 'anime style' so it might put you off visually, this is a good example of the difference between North American animation vs Anime (of Japanese animation). Has there been a North American animation that could make the same impact on critics? Animes cover a broader selection of stories then NA animation, and do them well. This is the value of anime IMHO.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wikipedia wrote:Ghost in the Shell made an impression on a number of filmmakers. Larry and Andy Wachowski, the creators of The Matrix and its sequels, showed it to producer Joel Silver, saying "we wanna do that for real."[1] Director James Cameron has called it "the first truly adult animation film to reach a level of literary and visual excellence."
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2010/02/10 15:10:12
Demimyn wrote:
No, I don't care at all if you like anime. I did care that there was a confusion of the 'anime style' and all the rest of anime which has different styles. I think it's a problem with the dilution of the term anime. Where 'Anime', to fans, refers to more than the shows that use the 'Anime style' while for most non-fans it means just the shows that have the anime style.
Fine, if you want to change the meaning of the word 'style' to suit your argument that's up to you. But you are incorrect, and are arguing this point with the wrong person.
I have posted words to this effect several times, but will do it once more. If I have to do it again, I'll just quote myself, because this getting irritating.
Anime is the Japanese STYLE of animation. Within this STYLE there are multiple GENRES. The Japanese STYLE of Animation has several identifying STYLISTIC characteristics.
This IS NOT the same as saying that ANIME is a homogenous entity, in which each text resembles exactly the other.
Jazz is a STYLE. Within Jazz there are several GENRES (e.g Bebop, free Jazz). The Jazz STYLE has several identif.......zzzz etc.
In North America, Anime or Japanimation, refers to japanese arnimation, while cartoons or animated are generally used for american shows.
@Albatross: The Jazz thing actually helps, and is a new way of explaining it. Thanks. I gotta admit I'm more confused on what Anime is. I'm going of Wikipedia (yeah I know, not the best source) which has a clear definition of what the STYLE of anime is, and then points out that there are shows that are refered to as Anime but don't have the same stylistic characteristics.
Yep, the etymology of anime is rather peculiar. It gets borrowed into the Japanese language as a shortened word for 'animation', and means any type of animation. English speakers then borrow it back in its shortened form and use it as a word to mean Japanese animation only. Manga is similar, in that in Japan it means comics, while over here it means Japanese comics. Another example of word juggling is how the words Ecchi and Hentai have evolved. Hentai means pervert in Japanese, so it was ported over to English to be used the same. Eventually it started getting referred to as "H", e.g. H-games. The Japanese language adopted this "H" and rendered it as "Ecchi", also meaning perverted. English speakers then took Ecchi and used it to mean perverted scenes, while H and Hentai are used to denote full sex scenes.
So I'm thinking in my head and trying to take yer jazz example and apply it to anime.
Anime = style
genres of Anime = studio ghibli, Osamu Tezuka, Shirow Masamune (these are all visual genres)
genres of Anime = shonen, shoji, harem, school, horror, action, fantasy, ... (these are all story genres)
I can understand this part, though I probably don't agree on what the characteristics are that define the anime style.
Then the bold underline part shows what needs reconciliation with the stuff above.
wikipedia wrote:While different titles and different artists have their own artistic styles, many stylistic elements have become so common that people[who?] describe them as definitive of anime in general. However, this does not mean that all modern anime share one strict, common art style. Many anime have a very different art style from what would commonly be called "anime style", yet fans still use the word "anime" to refer to these titles. Generally, the most common form of anime drawings include "exaggerated physical features such as large eyes, big hair and elongated limbs... and dramatically shaped speech bubbles, speed lines and onomatopoeic, exclamatory typography."[25]
[/endquote]
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/10 16:56:08
Pika_power wrote:One of the reasons I watch anime is for the plot. Name the basic plot of a show, and I'll try to find an anime that does it similarly.
Nice easy one to start:
Autobots do battle to destroy the evil forces of the Decepticons!
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Pika_power wrote:One of the reasons I watch anime is for the plot. Name the basic plot of a show, and I'll try to find an anime that does it similarly.
Nice easy one to start:
Autobots do battle to destroy the evil forces of the Decepticons!
Can you guess the show?
Transformers is the show.
The matching anime? Transformers. I know the RID series was, and I strongly suspect Armada through Energon was too.
Yes, Headmasters, Masterforce, Victory, Robots in Disguise, Armada, Energon, and Cybertron are all Transformers anime series. That's why it was an easier one. How about this one, what's the anime for:
Cranky New Jersey Doctor with a bum leg diagnoses obscure diseases while helped and hindered by pointless assistants, all in a Sherlock Holmes analogy.
Deminyn wrote:Then the bold underline part shows what needs reconciliation with the stuff above.
wikipedia wrote: While different titles and different artists have their own artistic styles, many stylistic elements have become so common that people[who?] describe them as definitive of anime in general. However, this does not mean that all modern anime share one strict, common art style. Many anime have a very different art style from what would commonly be called "anime style", yet fans still use the word "anime" to refer to these titles. Generally, the most common form of anime drawings include "exaggerated physical features such as large eyes, big hair and elongated limbs... and dramatically shaped speech bubbles, speed lines and onomatopoeic, exclamatory typography.
The stuff in bold could be considered common stylistic characteristics - note that I'm not claiming that EVERY anime/manga cartoon has them, but that they are common. I mean there has to be some unifying factors behind anime, otherwise why say you like anime? Why not just say you like a bunch of cartoons which are completely unrelated and in no way similar? It's because that statement would be untrue, no? If you recognise Anime as a style, then surely you have to accept that there are unifying forces at work. Like Rock music - do Meshuggah sound like Nirvana? Not really, but there are points of convergence.
I want to play the 'Anime Story Game'!:
'A young American student moves to Britain and becomes entangled with a bunch of football hooligans. He becomes seduced by the violence and male-bonding and becomes one of them, with tragic consequences.'
Is there an Anime film that resembles that? If so, I might watch it. The original was fething appalling!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/02/10 22:20:07
I am both selfish and chaotic. I value self-gratification and control; I want to have things my way, preferably now. At best, I'm entertaining and surprising; at worst, I'm hedonistic and violent.
Albatross wrote:
I mean there has to be some unifying factors behind anime, otherwise why say you like anime? Why not just say you like a bunch of cartoons which are completely unrelated and in no way similar? It's because that statement would be untrue, no? If you recognise Anime as a style, then surely you have to accept that there are unifying forces at work.
I say I like anime, 'cause I can go to a store, to their anime section, and find stuff I like. They are related, but not by style, they are related by story themes and by country of origin (or culture of origin might be better). I find this statement to be inaccurate and slightly misleading. I recognize that Anime is a style but also a label used by fans to describe a collection of animated shows that: Originate from Japan, Have a higher quality of animation than their North American counter part.
So as un-artisticly educated fan of Anime, I say 'I like Anime' and someone that knows what styles, genres, and mediums are looks at me and says, 'I don't like Anime b/c of the style of big eyes/exaggerated facial features/disproportionate body parts/loli emphasis/ad nauseum'. Then I look confused and say 'but that's only a small part of Anime' but then they say 'That IS anime' and we both cock our heads and look at the other as if they have no idea what they are talking about...
As for as I can tell, that's what we've got going on. From a fan point of view (and a Canadian marketing point of view) Anime = anything animated from Japan, while it seems that your point of view (and you said your the wrong person to argue medium and stuff with so I'm guessing you've read a book or two on it ) Anime = a style of animation characterized by "exaggerated physical features such as large eyes, big hair and elongated limbs... "
The wonders of language.
And for the sake of my insanity, I'm going to try and not come back here (I doubt that'll last, but I'll try - I lasted 5 min) as I really want to carry on painting and building. Including my heavily anime inspired Infinity stuff. (as a last parting shot, check out the Infinity website and tell me your opinion on their minis and a separate opinion on their art)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/02/10 23:25:46
I am both selfish and chaotic. I value self-gratification and control; I want to have things my way, preferably now. At best, I'm entertaining and surprising; at worst, I'm hedonistic and violent.
This is Ergo Proxy (if you can get the fansub with the notes, it helped me get a lot of the references that would've gone by me)
How about this then?
@Albatross
And from watching a clip of commentary on the matrix, it might be I like the cinematography style that is common in anime... didn't think about it before but maybe its the choice of story pacing, action style, camera angles, wide spanning background shots to create a feel, deviating from dialog heavy filming...
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2010/02/11 00:41:02
I just want to bring up an example why anime is a good medium.
We all know Halo. Its from a video game , if they want to make a series out of CGI , it'll either be too expensive , or if they cut them to budget too much , the quality will be sub par to all the nice CGI movies ingame.
So what happens? now it can be recreated , and story be retold + expanded into the form of :
I honestly have no fething idea. 
