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johnscott10 wrote:

Anti-Mag wrote:You're not good enough for Golden Demon. I'm quite elitist when it comes to painting and don't even bother reading threads if I think the models look like garbage. Yet this has gone on for three pages... why?

Assuming you're not trolling, drop the stubborn ignorance and be realistic. Set yourself a goal for the competition next year, and in the meantime get down to your local store and demand to be taught the basic techniques. Read every WD for their painting guides; they are the only good thing in that rag but they do work. Then, next year, start a new thread showing everyone how far you've come, with a link to this piss poor paintjob, and then you'll feel a real sense of achievement.

I wasnt goin to bother commenting on this thread, but by god ur comment just takes the biscuit....

Yes the DP isnt up to a GD standard but its not a piss poor paintjob either.

Takes the biscuit? I'm offering an opinion, and being honest about it. Get off your high horse bro.

I think you've done a pretty good job so far with your demon prince, and you show promise as a painter. You're model is obviously unfinished. With more work it will probably look quite cool.

As for GD...

There is no point even asking how you might paint that model better. Because the first thing anyone here is going to tell you is that 'out of the box demon prince' isn't going to get anywhere. Even with the best paint job in the world; you would struggle to get placed.

First thing you need is a new model, and a concept... your model really needs to appear like it has a bit of narrative behind it. The pose, the colours, the base, should all tell a story.

Second thing you need; is to spend about 6 months painting it. Because that is what GD winners often do. Being skilled is only a tiny part of it. What really separates GD winners from the rest of us, is the insane amounts of time and effort they pour into every tiny detail. Not to mention money... I frequently see them chop up sickeningly expensive models just to use for base details.

Do all that, and come back to us... then maybe we'll have something to discuss.

Anti-Mag wrote:You're not good enough for Golden Demon. I'm quite elitist when it comes to painting and don't even bother reading threads if I think the models look like garbage. Yet this has gone on for three pages... why?

Assuming you're not trolling, drop the stubborn ignorance and be realistic. Set yourself a goal for the competition next year, and in the meantime get down to your local store and demand to be taught the basic techniques. Read every WD for their painting guides; they are the only good thing in that rag but they do work. Then, next year, start a new thread showing everyone how far you've come, with a link to this piss poor paintjob, and then you'll feel a real sense of achievement.

Whoa, bro. I know you're trying to convey the strength of your criticism (and honestly, the OP needs it) but you've got a lot of hate in that post. What? Did a worse painter than you steal your commission or something? I don't see why you feel the need to attack him or his model. It isn't like the four pages of this thread is everyone telling him that he's gonna win; it's quite to the contrary actually.

Telling him "he isn't good enough" and that his paintjob is "piss-poor" goes over the line of what's constructive and what's downright insulting imho. You said yourself you don't normally post in threads like these; perhaps you should stick to that mantra.

/rant

Samus_aran115 wrote:Or making a sandwich, then dropping it on the floor.

Lol, good example.

Ok how is it demon winner website spelled my last name right but stuff of legends screwed up.. OI!!!

Ok onto you: Here's the deal some of the guys are being a little harsh but better to be harsh and honest because that is the only way you will improve. The only secret to winning a demon is time. Jakob Rune Neilson, and Mathieu Fontaine both told me that. Find a painter you like and then email them. Most of the main stream ones have no problems telling you how they did it and the way they went about it down to a T. Now look into getting quality brushes first and foremost, and how to properly handle and maintain them. Once you have a grasp from that artist look at another and even if it's hey how did you do your skin tone, or how did you do that metal. No one wins a demon in their first ever year of painting, as it takes time. Most of the guys who are rocking it spend 100+ hours on the models trying for that perfect blend. I am working on a Mike Mcvey model right now and have spent 10 hours just on the coat and I still don't think it's anywhere near done. Get the color wheel like people said and start studying art at school. You obviously want to be a better painter and that isawsome, but that will take time and work. If you are still into the idea of it a few more years down the road of learning how to paint then you are really ready to try for demon. It is no big thing to enter demon heck I had two friends throw models in because they thought the same thing and they are in their 30's. I told them that was stupid because all you need to do to enter demon is buy a ticket to games day, walk up and fill out the little two line registration for the model. My 7 year old cousin can do that. People spend tons of hours and don't even make the first cut.

You want the paint to go on smooth. Start by learning basic layering. Get the foundation set and paint a model with it. Do several thinned down(water to thin the paint) layers for the base. Once it is on strong and their aren't brush strokes and the model is smooth then try using a mix of 50/50 with the next highlight. Start Halfway down the surface area you are painting as this is the paint getting lighter. Then do the third highlight except at the edge on the 50/50. Once you can get that down then move on to learn other things inpainting. Learning proper brush stroke will help you start more then learning anything else. Also for the love of god don't use the GW brushes as they suck. For now use the reaper kolinskys as for your level they are solid.

GL and hope to see what you produce.

Skinnattittar wrote:A year or two ago a friend of mine entered into the GD competition in Maryland. She is an excellent painter, perhaps the best I have ever seen. She paints models as a living (well, part-full time now in this economy) and receives commissions from all over the world. Her models have been featured in a few magazines (I am told) and even a few box covers.

When she entered, she didn't even make it to the "Runners Up," despite entering a model into every category of Fantasy. I think she won an honorable mention or something. Now, this would not have been such a let down, except that (a) she was hoping to win to help with her business (people will pay extra for GD winning painters, and it also attracts more business to boot) and (b) those that won had inferior paint jobs. Her's extensively features free hand detailing, 3D effects, light effects (glowing weapons casting light on the models, viewable from most all angles, and extremely realistic), dynamic effects (if you turned some of the entries, they appeared to be moving!), and just general badassery.

The models that beat her's actually had mold lines still visible! Lacked any real intrigue in posing, free hand, shading, etc... Featured no interesting dynamics or effects, just very run of the mill, excellent, paint jobs. Would look good as box art, but if you paid more than just the going price for a decent paint job, you would be getting had.

The rumored reason she didn't win? Well, for one, being female, two, it was pretty obvious the judges were good friends with the other applicants (greeting each other by first name, conversing about their goings on [kids, family, whatever]), and that the judges just seemed to have already chosen who was going to win the competition.

Over the past many years I have been playing 40k, I have seen an notable increase in corruption streaming through the hobby. I am told this is nothing new. I had always sort of hoped that war gaming would be above such weaknesses as petty favoritism, but obviously it isn't.

So, if you want to win a Golden Demon, you'd better buy a good set of knee pads and start practicing with bananas.

HAHAHA! The exact same thing happened to me in Chicago 2009. I showed up behind that little sh*t Dylan Gauker and they judges were so busy felating him that I had to wait about 10 minutes to hand in my entries. I made 1st cut in every category I entered, (7) and walked away empty handed. At least I vindicated myself this year at Baltimore... but still, the same old faces kept winning for the same old models.

Look people are going to always hate the demon judging. So many people think that they are the bomb when in the end they may not actually be. I saw some great looking models through the glass, but when I got a little closer look as in actually looking I noticed tons of faults. In the end a Demon is a Demon gold silver bronze whatever. We are not always going to like what the judges choose but in the end they are the judges and all you can do is try harder. USA differs from Europe in what they like remember that.

eledamris wrote:

Skinnattittar wrote:A year or two ago a friend of mine entered into the GD competition in Maryland. She is an excellent painter, perhaps the best I have ever seen. She paints models as a living (well, part-full time now in this economy) and receives commissions from all over the world. Her models have been featured in a few magazines (I am told) and even a few box covers.

When she entered, she didn't even make it to the "Runners Up," despite entering a model into every category of Fantasy. I think she won an honorable mention or something. Now, this would not have been such a let down, except that (a) she was hoping to win to help with her business (people will pay extra for GD winning painters, and it also attracts more business to boot) and (b) those that won had inferior paint jobs. Her's extensively features free hand detailing, 3D effects, light effects (glowing weapons casting light on the models, viewable from most all angles, and extremely realistic), dynamic effects (if you turned some of the entries, they appeared to be moving!), and just general badassery.

The models that beat her's actually had mold lines still visible! Lacked any real intrigue in posing, free hand, shading, etc... Featured no interesting dynamics or effects, just very run of the mill, excellent, paint jobs. Would look good as box art, but if you paid more than just the going price for a decent paint job, you would be getting had.

The rumored reason she didn't win? Well, for one, being female, two, it was pretty obvious the judges were good friends with the other applicants (greeting each other by first name, conversing about their goings on [kids, family, whatever]), and that the judges just seemed to have already chosen who was going to win the competition.

Over the past many years I have been playing 40k, I have seen an notable increase in corruption streaming through the hobby. I am told this is nothing new. I had always sort of hoped that war gaming would be above such weaknesses as petty favoritism, but obviously it isn't.

So, if you want to win a Golden Demon, you'd better buy a good set of knee pads and start practicing with bananas.

HAHAHA! The exact same thing happened to me in Chicago 2009. I showed up behind that little sh*t Dylan Gauker and they judges were so busy felating him that I had to wait about 10 minutes to hand in my entries. I made 1st cut in every category I entered, (7) and walked away empty handed. At least I vindicated myself this year at Baltimore... but still, the same old faces kept winning for the same old models.

Hahaha you know you love him. He goes to my game store, Tower Games; they keep his Slayer Sword in the basement display case.

TBH: i wouldnt even enter it.
You would achieve nothing except end up broken hearted by it.

My advice: You need to start hammering out advanced painting styles rather than basics.
If you want to go somewhere, you will need to drop the drybrushing.
Both that and cell shading are too basic and show nothing to any extent.

Main things you want to work on: NMM, lighting, wet-blending.
Those 3 alone will get you moving well, but dont expect to get it right on the 1st try.
All 3 take tons of practice to pull off at a good standard, and even more to make them look worth the effort.

Train yourself up in each style, to do that, buy 3 models that offer plenty of practice.


1 - Giants or ogres are great for wet blending, simply for the skin tone changes.
Simply grab one of them and practice, once you have the basics, try adding in more tone changes (bruised areas etc)
That will also help you grasp wet-blending to a higher level.
I would suggest power weps for this, but they dont help too much since they are pretty damn small.
also, the

2 - Buy the sigvald model from the WoC line, or sanguinary guard models.
While only basic, use them to practice NMM painting on everything you can.
Use the wet-blending from the previous to help you with this.

3 - plasma weapons, lightning claws, anything that would generate alot of light will work.
This will again be wet blending in areas, but it needs to be used to show the radial effect and make areas seem as if they were being lit by the source.



While these may help, dont expect it to come overnight.
You will be spending painstaking hours on each for ages before you even get close.

Once you get them to an acceptable standard, do a trial run on a model to show them.
Keep in mind you want a model to show off with, so pick one that will help you compliment it with the chosen scheme.
That daemon prince is a great mini, but lacks any real chance to go all out on techniques due to too many basic surface areas.


all in all: I would aim for next year for now.
Spend the time working on techniques.
Dakka has some great tutorials, as does the GW site.
For now, try a few of those out and see how you get on.

Ok, I know I've been a little to ignored but I'm only 14, what do you expect?
Now just to get something straight, I know I'm not getting get past the 1st round but I've been telling myself for a few years that I'm going to enter and my whole family wanted me to, my dad even bought me the figure (limited edition and free entry thats $25 and my dad doesn't buy things for me)

So sorry but I'm entering, even though its a waste of time!

Ok, whats NMM?

With highlighting, is it when you add a lighter colour onto a darker colour, and than the 2nd highlight on to the 1st highlight but also making it blend in????

Ok, you are right, buying giants or orges to practice on but I dislike fantasy and dont want to buy them but you are right and I should practice skin tone!

And I know you have to be harsh to get things through, even though use might be being mean, I am actually learning from this and thanx for that.

I never intended for use to actually tell me how to painted!

This thread is probably annoying you and its annoying you, soon I'm going to buy a figure (40k) and enter maybe next year or the year after but do use have any suggestions on a figure that would be good and good to convert????

And sorry if i repeated things and my English is bad

Spend some time browsing the threads here and you will find the answers to most of your questions. That can be your first step.

Most any painting technique you'd like to research can be found, in depth, with a 3-second-googling. Don't be afraid to use a search engine to look for information, because it really is all out there. Plus a tutorial or video can't deride or mock you so you may enjoy it more...

I heard from some friends that compete that way that you ahve to compete locally then regionally in Australia, and the winners from those get to go to demon as since Australia is so big and would be hard to deal. Granted this may have been the case... not sure if it still is.

I do not get that!

Ok, I know I've been a little to ignored but I'm only 14, what do you expect?

It has nothing to do with your age or skill , its everything to do with your attitude. You keep asking for advise and pretty much ignored most of the suggestion so far.
Enthusiasm can only go so far till people realize you arnt taking in anything they are telling you.

Now just to get something straight, I know I'm not getting get past the 1st round but I've been telling myself for a few years that I'm going to enter and my whole family wanted me to, my dad even bought me the figure (limited edition and free entry thats $25 and my dad doesn't buy things for me)

Enthusiasm and to have a dream is nice. And even better your father is very supportive.

So sorry but I'm entering, even though its a waste of time!

Nothing is ever a waste of time if you learn from it.

Ok, whats NMM?

Search throughout dakka...

With highlighting, is it when you add a lighter colour onto a darker colour, and than the 2nd highlight on to the 1st highlight but also making it blend in????

More or less yes , the amount of high lights used varies of course

And I know you have to be harsh to get things through, even though use might be being mean, I am actually learning from this and thanx for that.

No ones harsh in here atm.

This thread is probably annoying you and its annoying you, soon I'm going to buy a figure (40k) and enter maybe next year or the year after but do use have any suggestions on a figure that would be good and good to convert????

And sorry if i repeated things and my English is bad

Not really annoying no , anything to help another person improve and realize their dream is nice to have.
There are no "good" figure as everyone has different tastes , but i can make a few suggestions.

1) Every new released model has its fresh enthusiasm to the eyes. So its not " oh yay another xxxx again , that we have seen for the 20th time"
So using new kits keep things fresh ( this is important when kit bashing , not so much if you are planning on scratch build / sculpt )

2) Consider the materials , most of us are dead afraid of metal because we dont have the tools to... Plastic are abit easier for us to cut and glue etc etc.

3) Most modelers seem to enjoy how elaborate something is made. Extra wires , tubes , exposed mechanical parts , anything to help bring the
"realism" to your model will be catchy to the eyes.

So make it look real in a way and yeah?

Feforfar wrote:So make it look real in a way and yeah?

what's a challenging figure that's a challenge for all painters including you?

Feforfar wrote:what's a challenging figure that's a challenge for all painters including you?

Everything is a challenge for me because im not good.

But i guess... models similar to this...
Where its a pain to not assemble it prior to painting , yet if assembled its hard to have the spray reach inside not to mention paint brush.

Everything is a challenge for me because im not good

What is this clad and is it a challenge to paint?

Thats Galrauch the Chaos Dragon ,

I dont think its hard to paint but i bet its hard to assemble.
I would probably cough blood by the time im done....

Why would you cough blood?

And I'm going to get that figure and enter it in a few years!

lol super glue fumes, but id say that it would be as hard as how much detail you want to put into it, i think you shoukld just chill for a little bit and actualy get past the young blood ideal and research how long the young blood contestans have actualy been painting ect, i think you realy need to understand how much of there short lives they have put into painting and modeling, and baisicly compare the time you have been to gauge some depth of there skills ect

How do you research it?

www.google.com

A forum is not your private research team. Sorry to be harsh but rather than asking Dakka you should just type the phrase or topic you want to learn about into google and read the first page or two worth of results, rather than expecting people to take the time out to type up an answer that you could have found in 0.003 seconds flat using a free search engine...

But than what do I type in?

And are use saying that I should just like look how long they've been painting for and etc?

1 - Use google to find out some names
2 - google those names
3 - click on the webpages that many of them will have made for themselves
4 - profit!

esentialy yes, just look ion to what it actualy takes to pain at thoes levels, and use that info the see where your at with painting ect, people that have a miniscule shot at actualy placing have spent years upon years painting and honing there skills, but in sayin that dont throw in the towle, it just takes time to learn

ktulhut: i coudnt have used dot point better lol

You're obviously very excited about the whole thing, and probably feeling rather fiery and defiant with all the criticism you've been getting, but here's my advice:

Stop thinking about indivdual models or contests.

Step away from the computer.

Go outside, maybe for a walk or just sit somewhere nice.

Clear your head, and calm yourself.

Think about exactly what it is you want to learn, and write that down as simply as you can. For example, you might want to learn about Wet Blending, or how long the average GD painter has been painting models before they win anything.

Think about that list. Slowly. What is the easiest question to ask that will get you the information you want.

Think about those questions. If you were Google, would you understand them?

Go back to your computer.

Ask Google those questions.

Read what it gives you. Not just the first result, or even the first page of results. All of it. Read, read read.

Learn from what you've read.

So write a few questions down and than go on google an type them in an read, read and read the answers i get?