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Hulksmash wrote:It's a 2k list. Basically the two Carnies are naked but joined by the 2 primes so that they get cover saves and wound allocation shennanigans. This also allows me to get cover for my Tervigons behind them since that's 4 decent sized models blocking LOS to the tervies. Originally the list had 6 Hive Guard and almost 30 suped up gargoyles but I think the raveners work better in this list too. Almost as many wounds, better able to take advantage of FnP, faster, and about the same number of attacks but with rending

I'd prefer the gargoyles: 1) poison + blinding poison means more wounds against pretty much everything; and 2) more bodies = more frontage = a larger threat radius, which can be really handy for multi-assaulting 2 units that are 24" apart.

I don't play Tyranids but I like the army and have kept pretty well read on them.... has anyone had any experience with a TMC heavy shooty army? Ie: Dakka Tyrants, Harpies, Tyrannofex, Hive Guard, and a few Onslaught Tervigons to taste?

Ex:
Hive Tyrant - 2 TL Devourers, Old Adversary
Tyrant Guard - Lash Whip
Hive Tyrant - 2 TL Devourers, Old Adversary
Tyrant Guard - Lash Whip
2x2 Hive Guard
2 Naked Onslaught Tervigons w/Cluster Spines
2x10 Termagants
3 TL Heavy Venom Cannon Harpies
Tyrannofex

I believe Stelek proposed a similar idea on his blog, but I think any army would have trouble dealing with 8 Monstrous Creatures with enough Vehicle stunning/killing firepower to keep any army at bay until they close to smashing range. Add in Old Adversary Bonuses to surrounding units and the other Tyrant powers... can an actual player elaborate on this style of play?

Hulksmash wrote:I can abuse wound allocation anyway because it's an indepent character. I don't need to make him different from the other IC to do wound allocation

This doesn't seem correct. The models must be different or they will be the same group. Wound allocation says that models are grouped together if they have the same stat line, wargear and special abilities. Just being an IC does not make them unique. Two primes made the exact same way would in fact be one wound group I believe. There is nothing that states IC's get special treatment, and identical IC's meet the requirements made in the book for like models.

Huh, I've never thought of having Primes join Carnifex units. Sneaky! I didn't realize it worked that way, but now that I think on it, why wouldn't it?

I was playing last night, have a Pyrovore success story.

I was up against mech zerkers, got my reserves in on 2, all 3 units. The land raider that my Tyrannofex had been shooting at had immobilized itself in his turn, so it was free to take a chosen target.

The Pyrovores spod was placed behind the rhino phalanx, I was hoping for 3 s5 hits on back armor ten. It scattered a bit, but the dread sized bases let me get the Pyros into good position anyway.

The Tyrannofex shot the rhino and wrecked it. The 10 berserkers had to pile mostly out the back, because the rhinos were close together.

The Pyrovores shot them, hit 7, 7, 9, and did 17 wounds. The zerks failed 5 saves. The spod got another one with it's shots.

On their turn the Berserkers charged the pyrovores. At init 5 they got 8 wounds, I made 5 saves and 3 went through, they lost a berserker to the acid. Swinging back I killed a Berserker, then the fist popped the last 2, which both exploded. Ultimately only the fist survived, on my next turn the spore pod killed him.


This was a somewhat lucky game, but not terribly so. I've seen them do much better, as well as much worse. They offer a service nothing else in the book really does.

DarthDiggler wrote:I'm interested in the Devourer Gants. 15 of them are 150pts and they throw 45 shots at 18". That's some serious Dakka. I figure they can command a stand of trees or some other cover to mitigate the return fire, but how have they worked so far?

If you remember Shep's drop list withthe mandatory Termagant broods in spores, one of my first ideas for tweaking it was to add devourers. Flamers -- as always -- are an issue, but with all the MCs, etc. coming down I don't think they'd be a priority target. Meanwhile they'd try to find a cozy spot to sit and snipe from. Obviously disembarked infantry are their real target, but heck, they're S4...if they get on a Chimera flank they're capable of contributing a shake or stun result.

Not sure if I'd spend the points at less than 2000, but I really like them in a 2500 pt drop build I'm planning.

I thought I had read about it on here but wasn't sure with whom to credit.

I like Gargs. And most of my lists feature 20+ of them. I just think the Raveners fit this particular build better. But we'll see

Here are my opinions of the different units from my playtesting on Vassal and with friends namely DevianID, yermom and Avariel who post on dakka as well among others.

HQs
Hive Tyrant - he is pretty expensive when you factor in the 1+ hiveguard with a lashwhip you need to buy with him for the cover save and protection from assaulty units. You don't want to give him wings because then he just dies really fast ask Yermom how fast flygrants die in 5th ed. He is more customizable and cheaper then the Swarmlord but if you spending this much points the swarmlord gets all the powers and better buffs for slightly more.

Primes - great cheap HQ for lower points. that you can attach to things like Hiveguard and upgrade him with bone swords for close combat punch or you can make him shooty.

Swarmlord - relegated to high points games because very expensive with a cost of 340+ because you need 1 hiveguard with a lashwhip for a cover save and assault protection. If you can afford him he is really awesome force multiplier with his buffs to your army and the make an enemy unit ws 1 is ridiculously awesome combined with assaulty troops. He is however pretty slow and at a big disadvantage in dawn of war. Definately not recommended at below 1850 points. DevianID really likes the Swarmlord.

Tervigon - HQ terivgon is a solid choice given its usefulness and the expensive of other HQs. Adrenal, Toxin and the Strength 5 large blast are required upgrades for the Tervigon. Tervigon spawns scoring gants and gives them furious charge. UCatalyst is the power taken most often for feels no pain although an arguement can be made for Onslaught to cast Zoanthropes or Shooty/Combat Tyrant, or Tyranofexes. DevianID made a strong argument for crushing claws on Tervigons but I tend to not find points for it as I'm squeezing 3-4 Tervigons in my lists.

Elites
Death Leaper - Has many good points but doesn't seem worth the elite slot or his points cost Biggest point is he is nearly unkillable and can pop up anywhere which is really good with objective missions going second. Lowering a models leadership by D3 can slightly hamper a psyker or make their hood less effective which is quite good if using psykers like Tyrants, Tervigons or Zoanthropes. This is hardly reliable as you roll a 1 for the d3 its not all that effective. Very good utility but not very good combat or shooting. Would get taken if slightly cheaper and not an elite slot.

Hive Guard - These are the elite choice to take. You need these for anti tank. 2 Strength 8 shots each with 2 wounds at toughness 6. This is the sell like hotcakes model like the Vendetta is for IG. You can convert warriors with leftover carnifex parts that you didn't use on your tervigon to save money.

Lictors - with better elites they really don't see play.

Venomthropes - the 5+ save is nice but the elite slot is at a premium. I agree with bundling him with a prime for surviability.

Ymgarls - Infiltrate and the choice of buffs are pretty good but I'd opt for regular stealers as the elite slot as at a premium you need the hiveguard or zoanthropes for anti tank.

Zoanthropes - The way to run these guys is on foot using Onslaught to move them up to fire sooner. In pitched battle or spear head they can be firing turn one with a little help from a Tervigon with Onslaught and a decent d6 roll. You want these guys as an answer to Land Raiders which is not walk up and bash or hope you get lucky with a Tyranofex. The problem here is with dawn of war they can take too long to move on up to shoot. Attaching a Prime is a good way to protect these guys from assault. Pods require you to spent for the pod and then a Tyrant for bonuses to reserves and then your not useful till turn 2 at the earliest and you can't attach a prime. Their effectiveness as not as good as what you would think on paper because you have to get off the power, get past hood, hit, penerate and then roll on damage table but they still marginally more effective then hive guard on high av targets. Been testing 2 units of Hive Guard with 1 unit of Zoanthropes with a Tervigon with Onslaught and its been pretty good outside of dawn of war it can take a couple turns to get in firing position.


Troops
Gants - cheap scoring unit that enable Tervigons as troops buy the minimum ammount because you can always make more with the Tervigon. Buying them upgrades doesn't make much sense because they die pretty easily unless you give them feels no pain.

Genestealers - the outflanking pressure is great but you need to take a decent sized squad 7-8+ with a brood lord for them to be effective which makes them pretty expensive. Great for smushing those pesky long fangs or taking out Vendettas or Manticores. Just make sure to spread out to not get hit by heavy flamers.

Hormogaunts - cost too much for what you get. If you want fast assault units go with Gargoyles or Raveners. Although a large brood of these with feels no pain from a tervigon congo lined across cover can work as a unit to advance to take the opponents objective.

Rippers - Biggest problem is they don't score and get insta gibbed by Strength 6.

Tervigon - most lists should have 2 of these guys they so good. Scoring 6 wound monster which spawns more monsterous creatures is the bomb. Adrenal, Toxin and the Strength 5 large blast are required upgrades for the Tervigon. Tervigon spawns scoring gants and gives them furious charge. UCatalyst is the power taken most often for feels no pain although an arguement can be made for Onslaught to cast Zoanthropes or Shooty/Combat Tyrant, or Tyranofexes.

Warriors - really cost too much for what you get vs other troops choices. Vulnerable to Strength 8+ insta kills but combining a prime helps.

Fast Attack
Gargoyles - these are the assault unit of choice other then Tervigon pumped up Gants. fast and you can buy them poison and adrenal for pretty cheap. They can get feels no pain from Tervigons as well.

Harpies - Not worth the points the heavy venom cannon is very poor for killing vehicles and they are not very good in assault. They are vulnerable to small arms fire and you need to convert one.

Raveners - I really liked these guys in 4th to run up behind the MC wall and then assault, squishies or small comba t squads. Still pretty good but hard to find points for them outside of ardboys points levels given everything else costs more.

Spore Mines - I been taking a few for deployment denial can be pretty good but is tough to fit in lists despite how cheap they are. I liked taking these in Apoc games with Meoptic spores as well where lots of infantry close together to hit.

Heavy Support
Biovores - pretty good for killing infantry that gets their ride wrecked and are bunched up for the template pain. Wouldn't take any without taking 2 Tyranos and hiveguard for anti tank with troops covered. Ability to kill troops where you need it is good. They usually get ignored for better things to shoot at.

Carnifexes - these just got their cost jacked up way too much to be competitive. Low init makes them jaws bait and the gunfex is no more so all you have is dakka fexs which aren't that good in the mech enviroment and close combat fexes never were that great too slow and other units are better.

Mawloc or "More Luck" - Aptly named More luck because thats what you need for this guy to be useful. You need to be lucky for him to hit what you want with the deepstrike and he's not that good versus vehicles. He can scatter and do nothing and he's not that good in assault and likely to get toasted during the opponents turn from meltas, rapid fire plasma, missles etc.

Trygon "Try Gone" - Aptly called the "Try Gone" because his typical game play is he deepstrikes to "Try" to kill a vehicle with his bad shooting and usually fails. Then he gets "Gone" in the opponents turn as he gets lit up by melta, plasma, las cannons, missles whatever with no cover save cause he so honking big. Is even worse if they have mystics. Running him across the board doesn't work that well either as he Tries to run across the board then gets Gone before he can do anything meaningful in assault.

Tyranofex - probably the best of the heavy choices. He is really good if you use him right. Early in the game shoot that Rupture cannon and try to kill or at least stun vehicles just like the old gun fex but make sure to move him on up the field so that later in the game once vehicles are blown up you can use his large blast and flamer template to kill infantry. Just make sure to screen him with gants so he doesn't get assaulted by something nasty.

My test lists have been constantly influx testing different things and also depending on points. Units marked with * have earned a spot in every list I make.

HQ
Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, Onslaught cluster spines*

0-1 Prime to add to Zoanthropes or Swarmlord + 1 tyrant guard with lash whip (2k+ and ardboys level only)


Elites
2-3 Hive Guard *

2-3 Hive Guard *

2-3 Zoanthropes *

Troops
10 Gants *

10 Gants *

Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, catalyst, cluster spines *

Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, catalyst cluster spines *

0-2 7 Stealers with Broodlord

Fast
0-3 Spore mines clusters.

0-1 15 + gargoyles with adrenal and toxin

Heavy
Tyranofex 265 *

Tyranofex 265 *

0-3 Biovores.

Idea is a nidzilla rehash with gants screening hive guard with terivgons behind and tyranos on the sides or you can split up into two forces moving up to midfield and leaving some gants behind to score and pushing others forward to score. If they go after your Tervigons your Hiveguard and Tyranos keep blasting away. You hopefully have a healthy supply of gants to deal with assaulters to keep your terivgons and tyranos safe. Swarmlord gives you close combat presence and buffs if you can afford him and gargoyles give you fast buggers to attack things like long fangs with. Somewhat cold to Jaws but nothing you can really do vs that.

Hulksmash wrote:Basically the two Carnies are naked but joined by the 2 primes so that they get cover saves and wound allocation shennanigans.

Question, wouldn't it be better to differenciate your primes to better increase wound allocation, otherwise, you have to group the wounds onto one prime first/remove. Or am I missing something?

Remember Independant Characters are their own unit (of one) in CC. Attacks have to be specifically directed at them, so the one getting attacked gets the hits and wounds. As for shooting they are just considered a member of the unit, so unless i'm mistaken, if they have the same gear they would count as their own "group", however just give one something slightly different, it's really not that hard to do.

However the Rulebook says the controlling player can choose to allocate wounds from shooting to the independent character.... maybe this is where the confusion is coming from...

-edit, meant to put both CC and shooting in this post...

I think the question arises from shooting not hand to hand. Do identical primes count as two wound groups when being shot at?

Let's not derail it with rules issues

@Kirika

Interesting that your keen on taking the Tervigon as an HQ. And a decent take from another view point is always a good thing.

That said I completely disagree with your take on the Trygon. If you have proper T6 saturation they will live to see combat if you start them on the table. And as for deepstriking they aren't that easy to get rid of assuming it's not a IG army your deepstriking into which is when it'd be smarter to start him on the table.

Disagree with your stance on Carnies as they can be very, very useful if used correctly. As has been discussed earlier in the thread.

And as for the Ygmarl's based on a lot of guys on here I respect explaining their use I think I'm gonna give them a shot. Should be pretty good but we'll see

Thank you for contributing though! It's always good to see another opinion and most of those points I heartily agree with!

I have to agree with Hulksmash here, the Trygon only sees its true potential when it is combined with other monstrous forces. I hear a lot that people say they tried it and didn't like it. I often hear, "I deepstriked one and it just died." Well yes, if you DS just one trygon consider it toast. The real key is to bring it in with other targets. Marching two across the table has seen some success, much more than just throwing one in DS. Deepstriking a pair can work, but if they come in piecemeal due to bad roles you have a big problem.

Basically the way I see it is you either walk two across the table, or you DS them both but have at least a +1 from Swarmy or a hive commander tyrant.

Re: Tyrant Guard:
I consider it something of a travesty to ever see them withOUT lashwhips. The scything talons do very little, and the lashwhips do a lot--and it's 5 points.

I am coming to appreciate Janthkin's single TG approach to guarantee WS9 for the brood, but I have always had more luck with the extra body or two to help get into CC where the WS even matters.

kirsanth wrote:I am coming to appreciate Janthkin's single TG approach to guarantee WS9 for the brood, but I have always had more luck with the extra body or two to help get into CC where the WS even matters.

That's the job of the rest of the list - you have to have something else sufficiently threatening that ignoring it to shoot at the Tyrant (with cover) is a losing proposition for your opponent. I like giant units of infiltrating genestealers, myself, preferably under the effects of Catalyst.

Just remember that individual wounds go on the Tyrant, not on the Guard.

Hmmm... lesee what I've got...

I run the following list:

HQ:
Tyranid Prime
Lash Whip
Adrenal glands
Regeneration

Elites:
3 Zoanthropes

3 Hive Gaurd

Troops
6 Warriors
Double Bonesword
Toxin Sacks
Devourers

20 Hormagaunts
Toxin Sacks

20 Hormagaunts
Toxin Sacks

14 Termagants

10 Genestealers

15 Genestealers
Toxin Sacks

Heavy:
Trygon Prime
Adrenal Glands

Trygon Prime
Adrenal Glands

My opponents tend to be medium to fully mech'd.

Here a a few of my thoughts:

1) Hive Gaurd: one of my more solid units, these guys perform fairly well in any game I have used them in. Not stunning, but solidly. Last game, they racked up 4 of my 10 killpoints singly-handedly, and even in some of my worst games, they have done solidly. They are very good at hitting small, annoying units like Transports, Gaurd Heavy Weapon Squads, and Eldar Pathfinders who are camped behind a wall. Compared to zoanthropes, they are less destructive, but more reliable.Their main advantages are that they have better range, are more durable vs small-arms fire, do not get insta-gibed, can insta gib larger numbers of multi-wound infantry (Nobz, for example), do not need line of sight, do not worry about Psychic hoods, and are less susceptable to bad luck, due to number of shots fired.

2) Hormagaunts: I like them. Gargoyles may be more killy, but Hormagaunts are scoring. They make great Sacrafice Plays.

3) Trygon Prime: Overall, my MVP. Walking on, they are great for tearing apart things like Vindicators, which they can get to quickly, and make a mess of. Deepstriking, they allow me to put a heavy assault unit exactly where a need it, as well as rapid reinforcement of the Synapse web.

I play my bugs a little differently. I try and reserve my whole army when I can and limit the number of turns the enemy has to shoot at me. I figure a prolonged game of shooting bugs is never a good thing so I try and go 2nd each game and give my opponent only 3 turns of shooting before the game might end. Most of my damage is done in the assault phase, which runs both player turns and this gives me 5 turns of assault fighting vs. 3 turns of the enemy shooting at me. In that respect I try and play the units that can play this game which means few Hive Guard and no Tervigons. I think this strategy was born of the desire to keep any game from going the full time limit and allowing me more minutes spent at Hooters during our AWC lunch breaks.

winterman wrote:

Not so good as their Ymgarl cousins due to no S buff but in a pinch they can handle a transport.

Something I feel should be made clear (not saying you don't know this Lukas, just wasn't obvious in your post) -- Ymgarls are better at anti-transport due to the +1A, not the +1S. This is because a S5 rending attack is not gaining a signifcant chance to destroy AR10 over a S4 rending attack, as both pen on a 6. So when using ymgarls against transports, I much prefer the +1A when attacking a vehicle (assuming no swarmlord in area).

However there are exceptions and the added flexibility is pretty cool as far as attacking vehicles in general. Reasons to use the +1S against a tank:
--When auto-hitting an AR10 vehicle with limited numbers of weapons (or is already immobilized) -- you get a reallly good chance of destroying via escalated damage results.
--If simply shaking is prefered over the chance of not doing anything, then the +1S is also a better selection (giving a .33 increase in probability of at least shaking). Sometimes worthwhile if faced with a tank that could tear up your stealers, etc.
--Swarmlord can give them furious charge.
--And obviously if facing anything that is not rear armor 10.

Yeah sorry that could have been clearer. I usually go +1A, but as you said there are exceptions. I also go +1S when I'm multicharging vehicles. Not much chance of actually wrecking either, but a good stun on both is worth it.

Something else I forgot to mention in my Ymgarl post (was reminded when I used them yesterday) is how easy it is to surround a vehicle and block off exits for disembarking troops. The result: A dead squad if you have the numbers, if not then at least they are pinned...easy meat.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
4. Winged Tyrant

I have hear d a lot of bad things from a lot of people about this model. No tyrant guard means less survivability, that's a given. But that's not really what it should be used for. In my mind there are 2 successful ways to use him (both involve deepstrike, though I guess you could start him on the board. I would love to hear how people use him like that successfully). I think he really only fits into a mostly DS army, but again I would like to hear about other successful builds involving the winged tyrant.

1) 2x TL Brainleech devourers
These weapons give him a bit more flexibility over option number 2. A bad scatter isn't a devastating for you and you can keep out of plasma range a lot easier. Guaranteed to make an impact the turn he arrives, whether his target is a transport or an infantry unit.

2) 2x scything talons and paroxysm
This is for those more willing to take risks. You have to deepstrike him close to do well, thus putting him in range of enemy plasma, melta, etc. A bad scatter can also cause big problems for you. But when it works, he really shines. Essentially he is there to stop 1 of your opponents Long Fangs/IG blob/Lootaz etc from firing at full effectiveness. Add to this that you should be saturating the enemy lines with deepstriking units and there's a reasonable chance the tyrant will survive the return attacks.

So the DS list I usually run looks like this at 2k.

HQ
Hive tyrant
2x TL devourers
Paroxysm
Life Leech

ELITES
3x zoanthropes
spod

3x zoanthropes
spod

10 ymgarl stealers

TROOPS

7 genestealers
Broodlord

7 genestealers
Broodlord

7 genestealers
Broodlord

HEAVY SUPPORT
Trygon

Trygon

Trygon

The real weakness of the list is the troops, so broodlords are necessary in all the units. Going 2nd isn't completely necessary, though it can mean a few units may be out of position if you deploy unwisely. Try to remember which of your troops you do/don't want in combat and deploy accordingly. Don't rush into it, I have had games where I have lost because I went first and deployed terribly and I have had games where I went first and won because I deployed properly. Also remember if you go first and they reserve everything you should still be in the stronger position since they should be bringing in less than you. They may castle up but on turn 3 you should simply overwhelm them.

However, if things do go your way your opponent has 1 of 2 options.

1. Reserve everything.
A solid choice on paper, but when it comes to it they will be bringing on 50% of their army to your 66%. Odds are in your favour from the start.

2. Deploy everything
A much better proposition for your opponent since they can bring their massed firepower to bear but it still has some flaws. You get to cherry pick your targets and eliminate the threats that you really need out of the way.

Another little anecdotal test run of a reserve Tyranid list, once again inspired thanks to this thread. List:

Hive Tyrant: 2 TL-Devourers, Hive Commander, Leech Essence, Paroxysm - 225
Tyrant Guard x1: Lash Whips - 65

The Swarmlord - 280
Tyrant Guard x1: Lash Whips - 65

Ymgarl Genestealers x8 - 184

Tervigon: Cluster Spines, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs, Catalyst - 195
Termagants x10 - 50
Genestealers x8: Toxin Sacs - 136
Genestealers x8: Toxin Sacs - 136
Genestealers x7: Toxin Sacs - 119
Genestealers x7: Toxin Sacs - 119

Trygon: Adrenal Glands - 210
Trygon: Adrenal Glands - 210

1994/2000

A reserve stealer shock

I played a Vassal game against our very own Gwar! with his Mechanized BW Orks featuring Ghazkull, including 15 burnas! This list really scared me, as it has the potential to out assault me, can out-run me after turn 2, and is full of hard to crack vehicles. I castled in a corner with everything except for the Stealers, Ygmarls, and the Tervigon. My flank assault hit home, and I was able to whipe out two loota squads and get an early lead on KP's that Ghaz and friends were never able to make up. Once again, the sheer killiness of termagants with: Preferred Enemy (Swarmy), Furious Charge, Poison, and Feel No Pain claimed two boyz squads. That's with 11 termgaunts completely free via spawning from the Tervigon.

Being able to bring reserves in on a 2+ is downright deadly, and re-rolling outflanking means I can get where I want to go. The Tervigon support really helps the stealers, Catalyst allowing them to survive even some nasty flamer action. It's true I have tons of points tied up in my 2 HQ's, but their massive army-wide synergy, support, and own killiness makes them more than worth it. Swarmy is excellent for chopping down enemy deathstars like TWC, Nobz or nasty IC's that lack Eternal Warrior. Taking one Hive guard with Lash Whips is a must IMO. Being able to get 4+ cover, plus having two extra wounds, and being able to make the most dangerous enemy swing @ I1 is a steal for 65 points.

Paroxysm is also the best psychic power in the game IMO. Being able to reduce nasty enemy assault units to WS1 is incredible as they hit even the termagants on 5's.

After testing out a couple lists borrowing a lot of knowledge from this thread, I'd say Nids are highly competitive. This is without a single Hive Guard or Zoanthrope in the list. (Although my first list had 9 )

@eNvY

I think the list may have trouble with armour. A full mechanized list will meet no resistance for 2 turns, meaning they can get where they need to go. In my mind the 4 broods of stealers with toxin is unnecessary. Maybe cut back to 3 and try to fit in some room for zoanthropes. That's just me though.

What are people's opinions on Harpies? Has anyone used them regularly enough to see their usefulness?

Generally I believe running them in pairs up a flank, shooting at side armor while the rest of your army advances has potential. Though unlikely to kill a vehicle they can strip guns off, immobilize, and stun them so as to restrict the enemy. Then when the big beasties get close, the pair can swoop in on a weakened squad using Cluster spines, their Spore mine Cysts, or their Venom Cannon to weaken the target further then use their Monstrous Creature attack and charging bonus to eat into the enemy.

Pvt. Jet wrote:What are people's opinions on Harpies? Has anyone used them regularly enough to see their usefulness?

Generally I believe running them in pairs up a flank, shooting at side armor while the rest of your army advances has potential. Though unlikely to kill a vehicle they can strip guns off, immobilize, and stun them so as to restrict the enemy. Then when the big beasties get close, the pair can swoop in on a weakened squad using Cluster spines, their Spore mine Cysts, or their Venom Cannon to weaken the target further then use their Monstrous Creature attack and charging bonus to eat into the enemy.

If you don't commonly face S10 guns then they can be nice. For myself, I play against Tau quite a bit, and broadsides just evaporate them.

Harpies don't have enough armor for my taste, 4+, right? Autocannons seem like they'd be a problem.

I think that harpies may be a bit like loota's. you want them effective enough that you want them, but not effective enough that your opponent feels that it's worth while to kill them.

So, only good in a list with target saturation much more dangerous than them, ya? Tyrants, T-Fexes, Tervigons? Or could they be used in a more rapid list as well, as fire support for an advancing Ravener, Geneastealer, S-Pod army?

My thoughts are... I like the idea of a flying S9 blast that has some decent close ranged stuff and is decent in assault... but I'm wondering what kind of army build would best draw attention away from the strangely fragile beasties.

I'd say a T6 saturation army would probably do it Pvt. Jet. Failing that I'd also be inclined to think a Gargoyle/Ravener heavy army might as well as people will have issues closer to home to worry about. As long as you stay away from Tau I could see them working. It's just for the same points I get the depth I like out of my other MC's. I feel like they are heavily overpriced for their purpose and stats. Honestly 125 would have been closer to acceptable.

So, unit comparison time.

Harpy w/TL HVC - 170 points

Carnifex w/ HVC - 185 (195 if you want that Adrenal upgrade for S10 on the charge)

Harpy has mobility, TL, Mine cysts, and assault scream.

Carnifex is slower and loses TL, but gains survivability and assault capability. Carnifex DOES have a model, however.

In a T6 Nidzilla list, which do you think serves the list better? I like the Harpy's mobility, but I think the Carnifex provide more Target Saturation and move at a speed closer to the rest of the army (Looking at Tyrants, Tervigons, Tyrannos, and Hive Guard) so the whole force would hit at about the same time.

They do fill two different rolls. As long as you have enough of a closing MC threat you'll be fine with a harpy's toughness. But if they do choose to shoot at you they could put the hurt on fast since it's pretty hard to get MC's cover. I'd honestly go for the force that hits all at once but I have 0 experience with a Harpy. Point cost and lack of utility in my play style keep me from trying it. And unlike Raveners and Ygmarls which I have been convinced to try I just haven't see good reasoning to give it a shot.

A certain blue blog seems convinced that Harpies work well with T-Fex. I'm a little skeptical of that.

Also, keep in mind that harpies are not all that good in CC, ws3 and s5 means they struggle vs MEQ.

Not to mention that they are only T5 which means they can be wounded on 5's and have a 4+ save. Not very survivable even in CC. I'm open to give them a shot if people can give me a good example but right now their on my never use list. And I've got 2 of them built for funsies when I went on a converting blitz so it's not the model issue