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Hmmm, fun army? Well I have to agree with the poster a few threads up, a green tide is a pain. Honestly, the units will get in their own way. And, Unless your playing against Tau, or maybe elder or guard, it won't be very fun for your opponent either (as well as taking all day).

I've run a fully maxed out troop choice of 6x30 boyz and it was sooo boring. For shootas 20 seems like a oddly good number. I've been trying them the past couple of games and it's worked out.

I also recommend size 15 loota squads, and frankly any ork unit should be over 10 if at all possible.

If you really want to have fun with a foot list, might I recommend stormboyz and bikes. Either or both are great fun and I try to include at least one in every army both if I can. Admittedly they are expensive $ wise but so is 120 shoota boyz.

Hi all,
So just to reference, my newest list and suggestions for additions are here (a few messages back on Page 3):
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/60/535825.page#5830140

I really appreciate all your feedback and concerns/thoughts on playing a tide army... but let me just say that IS the style I want to play right now So no need to comment on that anymore, I would much rather you guys help use up the points I have left.

As I mentioned, I think the ebst solution might be using 160 pts to get 4x Nobz with PKs and Bosspoles in each Boyz unit, but that is a LOT of points for 4 troops in a tide army no?

Thanks everyone!

30 boys are a power klaw delivery system. you're going to find out, after a few games, that power klaw will do more than the rest of the unit in certain assaults.

jcress410 wrote:
30 boys are a power klaw delivery system. you're going to find out, after a few games, that power klaw will do more than the rest of the unit in certain assaults.

Seems pretty clear you are saying the 160pts for these 4 units is well worth the cost

Is one big mek enough of an HQ?

Only trouble is, with one it might be hard to get all four units within 6" of the KFF.

Some deployment shenanigans can take care of this, but it's not convenient.

I dunno,
I always played a bunch of battlewagons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
practice deploying your list on your kitchen table or something. it's nice to see like 2k worth of models, just to see what you're really buying with all those points. Helps me 'visualize' the list.

jcress410 wrote:
Only trouble is, with one it might be hard to get all four units within 6" of the KFF.
Some deployment shenanigans can take care of this, but it's not convenient.
I dunno,
I always played a bunch of battlewagons.
practice deploying your list on your kitchen table or something. it's nice to see like 2k worth of models, just to see what you're really buying with all those points. Helps me 'visualize' the list.

Yeah the 6" is my worry too, thats why I was wondering if I should just get another big mek with KFF, and just get Nobz with Big Choppas and Bosspoles, to save the points... but you guys have shut that down

I haven't bought all my boyz yet, so $$$-wise I can still switch to battlewagons i guess...damn you guys and your AMAZING ideas

Also, do Big Meks with KFF give battle wagons a cover safe?

Yes they do.

Battlewagons and Trukks are a good way to get plenty of boys on the table and get them to the enermy line without needing nearly two hundred models.

 Dakkamite wrote:
Yes they do.
Battlewagons and Trukks are a good way to get plenty of boys on the table and get them to the enermy line without needing nearly two hundred models.

Thanks for the info!
Do you reccomend 2xWarboss or 2xBig Mekk with KFF for battlewagons? I really love this idea of big mek riding inside giving stuff cover save lol

OK, here is an idea I have for a list... please let me know your thoughts. I am debating the HQ, either warboss or big mek with KFF... thoughts?

HQ
1 Warboss with PK, cybork, 'eavy armor (100pts)
1 Warboss with PK, cybork, 'eavy armor (100pts)

Elite
10 Lootas (150pts)
10 Lootas (150pts)

Troops + Transport
20 Boyz with Shootas, 3 big shootas, Nob with PK and bosspole (169pts)
1 Battlewagon with reinforced ram and big shoota (100pts)

19 Boyz with Shootas, 3 big shootas, Nob with PK and bosspole (169pts)
1 Battlewagon with reinforced ram and big shoota (100pts)

19 Boyz Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PK and bosspole (160pts)
1 Battlewagon with reinforced ram and big shoota (100pts)

Total = 1298pts

This leaves me with 202pts... Here are some options I see...
1. 24 Boyz with shootas, 3 big shootas, Nob with PK and bosspole = 199pts
2. 30 shootas boyz with 3x big shoota = 195pts
3. 2x 3 Big Gunz Kannon + Gretchin crew 150pts

Please help me dakka! :(

You know for 160 pts. you could take mad doc grotsnik. Come up with another 150 and make those cc boyz dead ard' bionically. Makes that unit soak up so much fire and will still put a hurting on most armies when it gets there. Even without bionics FNP on 30 boyz goes a long way.

MDG was key in learning to play the orks for me, gives a ton of survivability that even with the numbers orks do lack.

Yeah, the 52 times were mostly test games against players trying out Landraiders and such. the same question always came up, don't you have any anti tank units. Yes I do. When I first began using them I thought I had to take tankbusta. When they would do nothing, I chalked it up as poor die rolls, poor tactics, and bad luck because Glory Hog would take them out of my control. The truth was I rolling about average with them. They cause some damage, but never finished the job. They would take fire because they were my anti tank unit and most of my opponents thought they would actually hurt their tanks. When 6th Ed came out, once again there were changes to Tankbustas - 5 test and they did slightly better, but slightly better from God Awful is still very bad. So now even if requested, I will still not field them and my 15 metal guys will stay at home in a box with all the other figures I no longer field.
Big Gunz are better than Lootas because they are cheaper to field. Always take 3 and with an ADL and Quadgun, they shoot it and still get their 3 shots. and 160 points is still cheaper than 225. If you get an ADL for your Loota - Don't get the quad gun and take them in units of 10 so they can go to ground behind the ADL (200 points). The great thing is since Lootas are elites and Big Gunz are Heavy Support you can take BOTH.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ossidium wrote:
Thanks for the info!
Do you reccomend 2xWarboss or 2xBig Mekk with KFF for battlewagons? I really love this idea of big mek riding inside giving stuff cover save lol

OK, here is an idea I have for a list... please let me know your thoughts. I am debating the HQ, either warboss or big mek with KFF... thoughts?

Please help me dakka! :(

Well you can't take the Big Gunz because you used up your Heavy Support slots with BattleWagons
Warboss make Nobs Troop Units - Nobs can take Battlewagons as Dedicated Transports.
here's my suggestion:

HQ 2x Warboss (PK, Cybork, Attack Squig, Bosspole) (115 each)
Troop 2x 10 Nob (Painboy, Orderly, 10 Cybork, Waaagh! Banner, PK, 3 Shoota/Burna) (340 each)
DT 2x Battlewagon (Def Rolla) (110 each)
Elite 2x 10 Loota (150 each)
HS 2x 3 Big Gunz - Kannons (60 each)
ADL, Quad Gun (100)

Thanks for the feedback Sleg and firmlog.

I have updated the first post with my new list... I have decided to go back to what I love so much about the Orkz... more boyz! I have tweaked it to include 3 Trukks, I think will help me with getting boyz in for CC, while keeping my lootas count high, and getting big gunz, which is something I really want because I have a cool idea how to make the models

The list is also pasted here below for any new people who jump to the end

1. I really wanted 'eavy armor on the HQs, but just didn't have the room :(
2. I am still wondering if one of my Big Meks should be a Warboss, but I really like the two meks for their KFFs

1500pts MMM SEXY WAAAGHH

HQ
1x Big Mek with Forcefield, 'eavy armor (90pts)
1x Big Mek with Forcefield, 'eavy armor (90pts)

Elites
10x Lootas (150 pts)
10x Lootas (150 pts)

Troops
30x Boyz with Shootas, 3 Big Shootas, Nob with big choppa and bosspole (215 pts)
30x Boyz with Shootas, 3 Big Shootas, Nob with big choppa and bosspole (215 pts)

12x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PowerKlaw and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk with red paint job (40 pts)

12x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PowerKlaw and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk (35 pts)

12x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PowerKlaw and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk (35 pts)

Heavy Support
3x Big Gunz Kannon + 4 Gretchin crew (72 pts)
3x Big Gunz Kannon + 4 Gretchin crew (72 pts)

idk how much you use the reinforced ram but if your not using it constantly you could drop 2 of the reinforced rams to buy your eavy armor for the big meks

wazrokk wrote:
idk how much you use the reinforced ram but if your not using it constantly you could drop 2 of the reinforced rams to buy your eavy armor for the big meks

Hi wazrokk,
I thought the reinforced ram was to help with that death/glory rolling...
is it not useful on trukks? I would for sure rather beef up the Mekks a bit

another option is drop the 2 kff's, pick up an aegist defense line (offers better cover anyhow and same points) put the big guns and 1 group of lootas back there put hte other groups of lootas in land cover nearby, i also think you'd enjoy playing with a shokk attack gun for ur big mek, can be really powerful or suicidal good fun orkish fun-hope this helps

if your woried bout anti air with the adl you can get a quadgun as well.

Ossidium wrote:

wazrokk wrote:
idk how much you use the reinforced ram but if your not using it constantly you could drop 2 of the reinforced rams to buy your eavy armor for the big meks

Hi wazrokk,
I thought the reinforced ram was to help with that death/glory rolling...
is it not useful on trukks? I would for sure rather beef up the Mekks a bit

Reinforced Ram lets trukks reroll dangerous terrain checks, so its a must, also it allows you to tankshock units with the trukk even though its not a tank
also if you take warbosses, an attacksquig is a must on them imo, well worth the 15 points, that extra Powerclaw attack does so much in close combat

wazrokk wrote:
another option is drop the 2 kff's, pick up an aegist defense line (offers better cover anyhow and same points) put the big guns and 1 group of lootas back there put hte other groups of lootas in land cover nearby, i also think you'd enjoy playing with a shokk attack gun for ur big mek, can be really powerful or suicidal good fun orkish fun-hope this helps

if your woried bout anti air with the adl you can get a quadgun as well.

Hi again, thanks for the suggestion, I had actually already through of that... I just really feel like a defense line is not Orkky enough for me I really want those Meks walking around having fun too lol

I do like your suggestion to remove reinforced rams for 'eavy armor on the mekks... Do you really think I don't need the rams? maybe I can give one truck red paint to be a quick one

as delevarius said it allows you to reroll dangerous terrain and tank shock, but to be honest, they usualy blow up before they reach the enemy as they are front armour 10, so i dont put 2 many points into my trukks just use them as transport to move quickly. i also agree that attack squigs are a must with a warboss, 15 points for a extra PK attack is always worth if your boss is oging to be in melee

have you thought bout tryin to make some points for battle wagons with deff rollas they are meaner then the reinforced ram have extra armor (front armour 14) can cary more boys, and deal d6 str10 wounds,2d6 if they try to deaht and glory regardless if they suceed or not (found in faq's on orks), as well as the re rolling dangerous terain, they cost a bit more points but its always fun to watch people run away before squashin em flat with ur deff rolla


Automatically Appended Next Post:
one of the biggest ways to find out what you need is to try em out play games, but personaly i dont think you need the rams, even if your trukk breaks down halfway to the board the 12 boys inside can either run to the other side, or take a objective near the middle (if your playing objectives)

Green Tide is always fun, time consuming and very difficult to maneuver for a beginner.

You have 2 KFF, why? Don't forget it's a 5+ cover (it's not stealth, nor is it shouded). You can't fit either in any Trukk so you are protecting your Boyz, it's not much. Personally if you are going green tide, Take the Warboss instead. There's no Mob Up so once you lose 25% or more of the 12 man squads, your save will be and 8 or a 7, which gives you a 50/50 chance they'll a take another wound and still run away before ever getting into CC. But even if theydon't rout, you will have to deal with overwatch and then Int 1 for your power claw to even attack. I wouldn't worry about giving your Nob the PK - it's 25 points, he'll never use. Like the Dakkajet, Trukks are paper a str 4 weapon (which is just about every weapon) can glance it to death, anything higher and you will be ramshackling your trukk (probably kill everyone on board). Fortunantly for them, the range on their weapons wont be an issue because you will be driving right for them, without the protection of the KFF.
Go back to the Battlewagons or at least 1 Battlewagon to help protect your Trukks (but it probably wont).

the pk does drop it to init 1 but ive found its pretty rare that they dont come into play at all, and ram shackling usualy only kills 3-4 orcs not all on board but that is enough to greatly wound em, if nothing else id drop one boy from the truck and put in a big mek with the kff keep each vehicle 5 inches from the center truck (spacing from templates and if big mek in middle trukk they all get the 5+ save) run em down their throat, and charge what evers close by if its only one unit, triple charge or move them till middle then split them off once they close enough that even if the trukk is shot down it wont matter.

Hey guys thanks for the above comments! I am really loving this dakka community for a super noob
So many abrevs I am getting a little lost in the posts lol.

I think I will change one big mekk for a warboss. Maybe cut one trukk to 11boyz to fit the boss...

I am still unclear if I should put the rams on the trukks, I am hearing two great arguments for either side lol.

Also on the battlewagons front, I don't like them for my boyz because :
1) super expensive where I live
2) a lot of points so i have to give up a lot when I want a lot of troops
3) I don't get to have my big gunz which i really think are cool

lol, sorry I will try to use less abreviations, id say just try out your army and see what works for you and what you enjoy using to smash da puny 'umans waaagh :p

I run my trucks as cheap as I can. And a reinforced ram will often end in the truck blowing up too. If you want a cc option on the truck and I've used ti to great effect against drop pod armies and dreads, use the ball and chain. 1 str 9 hit on a 4+ within 2" and you don't have to worry about the truck getting nabbed in the process.

Now it may be faq'd but I don't recall it. But the ball and chain works in the cc phase, not the players or owners phase, so you get one hit in both phases.

wazrokk wrote:lol, sorry I will try to use less abreviations, id say just try out your army and see what works for you and what you enjoy using to smash da puny 'umans waaagh :p

sounds like good advice... anything with smashin' is mmm!

firmlog wrote:I run my trucks as cheap as I can. And a reinforced ram will often end in the truck blowing up too. If you want a cc option on the truck and I've used ti to great effect against drop pod armies and dreads, use the ball and chain. 1 str 9 hit on a 4+ within 2" and you don't have to worry about the truck getting nabbed in the process.
Now it may be faq'd but I don't recall it. But the ball and chain works in the cc phase, not the players or owners phase, so you get one hit in both phases.

Yeah I agree I want to keep the Trukks cheap, but the rams for me I like because they let me reroll the dangerous terrain don't they? I don't really use it for the tankshock thing.

What do you guys think about changing a Mekk for a Warboss and throwing him in the trukk? I can work on an updated list tonight...

I think only the deff rolla allows rerolled dangerous terrain.

 firmlog wrote:
I think only the deff rolla allows rerolled dangerous terrain.

so what the heck, there's nothing worth getting on the trukks

OK, the new list... Just want to have some fun with boyz

1499pts MMM SEXY WAAAGHH

HQ
1x Big Mek with Forcefield, 'eavy armor (90pts)
1x Warboss, PK, cybork, 'eavy armor (100pts) <-- Goes in middle trukk

Elites
10x Lootas (150 pts)
10x Lootas (150 pts)

Troops
30x Boyz with Shootas, 3 Big Shootas, Nob with big choppa and bosspole (215 pts)
30x Boyz with Shootas, 3 Big Shootas, Nob with big choppa and bosspole (215 pts)

12x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PowerKlaw and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk with red paint job (35 pts)

11x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PowerKlaw and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk (35 pts)

12x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PowerKlaw and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk (35 pts)

Heavy Support
3x Big Gunz Kannon + 4 Gretchin crew (72 pts)
3x Big Gunz Kannon + 4 Gretchin crew (72 pts)

3 things i have noticed, the 11 boys you have at the same points as the 12 boys, red paint job increases trukks point cost by 5, and i would put he warboss in the trukk with red paint job, as your warboss is a beast in cc you should get him there fast as possible. Othewise i think the list looks good and killy. you will have to let us know how well it works for you.

 EmbracetheChaos wrote:
Reconsider those bosspoles. It's only 25 points, but check out the Mob Rule. 30 boyz should have zero problem with morale.

Not much of an Ork player, just something I noticed at glance. Also, a green wave with 120 boyz w/shootas should do just fine without transports. I have a tough time with 60 boyz, the body count alone is just too much for me to shoot before they're on the other side of the board.

I would also look at your anti-tank. Again, not much of an Ork player, so the Klaws may be enough. I just like something that can break tanks open from a distance.

It looks like a really fun list to me, even without any changes.

Youd be surprised how quickly I can spread green ooze on the field like butter with a MEQ army.

60 Orks is flamer fodder. 120 boyz is a mess, but trust me, trukks make a 10 fold difference.

wazrokk wrote:
3 things i have noticed, the 11 boys you have at the same points as the 12 boys, red paint job increases trukks point cost by 5, and i would put he warboss in the trukk with red paint job, as your warboss is a beast in cc you should get him there fast as possible. Othewise i think the list looks good and killy. you will have to let us know how well it works for you.

Ok... no diea what the sweet hell happenned to my math last night, but thanks! Updated below:

I had to remove 2 more Grot crew to make room for red paint job...
Quick question... should I just remove all the extra grot crew for 18 pts and put that somewhere? or will the extra crew help the big gunz a lot?

1499pts MMM SEXY WAAAGHH

1499
HQ
1x Big Mek with Forcefield, (85pts)
1x Warboss, PK, cybork, 'eavy armor (100pts)

Elites
10x Lootas (150 pts)
10x Lootas (150 pts)

Troops
30x Boyz with Shootas, 3 Big Shootas, Nob with big choppa and bosspole (215 pts)
30x Boyz with Shootas, 3 Big Shootas, Nob with big choppa and bosspole (215 pts)

11x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PK and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk with red paint job (40 pts) –Big Mek

11x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PK and bosspole (106 pts)
Trukk with red paint job (40 pts) –Warboss

12x Boyz with Slugga/Choppa, Nob with PK and bosspole (112 pts)
Trukk with red paint job (40 pts)

Heavy Support
3x Big Gunz Kannon + 3 Gretchin crew (69 pts)
3x Big Gunz Kannon + 3 Gretchin crew (69 pts)

with 'eavy Armor you do not need the KFF. If the Trukks pull more than 6" away from the Big Mek, you do not need the KFF. If the KFF is protecting the Big Gunz, give them an Aeigis Defence Line (Same Price as KFF - gives 4+ cover and the Big Gunz can go to ground for 2+ and snap fire)

You need to put the KFF in a Trukk, don't forget Trukks are armor 10, which means every weapon in 40k can glance (cause hull point damage). Every other codex has very good shooters, with 3 Hull points, it'll lose a hull point on every wound (without the Big Mek giving the 5+ cover). I've seen 8 Trukks go down first turn and never move. I've used 4 with similar results. Ramshackle is not your friend (if you could take 30 orks, I'd say yes, sadly only 12. If you are really lucky 1 of your units will be able to charge (probably not do much in melee, but they will charge none-the-less.

If you are not playing with Terrain, using the Big Mek to protect your footsloggers I can see, still not all that useful protecting Footsloggers. Terrain should be your best friend getting that 4+ cover for 30 Orks is key because even if you have a bunch out in the open, the closest model is shot first. And with 4+ or even 5+ cover why would you need the KFF's 5+ cover? I would also say practice moving 30 Orks, just lurching them forward with make the unit less effective than they could be.

 Sleg wrote:
with 'eavy Armor you do not need the KFF. If the Trukks pull more than 6" away from the Big Mek, you do not need the KFF. If the KFF is protecting the Big Gunz, give them an Aeigis Defence Line (Same Price as KFF - gives 4+ cover and the Big Gunz can go to ground for 2+ and snap fire)

You need to put the KFF in a Trukk, don't forget Trukks are armor 10, which means every weapon in 40k can glance (cause hull point damage). Every other codex has very good shooters, with 3 Hull points, it'll lose a hull point on every wound (without the Big Mek giving the 5+ cover). I've seen 8 Trukks go down first turn and never move. I've used 4 with similar results. Ramshackle is not your friend (if you could take 30 orks, I'd say yes, sadly only 12. If you are really lucky 1 of your units will be able to charge (probably not do much in melee, but they will charge none-the-less.

If you are not playing with Terrain, using the Big Mek to protect your footsloggers I can see, still not all that useful protecting Footsloggers. Terrain should be your best friend getting that 4+ cover for 30 Orks is key because even if you have a bunch out in the open, the closest model is shot first. And with 4+ or even 5+ cover why would you need the KFF's 5+ cover? I would also say practice moving 30 Orks, just lurching them forward with make the unit less effective than they could be.

Thanks for the tips. I have updated the list to have 3 fast moving trukks with the Mek and warboss...

Don't have any pts for aegis defense line, and I am still not convinced on them, feels so not orky :(