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I can understand the kids, outside of a few instigators the rest turned up out of crowd mentality, some probably didnt know that no one from the party lived there until too late and most probably didn't do any damage.

Thats not saying its right, but its understanding crowd mentality, put people in crowds with peer pressure and the do things they wont do otherwise.

However the parents who threaten to sue, they should get visits from the press. I think a rabid journalist backed up by two papparazi with flash cameras will be suitable punishment. I can see them getting real popular if their names are exposed, and I hope they are.

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:

Pro-tip; don't post anything like that online which may come back to bite you

What he said.

Eh, he's from Europe, guys. They aren't allowed to have those little pea-shooters over there. Tis a silly place.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Eh, he's from Europe, guys. They aren't allowed to have those little pea-shooters over there. Tis a silly place.

Yeah, and they also jail people for posting racist tweets. Imagine what they might do for threatening assault on someone via a website

 Orlanth wrote:
I can understand the kids, outside of a few instigators the rest turned up out of crowd mentality, some probably didnt know that no one from the party lived there until too late and most probably didn't do any damage.

Thats not saying its right, but its understanding crowd mentality, put people in crowds with peer pressure and the do things they wont do otherwise.

However the parents who threaten to sue, they should get visits from the press. I think a rabid journalist backed up by two papparazi with flash cameras will be suitable punishment. I can see them getting real popular if their names are exposed, and I hope they are.

So put them in the chair, under oath and hammer them with either perjury, or obstruction, because they DO know who started it, and those who did obviously deserve some punishment, mandatory volunteer service, cleaning/repairing the guys house.. something.


And yeah, if I were the guy whose house was broken into, I'd send those pictures over to the local news outlet, record all conversations with the parents, turn those over to the news, etc. Should get them singing a more sane tune fairly quick like.

QFT.

Master of Ordnance I read up a page to see if you were from the UK, if you were an American you could get away with that. But as a UK resident its a SHORT CUT TO A MANDATORY CUSTODIAL SENTENCE. I cannot emphasise that enough.
This is a sign of the times sadly, I have heard of any know several similar testimonies.

Ok what can you do.

First you need to be forwarned. Sorry to be cynical, but from experience of many cases known personally (so no not from reading Daily Mail) the cards are stacked against you
Accept this mantra as a sad truth, as it wont end up too far from the mark: the kids are streetsmart, it's the enforcement authorities who are dumb.

First. these kids likely are not stupid, they know you cant touch them, and will complain loud and fast if you do and their complaint will be heard. So don't give them any excuses, retaliation is no defense especially if you get a dogmatised social worker or child protection officer on you, they tend not to listen to reason. As a rule of thumb kids know how to play the system better than adults do, at least the adults who end up mattering.
Second if the offense becomes or has rumour to become firearms related expect crud to roll downhill very very fast. You have been warned. And no, it doesn't have to be a 'real' gun.
Third watch for any angle of accusation of discrimination or abuse. If you or they are ethnic, gay or disabled things change somewhat. This is the reality of our society today. If any of the kids are ethnic and you have an incident with them, expect accusations of racism to fly, then expect the burden of proof to be on you. If you or adults in your family corner a kid alone or in the dark, expect wild accusations of paedophilia from them or their parents, getting out of this will be even more difficult as even baseless accusations can be dangerous if they reach the wrong ears.

Now for the bad news. By having incidences with these kids in the past you are a target. I take it you are fairly young yourself but are over 16. Good for you to stick up for your little brother but ultimately your mum needs to call the police and lodge official complaints. Get the police to come round, which can take a while as the police will be reluctant to send a car to the area due to stretching, especially in the evenings, you can complain anonymously, and never admit to making the call to anyone not in direct authority.
The goal here is to put pressure on the local authority via the police, if these kids are in social housing, and they likely are and they cause enough of a stink, which means there is no small chance the council will evict the families to a sink estate where they belong. To achieve this you need to lodge complaints and create a paper trail, this is better off coming from a full adult taxpayer or council housing tenant.
If you are in sink estate the reason to create a paper trail is to sew the seed for having you moved to a better area instead. If the home is your own and not social housing then this wont help.
However do not otherwise expect complaints to stop the kids.

Talk softly and carry a big stick.
I know of two ex-servicemen living in the same block near to an orphanage. One serviceman got lip from the tearaway kids but stood his ground and spoke softly and firmly back, with no threats issued. He never swore at them. Now when they see him the kids run. The other guy is bigger and more physically impressive but flies into a temper when the kids taunted him, he could easily hurt any of them and could proably take on them all, but the kids respond by taunting him further and victimise his partner too and single out his property to vandalise. Work out the lesson for yourself.

 master of ordinance wrote:

I hate this fething "thou shalt not lay one fingeer the kiddys even be they brats and wholly in need of a good hiding but there incompetent parents refuse to take account for them" edict that the government has going.

I don't blame that on the current government, it came in full force with New Labour alongside other dogmas. The Social services, police and teaching establishments are all thoroughly dogmatised and it will take at least two terms with Labour out of power for any common sense to have a chance of being restored.
If you were living in Scotland it would be different, I know of one exaperated victim of teen hooligans living in Glasgow who was told by the police that so long as he didnt kill or injury them he could do whatever was needed to scare them off. Scotland got this levity because undermining Scottish culture was not part of the agenda, south of the border things are very different.

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:

Pro-tip; don't post anything like that online which may come back to bite you

Yeh, I sought of figured that one out once I had calmed down. :/
I guess im just angry at those parents whom cannot take responsibility for there own spawn

Thanks for this. As I said, it was my rage that got me commenting like this.
We have reported them to the police more times than I can count, and the most that happened was that we got a crime number. Once. The police in my area just don't do anything and our local station was closed to the public, so we can no longer go and report there. Our next nearest one is over 3 miles away. Frankly I am fed up and I do believe that we do go to softly on these brats but there is nothing I can do I guess.

having looked back I am going to remove my last comment, it was written in the blind rage of maddening anger.

And yes I am over 16, Im 19.

several posts edited or removed due to language.

The language filter is there as we do not want certain terms or words used on the site.

It is not acceptable or permissible for posters to work their way around the filter, this includes "cunningly" replacing letters with ! or similar for example.

This especially applies if you've been spoken to with regards to language in the past.

Kids these days, I'm ashamed to say I was born in the 90s.....

Understood red

welshhoppo wrote:
Kids these days, I'm ashamed to say I was born in the 90s.....

I'm not, quit being so pretentious like somehow you're this brilliant person in comparison to other people in your generation.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also I'm not really convinced about these generation gaps it seems it has more to do with age and maturity rather than one generation being better or worse than another I've read novels set in the 50's, 60's and 70's and the families seem to be dealing with unruly teenagers back then as

well.

 daedalus wrote:

 timetowaste85 wrote:

I swear, you're trying to win the "most hated person on Dakka" award today, aren't you? The fact that you don't know any (or at least 99%) of us in real life and actually think you know better how we'll raise our current/future children than we do is pretty pants on head. You must be trolling-nobody is that stupid. Most people here are talking about how we'd have been punished as kids, and how our kids would meet a similar reaction for screwing up like that. These parents are blaming everybody else. Just from the conversation you should be able to figure out the difference.

To be fair, if I could get my hypothetical kids out of "official" trouble, I would via any way possible. Having a juvenile record CAN'T look good when applying for schools, jobs, etc. I mean, the internet never forgets, and it's a bad, bad place to cultivate negative PR. Privately? Oh, there would be hell to pay for years to come. Years.

The problem here is that the above conditional has already been failed. You CAN'T save them, because the kids have dug their own grave by bragging about their crimes, and by threatening a lawsuit, the parents are effectively broadcasting it to the world loudly from the rooftops. Proper parenting at this point mandates forcing your kids to go forward and pay their dues.

But at what point "Shouldn't" your kid not have a record?

Drunken Delinquency?
Possession of Hard Drugs?
Breaking, Entering, and Trashing?

Drunk Driving into Vehicular Manslaughter?

At what point is it proper to, as a parent, say "You dun FETHED up, now live with the consequences." Not saying you don't be there for the poor kid who has to live with himself, but at what point do you say "You made your bed, sleep in it".

I don't have kids, as a disclaimer.

 Slarg232 wrote:

But at what point "Shouldn't" your kid not have a record?

Drunken Delinquency?
Possession of Hard Drugs?
Breaking, Entering, and Trashing?

Drunk Driving into Vehicular Manslaughter?

At what point is it proper to, as a parent, say "You dun FETHED up, now live with the consequences." Not saying you don't be there for the poor kid who has to live with himself, but at what point do you say "You made your bed, sleep in it".

I don't have kids, as a disclaimer.

Publicly? After you've pulled out every last legal stop to keep them from having one. The legal system is designed around the assumption that you'll be doing that, so you have to do it to get the fairest shake possible.

Privately? You ALWAYS deal with the consequences. If they were my kids, caught bragging or otherwise, I'd see them up there with a mop and bucket, helping to clean up for as long as it takes.

They already broke the first rule though: If you're going to feth up, make it as difficult to find out about as possible. The fact that these kids were bragging about it means that it's too late. They're already nasty little sociopaths.

IIRC, dont most offenses conducted by minors tend to completely disappear once they turn 18? By most I mean, just about everything short of murder, or especially violent crimes, or serious repeat offenses.

Truthfully,

I don't recognize anyone's right to exist outside of the family.

Well. I have to admit. There are many ways to raise your kids right. Some are good, some are to touchy feely lovey, and some are...denying reality. Always remember

You are the product of your environment

Your kids are in your environment

Its up to you as a parent to get your point across to them.

My best point I did. I brought a Xbox 360 and a PS3. Two failing report cards in a row. One blown up teen with a chip on his shoulder. Equal two smashed game system with a hockey stick. The other teen. I deleted all his level 80 toons from WoW.

 Jihadin wrote:
Well. I have to admit. There are many ways to raise your kids right. Some are good, some are to touchy feely lovey, and some are...denying reality. Always remember

You are the product of your environment

Your kids are in your environment

Its up to you as a parent to get your point across to them.

My best point I did. I brought a Xbox 360 and a PS3. Two failing report cards in a row. One blown up teen with a chip on his shoulder. Equal two smashed game system with a hockey stick. The other teen. I deleted all his level 80 toons from WoW.

I personally do not like that style. I think it is a waste and just causes them to resent you. If you take it the feth away then IMO it gives the kids something to work for, priviliges back and so forth.

 Jihadin wrote:
You are the product of your environment

Well I guess that answers the whole nature vs. nurture argument that has been going on for some time now.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
Well. I have to admit. There are many ways to raise your kids right. Some are good, some are to touchy feely lovey, and some are...denying reality. Always remember

You are the product of your environment

Your kids are in your environment

Its up to you as a parent to get your point across to them.

My best point I did. I brought a Xbox 360 and a PS3. Two failing report cards in a row. One blown up teen with a chip on his shoulder. Equal two smashed game system with a hockey stick. The other teen. I deleted all his level 80 toons from WoW.

I personally do not like that style. I think it is a waste and just causes them to resent you. If you take it the feth away then IMO it gives the kids something to work for, priviliges back and so forth.

Their future landlord won't see it that way

Well Im not their land lord.

I'm not out to win a popularity contest with my kids. I'm being a parent. If they can remember all the cheat codes, hidden caches, excellent hide spots, and the places to get the best gear then they should do great in school. Your "shock" because I went out and trashed 1500 worth of game systems and games and not sweat the "loss" of money. I'm not a "softy" parent. Granted I have not laid a belt on them like my dad did to me or nailed me in my head with a real Wok due to me saying the Fbomb to many times that POed my mom. Its tough love Airborne. Nothing but tough love.

Whatever you think is right. There is no "right way" to parent. But there are wrong ways.

The over board on whipping a kid is way to much of a punishment. Physically punishment to the extreme is not worth the hurt

I agree. I remember a girl telling me how her grand mother woud hit her with a broom. If she mis behaved the mther would point to a broom and she would stop. I was astonished. It didnt teach them why something was wrong, or why they should not do it. It teaches them to fear the parent. I think that no matter what a kid should never fear a parent.

 Cheesecat wrote:

welshhoppo wrote:
Kids these days, I'm ashamed to say I was born in the 90s.....

I'm not, quit being so pretentious like somehow you're this brilliant person in comparison to other people in your generation.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also I'm not really convinced about these generation gaps it seems it has more to do with age and maturity rather than one generation being better or worse than another I've read novels set in the 50's, 60's and 70's and the families seem to be dealing with unruly teenagers back then as

well.

What if he really is more brilliant than everyone else in his generation? I mean, someone's got to be.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I agree. I remember a girl telling me how her grand mother woud hit her with a broom. If she mis behaved the mther would point to a broom and she would stop. I was astonished. It didnt teach them why something was wrong, or why they should not do it. It teaches them to fear the parent. I think that no matter what a kid should never fear a parent.

I was taught it teaches kids that violence works and that it is ok to hurt someone you love.

 xole wrote:
I was taught it teaches kids that violence works and that it is ok to hurt someone you love.

Chris Brown is that you?

 Jihadin wrote:
I'm not out to win a popularity contest with my kids. I'm being a parent.

These 2 sentences should be remembered by EVERY parent, everywhere...

Update on the story. 6 of the kids have been arrested. Wonder how well that will help the parents sue the homeowner.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/27/police-arrest-6-people-for-vandalism-after-partying-teens-trash-ex-nfl-player/