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Bottle wrote: There's already talk on the UK independent scene podcasts of an extra layer of comp being added. I imagine the decisive moment will be next year's SCGT and if they decide to run AoS vanilla or with a comp. I don't imagine they'll do much points adjustment (though they might), but they might add further restrictions.
I say this from time to time, buuuuut I think it's important to remember that competitive WHFB 8E was virtually never played uncomped throughout its lifespan. Between regional restrictions, then ETC, then Swedish Comp catching at the end, we always added adjustments to the core rules, not necessarily because they were broken (I still think 8E was the best, despite its problems (read: spell lore imbalances)) but because they needed to be tweaked to accommodate more competitive gaming and its demands for increased balance.
Which is to say, I fully expect AOS tournaments to comp the game, and frankly really look forward to it.
- Salvage
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/12 14:33:41
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: So, I feel the need to say this, but just on the virtues of their Keywords alone, TK Chariots are shockingly powerful platforms for buffs. There are just so many really really potent, stackable, ones they can receive... their footprint is immense and obnoxious to play around, and they so easily gain back models.
I felt horrible at a tournament yesterday, because I THOUGHT I was way toning down my TK by taking no Necrosphinx, and no Mourngul, and still, at will, I removed any unit I wanted, from across the table, as needed. I saw some killer lists too, but outside of one tabled my other opponents in two turns.
I know "power ranking" put them somewhere in the "meh" category, but they really do just have access to too many good bonuses. I fully expect them to gain 40pts in cost, in next year's GH.
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: So, I feel the need to say this, but just on the virtues of their Keywords alone, TK Chariots are shockingly powerful platforms for buffs. There are just so many really really potent, stackable, ones they can receive... their footprint is immense and obnoxious to play around, and they so easily gain back models.
I felt horrible at a tournament yesterday, because I THOUGHT I was way toning down my TK by taking no Necrosphinx, and no Mourngul, and still, at will, I removed any unit I wanted, from across the table, as needed. I saw some killer lists too, but outside of one tabled my other opponents in two turns.
I know "power ranking" put them somewhere in the "meh" category, but they really do just have access to too many good bonuses. I fully expect them to gain 40pts in cost, in next year's GH.
Care to share your list? I'm definitely curious.
Leaders
Settra The Imperishable (360)
Tomb King (100)
- Dynastic Blade & Shield
Liche Priest w/mount(120)
Necrotect (100)
Royal Warsphinx (340)
- Venom Spike Tail
Units
Necropolis Knights x 6 (320)
Skeleton Chariots x 6 (280)
Skeleton Chariots x 6 (280)
Skeleton Warriors x 10 (80)
- Ancient Blades
Total: 1980/2000
In essence, Settra pops his Command Ability creating a bubble of +1 hit AND +1 wound, for almost every single model in the entire army within 18". He then lets the TK use his ability to give a chosen unit an additionally +1 to hit. Necrotect gives a unit +3" move and rerolling wounds of 1. Warsphinx debuffs a unit of your choice making your entire army wound it one easier. Incantation of Desert Wind the movement buffed unit, and you can essentially hit anything, anywhere as needed 5/6 times. If needed the Liche Priest also Righteous Smiting spells, making units roll additional attacks on a 6.
For instance... fully buffed, the Necro Knights attack the debuffed target. They roll 18 dice for the Venomous Bites. The Righteous Smiting and two hit buffs now mean you're hitting on 2's, and any 4+ on the dice generates a further attack. You're averaging 25 hits. You're rolling 2's to wound, re-rolling 1's, and every 4+ because of the Setta buff/Warsphinx debuff, does a mortal wound in addition to their damage profile. Its a rend -1 attack, and d3 damage per, so against a 3+ save unit, you're averaging 56 wounds already... and you've not even done the rider's attacks yet.... from virtually across the table.
And the army deploys soooooo wide, that its incredibly hard for your opponent to get behind your front-line, meaning sniping out heroes is their only hope, and really only Settra is "required" to make the list hum, and gets a 3+, and then 5+ and 6+ against any damage that does get through.
I also could've shuffled the list and found a way to get a Herald in there, returning ANOTHER Chariot and Necroknight to the list each turn... but honestly, I lost one unit of Chariots all day as is.
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: So, I feel the need to say this, but just on the virtues of their Keywords alone, TK Chariots are shockingly powerful platforms for buffs. There are just so many really really potent, stackable, ones they can receive... their footprint is immense and obnoxious to play around, and they so easily gain back models.
I felt horrible at a tournament yesterday, because I THOUGHT I was way toning down my TK by taking no Necrosphinx, and no Mourngul, and still, at will, I removed any unit I wanted, from across the table, as needed. I saw some killer lists too, but outside of one tabled my other opponents in two turns.
I know "power ranking" put them somewhere in the "meh" category, but they really do just have access to too many good bonuses. I fully expect them to gain 40pts in cost, in next year's GH.
Care to share your list? I'm definitely curious.
Leaders
Settra The Imperishable (360)
Tomb King (100)
- Dynastic Blade & Shield
Liche Priest w/mount(120)
Necrotect (100)
Royal Warsphinx (340)
- Venom Spike Tail
Units
Necropolis Knights x 6 (320)
Skeleton Chariots x 6 (280)
Skeleton Chariots x 6 (280)
Skeleton Warriors x 10 (80)
- Ancient Blades
Total: 1980/2000
In essence, Settra pops his Command Ability creating a bubble of +1 hit AND +1 wound, for almost every single model in the entire army within 18". He then lets the TK use his ability to give a chosen unit an additionally +1 to hit. Necrotect gives a unit +3" move and rerolling wounds of 1. Warsphinx debuffs a unit of your choice making your entire army wound it one easier. Incantation of Desert Wind the movement buffed unit, and you can essentially hit anything, anywhere as needed 5/6 times. If needed the Liche Priest also Righteous Smiting spells, making units roll additional attacks on a 6.
For instance... fully buffed, the Necro Knights attack the debuffed target. They roll 18 dice for the Venomous Bites. The Righteous Smiting and two hit buffs now mean you're hitting on 2's, and any 4+ on the dice generates a further attack. You're averaging 25 hits. You're rolling 2's to wound, re-rolling 1's, and every 4+ because of the Setta buff/Warsphinx debuff, does a mortal wound in addition to their damage profile. Its a rend -1 attack, and d3 damage per, so against a 3+ save unit, you're averaging 56 wounds already... and you've not even done the rider's attacks yet.... from virtually across the table.
And the army deploys soooooo wide, that its incredibly hard for your opponent to get behind your front-line, meaning sniping out heroes is their only hope, and really only Settra is "required" to make the list hum, and gets a 3+, and then 5+ and 6+ against any damage that does get through.
I also could've shuffled the list and found a way to get a Herald in there, returning ANOTHER Chariot and Necroknight to the list each turn... but honestly, I lost one unit of Chariots all day as is.
Thanks, I was mainly curious how deep you went on leaders and how you split up your units. Settra is such a beast. I'm really glad I was able to find a copy of him before he gets even harder to find.
One thing that I wonder is if it might be a good idea to split one of the units of chariots into two units of 3. My initial thinking around this is that it would allow you to completely screen Settra with the necropolis Knights in front, the six chariot unit in back and a chariot unit on each side. This will give you more protection against deepstrike shenanigans. While it does make it easier to lose a unit of chariots completely, it also means that if the opponent isn't able to completely focus fire one unit, you'll be able to bring back twice as many. It also might induce an opponent to try to focus down the 3 man units when in fact you do not care if they die.
Initially I thought about this change just for screening Settra, but it also allows you to ditch the 10 skeleton warriors in favor of a Herald, another Tomb King (thus allowing you to buff two of your units), or something tactical like a unit of Carrion.
I actually dislike them in units of three, and here's why... Chariots do almost all of their "work" outside of tarpitting, on the charge where they double their attack profile.
A focused opponent can make three chariots disappear, whereas a unit of six needs only one, its Icon Bearer, to survive, retreat, and start regrowing models, while your second unit of chariots charges in to replace them.
This keeps the unit alive, and viable, and when you're ready, gives you another chance to charge and maximize their value.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh, and those ten skeletons are surprisingly useful for bubble-wrapping the on-foot heroes, and otherwise are utterly ignored by opponents, meaning those are ten more models for possibly holding an objective.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/12 22:59:49
That makes sense -- I just figured that it might be worth it to protect Settra, especially if you can still use the 6 man chariots and the Necroknights to do the whole 1-2 punch thing. Of course you have a lot more practical experience than I do, so I'll have to defer to you on that one.
11527pts Total (7400pts painted)
4980pts Total (4980pts painted)
3730 Total (210pts painted)