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Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot





 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Polyvalent means it has different functions. Wildcats is just a call sign, I would hazard.


Yea, but it is a really smarmy and unconventional way to state that. Like, look at my awesome thesaurus!

But ultimately I don't care (about Infinity or GW names or any of them), because I'm playing a game. People that get bent out of shape over names...just...I dunno. Worry about more important things?



As opposed to "look at the copyright friendly nonsense words I cobbled together from the butchered remains of words from a thesaurus?"
They both aren't great, but at least one doesn't make whoever is using those terms look like a loon. Its actually one of the reasons I can't get into AoS, because getting into AoS would mean using those names, and for some reason I get really embarrassed when using them seriously.

Then again, repeating the word wolf a bunch of times isn't really inspiring either, so I guess GW is just really bad at naming things.



I haven't had any real problem with the faction I've been playing in AOS.

I've got Namarti Thralls and Reavers - perfectly reasonable. Namarti is a nonsense word, it's the thing they're called, and Thralls tells me they're slaves while Reavers tells me they're some kind of raider type thing.

Akhelion Guards, again, no issue with it. Akhelions are like the nobles, and they ride on creatures like knights while the Namarti are sort of a slave underclass. Cool, fine.

The monsters are called Leviadons, Morsaar eels and Alopexes. All pretty cool words that sound like the thing they're describing, particularly if you know that allopex is the latin word for shark.

The characters are called Akhelion Kings, Isharann Tidecasters, Isharann Soulrenders and Isharann Soulscryers.

"Eiodolon of Mathlann" is the only thing that is kinda weird, but it's a proper name and I guess it comes from old fantasy because he's an echo of the dead Elf sea god sort of akin to an Avatar of Khaine in 40k.

So you've got three totally made-up elf words, Akhelion, Namarti and Isharann, which all correspond to different castes within this fantasy society, and then you've got mostly normal descriptive roles and names. King, Reavers, Thralls, Guards, Tidecasters, Soulrenders, Soulscryers. All of those pretty immediately tell you what the thing does and what it's about. I don't feel any sillier using an Isharann Tidecaster than I do an Eldar Farseer.
   
Made in nl
Veteran Inquisitorial Tyranid Xenokiller






your mind

 NurglesR0T wrote:
What was wrong with the old names was that on nearly every point of IP infringement that was ruled against GW in court was do with the fact that they can't claim IP on generic fantastical labels.

It's why you no longer have Orks, but Orruks.

It's why you no longer have Elves, but Aelves.

Imperial Guard, Eldar and Space Marines are not original names which is why steadily over the years they have been rebranded under a clearer IP and their own creation.



Or they could just, like, make really good orks (and orcs)
for really good universally inclusive backgrounds (cuz the Old World really was, and 40k was this in space, turned on its head)
using really smartly designed rules that afford play at different levels of sophistication and at different scales,
with different degrees of realism according to player preference.

In so doing, sure, other companies might profit,
and a healthy, flourishing community of artists and writers, sculptors and painters,
never mind hobbyists and well, small business owners and independent retailers, brush manufacturers and so on,
would, well, be healthy and flourish.
And all would look to GW as a beacon, Gw's the Cadillac of ork minis,
and aspire someday understand their source of genius,
rather than spend increasing amounts of time oscillating between disappointment and disdain for the callous ineptiude as fattened shareholders effectively trip product development teams in the stampede for mo monay.....




   
Made in au
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade





No argument from me there.

The IP overhaul was an overreaction that probably was a result of hysteria between GW's legal counsel and Kirby.

The other option (IMO the better one) would have been to update several kits and start including several options (none of this let's include only one chaincannon per havocs box nonsense) to give their player base the incentive to not want to refer to third party sellers.

That coupled with the revival of an official bitz store will all but remove the need to look elsewhere. You'd still have some people interested in other model ranges but you'd definitely cut down a vast majority.




"Courage and Honour. I hear you murmur these words in the mist, in their wake I hear your hearts beat harder with false conviction seeking to convince yourselves that a brave death has meaning.
There is no courage to be found here my nephews, no honour to be had. Your souls will join the trillion others in the mist shrieking uselessly to eternity, weeping for the empire you could not save.

To the unfaithful, I bring holy plagues ripe with enlightenment. To the devout, I bring the blessing of immortality through the kiss of sacred rot.
And to you, new-born sons of Gulliman, to you flesh crafted puppets of a failing Imperium I bring the holiest gift of all.... Silence."
- Mortarion, The Death Lord, Daemon Primarch of Nurgle


5300 | 2800 | 1700 | 3600 | 2100 | 550

 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 NurglesR0T wrote:
havocs box nonsense) to give their player base the incentive to not want to refer to third party sellers.
The CHS debacle really was a "Be careful what you wish for!" situation for the players.

We wanted GW to have a kits everything that had rules. And so they did just that... by cutting the rules for things that didn't have kits. Not the outcome we wanted.

 NurglesR0T wrote:
That coupled with the revival of an official bitz store will all but remove the need to look elsewhere. You'd still have some people interested in other model ranges but you'd definitely cut down a vast majority.
The previous bitz store made sense when everything was metal, rather than on sprues, and even then it was shaky from a financial perspective as you'd need to keep all the parts you make in inventory at all times. That costs a lot. I lament the loss of their bitz service, but I also completely understand why it had to go.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/02/12 23:24:32


   
Made in au
Hissing Hybrid Metamorph





'Straya... Mate.

Cronch wrote:
The main takeway from this thread is that a lot of people think very poorly of potential gamers' intelligence. Poor drooling babes will be confused by made up names, as opposed to other made up names.

It is very daunting jumping in to 40k, let alone in to miniature games. Figuring our how to hobby, let alone how to build armies, what is available etc. When you have 100 weird names on top of that to try and remember its not very fun. I think that's the main point.
Not that its impossible for new people to get in to it, just its a lot harder when everything has a stupid name (rather than "Space Marine Troops").

 
   
Made in au
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade





 Rippy wrote:
Cronch wrote:
The main takeway from this thread is that a lot of people think very poorly of potential gamers' intelligence. Poor drooling babes will be confused by made up names, as opposed to other made up names.

It is very daunting jumping in to 40k, let alone in to miniature games. Figuring our how to hobby, let alone how to build armies, what is available etc. When you have 100 weird names on top of that to try and remember its not very fun. I think that's the main point.
Not that its impossible for new people to get in to it, just its a lot harder when everything has a stupid name (rather than "Space Marine Troops").


Further to this, take Stormcast Eternals - below is a list of their main units. Now as someone new to AoS, or even someone familiar but new to SCE - just how identifiable are these units from the names? (Hint, some are made up... but which?? )

Retributors
Sequitors
Vexitors
Evocators
Judicators
Fulminators
Zephitors
Decimators
Concussors
Protectors
Immolators
Liberators
Tempestors
Desolators

I know that over time you become familiar with the common units etc, but to be honest in my circle of AoS players some SCE players don't even refer to them as their proper names. eg. "These hammer guys are charging"


"Courage and Honour. I hear you murmur these words in the mist, in their wake I hear your hearts beat harder with false conviction seeking to convince yourselves that a brave death has meaning.
There is no courage to be found here my nephews, no honour to be had. Your souls will join the trillion others in the mist shrieking uselessly to eternity, weeping for the empire you could not save.

To the unfaithful, I bring holy plagues ripe with enlightenment. To the devout, I bring the blessing of immortality through the kiss of sacred rot.
And to you, new-born sons of Gulliman, to you flesh crafted puppets of a failing Imperium I bring the holiest gift of all.... Silence."
- Mortarion, The Death Lord, Daemon Primarch of Nurgle


5300 | 2800 | 1700 | 3600 | 2100 | 550

 
   
Made in us
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Pleasant Valley, Iowa

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The CHS debacle really was a "Be careful what you wish for!" situation for the players.

We wanted GW to have a kits everything that had rules. And so they did just that... by cutting the rules for things that didn't have kits. Not the outcome we wanted.


Truly, it was the Monkey's Paw of our generation.
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




 NurglesR0T wrote:
 Rippy wrote:
Cronch wrote:
The main takeway from this thread is that a lot of people think very poorly of potential gamers' intelligence. Poor drooling babes will be confused by made up names, as opposed to other made up names.

It is very daunting jumping in to 40k, let alone in to miniature games. Figuring our how to hobby, let alone how to build armies, what is available etc. When you have 100 weird names on top of that to try and remember its not very fun. I think that's the main point.
Not that its impossible for new people to get in to it, just its a lot harder when everything has a stupid name (rather than "Space Marine Troops").


Further to this, take Stormcast Eternals - below is a list of their main units. Now as someone new to AoS, or even someone familiar but new to SCE - just how identifiable are these units from the names? (Hint, some are made up... but which?? )

Retributors
Sequitors
Vexitors
Evocators
Judicators
Fulminators
Zephitors
Decimators
Concussors
Protectors
Immolators
Liberators
Tempestors
Desolators

I know that over time you become familiar with the common units etc, but to be honest in my circle of AoS players some SCE players don't even refer to them as their proper names. eg. "These hammer guys are charging"



The storm cast are the worst for names I think, as a whole army is there a worse example GW put out.
   
Made in us
Witch Hunter Undercover in a Cult







Apple fox wrote:
...The storm cast are the worst for names I think, as a whole army is there a worse example GW put out.


Primaris Marines. Stormcast at least start with different letters, but someone at GW decided naming two units "Inceptors" and "Intercessors" that had nothing to do with each other was a good idea.

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using. 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




 AnomanderRake wrote:
Apple fox wrote:
...The storm cast are the worst for names I think, as a whole army is there a worse example GW put out.


Primaris Marines. Stormcast at least start with different letters, but someone at GW decided naming two units "Inceptors" and "Intercessors" that had nothing to do with each other was a good idea.
infiltrators and Incursors
I forgot half of these exist
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I play marines and i get some of these units all mixed around still.
   
Made in at
Privateer




Austria

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 NurglesR0T wrote:
That coupled with the revival of an official bitz store will all but remove the need to look elsewhere. You'd still have some people interested in other model ranges but you'd definitely cut down a vast majority.
The previous bitz store made sense when everything was metal, rather than on sprues, and even then it was shaky from a financial perspective as you'd need to keep all the parts you make in inventory at all times. That costs a lot. I lament the loss of their bitz service, but I also completely understand why it had to go.


the problem is not the material, but how the Sprues are set up

As an example, Perry Miniatures, Mantic or Warlord Games have no problem to sell single Sprues with the special parts on it.
Because they can be made individually as there is a Command Sprue, Horse Sprue, Weapon Sprue

GW did the same, it was possible to buy a Land Raider or Predator Weapon Sprue, or Command Sprue.

It became a problem for GW as they upgraded and re-designed their process to be more efficient.
Now they don't have different Sprues that can be made individually but 1 unit box is just 1 Sprue (cut in half or smaller to fit in the Box) with the bits all over it.
So there is no point to offer customers the buy the single Command Sprue because it is identical to the the full unit box.

Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise

M41 - Alternative Rules for Battles in the 41st Millennium (40k LRB Project) 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Rippy wrote:
Cronch wrote:
The main takeway from this thread is that a lot of people think very poorly of potential gamers' intelligence. Poor drooling babes will be confused by made up names, as opposed to other made up names.

It is very daunting jumping in to 40k, let alone in to miniature games. Figuring our how to hobby, let alone how to build armies, what is available etc. When you have 100 weird names on top of that to try and remember its not very fun. I think that's the main point.
Not that its impossible for new people to get in to it, just its a lot harder when everything has a stupid name (rather than "Space Marine Troops").

All of the names in 40k and AoS will be weird to someone who never played. An Ogryn is just as weird a name as Bloodthirster which is just as weird as a dreadnough (which is neither a boat nor sports unified caliber armaments).
   
Made in gb
Emboldened Warlock




This thread was certainly interesting to read.

I must confess, GW can call their models whatever the hell they want, they're no different than the hundreds of fantasy novels out there who come up with their own names for generic fantasy tropes. Naming the models for their place in their games world is fine. The models are no more cringy than the other hundreds of sci-fi and fantasy games/worlds out there.


By all means you can hate it, but I must confess this thread smacks more of 'I hate this, GW sucks!' than any form of constructive critisim? I mean most GW naming even back in the day is stupid. Terrorgeist? Oh some kind of scary ghost!.. Wait it's a god damn undead bat?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




It may lack constructive criticism because it wasn't designed to give any ? This is literally just a throw away topic for people to voice how they hate Danklord Troglidians , or love them. GW won't ever read it, so constructive criticism would be pointless, voicing your opinion on likes or dislikes is almost entirely what a forum is for however.

Terrorgeist is also a pretty dumb name, and if you took a gander of the whole thread you'd see the current trash can list of names has been a work in progress and with AoS it just went up to 11.

Terrorgeist isn't even really that old of a product, in fact I think it was the last army book that vampire counts got that featured that model in it so its been heading towards this climax of silly sounding and just because something else is cring doesn't make a like word not solid cringe as well.
   
Made in gb
Emboldened Warlock




AngryAngel80 wrote:
It may lack constructive criticism because it wasn't designed to give any ? This is literally just a throw away topic for people to voice how they hate Danklord Troglidians , or love them. GW won't ever read it, so constructive criticism would be pointless, voicing your opinion on likes or dislikes is almost entirely what a forum is for however.

Terrorgeist is also a pretty dumb name, and if you took a gander of the whole thread you'd see the current trash can list of names has been a work in progress and with AoS it just went up to 11.

Terrorgeist isn't even really that old of a product, in fact I think it was the last army book that vampire counts got that featured that model in it so its been heading towards this climax of silly sounding and just because something else is cring doesn't make a like word not solid cringe as well.


True about the whole constructive part, but the names in GW have been silly since day one. AoS is no different to me, they're a bit more extravagantly named, but the whole setting is balls to the wall high fantasy, so the over the top names is par for the course!

It's fairly normal for GW model names to be confusing to non or new hobbyists, rebranding wont change that.
   
Made in at
Privateer




Austria

Cronch wrote:

All of the names in 40k and AoS will be weird to someone who never played. An Ogryn is just as weird a name as Bloodthirster which is just as weird as a dreadnough (which is neither a boat nor sports unified caliber armaments).


Good old times were local translation Studios were able to change those names
Cybot sounds better than Dreadnought, or Blood Damon instead of Bloodthirster

Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise

M41 - Alternative Rules for Battles in the 41st Millennium (40k LRB Project) 
   
Made in gb
Rotting Sorcerer of Nurgle






 Daedalus81 wrote:
 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Polyvalent means it has different functions. Wildcats is just a call sign, I would hazard.


Yea, but it is a really smarmy and unconventional way to state that. Like, look at my awesome thesaurus!

But ultimately I don't care (about Infinity or GW names or any of them), because I'm playing a game. People that get bent out of shape over names...just...I dunno. Worry about more important things?



“A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet.”
“Not if you called them stench blossoms”
“Or crapweeds”
“I’d sure hate to get a dozen crapweeds for valentines. I’d rather have candy.”
“Not if you called them scumdrops”



Names are important.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/13 10:41:40




A GW fan walks into a bar, buys the same drink as yesterday but pays more.

""Unite" is a human word, ... join me or die."

If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. 
   
Made in us
VF-1S Valkyrie Squadron Commander





Mississippi

Seraphim for Lizardmen is just inexcusable. Everything else, I have no desire to learn even more non-sensical names for units or factions that I’ve been familiar with for years.

Though I have to admit that Drukhari is slightly better than Dark Eldar (I had a similar reaction when D&D changed the Anti-Paladin to Blackguard - having a proper name instead of a not/anti-this).

It never ends well 
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

They're called "Seraphon", not "Seraphim"...and the units themselves didn't change names.

You know that right?
   
Made in gb
Assassin with Black Lotus Poison





Bristol

 Kanluwen wrote:
They're called "Seraphon", not "Seraphim"...and the units themselves didn't change names.

You know that right?


But that is also annoying as Malekith's dragon is called Seraphon

The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.

Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
 
   
Made in gb
Savage Khorne Berserker Biker




Southampton, UK

 Kanluwen wrote:
They're called "Seraphon", not "Seraphim"...and the units themselves didn't change names.

You know that right?


That could easily have been auto-correct. Besides, what was wrong with Lizardmen? Aside from being generic and non-copyrightable...

We all know that's the main reason why this is being done, and not only does it suck but it's also pointless. As many 3rd party manufacturers have already proven - while GW may indeed own the copyright on, say, "Feculent Gnarlmaw", there's nothing stopping someone else making an "evil poo tree, compatible with popular 28mm tabletop games"...
   
Made in us
VF-1S Valkyrie Squadron Commander





Mississippi

 Kanluwen wrote:
They're called "Seraphon", not "Seraphim"...and the units themselves didn't change names.

You know that right?


Not having the book or GW’s site open in front of me, I chose the wrong word - and that’s part of the problem. It’s silly, inexcusable and needs to stop.

It never ends well 
   
Made in gb
Assassin with Black Lotus Poison





Bristol

Crispy78 wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
They're called "Seraphon", not "Seraphim"...and the units themselves didn't change names.

You know that right?


That could easily have been auto-correct. Besides, what was wrong with Lizardmen? Aside from being generic and non-copyrightable...

We all know that's the main reason why this is being done, and not only does it suck but it's also pointless. As many 3rd party manufacturers have already proven - while GW may indeed own the copyright on, say, "Feculent Gnarlmaw", there's nothing stopping someone else making an "evil poo tree, compatible with popular 28mm tabletop games"...


Hell, it's worse than that. There is nothing preventing them from using those copyrighted names when saying that their kits are compatible with GW kits.

So if a company made a kit that was designed to add onto a GW kit, they could legally say that their kit is compatible with X kit, using the copyrighted name.

All the copyright prevents is them using it in the name of their kit (and frankly, who would want to for some of these ). They are still free to use it when saying what their kit is compatible with.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/13 16:53:08


The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.

Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
 
   
Made in gb
Rotting Sorcerer of Nurgle






 A Town Called Malus wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
They're called "Seraphon", not "Seraphim"...and the units themselves didn't change names.

You know that right?


But that is also annoying as Malekith's dragon is called Seraphon


Let us not forget the tickle porn of the same name too that appeared when you image searched "Seraphon". Though, it appears in the years since, GW's Lizzies have overtaken that in Google image top search results.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/13 16:50:08




A GW fan walks into a bar, buys the same drink as yesterday but pays more.

""Unite" is a human word, ... join me or die."

If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. 
   
Made in gb
Ancient Ultramarine Venerable Dreadnought




Nottingham

Where's all the people complaining that Skaven are called Skaven, and not Ratmen?

As with most things, it seems to be a case of nostalgia. Give it some years/decades, and the natural growth of new players into the hobby, and Intercessors and Seraphon and Drukhari will all be normal, just like how Sternguard and Vindicators and Skaven and Astartes and Callidus/Eversor/Vindicare/Culexus all were.

Read the history of the Charadon Crusade: The Crusade of Fury was at an end.
Join the Crion Crusade: I think it's the combination of butt jokes, democratic necrons, explosions, and mind-fething that draws people to this Crusade like moths to a bug zapper - War Kitten
Rippy wrote:Never forgetti, template spaghetti.
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Fixture of Dakka





 Grimtuff wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Polyvalent means it has different functions. Wildcats is just a call sign, I would hazard.


Yea, but it is a really smarmy and unconventional way to state that. Like, look at my awesome thesaurus!

But ultimately I don't care (about Infinity or GW names or any of them), because I'm playing a game. People that get bent out of shape over names...just...I dunno. Worry about more important things?



“A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet.”
“Not if you called them stench blossoms”
“Or crapweeds”
“I’d sure hate to get a dozen crapweeds for valentines. I’d rather have candy.”
“Not if you called them scumdrops”



Names are important.




You got a good chuckle out of me there.

   
Made in gb
Wight Lord with the Sword of Kings






UK

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Where's all the people complaining that Skaven are called Skaven, and not Ratmen?

As with most things, it seems to be a case of nostalgia. Give it some years/decades, and the natural growth of new players into the hobby, and Intercessors and Seraphon and Drukhari will all be normal, just like how Sternguard and Vindicators and Skaven and Astartes and Callidus/Eversor/Vindicare/Culexus all were.


Indeed most Skaven names are quite amusing - and I love Skaven

I AM A MARINE PLAYER

"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos

"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001

www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/528517.page

A Bloody Road - my Warhammer Fantasy Fiction 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Where's all the people complaining that Skaven are called Skaven, and not Ratmen?

As with most things, it seems to be a case of nostalgia. Give it some years/decades, and the natural growth of new players into the hobby, and Intercessors and Seraphon and Drukhari will all be normal, just like how Sternguard and Vindicators and Skaven and Astartes and Callidus/Eversor/Vindicare/Culexus all were.


I think this only apply to like half the issues presented here. There are some issues that I think if GW would take the effort to improve would probably benefit the settings a great deal.
They are selling both nostalgia and Cool and they should be mindful that cool very easy to break if they do not place it well into the world.

Edit, seriously what’s with auto correct this week. It feels like it is messing me up way more here >.<

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/13 17:33:03


 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




the_scotsman 785337 10715113 wrote:

Akhelion Guards, again, no issue with it. Akhelions are like the nobles, and they ride on creatures like knights while the Namarti are sort of a slave underclass. Cool, fine.

The monsters are called Leviadons, Morsaar eels and Alopexes. All pretty cool words that sound like the thing they're describing, particularly if you know that allopex is the latin word for shark.

The characters are called Akhelion Kings, Isharann Tidecasters, Isharann Soulrenders and Isharann Soulscryers.

"Eiodolon of Mathlann" is the only thing that is kinda weird, but it's a proper name and I guess it comes from old fantasy because he's an echo of the dead Elf sea god sort of akin to an Avatar of Khaine in 40k.
.


The stuff doesn't sound very fake. My greek is horrible, but from the stuff my grandmother tought me. An eidolon is just a word english idol. Akhilion of Mazembri was a greek philosopher from Quo Vaids. Alopex is a, and this rightlfuly stupid, a fox in greek. A leviadon is a smaller baby version of leviathan.
   
 
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