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Yup, just Graves. Tannen is a Woe.

yup, the other Dark Debts stuff simply have the "brilliance" characteristic.

Maybe it's just me, but right now the pledges seem to bob around the 195K with no real growth in sight. :(

10 new backers yesterday, and a boost to the average pledge

-1 backer today

actually I'm a bit surprised I thought (and hoped) after yesterdays change that this would have stabilised

Yeah, was a bit disappointed to not see significant growth when got online today. $3k/day for the last week didn't seem like that big of a push, once that first $3k happened in an afternoon... was hoping the KS had new legs, now not so sure (though still in generally better spirits about their attitude)

From the Kickstarter comments, thought I'd share:

When the cat's away, the mice will play! In about an hour (2pm PST) Mack and Justin are going to fire up Ustream and Justin is going to make a character! So join them at http://www.ustream.tv/user/Through_The_Breach !

Don't worry if you can't make it live, the video will be up on youtube shortly after, and links will go into today's update.

Now that I like, sad little chap I am, I always enjoy creating characters.

Miggidy_Mack wrote:
From the Kickstarter comments, thought I'd share:

When the cat's away, the mice will play! In about an hour (2pm PST) Mack and Justin are going to fire up Ustream and Justin is going to make a character! So join them at http://www.ustream.tv/user/Through_The_Breach !

Don't worry if you can't make it live, the video will be up on youtube shortly after, and links will go into today's update.

Couldn't nail Eric down for the character creation?

 spiralingcadaver wrote:
Yeah, was a bit disappointed to not see significant growth when got online today. $3k/day for the last week didn't seem like that big of a push, once that first $3k happened in an afternoon... was hoping the KS had new legs, now not so sure (though still in generally better spirits about their attitude)

Hopefully it builds over the next few days. Presumably we'll have cemented Santana for the top tier, and remember they said there would be a 'game' the community could win, which would bump us at least 40% of the way to the middle tiers getting Santana as well (100 points out of the 250 or less needed, depending on how far we blow past the 500 mark).

I think we'll see a significant bump if Santana hits the middle tiers. Even if you don't value her at Ebay prices, considering what you get in either flavour it's a pretty hefty deal when you include her (the double book set alone it ~$120 worth, and the potential for the other to be books, 4 figure kits, Santana and Hannah, plus the deck, maybe pdfs/sheets/screen, etc). Yes, granted, some of that is contingent on the contributions and likes/shares/retweets getting us to 750+ points, and/or making at least another 20k over 6 days, but I remain hopeful.

If we do get Santana's for the 125/158 tiers, I suspect we may need a little something to sweeten the deal for the gaming room. Not in a sense of greed, just recognizing that I guarantee you some people pledged at that level specifically for her. If they can still get her and save $100-111, they might drop down again. Hopefully not many of them, but even 5 or 10 becomes a pretty hefty setback to funding. Of course, that may be an acceptable loss, as long as at least 1 new person joins for each person that drops, once Santana is more affordably available (losing $100-11 but gaining $125-158 isn't a bad deal, and if more join than drop down, it becomes even more lucrative towards final funding).

Edit: correction; the middle tiers are getting Santana's, according to Wyrd on Facebook. O.O

I think that a number of effects are at work here;

1) First and foremost, Publicity: The most recent update was a huge step in the right direction, but it also only served to alert people that are a) already pledging, or b) following this campaign closely on forums or social media. Now, it's fair to point out the whole point of the update was to increase awareness, but the complication is that by de-linking the additions from the pledge level, it's unclear what each level actually gets. Which leads to point 2,

2) Clarity: Right now I couldn't tell you what's in the pledge levels as a reward. The "Ye Old Back-O-Meter One Thousand" may help to motivate people already pledged to spread the word, but it also means that, if you are interested in the Santana miniature, you have no idea what pledge level has one because the graphic isn't a live-updated device, it has to be manually updated. So sometime this evening, around 8pm EST, we'll find out if $225 pledges have Santana. The $125 and $60? Time will tell. Which leads to,

3) Uncertainty: We know that (hopefully) will be in the pledge levels, but until it's actually added, some people simply aren't going to pledge. If Santana and a 4th kit are what would sweeten the $125 pledge level to the point of being worthwhile... well, they aren't there yet. It's the "wait and see" attitude: people are waiting to pledge until what they want is reached, creating a bit of a Catch-22.

I think a combination of all three of those factors are at play, but the first is the most problematic. Buzz begets buzz, but it's unclear right now what can be done that hasn't already been undertaken. Mack's chats are very informative, but as I've alluded to before these chats provide fascinating insight into the design process... but they don't actually add anything. It's honestly unclear how many people would be persuaded to pledge based on increased knowledge of he game system, and it's equally unclear how many people who haven't pledged are even aware these chats exist at all.

This is not to say he shouldn't be doing them: more then anything they will pay a dividend later, when the game approaches retail availability they will no doubt be an invaluable resource for people wondering if it's worth picking up. It is merely the fund-raising appeal of them that seems somewhat unclear.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Forar wrote:
...Edit: correction; the middle tiers are getting Santana's, according to Wyrd on Facebook. O.O

Bwaaa? Well, shows me to take so long writing a post, one of my points is already partially negated!

Since I just edited it in, I'll add this now;

According to Wyrd on Facebook, the 125 tiers are also getting Santana.

Agreed, this needs to be updated on the Kickstarter page itself (ideally with a simple "This is what each tier gets now" breakdown list), but we're already there.

Be interesting to see how that influences people above and below (including non-backers).

Edit: and then you edited in response to my edit.

We have to go deeper.

EditceptionBWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

Forar wrote:
Since I just edited it in, I'll add this now;

According to Wyrd on Facebook, the 125 tiers are also getting Santana.

Agreed, this needs to be updated on the Kickstarter page itself (ideally with a simple "This is what each tier gets now" breakdown list), but we're already there.

Be interesting to see how that influences people above and below (including non-backers).

Edit: and then you edited in response to my edit.

We have to go deeper.

EditceptionBWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

I can't find anything about this on facebook (admittedly I'm on my facebook app)

From the comments under the most recent entry

Wyrd Miniatures Oh and as an update.. we already have enough points to add Santana to the $125 and $225 packages.
53 minutes ago · 3

Oh, I assumed they'd make an actual post on it >_<

Updating the OP

There appears to be a miscommunication with Ratty, who updates the page. We hit the $225 mark (500 points) but not the $125 mark (750 points). We're fixing the issue now.

Miggidy_Mack wrote:
There appears to be a miscommunication with Ratty, who updates the page. We hit the $225 mark (500 points) but not the $125 mark (750 points). We're fixing the issue now.

The OP is a lie nao D:

Oh! One thing that occurred to me that I keep forgetting to mention:

They need to put up pictures of what they are talking about!

People are visual creatures: the next update shouldn't just say "X and Y will now include Santana miniature", they should also have a nice clean;

Thanks Buzz, I hadn't seen that before. That is a nice miniature, but not worth the current price.

You should probably just lie and say the $125 got the Santana Mack. I think that would really really boost the number of backers.

 cincydooley wrote:
You should probably just lie and say the $125 got the Santana Mack. I think that would really really boost the number of backers.

Yeah. I might consider going up to $125 if Santanna was in there... That'd get me the books, Ms. Terious (is there a pic of that yet?), and the two character sprues, right?

 cincydooley wrote:
You should probably just lie and say the $125 got the Santana Mack. I think that would really really boost the number of backers.

I'd say-- I was quite surprised that happened so quickly, but thinking that it could do a lot to push the campaign.

Cy,

Miss Terious:

 Cyporiean wrote:
Thanks Buzz, I hadn't seen that before. That is a nice miniature, but not worth the current price.

If you mean the $100-200 they went for on ebay when they were extremely rare? Agreed.

If you mean when they're included within the other swathe of stuff you get with the Gaming tier? Not sure I agree, but I wouldn't argue it.

But once they're included in the Living/Dining room (125) tiers? They're practically giving them away. That's a giant pile of stuff along with a mini people paid more for alone, along with the books and either more books or a considerable pile of minis (5 including MPMs, Hannah, and Santana, 6 if you've got Miss T lined up. Plus maybe another MPM, the char sheet pad (...), FM screen and pdfs, depending on how the next 10-20k does or does not go).

If they make it down to the Core set tier that becomes pretty much pure shenanigans (of awesome). They're practically paying you to take it at that point.

And yes, even in my enthusiasm I recognize that by the time 1500+ of these hit the open market their ebay value will likely plummet to somewhere around the other limited edition figures (maybe $50'ish, rarely available after the initial rush), but even at $10-20 for a "nice and still relatively rare" figure it's a pretty solid addition to any of the tiers, particularly the first 3.

 Cyporiean wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
You should probably just lie and say the $125 got the Santana Mack. I think that would really really boost the number of backers.

Yeah. I might consider going up to $125 if Santanna was in there... That'd get me the books, Ms. Terious (is there a pic of that yet?), and the two character sprues, right?

I hate to counsel dishonesty, but I will point out one advantage of an opaque system is it's easy to "fudge".

Cyp, as of now, the $125 pledge includes 3 mini kits, and will hopefully graduate to 4 in short order.

 Cyporiean wrote:

Yeah. I might consider going up to $125 if Santanna was in there... That'd get me the books, Ms. Terious (is there a pic of that yet?), and the two character sprues, right?

Three sprues (1 random). Also a plastic fate deck.

 Cyporiean wrote:
Thanks Buzz, I hadn't seen that before. That is a nice miniature, but not worth the current price.

People on eBay disagree.

Another henchman posted this up, which might let people better assess what they're getting;

https://docs.google.com/a/cadillacfairview.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AnAzg5GNpKW5dHNmMmMyUUg0RWxNMEFMUEl2MXBhSVE#gid=0

 Alfndrate wrote:
Cy,

Miss Terious:

Alf, the big problem with promoting Miss T is the "rubbing it in your face" aspect for new pledges: saying essentially "isn't this awesome? You can't have one."

Of course, putting them back into pledges, that's a horse of a different (far more favorable) color...

Seriously, having that go away as an addition was and remains an almost irremediable issue for any future pledges.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Breotan wrote:

 Cyporiean wrote:
Thanks Buzz, I hadn't seen that before. That is a nice miniature, but not worth the current price.

People on eBay disagree.

I had a discussion about this on the backer forums (where I was promptly told to GTFO...); the value of a thing as a collector's item must not be confused with its worth. On the open market, I think it's entirely fair to value Santana around the worth of a KD pin-up, since that's what I at least would pay for a miniature of similar quality.

The problem is quite simply, if most people valued that miniature at $125 or so, Wyrd wouldn't be in this position. That it is, is because most people don't.

Forar wrote:
Another henchman posted this up, which might let people better assess what they're getting;

https://docs.google.com/a/cadillacfairview.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AnAzg5GNpKW5dHNmMmMyUUg0RWxNMEFMUEl2MXBhSVE#gid=0

The problem with that spreadsheet is its hard to figure out what exactly every level is getting currently. KH:M has the same issue. From the looks of it, at a glance, I would already assume we hit the 250k mark since theres a 1 in that column. It would be nice if someone just broke down the totals as they are CURRENTLY, and then updated them as the goals get hit.

Santana has been successfully added to the 225 level, NOT the 125 level (yet). There was a miscommunication and it has been corrected on facebook. In the meantime, we're heading for Santana at 125 at a good pace and I think (hope) we can get it there before the end of the campaign.

Sorry about that. :(