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Can't you take a 5-MANz unit along with a mega-armour Warboss in a Trukk? That gives you Ld9.
As an IC, the Warboss can quit the nobz the following turn, and both units could wreak havoc amongst enemy units (possibly with kombi-skorchas before assault phase).
But I understand that those 350 points could be invested somewhere else.

Then, maybe just 3 MANz + Warboss in a Trukk, bringing down the total to 250 points?

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Wow really only 3 or 4? I mean, I knew meganobz were 'ard, but I didn't know they were that 'ard. Is there something I'm missing about them. I know they're 2 wound "termies" all armed with power klaws and a healthy amount of attacks a piece, all for a mere 40pts. Aside from LD7 and slow and purposeful, is there anything else I'm missing?

LD7 and them going *splat* when shot with lascannons, demolishers or melta (or the Xenos equivalents) really concludes all there is to it. They aren't terminators because they can easily be tank-shocked or shot off the table if you bring the right tools. If you didn't (or your tools suffered an overdose of shoota bullets), they are more efficient than terminators. Terminators have good staying power no matter what, with good leadership, 5++ and better weapon choices, but they don't get that for free. Terminators also tend to be in trouble when getting hit by a lot of attacks, while MANz mitigate that by having two wounds and a gakton of attacks themselves. They look really similar on paper, but when played (or more accurately, played against), they have little in common besides 2+ armor.

 Bonzofever wrote:
Can't you take a 5-MANz unit along with a mega-armour Warboss in a Trukk? That gives you Ld9.
As an IC, the Warboss can quit the nobz the following turn, and both units could wreak havoc amongst enemy units (possibly with kombi-skorchas before assault phase).
But I understand that those 350 points could be invested somewhere else.

Then, maybe just 3 MANz + Warboss in a Trukk, bringing down the total to 250 points?

3 MANz in a trukk with reinforced ram cost 160 points. A MA warboss is 135. If you've got elite slots to spare, it's really more efficient to just get two units of MANz. In addition, you might also get to your target without your trukk blowing up, your trukk just being wrecked, or you passing the pinning test anyways (60% chance). Even if you get pinned, just get up and attack them next turn - you are sitting in a 5+ cover crater with 2+ armor models, it will quite some firepower to get them out of there. A lot more firepower than 160 points.

Yea Im not a fan of sticking a Boss in even with MANz. It always comes down to overkill. MANz will probably feth up whatever your throwing them at, so the Boss is again, PK overkill. Playing a MANz missile or two takes some finesse and learning how to get them where they are needed. Thats why I always tell people willing to try them, hold them back until midgame, then let the trukks rip up some table, it usually works well. But doing the newbie mistake, by sticking them in the front to play them "aggressively" is the fastest way to think they and trukks, suck the big one. No gak smart guy, how did you expect an AV10 vehicle to withstand an entire armies worth of shooting?


BUT I will admit, having a boss in there with a bosspole isnt a terrible idea as far as fixing their low leadership. Because a failed Ld test, that gets rerolled thanks to a bosspole is nice, because that 2+ armor is more then likely going to ignore the thumb on the noggin, and if not, well, youve still got a wound left. So for this reason only, Id say putting a boss in with them wouldnt be a terrible idea.

 KingCracker wrote:
Yea Im not a fan of sticking a Boss in even with MANz. It always comes down to overkill. MANz will probably feth up whatever your throwing them at, so the Boss is again, PK overkill. Playing a MANz missile or two takes some finesse and learning how to get them where they are needed. Thats why I always tell people willing to try them, hold them back until midgame, then let the trukks rip up some table, it usually works well. But doing the newbie mistake, by sticking them in the front to play them "aggressively" is the fastest way to think they and trukks, suck the big one. No gak smart guy, how did you expect an AV10 vehicle to withstand an entire armies worth of shooting?


BUT I will admit, having a boss in there with a bosspole isnt a terrible idea as far as fixing their low leadership. Because a failed Ld test, that gets rerolled thanks to a bosspole is nice, because that 2+ armor is more then likely going to ignore the thumb on the noggin, and if not, well, youve still got a wound left. So for this reason only, Id say putting a boss in with them wouldnt be a terrible idea.

Ironically my meganobz are used in such a nooby way but then again i know how to face my armor and take cover saves very well but I agree actually. I am starting to see that my Meganobz can get the job done well themselves i just worry about leadership 7... it seems SO DUMB they can't get bosspoles themselves for being so dead killy. Fluff wise it blows my mind meganobz wouldn't feel nearly fearless in megaarmor despite other gitz dying ... i do is it the other way as well though "if armor this good is failing i need to get outta here!"

I have been running 5 meganobz and a meganboss in small pts matches for about a month and I've seen exactly what cracker is saying. I've wiped an entire unit of FNP blood angel marines with their warlord who thought they would crash into 30 boyz and emerge victorious, oh they didn't take any wounds (more luck than tactics on that one) but i still had 13 boyz left standing defiantly at them. And next round my battle wagon rolled up directly behind them and popped out my boss + Manz and decimated the entire unit in 1 assualt down to the very last man. The sheer fact that nearly nothing other than nurgle is as formidable in CC as FNP assualt marines should heavily highlight the best circumstances of nobz + boss and the fact that 2 wounds is required to make them test is clearly an easier chance to avoid morale tests since you have 2+ armor. stil... ldr 7.... i can't ignore it.


Either way in my current games i need that hammer, I'd use a big mek but being able to treat manz as troops in my 600 pt games is too deadly

 Jidmah wrote:
3 MANz in a trukk with reinforced ram cost 160 points. A MA warboss is 135. If you've got elite slots to spare, it's really more efficient to just get two units of MANz. In addition, you might also get to your target without your trukk blowing up, your trukk just being wrecked, or you passing the pinning test anyways (60% chance). Even if you get pinned, just get up and attack them next turn - you are sitting in a 5+ cover crater with 2+ armor models, it will quite some firepower to get them out of there. A lot more firepower than 160 points.

I'm a bit confused here. Did you add cybork body, attack squig, bosspole and kombi-weapon to your WB? If you play him as HQ, remember MANz can be used as a Troop choice. For 110 points, your MA WB can face weapons that instant-kill nobz, a 2+/5++ wall that helps to pass Ld tests, plus the possibility to split them to aim at different units (which can come in handy). Anyway I see what you're getting at, you have a good point! I think I'll have to try this "two-pronged" attack.

Most of the time I'm facing IG and Eldar armies, MANz can prove effective against both of them by soaking up enemy fire. I have to admit it bothers me to spend points in such a few number of models. I tend to prefer target saturation rather than pure survivability - although a Trukk caught in a KFF bubble is nice.

 KingCracker wrote:
But doing the newbie mistake, by sticking them in the front to play them "aggressively" is the fastest way to think they and trukks, suck the big one. No gak smart guy, how did you expect an AV10 vehicle to withstand an entire armies worth of shooting?.

Obviously. The only time I played them on 6th edition, the unit was in reserve. But you have to fail your 3+ roll on turn 2 if you wish to do exactly as planned, i.e. throw these guys in the melee.

I hope you (Bonzofever) didnt think that was directed towards you. That was a general "smart guy"

But like Ive said, you can hold them in reserves, and if they come on to early, you can always hide them behind something.

I think I'll have to try 3 MANz in a trukk for my next list to complement a trio of battlewagons full of boyz./MANz. The trukk can always hide behind the wagons if there's nowhere else to go.

I don't think I'll be able to use my wagon converted from a baneblade though, trying to hide anything behind that thing usually gets me the side-eye from my opponents. love the model though.

I throw mine forward aggressively on turn one. This is mainly due to the fact that my whole army is in trukks or a lone battlewagon, and everyone is belting forward. The meganobz often attract fire that would easily wreck the three trukk boyz mobz, and either survive or soak it up like champs. That said, I'll have to try the unit in reserve sometime - it sounds like it could be a good tactic.

Fouler wrote:
I don't think I'll be able to use my wagon converted from a baneblade though, trying to hide anything behind that thing usually gets me the side-eye from my opponents. love the model though.

Just play your wagon as a Skullhamma

 Charles Rampant wrote:
I throw mine forward aggressively on turn one. This is mainly due to the fact that my whole army is in trukks or a lone battlewagon, and everyone is belting forward. The meganobz often attract fire that would easily wreck the three trukk boyz mobz, and either survive or soak it up like champs. That said, I'll have to try the unit in reserve sometime - it sounds like it could be a good tactic.

To me, the thing that maths can't take into account about MANz would be the "fear" factor.

In most of my games (4th & 5th) I used to run a couple of Trukks, one with the WB, the other with a KFF Mek. I remember my enemies firing all weapons at the vehicles, forgetting the second wave of foot Orks, the ones that eventually chopped them to bitz. On smaller boards (for 750-pts games) this used to be so effective! Your tactic remembers me the good ol' days.

On Turn 1 you can expect all enemy fire to be directed towards the "biggest threat", the vehicle transporting MANz. On Turn 2, heavy weaponry tries to take down the unit. Although you can't say for sure the other transports will be "safe", this kind of strategy can work. But you have to rely on the credulity of your opponent and a little bit of luck. At least, that's what I think!

 KingCracker wrote:
I hope you (Bonzofever) didnt think that was directed towards you. That was a general "smart guy"
But like Ive said, you can hold them in reserves, and if they come on to early, you can always hide them behind something.

One can't be sure, can he?

Anyway I agree with the way you play Orks. I too love playing a biker WB coming into play with a small unit of kopterz.
I'll try to play 3 MANz in Trukk in a 1,500 points build.

Yea, Koptas and BikerBoss. What a fun combo

It strikes me now that Meganobz would probably benefit considerably from Kustom Force field. The big nightmare for a MANz is of course Lascannons, because they might as well be a Guardsman against a Lascannon, but if you can give it a KFF save, that gives it the mobile equivalent of a Terminator invul save against ranged attacks, and with the recent Power Weapon nerfs, a 2up armor save in CC can only be bypassed by weapons that strike at initiative 1.

But just thinking about close combat Ork armies in 6e just makes my head hurt. All the transports and logistics that would be required - a major remodeling of army comp, plus purchasing all those ridiculously overpriced Meganobz - and for what, really?

Actually my big nightmare for my manz is disintegrators.

Sure a lascannon will instagib one, but only one.

A dissie ravager can wipe a whole unit with good rolls

TedNugent wrote:
It strikes me now that Meganobz would probably benefit considerably from Kustom Force field. The big nightmare for a MANz is of course Lascannons, because they might as well be a Guardsman against a Lascannon, but if you can give it a KFF save, that gives it the mobile equivalent of a Terminator invul save against ranged attacks, and with the recent Power Weapon nerfs, a 2up armor save in CC can only be bypassed by weapons that strike at initiative 1.

But just thinking about close combat Ork armies in 6e just makes my head hurt. All the transports and logistics that would be required - a major remodeling of army comp, plus purchasing all those ridiculously overpriced Meganobz - and for what, really?

5+ cover doesn't exactly make lascannons(meltas, lances, railguns) inefficient at shooting MANz though. Usually it means they have to shoot twice instead of once to kill a nob.

 Ascalam wrote:
Actually my big nightmare for my manz is disintegrators.

Sure a lascannon will instagib one, but only one.

A dissie ravager can wipe a whole unit with good rolls

In the same boat though a Flamer can wipe a unit if you have some bad rolls >.<

Can you please tell what base should be used for Grotsnik? 25mm or 40mm? I am confused to hear that it should be 25mm bases since Grotsnik belong to HQ choice.

Thanks in advance!

Normal 25mm. He's an infantry unit

HQ choices don't automatically get larger bases

 Jidmah wrote:

TedNugent wrote:
It strikes me now that Meganobz would probably benefit considerably from Kustom Force field. The big nightmare for a MANz is of course Lascannons, because they might as well be a Guardsman against a Lascannon, but if you can give it a KFF save, that gives it the mobile equivalent of a Terminator invul save against ranged attacks, and with the recent Power Weapon nerfs, a 2up armor save in CC can only be bypassed by weapons that strike at initiative 1.

5+ cover doesn't exactly make lascannons(meltas, lances, railguns) inefficient at shooting MANz though. Usually it means they have to shoot twice instead of once to kill a nob.

Yeah, and more importantly don't forget IG armies can easily ignore cover saves.
A Vendetta with 3 twin-linked lascannons can easily kill 120 points worth of MANz in one shooting phase.

In my game last Thursday against a seasoned Grey Wolves player I brought Wazdakka, 2 BikerBosses and a MAB in 2000 points.

I had 2 MANz missles with the MAB in one. After losing both BikerBosses and a bunch of Bikes and DeffKoptas to his TWC Deathstar, I was able to table my opponent. Manz Missile is low priority compared to 3 BB's (including Waz) on the table. The bikes were able to provide cover to the Trukks every turn until at least the Manz got out.

Highlight of the game was when an empty Trukk rammed his TWC squad and his PF HQ got a weapon destroyed result on his Death or Glory. Even empty Trukks can be dangerous.

I'm thinking the next Orks Codex will bring the points costs of a lot of units down if the Chaos SM release is any predictor.

Anywho, the point of the post was:

4 HQ's rock at 2000+ points.
BikerBosses are awesome.
MAB with 3 MANz are great in a Trukk. Not a waste of points.
No need for PK's on BikerMob Nobz. A BC is all you need when charging units along with 2 or more BikerBosses

 PipeAlley wrote:

No need for PK's on BikerMob Nobz. A BC is all you need when charging units along with 2 or more BikerBosses

That's an interesting statement. Could you extrapolate?

 matphat wrote:

 PipeAlley wrote:

No need for PK's on BikerMob Nobz. A BC is all you need when charging units along with 2 or more BikerBosses

That's an interesting statement. Could you extrapolate?

Yeah I'm interested too. That would save enough points in my biker lists I'm working on to buy a few more bikes!

My guess is that since the bosses will get 4 or 5 PK attacks each, there no need for more klaws really.

 PipeAlley wrote:
4 HQ's rock at 2000+ points.
BikerBosses are awesome.
MAB with 3 MANz are great in a Trukk. Not a waste of points.
No need for PK's on BikerMob Nobz. A BC is all you need when charging units along with 2 or more BikerBosses

I've had this kind of setup in mind for a few weeks now. At 2K points, double FOC: best used with 4 HQs.
So a MAB joining 3 MANz in a trukk is that good? Anyway 3 Biker Bosses sounds crazy. I'd like to try that! I only got one kustom-made Wazzdakka though.

For those interested in Kromlech models, I received my Orks in greatcoats today, without their arms (Artur is gonna send them to me promptly).
They look fabulous. I'm painting their jackets in blue just like the French "poilus" from WW1.
I think I'm going to use those metal krak grenades from the old bomberboyz kit, just for fun.
I hope I'll be able to test that Death Korps ally force asap.

 matphat wrote:

 PipeAlley wrote:

No need for PK's on BikerMob Nobz. A BC is all you need when charging units along with 2 or more BikerBosses

That's an interesting statement. Could you extrapolate?

Last week in addition to the above listed units I ran 4 mobs of Bikerboyz as follows, 3 bikes, one as Nob with BC for a total of 90 points a piece. I also ran 3 units of Deffkoptas 2x3 and 1x2. BikerBosses ran with the 3 strong deffkopta units and Waz with the 2-strong unit. I was going to outflank those 3 units if I went second but in the end I went first and lined up the 3 Deffkopta units each wih a boss in a row and interspersed my 4 Bikerboyz units. Behind that wall of cover were the 2 Trukks full of Manz.

So I had six fast Troops units. I figured I'd go cheap with the BikerNobz since I felt I had enough PK's to spare. I really like the cheap BikerBoyz Nobz that can take/issue challenges to the scarier opp. HQ's as long as they all can get into assault.

Anywho I learned a lot that game since it was my first game without a mob of foot boyz in half a decade I think.

So next game it'll be 5 x 90 point Bikermobz, 1 unit of 3 Rokkit Deffkoptas, 2 units of 3 MANz missiles one with MAB. And of course Lootas.

Here's the plan: run all 3 BikerBosses with any single unit of Bikerboyz if I get first turn or with the 3 Deffkoptas if I go second. Wih the rule of majority toughness, that unit will all count as T6! Basically Orks pretending to be Grey Wolves 4 HQ TWC. The bosses will be far enough away from each other that LoS rolls will transfer to the Bikerboyz or Deffkoptas.

Then I was thinking of serving else today:

If I ran a 3 Ork Mob of NobBikers with PainBoy and banner, would those bonii be transferred to the BikerBossses?

6 x T6 WS (Majority) 6 multi-wound FNP 4+5++4++ with at least 17 PK attacks on charge. Meanwhile it's a scoring unit and can take multiple Strength 10 shots to the face before losing models.

So YMDC does the Nobz gear affect the Bosses?

Yep. It's any model in the unit, as far as I know, including the Boss.

Has anyone ran warboss Zhadsnark da ripper from IA8? he's a biker that can tank shock and strike with his power klaw at Init 4. I'm going to start amassing some bikers and think this guy is better than Wazdakka.

Speaking of bikers, does anyone have any good plans on fighting a biker space marine list? The one I'm sizing up is fitted out with vindicators and land speeder tempests. I've only got 6 bikes myself.

Space marine bikes shouldnt be too much of a worry. space marines already have a small model count, and when they're on bikes it's even smaller. just pump more shots/attacks into them. Pks & SAGs will destroy space marine biker armies....

Hey, so, what are some tactics for fighting gaurd? they seem to have REALLY been boosted with 6th ed. I've only played vs. a gaurd player for 6th ed. and he beats me 90% of the time... most of the time i bring my 42 bikes for a wazz dakka army , but i was wondering if i should go for nob bikers?

chobarba wrote:
Space marine bikes shouldnt be too much of a worry. space marines already have a small model count, and when they're on bikes it's even smaller. just pump more shots/attacks into them. Pks & SAGs will destroy space marine biker armies....

Hey, so, what are some tactics for fighting gaurd? they seem to have REALLY been boosted with 6th ed. I've only played vs. a gaurd player for 6th ed. and he beats me 90% of the time... most of the time i bring my 42 bikes for a wazz dakka army , but i was wondering if i should go for nob bikers?

Which list is he using to beat you? Tanks, artillery, gunline?

a valkyrie
marbo
manticore
straken w/ 4 melta vets in a chimera
2-3 melta/flamer vets in a chimera
3 russes, either 2 normals and one demolisher or the other way around.
storm troopers
and 3 squads of normal gaurdsmen with an auto cannon hwt.

I've been trying the normal biker army, but even with the 4+ cover saves i'm still getting tabled, that's why i'm thinking of going with nob bikers.

chobarba wrote:
a valkyrie
marbo
manticore
straken w/ 4 melta vets in a chimera
2-3 melta/flamer vets in a chimera
3 russes, either 2 normals and one demolisher or the other way around.
storm troopers
and 3 squads of normal gaurdsmen with an auto cannon hwt.

I've been trying the normal biker army, but even with the 4+ cover saves i'm still getting tabled, that's why i'm thinking of going with nob bikers.

Well, if you go Nob Bikerz, watch out for any Str 10 and it looks like your opp is running plenty. Other than that, I'm a little consfused why you are losing 90% against guard and that particular guard list. If anything, more normal bikes would be good against any dedicated tank hunter weapons as they are only taking out 25 point models.