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 felixander wrote:
I'm gonna start a "Make Phil Kelly Write the Next Eldar Codex, Promptly" fund.

Who or what do I need to give money to to make this happen?

So...

Are there any actual recent/new rumors to discuss in here?

If not, this looks to be moved to 40K General pretty soon.

Here some anonymous email received by natfka, so take these rumours with the usual extra precautions:

A couple notes that you might find interesting:
As of 03/01/2013

- Autarchs take Paths. These represent completed paths they have walked and are tied to the various aspects. By taking a path you make the respective aspect warrior a troop choice (the exception are reapers who just become scoring)

- Overall point cost reduction (guardians see it the most, aspect warriors see it the least, but are instead a fair margin better with only a minor cost decrease for two of the schools).

- new special rule that influence how howling banshees interact in combat. It's current iteration really makes them feel like glass cannons that are amazing at what they're designed to do.

-Seer councils have brotherhood of psykers (the farseers still cast their own abilities in addition, but two farseers together cast more than 2 farseers separately)

- in general, aspect warriors are hyper focused and hyper successful if used properly
- No new aspect
- 2 new flyers
- lots of units get access to skyfire
- new tank (on falcon chasis)
- Avatar is buffed a lot
- Two new special characters
- exarchs are all really good in duels in different ways
- farseers are still awesome psykers
- warlocks improve deny the witch.
- falcon/wave serpent point reduction
- way to make some of the craftworld specific lists
- additional rules for allying with dark eldar
- expanded fluff on the war in heaven

I'm gonna put good money on Dark Reapers being the new Terminators with TH/SS. Dunno why, I just see it being so.

- additional rules for allying with dark eldar

Aaaand here's where we can, with complete and utmost certainty, call FAAAAKE. Move along, everyone.

Why's that? Why wouldn't Eldar ally with Dark Eldar?

 Snrub wrote:
Why's that? Why wouldn't Eldar ally with Dark Eldar?

We've had three 6th edition Codexes so far and it's painfully obvious that GW is actively avoiding any allies-specific rules, even between CSM and Daemons, which used to be a single army not so long ago. The only reasonable explanation is that they are leaving the door open to remove allies come 7th edition. Ergo, any rumour claiming special provisions for allies is clearly fabricated.

Hmm ok that makes sense. I thought you were calling false from a fluff perspective not a rules one.

 lord_blackfang wrote:


We've had three 6th edition Codexes so far and it's painfully obvious that GW is actively avoiding any allies-specific rules, even between CSM and Daemons, which used to be a single army not so long ago. The only reasonable explanation is that they are leaving the door open to remove allies come 7th edition. Ergo, any rumour claiming special provisions for allies is clearly fabricated.

That would be a fair point if GW didn't have a long history of changing design focus partway through editions.

 insaniak wrote:
That would be a fair point if GW didn't have a long history of changing design focus partway through editions.

Don't worry, I'm already stockpiling some righteous indignation for when the new GK come out and have special rules for buffing their allied SM and IG, while CSM/CD for the most part can't even use each others' teleport homers. But I don't expect it to happen quite so soon.

On the other hand they took great pains to cram CSM Codex and WoC armybook so full with new daemons, that the old distinction becomes almost obsolete and makes adding special daemon ally rules not helpfull selling these as distinct armies.

In the end this new rumour set stands opposed to your speculations. Even if your speculations make more sense than natfka rumours.

- Overall point cost reduction (guardians see it the most, aspect warriors see it the least, but are instead a fair margin better with only a minor cost decrease for two of the schools).

- new special rule that influence how howling banshees interact in combat. It's current iteration really makes them feel like glass cannons that are amazing at what they're designed to do.

- No new aspect

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Snrub wrote:
Why's that? Why wouldn't Eldar ally with Dark Eldar?

We've had three 6th edition Codexes so far and it's painfully obvious that GW is actively avoiding any allies-specific rules, even between CSM and Daemons, which used to be a single army not so long ago. The only reasonable explanation is that they are leaving the door open to remove allies come 7th edition. Ergo, any rumour claiming special provisions for allies is clearly fabricated.

I dunno. It's not that unbelievable, provided you don't assume it to simply be "beneficial rules".

It could be a further list of what can and cannot ally, or how they use the allies matrix in the Dark Eldar and Eldar lists.
I could easily see something like:
Rangers and Harlequins can be used in Dark Eldar Cabal lists with no penalties and Craftworld Eldar lists with no penalties, but suffer penalties in Wych Cults or Haemonculi Covens.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Snrub wrote:
Why's that? Why wouldn't Eldar ally with Dark Eldar?

We've had three 6th edition Codexes so far and it's painfully obvious that GW is actively avoiding any allies-specific rules, even between CSM and Daemons, which used to be a single army not so long ago. The only reasonable explanation is that they are leaving the door open to remove allies come 7th edition. Ergo, any rumour claiming special provisions for allies is clearly fabricated.

I dunno. It's not that unbelievable, provided you don't assume it to simply be "beneficial rules".

It could be a further list of what can and cannot ally, or how they use the allies matrix in the Dark Eldar and Eldar lists.
I could easily see something like:
Rangers and Harlequins can be used in Dark Eldar Cabal lists with no penalties and Craftworld Eldar lists with no penalties, but suffer penalties in Wych Cults or Haemonculi Covens.

Maybe even that Psykers impose greater penalties for DE (or are not allowed to be taken at all, at least in Vect lists) or claryfying that all eldar ARE in fact Eldar for the purposes of psychic powers. It would be fun if Pathfinders could be taken more easily for DE armies, or if certain DE units could be taken more easily in Eldar armies (IE, if you are using 2+ guardian units in your list, then DE units may be taken as allies at a 2 for 1 slot allowance, since Guardian use means the Craftworld is under attack, and nearby DE tend to drop their business to aid craftworlds under direct attack.) Still hoping for Maidenworld rules.

I'm still firmly under the belief that GW would be better off making a supplement book that gave fluff for various types of army combos allowed under the Allies system. I think it would make a considerable amount of money, even if it was little more than paint schemes, modelling ideas, fluff bits, and so on. "Inducted Guardsmen" for instance, outlining the organization and cooperation between units of guardsmen used solely by the Ordo Malleus. "Eldar Corsairs," for a list of Eldar and Dark Eldar units that would appear in a typical Corsair raiding party, and examples of head swaps, model adjustments, and other substitutions to smooth out the edges of DE models and "slightly spike up" CE models. Or a "Witch hunter task force" of Sisters of Battle and Black Templars. Will it be just as obsolete as any other book the second the next Codex come out? Sure. But since its a hobby book more than a rule book, it could have continued value for some time.

Though for that matter I think it would make a great series of articles in White Dwarf. Added value for practically no work, and they could keep the series going for the entirety of 6e.

It could also be something simple like: DE models in CWE units do not benefit from Eldar powers.

It looks reasonable, its just the thing about allying with DE makes me think this is fake.

From a rules perspective or fluff one TH? Rules wise, maybe, depends on what it actually turns out to be, they already share Harlequins, as others have noted could be restrictions, limitations on powers etc, of course it might be they can literally add units into the list without the requirement of an allied force. Scary, but it wouldn't surprise me, if a step back to the old GK days.

Of course fluff wise it is fine to have them as alies, Dark Eldar and Eldar are nothing like Asur and Druchii in their relations. Its more of a general avoidance, but I suspect a Farseer would let an entire Human world burn to save a Dark Eldar life as much as he/she would for a Eldar one.

As to the points reduction, I pretty much expected it, seems a sly way to increase army size without a huge overhaul to the armies. Doesn't come across immediately as a huge change, in fact we take it as a positive for how much we can field now and happily add more figures to our current list. Win win for GW.

Re the DE Ally thing: It may have to do with the fact that Harlequins are in both books, and maybe that Harlequins from either detachment may be treated as both Eldar and Dark Eldar models, and may use allied transports.

If the allying rule change is true, I also expect it to be a restriction or have a drawback. Alternatively something along the lines of Harlequins count as both Eldar and Dark Eldar regardless of which slot they used, or Dark Eldar count as Eldar for X rules. (Fluff wise, do Craftworld Eldar still see Dark Eldar as Eldar?)

Just listing off thoughts now:
I hope the Autarch Paths is true, I would love to be able to field a pure Aspect Warrior army of any aspect (or build a force centered on one).

As much as I hate the concept of Eldar being playable as a hoard/blob, we do need something to pack numbers sometimes. We have a specialist for everything, and guardians seem to be a specialist cannon fodder.
I'd be very glad if the do end up having put more into buffing units than reducing their costs. We're a dying race, fewer numbers suit us better.

I hope these special rules are giving the banshees some options rather than just a flat "you get this" (same with other Aspects). What we had for a brief time before the errata where banshees had power weapons, not power swords, was beautiful. Their core role didn't change, but how you implemented it on could.

Only 2 new flyers, 1 tank and 2 characters seems odd, though I suppose it doesn't rule out new none-aspect units (such as the alternate wraithguard)

Particularly if unit powers are still tied in to their Exarch, I'd be glad to see a boost in the challenge ability.

Pyro-Druid wrote:
(Fluff wise, do Craftworld Eldar still see Dark Eldar as Eldar?)

Yes, very much so. It's not like Imperium vs Chaos at all. Eldar see Dark Eldar as the brother that dropped out of school, joined a gang, and started doing drugs; they don't approve of their brother's actions, but they're still kin and will gladly obliterate gallons of humans to ensure their survival. Dark Eldar are less altruistic towards their Craftworld kin, but will take the opportunity to 'convert' their bro to their point of view through pain and threats... it's a much more altruistic mercy than what they usually give their victims. Also, DE tend to sacrifice other Eldar regardless of if they're Craftworld or not.

...I guess technically it's more like the Craftworld Eldar is the older brother that got beat out of the gang, stopped doing drugs, went to school, and became a lawyer. Occasionally, the stuck-up older brother has to bail the little mischievous darker brother out of trouble because he's still kin.

Quark wrote:
If true, the guardians thing worries me. They're not expensive, they have a terrible weapon. Especially after the rapid fire rule change. 12" assault scares absolutely no one. But hey, let's make a blob troop for the race that is supposed to treat every life as sacred.

They could just change the fluff to make the Eldar horribly class-conscious, with the Guardians as the poor white trash or peasant levies, intended to die in droves while the better folk survive unscathed. Because that's pretty much how it plays out. It'd make sense too, since the Eldar already treat every other form of sentient life as scum unfitting of their notice, so having their upper crust extending that attitude to the plebs of their own race is just a short leap of logic away. It'd also be more interesting than the current Eldar background, and would give them internal tensions and detail as a people that I feel they've always been lacking.

 Absolutionis wrote:

Pyro-Druid wrote:
(Fluff wise, do Craftworld Eldar still see Dark Eldar as Eldar?)

Yes, very much so. It's not like Imperium vs Chaos at all. Eldar see Dark Eldar as the brother that dropped out of school, joined a gang, and started doing drugs; they don't approve of their brother's actions, but they're still kin and will gladly obliterate gallons of humans to ensure their survival. Dark Eldar are less altruistic towards their Craftworld kin, but will take the opportunity to 'convert' their bro to their point of view through pain and threats... it's a much more altruistic mercy than what they usually give their victims. Also, DE tend to sacrifice other Eldar regardless of if they're Craftworld or not.

...I guess technically it's more like the Craftworld Eldar is the older brother that got beat out of the gang, stopped doing drugs, went to school, and became a lawyer. Occasionally, the stuck-up older brother has to bail the little mischievous darker brother out of trouble because he's still kin.

Thanks for clarifying that for me, I had wondered for a while and never got around to searching. Guess that makes the whole Ynnead, God of the Dead, plan a lot harder to pull off.

It still shoots all prior eldar fluff to hell... brink of extinction means not many left alive, hence the necessary extreme devotion to paths... even guardians are supposed to match scout marines in abilities but even more precious in life due to each craftworld having 200-500,000 members... Even if they got someone to write codex who would just come up with new stuff, introducing a meat-shield moniker to guardians would be like saying tyranids arent as hungry as they used to be... just doesnt work or make a lick of sense

Rob I think your numbers are off. The Craftworld Eldar are a dying species, but there are still billions (if not.trillions) of them left. Dwindling does not mean small, it just means decreasing.

From an anonymous email to Darnok over at Warseer:

Every 3-4 months, as an independent retailer, we get a list of items that must be stocked. These are changed in advanced so we don't order old stock, and to give us a change to sell off old stock before new items turn up. The last one in about October / November added a few basic Marine items but dropped Tau Battlesuits, which would tie in with concepts of new battlesuits and new Tau for Spring / Easter.

Yesterday I got the new list, which had a lot of changes in the Fantasy sections. I no longer have to stock High Elves Spearmen, Wood Elves, Bret Knights or Dwarf Warriors. It can therefore be reasonably speculated that these core troop choices will be relaunched in the next 6 - 8 months. The only change in 40k was I no longer have to stock any Eldar (not even DA or Guardians).

I know its not radical or ground breaking and gives no specific dates, but the Bret / Wood /Dwarf news I think is a bit new.

even if a quarter of the reported new units come out I'll have to start yet another army

Larry Vela over at BOLS wrote:-New Eldar "large tank" is being worked on (not the same as the new falcon variant)
-Guardian/Storm Guardian combo plastic box
-Guardian jetbikes/Shining Spear combo box

Aha, you found the thread. I was looking for it earlier and got distracted.

It is easy for me to find rumour threads I started

If they simply unlocked the option to make Aspect Warriors scoring, I'd happily play the codex as is.