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So... any chance of the pledge manager being reopened for late add-ons?

chaos0xomega wrote:
So... any chance of the pledge manager being reopened for late add-ons?

^^ this!

edit: and so I don't seem rude, I PM'd Aza about the bits ; p

Just saw that Kingdom Death had an update. It ain't pretty, delay-wise. Q4, at the very least.

Man I hope we don,t get hit with the same bat.

Er, he didn't even hint at Q4 - which makes me thing 2015 is a thing that's happening.

WGF, right?

So, what does that mean here?

Nothing good, I'd wager!

Don't tell mom the factory manager's dead..?

 Alpharius wrote:
Er, he didn't even hint at Q4 - which makes me thing 2015 is a thing that's happening.

WGF, right?

So, what does that mean here?

Nothing good, I'd wager!

I'm trying to remain a bit upbeat. Wanna jinx us, man?

 Alpharius wrote:
Er, he didn't even hint at Q4 - which makes me thing 2015 is a thing that's happening.

WGF, right?

So, what does that mean here?

Nothing good, I'd wager!

No relation between KD and DFG, different projects with different staff. We are still shooting at Q3, although I wager late Q3... I will let you know if anything changes.

As far as the pledge manager being reopened I doubt that will be possible, I had asked about that some time ago and was given a definitive no. The issue main comes from the lack of interface between their internal POS and the hand coded pledge manager, nothing is automated and there is not an automated way to accept payments. They simply do not have the staff to deal with this in a manual mode.

Thats when I started floating the idea of a discount coupon. That was a soft no, I believe once again it comes down to staff levels. Dealing with that issue would require hiring temp help, which is not an option at the current time. The only thing I have to kick around at this point is if I can run a coupon through my website. It would have to be shipped from my distribution center in Michigan and there are costs associated with that. I would also need to structure it in a way that would minimize the hit to WGF shipping staff. Perhaps pulling together the orders over a months’ time and having them send one monster shipment rather than driving them crazy with many small orders…. I am just brain storming and I have no idea if this will be acceptable to either my backers or WGF.

I asked if we could ship the 15mm Mortis and weapon arms if they arrived before the rest of stage three and the answer was no. They may not be sending those kits in the shipment with the other items for other customers due to space concerns. So it may be a moot point to start with.

Q3 2015? I was hoping for Q1 or Q2 at least!


Am I joking? Even I'm not sure, anymore....

It'll come the same time as wave 2 for the RRT KS

Oh no. Wave 3 of this will be here WAY before that.

Current estimates of wave 2 for RRT depends on the likelyhood of Satan skating to work!

 NoseGoblin wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Er, he didn't even hint at Q4 - which makes me thing 2015 is a thing that's happening.

WGF, right?

So, what does that mean here?

Nothing good, I'd wager!

No relation between KD and DFG, different projects with different staff. We are still shooting at Q3, although I wager late Q3... I will let you know if anything changes.

As far as the pledge manager being reopened I doubt that will be possible, I had asked about that some time ago and was given a definitive no. The issue main comes from the lack of interface between their internal POS and the hand coded pledge manager, nothing is automated and there is not an automated way to accept payments. They simply do not have the staff to deal with this in a manual mode.

That when I started floating the idea of a discount coupon. That was a soft no, I believe once again it comes down to staff levels. Dealing with that issue would require hiring temp help, which is not an option at the current time. The only thing I have to kick around at this point is if I can run a coupon through my website. It would have to be shipped from my distribution center in Michigan and there are costs associated with that. I would also need to structure it in a way that would minimize the hit to WGF shipping staff. Perhaps pulling together the orders over a months’ time and having them send one monster shipment rather than driving them crazy with many small orders…. I am just brain storming and I have no idea if this will be acceptable to either my backers or WGF.

I asked if we could ship the 15mm Mortis and weapon arms if they arrived before the rest of stage three and the answer was no. They may not be sending those kits in the shipment with the other items for other customers due to space concerns. So it may be a moot point to start with.

Thanks for asking, Mark.

I still think their saying Q3 this year is beyond silly, though

They need to give a realistic number.......... 2014 should be pushed for hard..... but if they're saying Q3 it sounds like they're just stringing everyone along a bit. They said the same right till the end of Q2, so yeah, at some point that's silly when you yourself know the remaining steps needed to be done?

If you factor in just the boat time and loading I think Q3 is a no go, especially with models still in the design phase. I'm all behind the project as it has developed great models, but with rules still not done and a possible few years till an opposing force is even a dream, I can't help but think WGF has missed a great opportunity to strike GW at a critical point. GW is still in a downward spiral from my perspective, but at this pace I can see them right themselves before DFG can take a real foothold and establish a presence in the market. If that's the case then I fear these will just become another novelty item available in the market.

 NoseGoblin wrote:

As far as the pledge manager being reopened I doubt that will be possible, I had asked about that some time ago and was given a definitive no.
That when I started floating the idea of a discount coupon. That was a soft no,
I asked if we could ship the 15mm Mortis and weapon arms if they arrived before the rest of stage three and the answer was no.

How 'bout them nice, endearing gestures from WGF?
Along with their current track record, it certainly makes me want to back another WGF project in the future.
Not to mention Q3 being insulting to our intelligence (I recognise you're just the messenger).

Mark - perhaps it might be worth your while to speak to Justin from SWM about shipping? I'm not sure if he has a deal or knows something, or if he just takes a hit, but he offers discounted and even free shipping from his website, including worldwide if the order is large enough. I've got no idea how he does it, but it might be worth you having a chat to him.

 Azazelx wrote:

 NoseGoblin wrote:

As far as the pledge manager being reopened I doubt that will be possible, I had asked about that some time ago and was given a definitive no.
That when I started floating the idea of a discount coupon. That was a soft no,
I asked if we could ship the 15mm Mortis and weapon arms if they arrived before the rest of stage three and the answer was no.

How 'bout them nice, endearing gestures from WGF?
Along with their current track record, it certainly makes me want to back another WGF project in the future.
Not to mention Q3 being insulting to our intelligence (I recognise you're just the messenger).

i will agree that hearing this kind of stuff makes me less likely to back things from WGF in the future, they dont have much of a record of being able to produce much of anything on time and seem to not care, but I guess you can do those things when your able to produce the quality of models at the pricing they do. Its also pretty interesting that in large this thread has managed to stay far more positive that most of the other majorly delayed KS threads. The tablescapes thread was pretty hostile for a good while

I'll still buy their stuff at retail when it's something I'm interested in. I just won't give them money 1-3 years upfront. Even thinking long-term, this is too much of a factor/potential factor:

 RiTides wrote:

To be completely honest, I really love these models, but the projects I had intended them for are long since finished.

Yep, WGF is likely off my KS list at their current rate of progress on a few projects. Lot of things I could have done in the past couple years with the money where opportunity cost is trumping the savings of the KS.

I might make an exception for DFG in a limited fashion, because I don't think any of the slowdowns have to do with Mark (outside of the complexities of the design) and I think he's been open and communicative even if the information he's given to relay is inaccurate. He's not tried to slap lipstick on a miniature pig (*cough*robotech*cough*) or imply that we're ingrates for not fawning over every last detail released and/or being frustrated with the delays. Even with my fondness for DFG though, it's doubtful I will put up the kind of funds this one saw. To my mind that's a shame, but I'm not in a position to be a patron...I'm still a consumer at the end of the day.

Still, in a retail setting WGF does do good work, so they're not (yet) on my "will not do business with" list.

I think it might become interesting for Mark to slip into a regular release schedule for any other races from the Ironcore universe, rather than a delayed KS on top of this one. Yes, much less grand, but much more manageable.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
I think it might become interesting for Mark to slip into a regular release schedule for any other races from the Ironcore universe, rather than a delayed KS on top of this one. Yes, much less grand, but much more manageable.

seems that would largely depend on how much cash hes made from the first KS plus retail, as any future releases still need the tooling right? Which is the pricey stuff. Unless he goes a more traditional route and get a loan

Honestly, I would still back another DFG Kickstarter, as long as it is a product I want (*cough*Eisenkern tanks*cough*). I think WGF simply took on too many projects at once, particularly projects that bloated during their KS funding period.
But, it's still an algebraic equation of cost vs. time vs. savings vs. special extras to determine if I'm willing to go for it.

I did have to laugh at seeing ironicsilence's sig, as I'm still waiting on my assault butts, as well.

 NoseGoblin wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Er, he didn't even hint at Q4 - which makes me thing 2015 is a thing that's happening.

WGF, right?

So, what does that mean here?

Nothing good, I'd wager!

No relation between KD and DFG, different projects with different staff. We are still shooting at Q3, although I wager late Q3... I will let you know if anything changes.

As far as the pledge manager being reopened I doubt that will be possible, I had asked about that some time ago and was given a definitive no. The issue main comes from the lack of interface between their internal POS and the hand coded pledge manager, nothing is automated and there is not an automated way to accept payments. They simply do not have the staff to deal with this in a manual mode.

Thats when I started floating the idea of a discount coupon. That was a soft no, I believe once again it comes down to staff levels. Dealing with that issue would require hiring temp help, which is not an option at the current time. The only thing I have to kick around at this point is if I can run a coupon through my website. It would have to be shipped from my distribution center in Michigan and there are costs associated with that. I would also need to structure it in a way that would minimize the hit to WGF shipping staff. Perhaps pulling together the orders over a months’ time and having them send one monster shipment rather than driving them crazy with many small orders…. I am just brain storming and I have no idea if this will be acceptable to either my backers or WGF.

I asked if we could ship the 15mm Mortis and weapon arms if they arrived before the rest of stage three and the answer was no. They may not be sending those kits in the shipment with the other items for other customers due to space concerns. So it may be a moot point to start with.

I'd be fine with ordering w/ coupon or what-have-you via your site, even if there would be a delay associated with having to wait, etc.

 ironicsilence wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:

 NoseGoblin wrote:

As far as the pledge manager being reopened I doubt that will be possible, I had asked about that some time ago and was given a definitive no.
That when I started floating the idea of a discount coupon. That was a soft no,
I asked if we could ship the 15mm Mortis and weapon arms if they arrived before the rest of stage three and the answer was no.

How 'bout them nice, endearing gestures from WGF?
Along with their current track record, it certainly makes me want to back another WGF project in the future.
Not to mention Q3 being insulting to our intelligence (I recognise you're just the messenger).

i will agree that hearing this kind of stuff makes me less likely to back things from WGF in the future, they dont have much of a record of being able to produce much of anything on time and seem to not care, but I guess you can do those things when your able to produce the quality of models at the pricing they do. Its also pretty interesting that in large this thread has managed to stay far more positive that most of the other majorly delayed KS threads. The tablescapes thread was pretty hostile for a good while

Have you seen the Robotech Tactics kickstarter thread? Geebus...

Assuming he made enough cash from post KS sales, or that those numbers are interesting in and of themselves, he could continue, as you said, with a loan or on credit directly with China.

I still find it funny that Tony Reidy took a dig at DFG for a)dealing with China and b)his stuff requiring the inclusion of a screwdriver. I guess time told, after all.

What scares me a bit is that the game is still in its infancy and if he goes for Shadokesh as a second force... let's be honest they have few analogues in other games, so they'll have to stand squarely on their own.

Yeah, the more I grind on this the more I think Q 3 is an issue, I am confident that the file portion can be done as long as there are no major issues by the end of August.

Where we start to fall apart is the travel time and all the steps that need to take place after the files have been completed. If they ship by water the files would need to be completed on or around the 24th of this month if we expected an end of September ship to all of you.

I will work out a timeline that I think is reasonable based on my experience and get with my rep to go over each of these steps and see if we cannot come up with a reasonable approximation.
It may take a few days as my rep may need to chew on it for a bit before coming back with an answer… I should be able to have something for you in an update form when I post the Heavy Support Valkir.

Thanks again guys!

That'd be fantastic, Mark. Thanks for following up on this!

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:


I still find it funny that Tony Reidy took a dig at DFG for a)dealing with China and b)his stuff requiring the inclusion of a screwdriver. I guess time told, after all.

Did he? Never really liked that guy...

What scares me a bit is that the game is still in its infancy and if he goes for Shadokesh as a second force... let's be honest they have few analogues in other games, so they'll have to stand squarely on their own.

Isn't that an advantage though? That broadens their appeal beyond people (such as myself) whom are salivating for a chance to play Iron Core, to include players of other systems or who may have want/need for miniatures which are at least somewhat aesthetically similar to other options on the market. In other words, it broadens the customer base beyond those who are looking for a new game, and makes the product a more attractive options for people looking for alternative options for their own games.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Honestly, I would still back another DFG Kickstarter, as long as it is a product I want (*cough*Eisenkern tanks*cough*). I think WGF simply took on too many projects at once, particularly projects that bloated during their KS funding period.
But, it's still an algebraic equation of cost vs. time vs. savings vs. special extras to determine if I'm willing to go for it.

I did have to laugh at seeing ironicsilence's sig, as I'm still waiting on my assault butts, as well.

really?! I got my assault butts a while ago

chaos0xomega wrote:

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:


What scares me a bit is that the game is still in its infancy and if he goes for Shadokesh as a second force... let's be honest they have few analogues in other games, so they'll have to stand squarely on their own.

Isn't that an advantage though? That broadens their appeal beyond people (such as myself) whom are salivating for a chance to play Iron Core, to include players of other systems or who may have want/need for miniatures which are at least somewhat aesthetically similar to other options on the market. In other words, it broadens the customer base beyond those who are looking for a new game, and makes the product a more attractive options for people looking for alternative options for their own games.

If the game is developped and available, yeah, it'll definitely be an advantage. If not, then it'll be a big gamble.

Ok forgive me if this is a really dumb question but I just ordered some of the Stormtroopers to paint up but what is this Ironcore Universe you guys mentioned? Is Mark actually building these models into a game of sorts? (Currently my use for them are proxy models). I did not jump into the KS so it probably is a dumb question, but I would love to use these units in a game that actually uses them.

Ironcore is indeed he name of he game for these models. It's still in the major infancy stage from my knowledge. It is more big stomps robot action than troop combat, but hey, the bottom of the robots feet need o be greased somehow.

I'd say pupal stage, rather than infancy, even. It's a really big blastocyst at this point.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Honestly, I would still back another DFG Kickstarter, as long as it is a product I want (*cough*Eisenkern tanks*cough*). I think WGF simply took on too many projects at once, particularly projects that bloated during their KS funding period.
But, it's still an algebraic equation of cost vs. time vs. savings vs. special extras to determine if I'm willing to go for it.

Fair 'nuff. I'll buy them when and if they hit retail. I'm sure Mantic's endless PVC ..I mean "premium plastic" needs my Kickstarter money far more badly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NoseGoblin wrote:
I will work out a timeline that I think is reasonable based on my experience and get with my rep to go over each of these steps and see if we cannot come up with a reasonable approximation.
It may take a few days as my rep may need to chew on it for a bit before coming back with an answer… I should be able to have something for you in an update form when I post the Heavy Support Valkir.

My prediction of your rep's reply:

No.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
I'd say pupal stage, rather than infancy, even. It's a really big blastocyst at this point.

Yeah. At this stage, the game is called these models are my "Imperial Guard/Astra Militarium/Stormtroopers/mMilitarum Tempestus/Inquisitorial Retinues, Dreadknights and Imperial Knights".